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Author Topic: The Outer Worlds - Obsidian  (Read 26676 times)
schild
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Reply #105 on: October 31, 2019, 05:16:13 AM

People are acting as if well written, bug free games not jam packed with micro transaction bullshit are just falling off tree's at the moment.

The vast majority of "well-written" (ignoring the fact the bar just got pushed up into the stratosphere) games tend not to have much if any DLC and are coming out at the same clip as always. But I don't know who is talking about this at all or saying anything about it.
Sky
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Reply #106 on: October 31, 2019, 06:31:10 AM

Dr. Phineas Wells is more Rick of Rick and Morty than Doc Brown.
I'll take your word for that.
HaemishM
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Reply #107 on: October 31, 2019, 07:46:21 AM

People are acting as if well written, bug free games not jam packed with micro transaction bullshit are just falling off tree's at the moment.

Yeah, this kind of level of quality really shouldn't be scoffed at based on how shitty the biggest AAA games have been lately.

schild
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Reply #108 on: November 04, 2019, 08:01:00 AM

so I think i'm approaching the end of this

it's not a very good game, even compared to any of the Fallouts

it's just like 30 hours of going through the motions
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Reply #109 on: November 04, 2019, 10:50:01 AM

Words inc.

So yeah, I want to start off by saying this is a perfectly fine game.  It does it's thing, moved at a good pace, and kept me engaged enough to get through the thing with almost 100% quest completion.  So when I now write out everything that disappointed me about the game, it's not to dogpile saying it was terrible.  If anything, I had high expectations from it because I've loved pretty much every game Obsidian made, but this one fell flat.

After some thought, this game is basically a cross between Fallout:NV and KoToR in how the game is organized and plays.  Two games I loved, but in blending them, they took out aspects that made both great.  You travel around to different self contained 'mini-open worlds' that you explore and can sandbox how you solve the problems of each area (good, bad, grey).  This COULD have been great, but every zone felt totally lifeless and bland.  They were very pretty (compared to the ever grey/brown of Fallout), but it felt like I was exploring a mid-2000's mmo level instead of an open world.  Lots of impassable hills that forced me into very specific paths, and there weren't even interesting things to find along the way.  Just random Marauders and giant crates.  All of the Fallout maps felt way more alive and hand crafted.  KoToR had more limited level design, sure, but each world was totally different looking and felt unique.  Terra 1 and 2 were basically the same thing with a slight pallet change, and that's where 80% of the game was.

Combat felt way less impactfull or engaging.  In KoToR when you level up you can pick various skills you can choose to use in combat or dialog.  These skills are varied, and have very immediate game impact when you gain/use them (Think the differences between Force Lighting,  Affect Mind, Force Leap).  This kept things interesting, even if combat could have been way better in it.  This basically lifted Fallout's combat, so we didn't get any of that.  But it also cut out a ton of what Fallout did.  The time freeze thing was a way less engaging version of VATS.  Combat was more or less a straight FPS with my skills/perks not feeling like they changed much after the first few levels.  The game basically cut out the best parts of Fallout and KoToR combat, and the results were pretty bland.

Skills really did not feel impactful.  I went full Hack/Lockpick/Engineering/Science/Long Guns with almost zero points into anything else (none into dialog).  Often times I couldn't pick the special dialog option….. but taking the non skill check STILL got me exactly what I was trying for.  I'm not even sure wtf the point was half the time.  On top of that, it was insanely easy between perks and companions to max all your skills without even trying or intending to.  I had 15 persuade skill the entire game.  An 80 skill check came up late in the game I saw I could do, and I realized that between all the bonus stuff, I somehow had 90 persuade.  Playing around, I could do that with anything.  Like, in previous games, the skills you choose to take can make your entire play through DRASTICALLY different.  I'm very certain other than choosing to be a dick or not, each play through of this game will feel exactly the same.  On top of that they cut out all the mini-games involved with lock-pick or hacking in Fallout.  Maybe some people didn't like those, but it was something that engaged me and gave my skill action more impact.  Here I just click a button, thing opens up, and I quickly grab yet another few bits before moving on.  Just yet another thing that made the game feel more shallow.

That leads to another thing.  The game was way to god damned easy, even on hard mode.  There was so much money, ammo, and equipment laying around I never once purchased anything from any vendor.  After only getting to about level 8 or so, I was pretty much unstoppable killing machine.  Any skill check was easy to get by no matter my build.  You reach a point in all of these open world games were you become a god, but usually you have to put a lot of hours into it playing the struggling hero carefully using his limited resources before that hits.  It felt like I hit that point way earlier than in any other game of this type.

Finally, story.  Thematically they really didn't know what they wanted this to be.  I mean, it was Firefly, the RPG, which is a great idea for this sort of game.  But they tried to introduce the over the topness of Borderlands in how they handled the way the corporations worked….. but then kept varying back into playing it straight.  It was super jarring.  You either need to fully embrace the zany satire aspect, or fully embrace the cruel dystopian aspect.  They kept zigging between the two and it honestly broke immersion.  The voice acting was all fine, and your companions were all mostly fine, if mostly forgettable.  None of these characters really stuck with me very much compared to previous games (and I did all of their background quests).  Bubbly Lesbian girls quest was probably the most annoying and felt super forced, but I can see this being a personal taste thing.

Overall, it just felt like a well engineered by the books effort.  Which unfortunately is a crime considering the setup and company behind meant this had so much more potential to be better.  It's not a bad game, but it felt like they dropped the ball.  Happy I only paid $1 for this.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2019, 10:54:02 AM by Teleku »

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HaemishM
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Reply #110 on: November 04, 2019, 02:11:01 PM

There is WAY WAY WAY too much shit to loot out in the world. Weapons, armor, ammo, there is absolutely no scarcity of anything. Choosing which weapon to use isn't a balance of "am I going to find enough ammo to survive a fight with this" it was very much a "I like that shiny effect more than this one."

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Reply #111 on: November 04, 2019, 03:29:40 PM

There is WAY WAY WAY too much shit to loot out in the world. Weapons, armor, ammo, there is absolutely no scarcity of anything. Choosing which weapon to use isn't a balance of "am I going to find enough ammo to survive a fight with this" it was very much a "I like that shiny effect more than this one."

This is fairly common in RPGs thanks to Diablo. It didn't bother me much in this game. Now, if it was intended as a survival game like the Long Dark (one of my favorite games of all time) then yeah, it'd be a huge issue but in an RPG like this I'm fine with it. I basically found a pistol I liked and a hunting rifle I liked and stuck with them for the last like 30% of the game just tinkering to catch them up to my level from time to time. The hunting rifle did a lot more damage but the pistol had a mod for N-ray energy and was brutal up close.

"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
Tebonas
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Reply #112 on: November 04, 2019, 10:15:33 PM

Especially at normal the difficulty of this game is a joke, I heard its better on higher difficulty, though. Only have a month with it, so I will try that when it comes to Steam.

I suspect the tinkering is something that will make most loot drops obsolete even then, though.
Phildo
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Reply #113 on: November 05, 2019, 06:43:58 AM

Has anyone tried this on console?
HaemishM
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Reply #114 on: November 05, 2019, 07:15:27 AM

I suspect the tinkering is something that will make most loot drops obsolete even then, though.

At least early on, tinkering is pretty trivial and disappointing. It's basically taking a gun that does 60 damage and makes it do 62.

Riggswolfe
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Reply #115 on: November 05, 2019, 09:33:55 AM

Has anyone tried this on console?

I played in on Xbox with the game pass. My only complaint on console is that the text is too small pretty much everywhere except dialogue and the quest menu. Obsidian knows about the complaints and is working on it though it's weird to me they didn't notice it during testing. Basically, you'll probably squint at screen popups and stuff.

I suspect the tinkering is something that will make most loot drops obsolete even then, though.

That's how I felt too but later weapons it seems to make a bigger difference. It also raises the level of the weapon which I think probably has some impact besides just the DPS increase as I noticed a larger increase in damage than simply going up by 2 points would account for.
At least early on, tinkering is pretty trivial and disappointing. It's basically taking a gun that does 60 damage and makes it do 62.

"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
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Reply #116 on: November 05, 2019, 10:07:55 AM

I assume all UI issues with console versions is because no one bothered to play it in a living-room setting.

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Tale
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Reply #117 on: November 05, 2019, 11:02:59 AM


So... everything that feels wrong with it right at the start, but for 30 hours. Thanks for finding out.
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Reply #118 on: November 05, 2019, 11:07:27 AM

Yeah that's pretty correct. It's not a good game. It's the best produced game Obsidian has created. But it is not good.
Ard
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Reply #119 on: November 05, 2019, 07:59:28 PM

It’s like the diametric opposite of what they usually do.  It’s leaving me very confused.
schild
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Reply #120 on: November 05, 2019, 08:47:47 PM

Yea I would've preferred an ambitious, innovative mess to a very polished fallout mod.
Tebonas
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Reply #121 on: November 08, 2019, 02:51:20 AM

I'm happy to say I encountered a game-breaking bug near the end, so my faith in the predictability of companies in almost restored.  awesome, for real


Tale
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Reply #122 on: November 13, 2019, 04:13:53 PM

If you signed up to the $1 for 1 month Xbox Game Pass to get this game, you can now spend another $1 for 3 months of Xbox Game Pass Ultimate (added on to your remaining time from the original deal).

https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/496526
schild
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Reply #123 on: November 13, 2019, 06:31:31 PM

If you signed up to the $1 for 1 month Xbox Game Pass to get this game, you can now spend another $1 for 3 months of Xbox Game Pass Ultimate (added on to your remaining time from the original deal).

https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/496526

Good looking out, XGP seems to just have everything.
Tale
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Reply #124 on: December 06, 2019, 07:15:09 AM

Teleku
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Reply #125 on: December 09, 2019, 09:39:12 PM

I don't think hitting the joke ending should count as a successful speed run.  :p

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schild
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Reply #126 on: December 09, 2019, 09:55:02 PM

somehow that was boring in only 12 minutes
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Reply #127 on: December 10, 2019, 04:43:38 AM

I keep thinking about this. I feel bad I didn't enjoy it more, because I appreciate the good dialogue, the interesting characters, the art design--etc. It's certainly more pleasurable to play a mediocre game that has polish. But it really is mediocre, and I think in the end it's because everything is a bit too small, the people aren't ultimately quite human enough (they're just a bit too much in line with the theme/plot), there isn't that much to discover that's hidden or surprising, and the weaponry/combat is sort of boring. It's those last two where this loses in comparison to either Fallout NV or Fallout 4. I don't think I ever really found a place that was just sort of there that had its own thing going on, and I don't think I ever really cared about loot--there was no sense really of having gotten a great weapon or the need to do some great crafting, etc. I know I didn't eat food once despite having picked it up obsessively.

The best part I think were the companion quests, which I genuinely enjoyed.
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Reply #128 on: December 10, 2019, 09:49:18 AM

The loot in the game was probably the worst part - way too much of it, most of it being crap. In the time I've played, there's never really been the sense that I will run out of ammo, or not have a weapon up to snuff.

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Reply #129 on: December 10, 2019, 10:11:29 AM

The inventory UI and all associates elements is the worst thing. Can't compare equipment properly, can't see encumbrance in the store menu, can't sort (or FILTER for fuck's sake) consumables by effect, can't sort in the companion inventory, etc, etc. Not even half-ass, third-ass at best.

I'd like to get a video of the devs commenting on me trying to do basic 1997 inventory management but instead swapping screens and writing notes on a paper pad.

I like it for what it is, which is a pretty RPG museum that I don't have to work hard to enjoy. I'm not into challenges these days.

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Reply #130 on: December 20, 2019, 07:29:51 PM

for me at least, the only redeeming factor for Skyrim and the recent Fallouts has been the fact that a whole lot of the broken and incomplete shit Bethesda couldn't be arsed to do right could be modded out, and the game even enhanced and expanded. Improved graphics, better AI, vastly improved UI, better dialogs, normal looking children instead of potato-faced freaks, completely re-balanced perk trees, loot tables, spell systems, all are possible in Skyrim with mods. Hell, there's some awesome stuff being done with a Skyrim mod to basically redo Morrowind completely in the skyrim engine.  Don't get me wrong, I love Skyrim, and have always liked the concepts in Fallout (except that abominable online version), but the buggy, incomplete, incompetent laziness coming out of Bethesda that is getting progressively worse even as the graphics and pretty fluff stuff gets better and better just chafes me raw.

So, the big question. Can The Outer Worlds be modded to fix their shortcomings? It seems like modding on a stable foundation would be vastly easier than the arcane workarounds folks have to do in Skyrim to get shit to work despite Bethesda's buggy best efforts to make it impossible.  But is it even possible here?

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Reply #131 on: December 22, 2019, 11:04:19 PM

for me at least, the only redeeming factor for Skyrim and the recent Fallouts has been the fact that a whole lot of the broken and incomplete shit Bethesda couldn't be arsed to do right could be modded out, and the game even enhanced and expanded. Improved graphics, better AI, vastly improved UI, better dialogs, normal looking children instead of potato-faced freaks, completely re-balanced perk trees, loot tables, spell systems, all are possible in Skyrim with mods. Hell, there's some awesome stuff being done with a Skyrim mod to basically redo Morrowind completely in the skyrim engine.  Don't get me wrong, I love Skyrim, and have always liked the concepts in Fallout (except that abominable online version), but the buggy, incomplete, incompetent laziness coming out of Bethesda that is getting progressively worse even as the graphics and pretty fluff stuff gets better and better just chafes me raw.

So, the big question. Can The Outer Worlds be modded to fix their shortcomings? It seems like modding on a stable foundation would be vastly easier than the arcane workarounds folks have to do in Skyrim to get shit to work despite Bethesda's buggy best efforts to make it impossible.  But is it even possible here?

There are some mods out but Bethesda games are made from the start to be moddable and they release modding tools to help. With the Outer Worlds people are just kind of figuring out how to do it despite not having the tools.

"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
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Reply #132 on: December 23, 2019, 06:34:06 AM

Mods won't breathe a soul into outer worlds.
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Reply #133 on: December 27, 2019, 03:08:56 PM

Yeah, I don't think it's open enough, basically. There's not enough real estate where nothing is happening except some spawns. It's like saying you're going to mod Bioshock into a more open-world game or something.
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