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Author Topic: $400 WiFi-enabled 4-ton-force juicer's $120 million fail  (Read 21526 times)
MahrinSkel
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When she crossed over, she was just a ship. But when she came back... she was bullshit!


Reply #280 on: July 29, 2018, 02:17:25 PM

"Lose money until we're a monopoly" is VC catnip. The more money you plan on losing, the more lucrative the potential monopoly.

--Dave

--Jello Biafra: "If evolution is outlawed, only outlaws will evolve."
IainC
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Reply #281 on: July 29, 2018, 10:16:58 PM

Theaters and/or an appmaker probably could make a decent return on an app that sold tickets for cost+ some number for seats that are unsold if one could solve the problem of managing the inventory and acquiring the customer.
I'm not sure that works so well for cinemas where a lot of the traffic is last minute box-office sales anyway. I guess you could ringfence a bunch of second/third week tickets as 'unsold inventory' on the basis that they probably will be, but it's not as predictable on a per-instance basis as hotels/cruise ships/airlines.

- And in stranger Iains, even Death may die -

SerialForeigner Photography.
Goumindong
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Reply #282 on: July 30, 2018, 12:53:40 AM

Theaters and/or an appmaker probably could make a decent return on an app that sold tickets for cost+ some number for seats that are unsold if one could solve the problem of managing the inventory and acquiring the customer.
I'm not sure that works so well for cinemas where a lot of the traffic is last minute box-office sales anyway. I guess you could ringfence a bunch of second/third week tickets as 'unsold inventory' on the basis that they probably will be, but it's not as predictable on a per-instance basis as hotels/cruise ships/airlines.

It also hasn't worked out so well for Hotels and Cruise ships because people know that they can find last minute deals and therefore wait. There have been significant substitution effects in those markets.
Khaldun
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Reply #283 on: July 30, 2018, 04:41:47 PM

I heard a presentation by a producer a few years back where he talked about the movie theater biz. On one hand, it's incredibly crucial to the basic business model of film production. If you don't make a good first weekend, the entire rest of your revenue stream is usually, though not always, borked. (You can occasionally do really well on theatrical releases outside the US while tanking here; or every once in a while, you hit it big in the first round of PPV on cable because for some reason lots of people wanted to see your movie but didn't see it in theaters.)

If you have a film that's in the theaters for 3-5 weeks and doing decent business, almost all of your business is done on Thurs-Fri-Sat-Sun matinee. Sun night it starts to fall off. Monday-Wednesday theater owners would just as soon close because almost nobody goes to the movies, but they've found in many cases that if they close, people stop coming altogether to their theater--it has a rebound effect. So they reluctantly stay open.

I asked the guy why everybody doesn't go Alamo Drafthouse and redo their theaters as fairly good drinks-and-food and then during the week show movies with really small rental costs that might entice some audiences out. He basically shrugged and said, "because it's an industry with a relatively limited imagination, just like the movie industry itself". But I've noticed that slowly that's actually starting to happen--a lot of theaters are putting in new super comfortable seats that you book directly (no more showing up and having to split up a four or five-person group or sit in the first row) and many are adding (bad) food and booze.

If you coupled a better theater experience with more interesting mid-week shows, a coupon/pass approach might be a good mechanism to go along with it. But that's the thing with crowdsourcing/ecommerce start-ups. None of them are really intended to be serious attempts to build up an established economy of some kind or to add value to it. They're almost all scams, many of them looking to cannibalize some existing public goods or some underdefended business sector.
Samwise
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Reply #284 on: July 30, 2018, 04:48:03 PM

I asked the guy why everybody doesn't go Alamo Drafthouse and redo their theaters as fairly good drinks-and-food and then during the week show movies with really small rental costs that might entice some audiences out.

100x this.

I wanted to see They Live at my local Drafthouse and it's sold out two weeks in advance.  On a Monday night.  Don't tell me nobody goes to movies on weeknights.   awesome, for real

"Nice attempted blast about my "drinking".  I do enjoy a nice cuppa, but that is because I am a bon vivant of gregarious nature and cheery disposition." - Ab
schild
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Reply #285 on: July 30, 2018, 09:20:55 PM

They had five showings of they live in Austin, all of them had shit seats within hours of announcement.
Ironwood
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Reply #286 on: July 31, 2018, 04:28:01 AM

I asked the guy why everybody doesn't go Alamo Drafthouse and redo their theaters as fairly good drinks-and-food and then during the week show movies with really small rental costs that might entice some audiences out.

100x this.

I wanted to see They Live at my local Drafthouse and it's sold out two weeks in advance.  On a Monday night.  Don't tell me nobody goes to movies on weeknights.   awesome, for real

Yes, it's true ; there are a lot of sad people out there.   why so serious?

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
Chimpy
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Reply #287 on: July 31, 2018, 05:25:44 PM

Selling "unsold seats in a movie already running" doesn't really make sense for the movie theater operator except as a driver of concession sales because iirc, they don't pay the movie distributor per movie shown they pay per ticket sold. It doesn't work like last minute hotels, cruise ship cabins, or airline tickets.

The reason you can buy discounted same day tickets for Broadway productions is that they pay their royalties (and salaries for cast and crew) per performance so every extra seat sold is more money regardless of price paid.

'Reality' is the only word in the language that should always be used in quotes.
Yegolev
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Reply #288 on: July 31, 2018, 06:34:51 PM

I'm pretty sure you are right. The production companies make all the money on the movies. Theaters make money only on concessions.

Why am I homeless?  Why do all you motherfuckers need homes is the real question.
They called it The Prayer, its answer was law
Mommy come back 'cause the water's all gone
HaemishM
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Reply #289 on: August 01, 2018, 11:27:09 AM

Getting butts in seats on unsold tickets would increase concession sales, but you're probably right in that the money involved is not going to be enough to get this kind of thing off the ground. That may be why no one has done it - well, in addition to the fact that most theater chains (which is where this would have to come from) probably still aren't forward thinking enough to figure out how to stop their eroding market other than idiotic jiggle chairs (see the Cinemark D Box experience - or don't because why would you?).

Sky
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I love my TV an' hug my TV an' call it 'George'.


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Reply #290 on: August 01, 2018, 01:32:02 PM

I only go for IMAX 3D. Otherwise, that's why I have a big tv.

Fiancee LOVES going to our shitty local theater, I'll never understand it. Pay a ton for shitty concessions, hold your pee or miss part of the movie, strangers being humans. She will also bitch about my sound system being too loud during movies but loves the theater where it's poorly tuned and way too loud for the space.

 swamp poop

Yegolev
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Reply #291 on: August 06, 2018, 09:13:43 AM

I think tradition is a bigger influence over people's minds than any of us would feel comfortable admitting.  Or maybe she just has a Life On Mars thing going.

As for theater companies (not to be confused with theatre companies), if you ever make friends with someone who works at one, you'll find that they are like every other business on the planet and you'll wonder how any of them stay solvent.  THEN you'll realize that everyone is a greedy, shortsighted doofus and it's your own expectations of our species that need to be adjusted.

Why am I homeless?  Why do all you motherfuckers need homes is the real question.
They called it The Prayer, its answer was law
Mommy come back 'cause the water's all gone
Khaldun
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Reply #292 on: August 06, 2018, 01:28:10 PM

Yes. It's why I both laugh and scream every time some douchenozzle talks about how running the government like a business would be so much better.

Virtually every business on earth is just as full of waste and incompetence, and most survive just fine that way--signally because part of their function is to find scapegoats when something goes wrong and to make sure that the scapegoat has no choice but to fall on their sword.
Sky
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I love my TV an' hug my TV an' call it 'George'.


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Reply #293 on: August 07, 2018, 08:50:30 AM

you'll realize that everyone is a greedy, shortsighted doofus and it's your own expectations of our species that need to be adjusted.
No, I'm good on that front  Cthulu

Actually, I've canonized it as the defining traits of humanity: selfish, short-sighted, and stupid.

Cherish exceptions, don't expect them.

Abagadro
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Possibly the only user with more posts in the Den than PC/Console Gaming.


Reply #294 on: August 12, 2018, 01:12:55 AM


"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

-H.L. Mencken
Goumindong
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Reply #295 on: August 12, 2018, 01:41:37 AM

Best comment is “2 juice 2 ero”
HaemishM
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Prevent all damage that would be dealt to you and other troops you control.


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Reply #296 on: August 12, 2018, 01:54:10 AM

$800 to squeeze fruit? The fuck is wrong with people?

Sir T
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Reply #297 on: August 12, 2018, 03:44:10 AM

Looking down the twit twitter thread, what half the people are bitching about the fact that this thing uses a plastic bag. AAAH PLASTIC THEREFORE EEEVIL!!

Sometimes irony is pretty ironic.
Shannow
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Reply #298 on: August 13, 2018, 12:53:30 PM

just eat the fucking fruit you tools.

Someone liked something? Who the fuzzy fuck was this heretic? You don't come to this website and enjoy something. Fuck that. ~ The Walrus
slog
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Reply #299 on: August 13, 2018, 02:17:58 PM

just eat the fucking fruit you tools.

NO! We want Juice!  If they could just stick the juice in a box with a spout that you open it would all be good.

"Die of flaming ass cancer you schmuck. No really, die."

.
Mandella
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Reply #300 on: August 13, 2018, 03:26:20 PM

just eat the fucking fruit you tools.

NO! We want Juice!  If they could just stick the juice in a box with a spout that you open it would all be good.

Can.. can I maybe use a straw? Maybe a sharp one that I could stick through the side of the box???

Boy I'd throw some VC capital at that!
Trippy
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Posts: 20961


Reply #301 on: August 13, 2018, 03:53:01 PM

Since everybody's so environmentally conscious today what we really should do is take some of the water out of juices (which consumers can add back themselves) so it costs much less to transport and takes less room to stock and store. We could even freeze it so it lasts much longer (less waste from juices expiring).
HaemishM
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Prevent all damage that would be dealt to you and other troops you control.


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Reply #302 on: August 13, 2018, 05:11:58 PM

You mean like concentrate? What am I, a fucking savage?  why so serious?

Trippy
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Posts: 20961


Reply #303 on: August 13, 2018, 05:33:38 PM

With the right messaging I'm sure the hipsters will be into it awesome, for real
Abagadro
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Possibly the only user with more posts in the Den than PC/Console Gaming.


Reply #304 on: August 13, 2018, 06:18:37 PM

Plus you can use the concentrate to make an Orange Julius.

"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

-H.L. Mencken
Sky
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I love my TV an' hug my TV an' call it 'George'.


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Reply #305 on: August 13, 2018, 09:57:04 PM

When it says 3 cans of water it means vodka.

Tale
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sıɥʇ ǝʞıן sʞןɐʇ


Reply #306 on: August 13, 2018, 10:32:32 PM


Apparently Juisir was at one point JUlaVIE, and Juicero already sued them. But with Juicero gone, the Chinese-made Juisir marches on.

This article in Chinese reveals some things via Google Translate: https://36kr.com/p/5147962.html - The writers see it as a scam.

For example, the classic Juicero boast was that its squeeze pressure was equivalent to the amount needed to lift two Teslas. The Juisir website in Chinese mimics almost the same marketing copy, but boasts that it has the power to lift four Teslas.
schild
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Reply #307 on: August 13, 2018, 11:22:20 PM

my hands can lift six teslas, but i never need to exert that much to juice a bag of mushy fruit parts
HaemishM
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Prevent all damage that would be dealt to you and other troops you control.


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Reply #308 on: August 14, 2018, 10:14:32 AM

How the fuck is it harder and somehow worse to just open a bottle of pre-prepared juice (yes I know, lots of sugars and such) than to cut up fruit bits, drop them in a bag and watch an overpriced hipster ego massaging vice grip squeeze the bits into pulpy fruit vampire slushies?

schild
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Reply #309 on: August 14, 2018, 10:38:21 AM

I don't feel like explaining fruit and shelf life to you.
Yegolev
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2/10 WOULD NOT INGEST


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Reply #310 on: August 14, 2018, 03:55:46 PM

Talk of FCOJ reminds me of Trading Places.

Why am I homeless?  Why do all you motherfuckers need homes is the real question.
They called it The Prayer, its answer was law
Mommy come back 'cause the water's all gone
Sir T
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Posts: 11857


Reply #311 on: August 14, 2018, 05:29:10 PM

For all your FCOJ price graph needs.

Sometimes irony is pretty ironic.
slog
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Reply #312 on: August 15, 2018, 02:36:11 PM

Since this is now the "stupid buisnesses of the internet age" thread, I present to you: MoviePass!

Quote
The owners of MoviePass need another $1.2 billion.
Helios and Matheson (HMNY), parent company of the popular movie subscription service, told regulators Monday that it wants to sell that much in stock and debt securities.

MoviePass exploded in popularity because of its low price. For just $10 a month, about the cost of a single movie ticket in most places, MoviePass subscribers can see one movie a day.

But the company loses money when its customers use a pass, because it must pay theaters for the tickets



This is brilliant.  Lose billions selling a subscription service to movies because you are just buying tickets at face value.


Update

MoviePass just lost $132 a share and it's trading at 5’ !

https://money.cnn.com/2018/08/15/news/companies/moviepass-losses-mount/index.html


It has burned through more than $219 million in cash since the beginning of the year. Most of that money, more than $150 million, has been spent in the last quarter.

Meanwhile, the company's cash reserves are dwindling. It has only $15.5 million in cash on its balance sheet, plus another $28.7 million held by payments processors. Helios and Matheson warned that "without raising additional capital, there is substantial doubt about the company's ability to continue as a going concern."

"Die of flaming ass cancer you schmuck. No really, die."

.
Trippy
Administrator
Posts: 20961


Reply #313 on: August 15, 2018, 08:02:33 PM

They recently reduced the number of movies you can see per month to 3 (with a discount on additional ones) to try and slow down the hemorrhaging. They also used that change in plan to "uncancel" some people's subscriptions.

https://www.vox.com/culture/2018/8/14/17687732/moviepass-cant-cancel-opt-in-email-app

Goumindong
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Posts: 3815


Reply #314 on: August 15, 2018, 08:12:11 PM

Since this is now the "stupid buisnesses of the internet age" thread, I present to you: MoviePass!

Quote
The owners of MoviePass need another $1.2 billion.
Helios and Matheson (HMNY), parent company of the popular movie subscription service, told regulators Monday that it wants to sell that much in stock and debt securities.

MoviePass exploded in popularity because of its low price. For just $10 a month, about the cost of a single movie ticket in most places, MoviePass subscribers can see one movie a day.

But the company loses money when its customers use a pass, because it must pay theaters for the tickets



This is brilliant.  Lose billions selling a subscription service to movies because you are just buying tickets at face value.


Update

MoviePass just lost $132 a share and it's trading at 5’ !

https://money.cnn.com/2018/08/15/news/companies/moviepass-losses-mount/index.html


It has burned through more than $219 million in cash since the beginning of the year. Most of that money, more than $150 million, has been spent in the last quarter.

Meanwhile, the company's cash reserves are dwindling. It has only $15.5 million in cash on its balance sheet, plus another $28.7 million held by payments processors. Helios and Matheson warned that "without raising additional capital, there is substantial doubt about the company's ability to continue as a going concern."

Its actually worse than that :P

Those are the top end numbers, but as the article notes there was a reverse 250-1 split on the stock. Which means that they took 250 of every stock and replaced it with 1 (in order to keep it from being delisted by NASDAQ). So the actual price jump was 132 dollars to .02 cents
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