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Author Topic: John Wick 2  (Read 1250 times)
Merusk
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on: February 10, 2017, 08:56:01 AM

Saw this last night because, hey, if movies are going to open on Thursdays now I'm going to go. Particularly since all the recliners and reduced seating they've caused means if I don't go on "off" days I'm craning my neck to see the screen.

Anyway; it was good and enjoyable. I disagree with the folks who say it's better than the first for two reasons.

First: They added a lot more story. Story takes away from the action and an attempt to drive a narrative isn't needed here. While some people were starving for more information on this huge international assassin underworld, I don't think most of us were. We just want to see tight gunplay and no-goddam-shakycam action and martial arts.

The good news is we still get plenty of the latter two. There were a few martial-arts scenes with more quick-cuts than the first film had, which I was disappointed with, but it still stands out for holding a scene in-camera and letting it wash over you. Quite different from any other action movie these days because of that alone.

The bad news is that water-down this otherwise great action movie with some internal assassin's world politics bullshit. The movie isn't just, "Man seeks revenge for people who took the last bit of his wife from him." It made the movie slow down in parts that it otherwise could have been a lot tighter because they didn't add drama the way the scenes in the original did. The 7 minute discussion between John and his target lacked any of the tension of the murder of DaFoe or the black guy in The Continental.

My second gripe is they went a little too over-the top with some of the scenes. The first movie was believable because John got beat-up, knocked around and took damage. That still happens here but some of the hits and mcguffins have you rolling your eyes a bit. He's hit way too often and too severely in some parts for it not to break your immersion and go, "wait, what?"

They were trying to up the ante from the first movie here and overdid it. A guy gets hit by a car multiple times he's not just going to hop up and take out a man rushing in to close-quarters. Nor is a guy with a stab wound in his thigh going to be doing power kicks with that leg or running around on it 20 minutes later.

Still, great watch and if you liked the first you'll like this one.


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I really like the cocks. - Lantyssa
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Velorath
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Reply #1 on: February 10, 2017, 02:26:27 PM

I actually liked the world building stuff in this. It wasn't something I needed explained in the first one, especially if they were just going to leave it as a stand-alone movie. Since they feel the need to do sequels though I think that it's better that they expand things out rather than just do another threadbare plot where Wick kills a bunch of people. Doing a complete rehash would leave me with the feeling of just wanting to watch the original again.
Soulflame
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Reply #2 on: February 10, 2017, 07:22:04 PM

My wife is ambivalent about seeing this in theater, she has watched the original on TV and is taking the attitude of "I can wait to see the next one on TV as well!"

We'll see...
Teleku
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Reply #3 on: February 11, 2017, 01:02:50 PM

I actually liked the world building stuff in this. It wasn't something I needed explained in the first one, especially if they were just going to leave it as a stand-alone movie. Since they feel the need to do sequels though I think that it's better that they expand things out rather than just do another threadbare plot where Wick kills a bunch of people. Doing a complete rehash would leave me with the feeling of just wanting to watch the original again.
Yeah, exactly.  Didn't feel the movie needed a sequel at all, but if they're going to do it, concentrating on the world building aspect of the first movie is absolutely what I'd want them to do.  Might go see it if enough people give it a thumbs up.

Also, please tell me somebody has a line in this one about not touching his dog.   why so serious?

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Ginaz
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Reply #4 on: February 11, 2017, 03:52:14 PM

Going to see this today as I really enjoyed the first one.

Also, it looks like someone's feels has been hurt.  Won't anyone think of the children??? Ohhhhh, I see.

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2017/feb/10/john-wick-chapter-2-gun-violence-keanu-reeves

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Ironwood
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Reply #5 on: February 11, 2017, 04:51:37 PM

It's a valid criticism, I guess.


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Evil Elvis
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Reply #6 on: February 11, 2017, 07:36:38 PM

Saw it Friday. I agree with Merusk.

They tried to crank everything up to 11, and it doesn't work that well. The choreography is great, the action is good, but the the world building is downright stupid at times.

Fun enough to watch, but nowhere near as good as the first.
Ginaz
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Reply #7 on: February 11, 2017, 08:38:44 PM

It's a valid criticism, I guess.



It's almost like people go to a movie rated R with the warning of "strong violence throughout" wanting to be offended.  Maybe Jack Thompson was right and the Grand Theft Auto games turns kids into violent criminals, too. awesome, for real

Anyway, I saw this tonight and while I didn't enjoy it as much as the first movie, it was still pretty good and everything I expected it to be.  The criticisms of John Wick taking too much damage but still being able to kick ass is valid, though it's not as obvious as it is with other action movies.  It's still hard to believe Keanu Reeves is 52. ACK!

I'll pre order you SWTOR if you let me put my lightsaber in your sarlaac cave
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWb3cxA4g_U&feature=related
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Velorath
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Reply #8 on: February 11, 2017, 11:04:24 PM

It's a valid criticism, I guess.



Absolutely. I'm really not a gun person, but partway through the movie I was thinking to myself "it would be cool to have a shotgun like that". Having grown up in the 80's I'm used to gun fetishization but I can't knock other people for it rubbing them the wrong way.
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #9 on: February 11, 2017, 11:19:50 PM

but the the world building is downright stupid at times.


I strongly disagree.

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Evil Elvis
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Reply #10 on: February 12, 2017, 08:49:57 AM

but the the world building is downright stupid at times.


I strongly disagree.

Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #11 on: February 12, 2017, 08:53:35 AM

Why does everyone assume every person in the movie is an assassin? It's very obvious everyone "under the table" is simply a criminal. In the beginning you see the russians moving drugs/gold etc.  This is a massive criminal conspiracy and whole the movie focuses on the assassins it was very obvious to me that other parts exist.

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Merusk
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Reply #12 on: February 12, 2017, 09:58:03 AM

Here's my problem with the world building; it was too forced. In the first movie it was all just part of the story. He happened to have these funny coins that turned out to be currency. There happened to be a single underground hotel that accepted them and had its own rules. It all just unfolded naturally around the rest of the movie.

Here, they had to make bits of it center-stage. The big party for the sister, the cutsey sommelier bits, homeless Morpheus giving a big exposition on how he's been set-up. Most of it wasn't needed. Just show us these bits, lead us into it but don't explain it all. You're diverting from your central story when you do that, it's pointless.  Expanding ang building the world should be organic, we don't need the explanation.


I can't get past the panties - Alluvian
I really like the cocks. - Lantyssa
People rarely believe just how good I am at sucking. - Lantyssa
I love the swinging dongs - Signe
Velorath
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Reply #13 on: February 13, 2017, 03:20:48 AM

I'm not saying it was all perfect but I'm also not going to nitpick a lot of the smaller issues. Also I don't think the world building was forced. Their endgame seems to be to get him to a place where he's on the outs with this whole organization and in order to do that you have to at least somewhat explain the structure and the rules of it. They manage to do that, and it's not like the movie is short on action because of it.

If they just redid the first movie, they'd just be dealing with diminishing returns. My only real issue with this one is that despite knowing the rules and that Wick ultimately had no choice, Cassian still wants to get revenge on Wick rather than the person who hired him.
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Reply #14 on: February 13, 2017, 10:02:10 AM

I'm not saying it was all perfect but I'm also not going to nitpick a lot of the smaller issues. Also I don't think the world building was forced. Their endgame seems to be to get him to a place where he's on the outs with this whole organization and in order to do that you have to at least somewhat explain the structure and the rules of it. They manage to do that, and it's not like the movie is short on action because of it.

If they just redid the first movie, they'd just be dealing with diminishing returns. My only real issue with this one is that despite knowing the rules and that Wick ultimately had no choice, Cassian still wants to get revenge on Wick rather than the person who hired him.

This was my only real problem with this movie.

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Merusk
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Reply #15 on: February 13, 2017, 10:26:27 AM

I feel like there's a missing scene about his relationship with her. He mentions "someone Icared about" when at the bar telling John he'll be coming for him, but it wasn't concrete enough for that reaction.

Again, I'm not saying it's bad just that the first was so well done that the breadcrumbs flowed while here they stick out. I didn't like their addition because of that and the more I thought about it the more it jarred me. Still a great movie.

I can't get past the panties - Alluvian
I really like the cocks. - Lantyssa
People rarely believe just how good I am at sucking. - Lantyssa
I love the swinging dongs - Signe
Lakov_Sanite
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Reply #16 on: February 13, 2017, 10:40:06 AM

There a lot implied about Cassian and the Italian lady in a couple brief scenes. It was what she said about being glad he was by her side and the look she gave them that had my wife turn to me and confirm they were indeed banging.  Also the way Italian lady talked with Wick made me think they had a thing once, maybe he was her bodyguard at the time too and Cassian ended up being a replacement in more ways than one. 

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Reply #17 on: February 20, 2017, 03:08:33 AM

I think the thing with Cassian is him referring to her as "his ward." He isn't an assassin. He is a bodyguard. Different rules.

I fucking loved this movie. It's completely fucking stupid and over the top but who cares. It's a movie about an unstoppable killing machine in a crazy world of assassins hiding in every walk of life and byzantine ass rules with gunsmiths in wine cellars and bullet-proof tailors hiding in sweatshops. It's bonkers for a reason and I love, love, love it. It and the first one are frankly the best video game movies ever made.  Him continually having to take other people's guns to continue his spree had me grinning like an idiot.

The whole last big action sequence is such a great homage to the climax of Enter the Dragon.  I LOVE THIS STUPID GOD DAMNED MOVIE.

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Reply #18 on: February 21, 2017, 01:45:12 AM

The only thing that makes me sad about this franchise is that even if we get a third movie, we will probably never get a movie that details what exactly was entailed in the "impossible task".

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Reply #19 on: February 21, 2017, 05:45:39 AM

The only thing that makes me sad about this franchise is that even if we get a third movie, we will probably never get a movie that details what exactly was entailed in the "impossible task".

Well, he referred to the killing of the lady at her ascension as impossible so probably something to do with the high table.
Ard
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Reply #20 on: February 21, 2017, 11:30:33 PM

The only thing that makes me sad about this franchise is that even if we get a third movie, we will probably never get a movie that details what exactly was entailed in the "impossible task".

This is something I'm actually really afraid is what the third movie is going to be.  Hour and a half flashback to the impossible task, and 20 minutes of him dying a slow painful death in a hail of bullets and knives.  I really want them to leave that as part of his mythology and not try to explain it too hard, I think they'll only end up making it look dumb if they try to do it.
Merusk
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Reply #21 on: February 22, 2017, 11:41:28 AM

Yeah, I agree with that. Sometimes it's best to leave it to the audience.

I can't get past the panties - Alluvian
I really like the cocks. - Lantyssa
People rarely believe just how good I am at sucking. - Lantyssa
I love the swinging dongs - Signe
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