2013 NFL Super Bowl Prediction Challenge

[Paelos]

We get on players for constantly speaking in boring cliches. A player finally gives a great, I owned you, WWE heat of the moment speech, and he gets nailed as a classless thug.

Because we're fair like that.

Also, Erin Andrews job is as fucking useless as poker commentary, but we are forced to pretend that sideline reporting is somehow a legitimate pursuit because it's one of the few ways women can get a job on an NFL broadcast. Moments like the Sherman thing are the only reason it should exist at all, and I for one am glad it happened.

[HaemishM]

He made 1 fucking play. Crabtree made more catches than Sherman had tackles. Whether it was because Sherman was intentionally avoided or not, numbers say Sherman needs to shut his festering gob.

Dude...what?  I know they don't get a lot of coverage, but you are talking like you don't even know who he is.  He got thrown at twice, which is about normal for him.  Throwing at him is a terrible idea.  He obviously talks an insane amount of smack, but the dude backs it up like nobody's business.  He was not covering any one receiver yesterday, which is the only reason Crabtree got any action at all.  

Hate him for his mouth, that's cool, but the guy is down right amazing in coverage.

I KNOW how good a corner he is. I KNOW how good his entire team's defense is. I can easily believe that he IS the best corner in the game.

But in last night's game, which is what I was talking about, Crabtree made more catches than Sherman had tackles or passes defensed. He made one play the entire fucking game and he talks shit LIKE AN ASSHOLE. He is a great cornerback, great footballer WHO IS AN ASSHOLE.

[Nebu]

To be fair, part of the reason that Sherman had so few plays was because teams tend to go away from him.  He's a very good cover corner, but he's also one of the biggest shit talkers in the league.  Maybe he's channeling Michael Jordan.

[Shannow]

Two weeks of Peyton Manning fellatio and hand-wringing over Richard Sherman.

Oh joy.

[Paelos]

Thug is the new subtle N-word. It's annoying how it gets tossed around.

[Ingmar]

It's not all that new, but yeah. I remember the exact moment I realized when it was A Thing; my old DAOC server forum had one of those 'post pictures of yourself' threads, and two black guys (iirc they were brothers) posted a picture of themselves with a baby, I believe it was the baby daughter that one of them had just had. This conservative southern white dude posts "what a couple of thugs" in response (their hair was done in cornrows.) This was mid-2002. It's been a dogwhistle for a long time, but it's nice that realizing it is catching on with the larger public now.

[Paelos]

Yeah in the last decade I think it's a great racism spotter.

There are legitimate thuggish things, but they usually involve guns and violence.

[sickrubik]

People love using it, because they can back out of it... even if they can't actually back out of it because they've judged someone based on color, like with Ing's example.

However, when it comes to "legitimate thuggish things", the problem is still based on race, because you don't see that word ascribed to someone not black.

[Ginaz]

He made 1 fucking play. Crabtree made more catches than Sherman had tackles. Whether it was because Sherman was intentionally avoided or not, numbers say Sherman needs to shut his festering gob.

Dude...what?  I know they don't get a lot of coverage, but you are talking like you don't even know who he is.  He got thrown at twice, which is about normal for him.  Throwing at him is a terrible idea.  He obviously talks an insane amount of smack, but the dude backs it up like nobody's business.  He was not covering any one receiver yesterday, which is the only reason Crabtree got any action at all.  

Hate him for his mouth, that's cool, but the guy is down right amazing in coverage.

I KNOW how good a corner he is. I KNOW how good his entire team's defense is. I can easily believe that he IS the best corner in the game.

But in last night's game, which is what I was talking about, Crabtree made more catches than Sherman had tackles or passes defensed. He made one play the entire fucking game and he talks shit LIKE AN ASSHOLE. He is a great cornerback, great footballer WHO IS AN ASSHOLE.

He was a little over the top in his interview but if you listen to his explanation later he did it because Crabtree was talking shit to him and other Seattle DBs.  Same thing happened with the whole "U MAD BRO!" thing with Tom Brady.  Brady was talking shit because he was up by 2 scores and basically said to them some variation of "Do you know who I am?" or "I'm Tom Brady and you're not, see me after the game".  Well, Sherman saw him after the game.  It just didn't go down like Brady thought it would.  Sherman is a pretty smart and articulate guy and I don't have a problem with what he's said.  The NFL can be boring as fuck at times and we all bitch about it yet when someone does something colourful what do some people do?  Bitch about that.

[Cyrrex]

Yeah, it just comes off as too much butt-hurt when you say things like "he only made one play all day!!".  That is dumb, and you know it.

I will put this out there, however:  I do not understand nor agree with the way we try to protect the precious little feelings of millionaire professional athletes.  If you and I are playing a pickup game of (insert sport here), then sure, we need to behave like civilized human beings.  These guys, on the other hand, are extremely well paid, idolized, modern day gladiators and I give less than two shits about them getting sad when some guy celebrates a touchdown with a teammate, or pulls out a pen and autographs the ball, or whatever it is that has been ruled illegal these days.  That some of you then get butt-hurt on their behalves at the same time just blows my mind.  Direct taunting, sure that should probably be a penalty offense, as should be anything that causes significant delay to the game. 

These guys are at each other ALL the time on the field.  Non-stop talking, taunting, intimidating, posturing.  But as soon as it actually becomes visible and we can watch endless video replays of it?  Suddenly it is an outrage.  Give me a break.

[Chimpy]

The reason those things are penalties is not to coddle the feelings of the opposition, it is to attempt to keep tempers down so a riot doesn't happen every game. The NFL is a game about controlled violence and they are trying to keep the violence in check. If they allowed the players to say/do whatever they wanted a typical NFL game wouldn't make it to halftime before the riot police would have to separate the players with teargas and tazer cannons.

I don't give a rat's ass about the feelings of the players.

[Cyrrex]

Uh, no, I don't buy that.  You don't have to look much farther than to a thread like this to see that the fans get all bent out of shape over it.  The NFL doesn't want to upset the fans.  I can't recall a time where the NFL ever had an issue with actual fighting (other than isolated stuff here and there), even back when the celebrations were at their high point.

Because again, they are already doing all this shit talking.  Endlessly.  When Sherman gives the choke sign to Kaep, it is no different than the kind of shit they have probably being saying to him the entire game, and I am sure he has heard it a billion times before.  The difference is that little Billy at home sees it, and we sure can't have that.

[HaemishM]

Yeah, it just comes off as too much butt-hurt when you say things like "he only made one play all day!!".  That is dumb, and you know it.

I will put this out there, however:  I do not understand nor agree with the way we try to protect the precious little feelings of millionaire professional athletes.  If you and I are playing a pickup game of (insert sport here), then sure, we need to behave like civilized human beings.  These guys, on the other hand, are extremely well paid, idolized, modern day gladiators and I give less than two shits about them getting sad when some guy celebrates a touchdown with a teammate, or pulls out a pen and autographs the ball, or whatever it is that has been ruled illegal these days.  That some of you then get butt-hurt on their behalves at the same time just blows my mind.  Direct taunting, sure that should probably be a penalty offense, as should be anything that causes significant delay to the game. 

You are not listening to a word I've said. I could give two rat fucks about Crabtree's feelings. This is not about Crabtree's feelings. This is about being a gracious winner, not a sniveling, chest-pounding neanderthalic ASSHOLE. It's about winning with honor and class. It's about getting to the end of a well-fought contest and shaking hands not to coddle the other team's feelings but to congratulate them on a game well-played.

It's the difference between fun PVP and not-fun - because it's a GAME. It's a fucking game. There's not one reason to piss on the losing team in some kind of macho bullshit "I IS DA BETTA MAN!" bullshit. It's why people complain about GRIEFING and it's the attitude that leads to bullshit like Trammel. Most people who like to compete love doing so only until the other guy starts teabagging their corpse and then it's not fun anymore because suddenly it became personal for no good goddamn reason. With Sherman, it apparently WAS personal and it was based on something that happened MONTHS ago off the field - which shows that he's a petty little shit as well as being a poor winner.

Be a gracious winner. Keep your petty off-field beefs off the fucking field because it's got nothing to do with the game and it makes the entire game look bad.

[Cyrrex]

That's a perfectly valid opinion.  God knows there are many, many people who share that exact opinion (despite my words, I myself would try to act with respect to other players in a similar situation).  My point of contention was that you kept harping on the fact that Sherman only made one play, and he had somehow been outplayed over the course of the game.  That's pants on head territory, and you can't possibly believe it.  I am forced to assume you only said it out of anger at the situation in general.

[HaemishM]

Actually no. I only root against the Seahawks because I hate them (especially Golden Tate, another asshole) but I'm happy to admit they deserved to win that game. I couldn't really care whether the 49ers beat them or not because I don't have any skin in the Niners either. But Sherman comes out and says he is the better player and that Crabtree is a "sorry" or "mediocre" player and the statistics DO NOT BEAR THAT OUT. Sherman DID only make ONE PLAY in the game - whether that be from Kap not targeting him or from his awesome coverage (and I would assume it's a lot of both) doesn't matter. Crabtree had 4 receptions for 52 yards on 8 targets. At least 2 of those receptions were much needed receptions on 3rd down to keep the chains moving against a tough defense. Sherman had 2 tackles and 1 pass defensed. His PD just happened to be at clutch time. Again, not sure if that was because the ball wasn't coming to his side of the field or not - that's not in the stats. The stats say he only made 3 total plays to Crabtree's 4. On the basis of stats, Crabtree made more plays - Sherman's just had a bigger impact at a more visible time in the game.

What I'm saying was that his stats, the visible impact both had on the game does not justify saying that "Crabtree is a sorry receiver" or a "mediocre receiver." Boldin, SF's leading receiver in that game had only 5 catches for 53 yards and 1 TD on 9 targets. Is Boldin a "mediocre" receiver? No. So don't go acting like your 1 play makes you the Muhameed Ali Jesus Christ Superstar on national TV.

[Cyrrex]

Yeah, his saying that Crabtree is mediocre is pretty far-fetched, I'll give you that.  "Sorry" is a more qualitative judgement, and I actually agree with that one    And yes, saying either of those things after the game on national TV was rather unwise in any event.

As for your breakdown, we'll just have to agree to disagree.  There is no question at all in my mind that Kaepernick, just like every other QB in the league, tried to keep the ball away from him.  He was definitely going to Maxwell's side of the field.  I think it is patently wrong to imply that just because Crabtree was involved in more plays that he somehow had as much or more impact.  Sherman's best games are the ones where his name is rarely called, and this was no exception.  And as for Crabtree, do you not remember the short arm thing he did on a critical play in the the 4th quarter?  Weak sauce.

[Paelos]

Crabtree is rather mediocre though. He's had one outstanding year in 2012 where he achieved 14th in receiving yards and 9 TDs.

Otherwise? 34th in 2011, 44th in 2010, and 60th in 2009?

Taken into account his total production, I can't say he's even in the top 30 of receivers I want on the field right now.

[ghost]

Richard Sherman is awesome.  I'm glad to see someone with cajones like in the old days.  The only reason we see this shit now is because they're all stupid enough to use twitter. 

[Ingmar]

Crabtree is rather mediocre though. He's had one outstanding year in 2012 where he achieved 14th in receiving yards and 9 TDs.

Otherwise? 34th in 2011, 44th in 2010, and 60th in 2009?

Taken into account his total production, I can't say he's even in the top 30 of receivers I want on the field right now.

2012 was also the only year he had a full preseason and never got hurt at any point IIRC.

[Paelos]

Injuries play into your ranking as a great receiver. Especially over 5 years.

[Surlyboi]

Tom Brady weighs in on Richard Sherman.

"I don't know him at all. I've watched him play. He's that kind of guy," Brady said. "So, you know. I approach the game—and I have respect for my opponents. That's the way our team always plays. We win with graciousness, and when we lose, we could do better. Some teams don't always do that, or that's not their program."

Except you haven't won since they made you stop filming the other teams, Tom.

[01101010]

I actually liked the rest of that interview blurb:

The only way to counter that is to beat them. When you don’t win, it’s hard not to say — you just gotta shut your mouth and listen to it. Maybe when you get an opportunity down the road, maybe that’s a source of motivation. But they got a good team. They played well all year. They played well at home. And that’s why they advanced, too. -T.Brady

[Paelos]

He's still got his rings. Richard Sherman doesn't have anything yet.

Also, I'd trade Russell for Tom any day of the week.

[Shannow]

nononoo SPYGATE!!!!

SPYGATE SPYGATE SPYGATE!!!!

SPYGATE!

btw did I hear correctly that the John Elway Bronco's teams of the late 90's got dinged pretty hard for some big time cap violations?

nevermind....SPYGATE!!!

 

edit: Actually the whole story is indicative of the whole manufactured hand-wringing media crap about this story. Brady was directly asked a question about Sherman on his regular Monday morning appearance on sports radio. His comments, I think, weren't all that over the top but christ some of the headlines on Yahoo, etc were.

[Surlyboi]

Gotta love riling up pats fans.

Scream spygate all you want and point to other teams that may or may not have done it, Bellichick the homeless actually got busted doing it and the taint will always be there.

[Paelos]

He likely won't win again. As I've said before though, I just think hating Brady is a waste of time. Dude's basically living the dream.

[Megrim]

'murricans cannot into sportsmanship

hue

[Surlyboi]

He likely won't win again. As I've said before though, I just think hating Brady is a waste of time. Dude's basically living the dream.

I don't hate Brady as much as I hate the way the media slobbers all over him like he can do no wrong and he overcame some great hardship.

[Ingmar]

I've wrapped around to liking him now, the way he embraced the whole high five thing won him a lot of points with me.

[Shannow]

He likely won't win again. As I've said before though, I just think hating Brady is a waste of time. Dude's basically living the dream.

I don't hate Peyton as much as I hate the way the media slobbers all over him like he can do no wrong and he overcame some great hardship.

fify.

[Yegolev]

Broncos.

Seahawks.

.fact   

[Paelos]

He likely won't win again. As I've said before though, I just think hating Brady is a waste of time. Dude's basically living the dream.

I don't hate Peyton as much as I hate the way the media slobbers all over him like he can do no wrong and he overcame some great hardship.

fify.

The difference is Peyton is probably one of the most likable human beings in football. Brady doesn't fit that mold except for Pats fans.

[Phildo]

Wasn't Brady the one who left his pregnant wife for a supermodel?

[Paelos]

Wasn't Brady the one who left his pregnant wife for a supermodel?

Girlfriend, not wife.

[Phildo]

So he knocked her up out of wedlock?  Tom Brady sure is Mr. American Values.