Elite: Dangerous

[Sir T]

From what I've seen if they yanked the "offline Mode" they game would immediate turn into the same sort of ganking massacre simulation that Eve online was when it first started and to some extent still is. "No hand holding sandbox" means  20 or so 15 year old's on the undock blowing people up and giggling about how leet they are. Its sad to say but the biggest flaw of not having an online mode would be the players playing the damn game. If you didn't have players a totally online mode would work fine 

I enjoyed coming back to eve because there was finally a way for me to make money while avoiding all the idiots and just exploring and have a good time by myself. But even the mighty Eve systems are totally samey. There are only 4 types of interiors and not that much variation on exteriors for stations, and most of the time when you are off scanning you are in an empty system with no station anyway. Even the sites you find are just 3 or 4 variations on a theme and that has gotten samey.

Sounds like E:D would be right up my alley then. I think you need to either send your concerns to the developers or change your expectations falc.

[apocrypha]

Look, I've been telling Apocrypha this whole time right here "what were you expecting?". And now I am very close to join the ranks of those who were expecting "more" simply because while it's true that they keep adding a lot of things, what they add is directed grind instead of anything that makes you care other than getting the next big ship.

I'm sorry for piping up again, but this really was what my problem with E:D was, and still is.

It wasn't that I burned out on it, it was that I gradually became aware that the entirely reasonable expectations for this game were never going to be met. And by reasonable expectations I mean the expectations that the game, on release, would be fun & interesting, would be a modern game worthy of playing, would avoid forcing the player to repeat boring actions over and over again just to increment some numbers to let you repeat those actions again, faster.

All the while I was playing the beta I was saying to myself "this is only beta, this obvious placeholder mechanic for trading/combat/mining/ship upgrading/landing/etc. is going to be replaced with the REAL mechanic or system by launch date". Except none of them ever were. When I realised that the poor, unimaginative, out-dated implementation of every single game system was what Braben's vision actually was, well, then I bailed. The game is, for all the blather about billions of star systems, boring, repetitive and shallow, and none of the expansions are going to change that because Braben has zero imagination and has learned nothing in all the decades since Elite.

I didn't have outrageous expectations, I had entirely reasonable ones, and they were absolutely unmet.

[ajax34i]

When I realised that the poor, unimaginative, out-dated implementation of every single game system was what Braben's vision actually was, well, then I bailed.

I don't know whether or not he has imagination, but I think his "vision" is delivering on the nostalgia of Elite, exactly.  I mean, I got the distinct impression that they're not implementing any of the improvements to spaceflight sims because they want to deliver the "feel" of Elite, and it's a dated game so the "feel" feels dated.

I argued on the boards (long ago) about changing the death insurance system because it felt stupid, and even the fans pointed out that it wouldn't feel like Elite if any changes were made.  So ok I don't want to play this game then.  My biggest issue, though, was camera shake on landing that gave me eye strain pain, with nobody acknowledging my complaint or adding a "turn camera shake off" toggle over several patches.  I have no clue if it's still on with no options, probably still is.

Anyway, sorry for the tangent.

[Hoax]

vanguard. in spaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaace

even the E:D thread is boring, at least SC has a truly fearsome cult and life destruction stories to gawk at.

[Pennilenko]

I really like Elite:Dangerous, however, I play it mainly as a space ship sim only in small time chunks. I can see how I would be super bored and disappointed if I gave it more time than I do.

I also think it helps that my expectation was that it was going to be a literal copy of original elite with modern graphics.

[Lucas]

"Powerplay" update launches today! Here's a trailer for it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWPhk5Gclbo

[Sir T]

Just looked at the specs for this and my computer burst out crying. Guess I'll just buy Tropico instead :P

[Samprimary]

how does one find a high intensity RES that is of any intensity shy of "ghost town"

how does one pay the exorbitant ship integrity repair fees and be able to profitably explore

what's going on with this patch yo

[Falconeer]

I can't really answer that, I am sorry, but I'm here to post the first "Powerplay video" that Frontier released today trying to highlight and explain the intricacies of the new system. Complicated enough that the whole series will be made of 4 parts.

It's worth watching, cause it's pretty.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWcL8qEGg7Q

[Pennilenko]

Here is my short explanation of the powerplay update.

RES bounty hunting is ruined.
Ship modules sell back for a 10 percent loss.
Pledging to a power yields no real rewards for the effort.
Mining is still boring as shit.
Mission running is mildly more rewarding than before.
Compared to before the update, game is grind x2.

That is all. I have no idea what Frontier is trying to do, but I have no fun now.

[Falconeer]

They shifted the combat money from RES to CZ. Which is a good move in my opinion, as RES were riskless and CZs are not.
The 10% module loss is on hold, I believe, isn't it?

[Samprimary]

i can't get any money anywhere and the remaining methodology to gain money is twice as boring and provides at most a third to half the income as before.

The costs on ship repairs for integrity make it so I can't do long runs or exploration.

I'm basically just losing money fast now and when I try powerplay stuff it is twice as boring and provides pretty much literally no money.

What the hell do I do?

[Sir T]

You celebrate the Eve Online experience.

(Meaning this is like Eve Online, to be clear)

[Samprimary]

pleh.

[Samprimary]

Ok so this is officially a Bad Patch. Please someone give me someplace I can go system-wise to do combat bonds.

I don't know where they are or how to find them help

[Falconeer]

Not sure this will help you, maybe.

[Samprimary]

That does kinda! I will follow that particular inquiry and see where it goes and what they find (and if the currently bafflingly broke RES's get retuned)

I'm still hunting down a way to do combat bonds instead.

[Pennilenko]

We should be able to access galnet as soon as we jump into a system and have access to the nav beacon. That was we could scan the news for that system super easy and see if there is a war on or not.

[Falconeer]

Part 2 and Part 3 of the Pretty Powerplay tutorial.

[Samprimary]

Alright, so Powerplay is bad in a way that most E:D supporters aren't really equipped to see, unless they themselves have hit a reasonable burnout point on the grind. And where it's bad it's really, really quite bad.

It does nothing to alleviate or diversify grind, since it only offers a parallel new grind (and goddamn is it grindy as fuck) for less tangible progress than you already have in a game which already hits a giant grind wall.

It's the sort of thing that comes part and parcel with gradually increasing loss of users, no matter what logic is used to defend the game by the core supporters, I suppose. It can't be a really popular opinion to just up and say "powerplay is bad and intensifies rather than ameliorates the game's lack of basic fun things to do"

[Samprimary]

Solution for duration of crisis:

- Join Arissa Lavigny-Duval.

- Grind up 100 merit points using any method you can tolerate the dullness of.

- Turn them in and get the Rank 2 loyalty bonus, with the accompanying 20% bounty increase.

- As Lavigny-Duval is currently the second most powerful faction, aforementioned bounty increase is now 40%.

- Lavigny-Duval also provides a 20% increase on all bounties handed in in her systems.

- Promptly ignore Powerplay, and go RES bounty hunting at normal (not high or low intensity) RES's, and enjoy your 160% bounty return rate.

[Falconeer]

What's weird is that the three actions you can choose to do, prepare, expand and control, are not really that different in terms of gameplay from each other or from anything you were doing before Powerplay. Worse, they are LESS rewarding unless you care for some flags on a map that you are almost certainly not going to be able to move by yourself, so the illusion if being part of a nation is just that: an illusion. And this is my own take which is not popular but AS LONG AS YOU CAN PLAY OFFLINE Powerplay is a joke. A whole expansion that is meant to give players reasons to go to certain areas and fight for control (including the ability to shoot each other) is made insignificant by the abily everyone has to still grind Powerplay quests while NOT being online (so only fighting the AI but still affecting the online balance of Powers). Ugh.

[Pennilenko]

I tried to voice some of my observations on the official forums regarding some of the problems regarding powerplay. I got shouted down pretty quickly.

[Falconeer]

Powerplay can't even be defended with the "OLD ELITE" mantra. It's new, it sounds great on paper, it has potential, but it does NOT work in its present incarnation.

[Samprimary]

On a more analytical level it honestly doesn't even feel like the best investment of resources — the game has a number of parts that need to be plugged up hardcore.

If I were in charge of the game I could have plugged a serious number of holes in the core gameplay for half as much effort. Including but not limited to overhauling the bulletin board mission system and offering actual tours of duty.

[Viin]

You already bought the game, they don't care about /your/ feelings.

[Falconeer]

That's not true though. They need to sell you the expansion, and they definitely need you to rave about the game to seel more boxes.

[Samprimary]

You already bought the game, they don't care about /your/ feelings.

Evidently, yeah. But adding to this game is obviously an added expense and costs plenty of man hours, so I would only presume they intend to have the fruit of those labors pay off with a more playable game that people will continue to buy and/or microtrans, or otherwise keep the property viable enough for future expansion that can be sold. If no, then why bother making that investment at all?

As it stands they're definitely spending the money, but not in ways that keep the property vitalized.

The largest problems I see are these:



1. The game is an infinite selection of the same three environments separated by a banal frame shift traversal method that becomes old for the vast majority of players very fast. Spacedock, Open space, Asteroid belt. Repetition in the themes are extreme. You can travel the galaxy and only ultimately be meaningfully interfacing with these three locations. Variety is often very minimal.

2. The game further distills the limited selection of environments down to a painfully small amount of actions that you repeat to progress in the game. Repetitious corkscrewing across FSD space to land ships and collect money via trading, or repetitious shooting of hapless pirates to collect money via bounties, or repetitious dodging of stars in the infinite three to four action process that constitutes exploration. Or, for a hearty band of masochists, you can mine rocks — the glittering Tritanium-level standard of wasting your life away In Space™ (appropriately, it's extra grueling and inferior as a profit choice in Elite, so it's how you spot the true masochists).

3. You can do other things but they are often so minimally viable for profit and/or so frustratingly obtuse that most players will never bother. The bulletin board system has required drastic overhaul since forever and missions are one of the weakest parts of the game, a glaring failure that is relatively easily remedied, but is not.

Last but not least — a statement which is so powerfully true in its simplicity that only a bare minimum of Elite players will dare acknowledge it:

4. The weapons balance in the game is extremely poor, which ultimately means that the combat model in the game is necessarily also extremely poor.

[Trippy]

But is it fun?

[Samprimary]

I'm satisfied with my purchase ($free) and could tell you how to get like 10-20 bucks worth out of this game as an adventure in learning spaceflight.

As for the overall fun factor, I am not sure whoever is in charge of the project at present is going to have a real good time with the present maintenance of active players.

[Falconeer]

Looks like some insane Death Racing PvP mode is coming to Elite. Here, straight from the E3 Xbox trailer.

Ye gods.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jG5J5hCAC4c

[Draegan]

When I tried the game when it was released, it felt like the game was just a game of daily quests from WOW but with all the landing and taking off etc.

[Pennilenko]

When I tried the game when it was released, it felt like the game was just a game of daily quests from WOW but with all the landing and taking off etc.

That's a much better comparison than what I could come up with.

[Samprimary]

*rolls into thread*

hey did they change anything meaningful about the game grind how we doing thanks

*falls off thread*

[Falconeer]

No not at all. And the next thing on the horizon is a PvP arena where you don't even use your own ships.

There's some hope curiosity for August 5th when they will announce something big and new at Gamescon. So far, no idea of what it could be.