US East Coast weather fun ahead

[Sjofn]

My sister in PA has her power back, and my parents have THEIR power back (they live in Ocean County, not very far from Seaside ... but far enough, thankfully). Not sure about my other sister, but I'm pretty sure hers is probably back too.

I also have the terrible "half my childhood just washed away" feeling.

[Surlyboi]

Vast amounts of stuff just got trashed in a key area. That's your key phrase right there. Unlike Ground Zero, most of the shit that went out here affects a helluva lot more people and New Yorkers will not take people dicking around with necessary services lightly. If this takes more than a week to get at least a significant chunk of the city up am running again, heads are gonna roll.

Katrina was easy to dither on because most of the people in the hardest hit areas were poor and underrepresented. The combined wealth of one or two blocks in TriBeCa alone is probably greater than that of everyone in the Ninth Ward. That money is going to get shit fixed really quickly. People in the "Dead Zone" are already starting shit.

[Tale]

If this takes more than a week to get at least a significant chunk of the city up am running again, heads are gonna roll.

Limited electricity may be back in that timeframe.

But no matter how much money anyone puts into the job, they can't just pump out the subway and hit the on switch. Same goes for all other underground infrastructure that is full of salt water, from subway stations to shopping malls to tunnels full of cable. Its whole insides will need replaced. I would estimate months.

Even if you have power, all the equipment below ground, including the escalators down, is now trash. Am I wrong?

[lamaros]

Just the stimulus the economy needs.

[Tale]

Here is the MTA's Hurricane Recovery Subway Map. The dulled areas are out of service.

The MTA is $31 billion in debt and going backwards. Nobody put anything away for a rainy day.

[Ingmar]

The debt probably isn't relevant, since this will be paid for with emergency funding from other government entitles (state, federal, whatever.)

[Tale]

The debt probably isn't relevant, since this will be paid for with emergency funding from other government entitles (state, federal, whatever.)

The kind of irony that would take us to Politics.

So I'll go elsewhere: Tokyo apparently has enormous purpose-built tunnels to drain flood water.

[Signe]

My sister in PA has her power back, and my parents have THEIR power back (they live in Ocean County, not very far from Seaside ... but far enough, thankfully). Not sure about my other sister, but I'm pretty sure hers is probably back too.

I also have the terrible "half my childhood just washed away" feeling.

My sister, who lives in suburban Philly, didn't lose power for very long.  Both my nephews (one in Ardmore and one in Baltimore) are fine although flooded.  My cousin in Sea Isle who wouldn't evacuate is fine although still stupid.  All you lot seem okay. So I'm happy.  Sort of. 

I also have the terrible "half my childhood just washed away" feeling.

Me too.  I spent lots of happy summers as a kid at the Jersey shore.     So it's crappy... still have fond memories.  I didn't think it was crappy when I was 8.

[rattran]

I grew up on Brigantine, looking at the devastation pictures is odd, as there's a lot of stuff built there in the last 20 years that is in areas that ALWAYS got fucked in even minor hurricanes. Houses in front of the dunes, massive condos built on what used to be part of the lagoon, etc. Shit, did they forget there's no building north of 14th st because the storm in 1962 washed away those 4 blocks killing people? Stupid fuckers and greedy developers are stupid and greedy.

[Jherad]

Last night we went and picked up my mother in law from Monmouth County NJ. She's been without power since the storm and wanted to stay but the weather was turning cold. They may remain without power for another week apparently.

Very eerie driving at night past dead strip malls without a single light on.

[Signe]

I grew up on Brigantine, looking at the devastation pictures is odd, as there's a lot of stuff built there in the last 20 years that is in areas that ALWAYS got fucked in even minor hurricanes. Houses in front of the dunes, massive condos built on what used to be part of the lagoon, etc. Shit, did they forget there's no building north of 14th st because the storm in 1962 washed away those 4 blocks killing people? Stupid fuckers and greedy developers are stupid and greedy.

Every time we went to the Jersey shore when I was little, I would beg, cry and scream to go to Brigantine Castle.  I LOVED it.  Too bad it burned down.     I'd go there now if it were still around!

[Strazos]

Mother's place in Sicklerville (maybe 40 minutes from AC) was untouched.

No casinos for me this weekend.

[Signe]

I'm pretty sure you're too young to go to casinos anyway.  At least you were last time I checked your age. 

[Tale]

Brooklyn-Manhattan bus line. Block 2 of 6.



The subway tunnels are still full of water. Even when they are dry, it will take some work to get them ready. This is not going away anytime soon.

[Bzalthek]

I dunno, by the time you finally get a bus you'll either have wasted enough time to walk there or it's time to go home.

[Ghambit]

I'm really starting to get a post-Andrew vibe (soup kitchens and angst) with this, in agreement with Schild.  It's starting to be a true clusterscrew in NYC.  There just isnt enough response for the shear mass of humanity that now needs help; and the infrastructure required to run these communities won't come fully online for a while.  This is bad.  Real bad.     This is before even considering everywhere else.   

Hell, I'd forgotten about Staten Island (figured things werent that bad) but apparently they're truly assfucked over there.  Half million people there.      Not an evac-zone?  Srysly?  They took the maximum surge on the nose.

And looking at the Subway map... Brooklyn is now truly an island.  How's that supposed to work?  Insane.

[Merusk]

Here's a dimension I'm sure a lot of us haven't even considered.  I hadn't until I heard it on the radio a bit ago.

The elderly.

No power means no elevators means starving elderly trapped 10+ stories up.

Children, don't let your parents move to the city.

[Pennilenko]

I really did pause for a double take at all of the people from there on my Facebook saying things like everything will be back up in a week.

[Lantyssa]

They haven't been through a hurricane like this before.  They can't conceive of how much work it takes to get the infrastructure back up.

[Venkman]

I really did pause for a double take at all of the people from there on my Facebook saying things like everything will be back up in a week.

Middle class and the afluent have options. Taxis instead of buses instead of subways. Bikes if they're close, work from home if not, can afford hotels and avoid the truly disaster-hit washed-away areas in part because they lived elsewhere.

I'm not saying all your Facebook links are rich of course, just that I would guess they don't feel as affected by those for whom Meals on Wheels is climbing 25 quiet and darks stories to bring food to. NPR has been running stories about the elderly the last few nights.

The people for whom a city is usually the best of safety nets are the ones for whom I feel worst. At least with Blizzards they can use heat elements to clear paths. Nothing's clearing water in this amount except time.

[Nightblade]

Hell, I'd forgotten about Staten Island (figured things werent that bad) but apparently they're truly assfucked over there.  Half million people there.      Not an evac-zone?  Srysly?  They took the maximum surge on the nose.

And looking at the Subway map... Brooklyn is now truly an island.  How's that supposed to work?  Insane.

I live on staten island, and yes "fucked in the ass" is the word I'd use to describe it. Huge strips of buildings with no power, property ruined, a new business across the street from my store is decimated and my place isnt necessarily in too good a shape. It will take at least a month to rebuild. Beached cars, coolers and dead fish are baking in the winter sun.

Some chase banks offering free cell phone charging, people without heat having to use their stove to keep cool, Long Island apparently to go 3-4 weeks without power and the only meager news these poor people get is

"This was worse than we thought" -Con Ed

[Trippy]

Here's a dimension I'm sure a lot of us haven't even considered.  I hadn't until I heard it on the radio a bit ago.

The elderly.

No power means no elevators means starving elderly trapped 10+ stories up.

Children, don't let your parents move to the city.

They'll probably die of hypothermia before they starve to death

[Tale]

I'm really starting to get a post-Andrew vibe (soup kitchens and angst) with this, in agreement with Schild.

Do you mean me? I was the one posting that this looks broken for months.

I was in NYC for 5 days in August and got a good look at the city. I happened to be in a three-month competition to cover distance on foot, so I went for huge walks. From Battery Park to 103rd Street and much in between. Out to Stuyvesant Town, along the shore to the Brooklyn Bridge, over the bridge and back, back up to 42nd Street. I took the Staten Island ferry. I went places on the subway. Came in from Newark on the train. Left via the A train to JFK.

A lot of the infrastructure seemed underfunded and dilapidated ($30 billion MTA debt explains a lot). I wouldn't like to have the task of getting that back online, but good luck to them.

[Surlyboi]

One of my guys was talking about a special needs home near him in Chelsea that's without power and how the residents are handling it. Con Ed moved in with an emergency generator today.

I walked around in the Deadzone this evening before finding myself a cab to get back to my side of the power line. It was super eerie. There are some pockets of power here and there, but the majority was like an urban Burning Man. People walking in groups, holding flashlights or carrying glowsticks so they could see and be seen. Another one of my guys that lives on the Lower East Side, who's now crashing at my place was telling me that you can tell who you should avoid by the lack of flashlights. It's almost post-apocalyptic. There are also spots where the police are setting up portable light stands.

Time Warner is sending portable wifi and charging trucks through the deadzone to keep people up and running with their portable devices. All the cafes and places with free wifi are absolutely swamped with people trying to get stuff done.

We've been bussing employees into one of our retail stores and carpooling some of the corporate people who don't want to telecommute into the office we have above the power line. The Wife's office is down the block from ground zero and she's figuring she won't get back in there before we leave for vacation next week.

There are stirrings of discontent beginning to show up on twitter and other social networks. Some people in the deadzone and Staten Island are less-than-thrilled that the powers that be are spending money to make sure the marathon happens, money they think would be better spent getting power back to affected areas.

This sums it up pretty well...

[Ghambit]

The "Power Line?"  That's what you guys call it or did you just make that up? Gawd.  Next, people downtown will start speaking Gutterspeak and having retinal shinejobs done for nightwalks.  Deadzone couriers could be called Shadowrunners. 

Just how long do you uptown folk think you'll last with downtown near shut down and most of the outer burroughs near unreachable?  The slowdowns will creep uptown sure enough.  Where will you get the staffing?  Are you hiding murlocs below ground or some shit?

NewYorkers are the most impatient people on the planet.  I give them till football Sunday before they start really phreaking out.

[Surlyboi]

Deadzone, SoPo (South of Power) there's a bunch of names. Those two are probably the most popular that I've been hearing.

People are already antsy. Just saw a news piece about the gas lines and fights breaking out. That shit may actually spill uptown, but we'll see. If ConEd gets a majority of the power back up by the weekend, that'll quell things quite a bit. If not, the National Guard is here in fairly large numbers, right now providing support services, but I'm pretty sure they can be repurposed for other shit on the fly.

My houseguests are going to house sit while we're in Fiji, if we can get out. If shit gets real, he breaks out the assault weapons. 

[Trippy]

The "Power Line?"  That's what you guys call it or did you just make that up? Gawd.  Next, people downtown will start speaking Gutterspeak and having retinal shinejobs done for nightwalks.  Deadzone couriers could be called Shadowrunners. 

Just how long do you uptown folk think you'll last with downtown near shut down and most of the outer burroughs near unreachable?  The slowdowns will creep uptown sure enough.  Where will you get the staffing?  Are you hiding murlocs below ground or some shit?

NewYorkers are the most impatient people on the planet.  I give them till football Sunday before they start really phreaking out.

Stop the Doomcasting please. We really don't need people here predicting the end of the world because of Sandy.

[Ingmar]

ConEd claims Manhattan will pretty much all have power by Sunday.

[Morat20]

ConEd claims Manhattan will pretty much all have power by Sunday.

New York's a bit lucky there. It's all..compact. Fixing one thing fixes a lot of people at once.

When Ike came through, you not only had blown transformers, you had individual lines down everywhere. My home was out 11 days, because the only line down my street was down about two blocks away. The power was on right before the downed line, off behind it. But it was only about a 100 homes, so it had really low priority. They were fixing big transformers, making sure grocery stores and gas stations had power, etc.

I suspect 99% of NYC will be powered well before the less urban areas are back up.

I've seen some pictures of the coast. Looks bad. During Ike I personally saw a big yacht (60 or so fee at leastt, three decks maybe?) that was wedged up between two houses in Clear Lake -- Houses had to be 500k, minimum. Don't even want to know how much the boat cost. Sucker was just leaned up against one of the houses, with about five feet of clearance on the other side. Only damage to the house was a broken railing on the second story. Boat had an entire propeller missing.

Have no idea how they got it back in the water.  And Clear Lake is a heck of a lot more sheltered than Atlantic City or Jersey Shore looked.

[Merusk]

I've mentioned it before, but you're lucky in that it was a road line, Morat and not the line to your house from the main line.  I used to know a lineman in WoW and he told me the priorities a long time ago. Essentially residential and subdivisions are at the bottom and lines from the mains to individual houses are at the bottom of that list.

When Ike came through there's a house down the corner from me that was so fed-up with waiting they put a sign on their lawn, I guess to try and shame Duke Energy in to fixing them sooner. They were at 21 or 22 days before it was finally fixed.

[Morat20]

Yeah, I know. My in-laws were down another three days -- one of a cluster of four houses. The entire rest of the neighborhood had been up a week when their power was finally restored. I think it was some sort of sub-something or other. All four houses apparently had buried lines to the pole, and something was hosed up with just that pole where it went into the ground.

The way a bunch of New York is setup, there's a lot less individual stuff broken, I think. Mostly big stuff that broke lots of people, rather than tons and tons of individual lines down.

[Ingmar]

Fuckin' Duke Energy. 

[Surlyboi]

Stop the Doomcasting please. We really don't need people here predicting the end of the world because of Sandy.

People have been doomcasting NYC for years. A lot of them New Yorkers. Short the the end of the world, we'll still be here.

[MahrinSkel]

Wired article about "Unwatering" NYC, essentially the Army Corp of Engineers is bringing in a bunch of huge pumps (many of them from New Orleans) and the associated support equipment (generators, etc.).  The problem isn't just removing the water, but not doing additional damage while doing so.

I'd say that we're looking at a few weeks before most of the NYC subway and vehicle tunnel system is functional.  Some pieces will doubtless turn out to have taken major damage and be offline for months/years.

--Dave

[Quinton]

Just catching this thread now... was totally not up on just how much impact of the storm there was in NYC... hope everyone out there is doing okay through all this.

Bloomberg's ASL interpreter is fascinating to watch -- a friend pointed out this blog post illustrating that a lot of the facial expressions and posture are not just for emphasis, but actually grammatical elements -- I had absolutely no idea ASL had these layers beyond the gestures... http://www.mentalfloss.com/blogs/archives/149593

Realtime translation is crazy impressive.