London 2013

[Yegolev]

It is time.  We are starting to seriously look at places to stay for a London visit in 2013.

Overview: We want to be Jane Goodall but for English instead of zebras or whatever she lived with.  We want to see the neighborhood from the perspective of someone that lives there.  This means grocery shopping, cooking and such.

Objective of thread: Gather intelligence from people familiar with London.

First candidate is strong.  It is a townhome in Westminster, neighborhood seems to be called Maida Vale.  Apparently it is within walking distance to anything and I'm not likely to get stabbed or accosted by Dickensian orphans.  Opinions?

[Lantyssa]

Don't you need the orphans for a real-to-life experience?

[Miasma]

They call chips crisps and elevators lifts.  Crazy.

[proudft]

Both times I've vacationed in London we stayed in Kensington, once in a townhouse and one in a random hotel from hotwire.com.  It seemed perfectly nice, if perhaps a bit staid. There are tube stations all over the damn place in London, you'll probably be super close to one (especially from an Amurican perspective) no matter where you stay.  You get yourself an Oyster card day one and pop on and off the tube and/or buses as you please, it's like some kind of magical transportation miracle.

[croaker69]

They call chips crisps and elevators lifts.  Crazy.

Also the first floor is the second floor...

[Lantyssa]

Have you noticed those translation guides always tell you a diaper is a nappy, but never what a napkin is called in Britain?  They want us to remain ignorant so they can laugh at us!

[Yegolev]

I'm not worried about the language, thanks to lots of Doctor Who, Are You Being Served?, and probably some other horseshit I have forgotten.  Jason Statham movies.  Yes, those.

More later.

[Tale]

You will have more of a multicultural experience, alongside your English experience, anywhere you go in London nowadays, although you have picked a relatively affluent area. Less Dickensian orphan, more London Central Mosque.

Olde England has moved to the green belt and beyond.

[Jherad]

Have you noticed those translation guides always tell you a diaper is a nappy, but never what a napkin is called in Britain?  They want us to remain ignorant so they can laugh at us!

Hey, I'm still figuring things out the other way. I got a giggle the first time I asked for serviettes in a diner.

[IainC]

If it helps I get the same when I go to the US. I ask for tea and they bring me this vile shit called Liptons instead.

[Ingmar]

If it helps I get the same when I go to the US. I ask for tea and they bring me this vile shit called Liptons instead.

How dare they bring you tea from a company headquartered in the UK! 

[ghost]

If it helps I get the same when I go to the US. I ask for tea and they bring me this vile shit called Liptons instead.

There is some good tea, however.  You just have to look for it. 

[DraconianOne]

It is time.  We are starting to seriously look at places to stay for a London visit in 2013.

Overview: We want to be Jane Goodall but for English instead of zebras or whatever she lived with.  We want to see the neighborhood from the perspective of someone that lives there.  This means grocery shopping, cooking and such.

Objective of thread: Gather intelligence from people familiar with London.

First candidate is strong.  It is a townhome in Westminster, neighborhood seems to be called Maida Vale.  Apparently it is within walking distance to anything and I'm not likely to get stabbed or accosted by Dickensian orphans.  Opinions?

How long are you staying? Planning on spending it all in London or travelling too?

Not that it matters - this is the only website you need: http://www.beerintheevening.com/ Remember: real men drink real ale.

[eldaec]

They call chips crisps and elevators lifts.  Crazy.

Also the first floor is the second floor...

You have that the wrong way around.

[K9]

It is time.  We are starting to seriously look at places to stay for a London visit in 2013.

Overview: We want to be Jane Goodall but for English instead of zebras or whatever she lived with.  We want to see the neighborhood from the perspective of someone that lives there.  This means grocery shopping, cooking and such.

Objective of thread: Gather intelligence from people familiar with London.

First candidate is strong.  It is a townhome in Westminster, neighborhood seems to be called Maida Vale.  Apparently it is within walking distance to anything and I'm not likely to get stabbed or accosted by Dickensian orphans.  Opinions?

Maida Vale is a nice district, although I'd note to you that the Borough of Westminster is huge, while the area most people think of as Westminster (the area around Parliament) is pretty small. I have friends who live in Maida Vale and looked at living there myself, it's pretty residential, but that sounds like what you want. It's not got the best connections, and the only things you're really in walking distance from is Regent's Park, everything else is going to require a bus or tube ride.

If you have any particular interests in food I can point you at any number of good places to eat that tourists would never find by themselves.

There's so much else I could say about London; I have lived here going on 10 years and love it.

[Yegolev]

OK, got some good stuff pretty quickly.  I figured the cockney-meme had more legs than that, but I'm not complaining.

You will have more of a multicultural experience, alongside your English experience, anywhere you go in London nowadays

Expected from a massive international city, so that's fine.

...London Central Mosque.

Olde England has moved to the green belt and beyond.

Is there more detail behind this?

If it helps I get the same when I go to the US. I ask for tea and they bring me this vile shit called Liptons instead.

You, sir, were pre-selected for tea-snob detail.  I'm being complimentary.  So, make a list.  Spending time in London means I had better get some of that tea.

How long are you staying? Planning on spending it all in London or travelling too?

About a week.  We aren't planning on going outside the city due to the belief that there is more than enough to occupy us without leaving.

Not that it matters - this is the only website you need: http://www.beerintheevening.com/ Remember: real men drink real ale.

Great link, that's what we are looking for: "Real London Experience"

Maida Vale is a nice district, although I'd note to you that the Borough of Westminster is huge, while the area most people think of as Westminster (the area around Parliament) is pretty small. I have friends who live in Maida Vale and looked at living there myself, it's pretty residential, but that sounds like what you want. It's not got the best connections, and the only things you're really in walking distance from is Regent's Park, everything else is going to require a bus or tube ride.

The Maida Vale house was the first good find on vrbo.com that my wife sent me.  We aren't married to it.  The vrbo description says it is a ten-minute walk from Little Venice and some other possibly-notable stuff.  As for bus/tube ride, you obviously have never been to Atlanta.  Everything is thirty minutes away by car.  A ten-minute tube ride seems downright charming.

If you have any particular interests in food I can point you at any number of good places to eat that tourists would never find by themselves.

My main interest is in eating good english food.  I've been told it exists.  What we can do is wait until we have decided on a place to stay, then we can get into dining details.  Also grocery shopping since I'll have a nine-year-old and we won't be out every night.

There's so much else I could say about London; I have lived here going on 10 years and love it.

[Tale]

...London Central Mosque.

Olde England has moved to the green belt and beyond.

Is there more detail behind this?

Mostly that my base reaction is "meh, London". I was born in Edinburgh, Scotland, which isn't far away and possesses far more awesome. Then there's my favourite place, Wester Ross.

I've visited London quite often as I have family near Maidenhead, specifically Taplow. It starts to get very oldschool English out there, country pubs, green fields and deer. London officially has a "green belt" around the extremities of the greater city, which are required to remain that way.

London benefited hugely from the Olympics though. Prior to that its cultural melting pot was very tense (see the riots, etc) and still could get that way. I enjoyed staying in Brixton, which is full of black West Indian culture and food. I passed through western parts of London on a bus and it was literally mosque after mosque for a long way. I'm mentioning this a lot because your post sounded like you wanted an older English experience, and London feels like it has a far larger influx of migrants than any other city I've been to - and I'm from Sydney, which is incredibly multicultural.

[Signe]

There is an awesome tattoo place named "Eclipse" in Camden if you're looking for more permanent postcards.  There's an app (http://banksylondontourapp.co.uk/) if you like urban art and want to see the Banksy stuff.  You can also look them up online.  It's just you guys are so into your phones and all.  I love Banksy stuff.  It'll be worth it.  You can also do lots of walking tours of really seedy areas where serial killers roamed.  London has lots of serial killers although maybe not as many as Portland, which seems to have thousands.

[DraconianOne]

...London Central Mosque.

Olde England has moved to the green belt and beyond.

Is there more detail behind this?

[Yegolev]

Alright:
1. There's a designated green belt around London.
2.  It's very multicultural.
3.  I need to think about phone service.

I'm very OK with the multicultural bit, as long as there isn't some sort of Little America neighborhood that I end up in.  Because that would be dumb.  However since we do have mosques and black people in Atlanta, I'll make note of that.  I would like to get the older English experience, but I'm not restricting myself such that I'll be disappointed if I see a lot of Germans, or any other ethnic group that I don't see every day.  Still, it would be great to spend time mingling with some stiff-backed muttering English types.

Since it was mentioned, I preferred Glasgow to Edinburgh, if that says anything about me.

[Chimpy]

What kind of phone/provider do you have in the states? If you have an unlocked GSM phone you can get a prepaid sim for like 30 bucks.

[Ironwood]

Since it was mentioned, I preferred Glasgow to Edinburgh, if that says anything about me.

Yes.  It really does.

 

[Signe]

Edinburgh has a lot of hills.  That makes Glasgow better.  Well, except that one GIANT hill in Glasgow.  That one did me in.  I always liked Glasgow, too.  I never go to Edinburgh because I'm already in England.

[Yegolev]

I never go to Edinburgh because I'm already in England.

Exactly!

[Yegolev]

What kind of phone/provider do you have in the states? If you have an unlocked GSM phone you can get a prepaid sim for like 30 bucks.

I'm using a Droid RAZR on Verizon.  Will research later, once I seal up all these sudo-to-root holes we just found.

[K9]

I had a little think about stuff to do in London with a 9yo (caveat, I'm in my late 20s and have no kids).

Hackney City Farm is a fun place to visit, and the associated kitchen does a good brunch/lunch. The place is very kid friendly, and while it's not very big, it's in a part of London that's definitively not touristy. It's also pretty close (in London terms) to The Museum of Childhood which I have heard good things about, although I can't fairly comment since I have never been. You're also close there to Victoria Park, which is the main park in the East End of London, they have some deer there, and during the summer there are a mix of festivals and other events that might be of interest, but you'd need to check closer to the time.

If you wanted to see real deer (and you want to have your own Fenton moment) you're better off heading down to Richmond Park. Richmond is one of the leafier, more affulent suburbs of London, and it's easily accessible. The park is pretty nice although it doesn't have formal gardens in the same way that places like Hyde Park or Regent's Park do. You can hire bicycles there and they have some easy trails to cycle around. My housemates and I have often cycled down there on the weekends for exercise, it's a pretty place. The equivalent of Richmond Park in North London is Hampsted Heath, which is set in a similarly suburban bit of town and has no deer. It does have open air swimming pools though which are great fun in summer. It's definitely one of the places that Londoners go to get away from London as it were. There's also one of the best views of London from Parliament Hill there.

The other place that has an exceptional view of the city is Primrose Hill which is an area between Regent's Park and Camden that has been popular with successful musicians, artists, actors, models and such. There's a good selection of restaurants and bars there, and if you were coming as a couple I'd readily encourage you to go see a gig at The Roundhouse in Camden, which is the best gig venue in London in my mind. You're also within walking distance of London Zoo which you may or may not like, but I tend to think is pretty good. They have an artificial rainforest there where the animals can run freely and you can get close to them; it's a pretty fun exhibit.

More centrally there's lots of well-known touristy stuff, some of which is brilliant, a lot of which is (in my opinion) utter dross. The Science Museum and the Natural history Museum are arguably two of the best in the world (The NHM is better than the American Museum of Natural History, the Science Museum isn't quite as good as the Air and Space Museum imho, ymmv). The NHM has a lot of stuff you can't see anywhere else, and I know as a kid I always loved the dinosaur skeletons, and the replica life-sized blue whale they have hanging from the ceiling in there. The Science Museum is more fun for kids, with areas like the Launchpad and the Google Web Lab. Both places run a lot of events too, especially for kids. If your kid can handle more serious stuff or has an interest in history then the British Museum is always excellent.

Two less well known museums, but once that are world-class are the Wellcome Collection and The Hunterian. Intuitively I'd say that a 9yo would probably find the Wellcome Collection a bit more boring than anything else I have suggested, but as an adult I am always blown away by the quality of the exhibitions they put on, which often try to contrast and relate science and medicine with art and culture in really clever ways. The Hunterian is a simply brilliant museum, although again it might be a bit too subtle for a 9yo. They do have a giant skeleton though, from a chap who paid his mates to bury him at sea so he wouldn't end up on show after he died. His mates then sold him to a doctor as soon as he popped his clogs.

If you want more parks or playgrounds, there are a couple of really good ones in West London. The Princess Diana Memorial Playground is pretty cool in my view, although I have only been in once while babysitting for a friend (they only let you in if you have a child). They have a pirate ship! Holland Park Adventure Playground is also pretty fun. It's probably not worth a detour, but if you were in the Notting Hill area and needed to have your kid wind off some steam it might be something to bear in mind.

Food wise I have always enjoyed going around Borough Market; there's a huge variety of stalls, and most offer free samples. They also have a branch of the Neil's Yard Dairy there, which you should make a point of making a pilgrimage to if you have any love of cheese at all. The only caveat I'd make about Borough Market is that it does get incredibly crowded at lunchtimes and weekends (when the most stallholders are there - saturdays usually I think) so it might not be absolutely ideal with a small kid. I'd avoid the Portobello Road Market unless you have wistful notions of seeing where Hugh Grant lived in 'Notting Hill'. The whole place always seems ridden with tourists any time I go, and most of the stalls only seem to sell tat. The area is very pretty itself, and has a lot of nice pubs, bars and restaurants, but in general I don't see the appeal (as a tourist). Spitalfields Market is more interesting I think, and Smithfields Market too, if you like seeing a lot of meat and fish on sale in a beautiful Victorian open market. Only problem with Smithfields is that most of the business is done by about 9am.

Pretty much everything up to this point is free entry I'd add. It's amazing how much you can do in London for free, it makes me wonder why people pay such exorbitant rates for some of the more touristy "attractions"

Historical stuff that I have done and rate include the Houses of Parliament Tour, and The Tower of London I have done the former twice and latter once and I have always found the guides to be interesting, knowledgeable, well-paced and witty. The Tower has a lot to see, you could easily spend the best part of a day there, and if you want gruesome history and such then that's far more real than the London Dungeon (AVOID). The Palace of Westminster and the Houses of Parliament are just beautiful, and there is so much history in the place. The tours for both are not over-long either, so they'd probably survive a 9yo's attention span.

Outside London you don't have to travel too far to get to Bodiam Castle. We used to go here all the time as a kid and it's brilliant. It's also something you simply don't have in the US. As an added bonus there also seems to be an active steam railway servicing the castle, so that would probably be a fun day out.

SHIT TO AVOID:

Madame Taussads
The London Dungeon
Tour of London Bus Rides
River Tours (seriously, just take the river bus, it's a fraction of the price and you don't have a hungover Bulgarian arts student mumbling facts at you the whole time. London is great to see from the city, since the river is so dominant in its history)
The Planetarium
The Sea Life Centre

I'll have a think about some other things. Closer to the time you may find the kids section of Time Out useful. They do a pretty comprehensive listing of all sorts of events that are on for kids in London, you'd probably find it helpful and an interesting way to find things to do in London that would be closer to what the natives do.

[Chimpy]

I don't think the RAZR is going to have a GSM radio in it. So basically you will be stuck with either borrowing a phone or buying a cheap one unless you are planning on buying a new phone before you go, then you would want to look for "world phone" as a marketing pitch on Verizon or Sprint.

(iPhone 4S/5 would fall in that category)

[Trippy]

I don't think the RAZR is going to have a GSM radio in it.

Some models do, even though Verizon is CDMA, though it may be locked/disabled.

[Furiously]

How's the exchange rate now? When I went a few years ago it was like 1 pound to 1.5 dollars. Needless to say I couldn't have afforded myself if work wasn't paying the tab.

[ghost]

Edinburgh and London are completely different beasts.  Edinburgh is fucking awesome.  There's a lot to see and do and the castle is fucking amazing.  London is just immense and full of anything you want to find.  You could spend 6 months there and not even scratch the surface of everything there is to do.  I highly advise going to the British Museum while you are there.  It's also worth catching a football match, if you're lucky enough to have a decent one going on while you're there.  I would disagree about the cheesy stuff-  some of it is worth doing just for the "I did that" factor, such as the London Dungeon.  

[Hammond]

I don't think the RAZR is going to have a GSM radio in it.

Some models do, even though Verizon is CDMA, though it may be locked/disabled.

We have a couple guys that travel to Europe several times a year.  The global data plans on Verizon are brutal expensive if your phone is a global phone.   The xt912 model on the razor is the global version of that phone. 

You can buy a prepaid phone for fairly cheap and that would probably be a easier route.  Just buy two of them and you are good. 

[Chimpy]

How's the exchange rate now? When I went a few years ago it was like 1 pound to 1.5 dollars. Needless to say I couldn't have afforded myself if work wasn't paying the tab.

www.xe.com/ucc

Was about 1.65 when I was in Scotland in May.

[eldaec]

My main interest is in eating good english food.  I've been told it exists.  What we can do is wait until we have decided on a place to stay, then we can get into dining details.  Also grocery shopping since I'll have a nine-year-old and we won't be out every night.

No idea what sort of budget you're aiming in, but some places from cheap to not so cheap...

http://www.tayyabs.co.uk/ *
http://www.thedrapersarms.com/
http://www.arbutusrestaurant.co.uk/
http://www.harwoodarms.com/
http://www.saltyard.co.uk/ **
http://thehawksmoor.com/
http://dabbous.co.uk/
http://www.dinnerbyheston.com/

*Not really that good but an institution.
**Not at all English but just that good.

For cooking yourself....

http://www.boroughmarket.org.uk/ There are other farmers markets that pop up - but this is the most institutional.
Basically most of the turkish area in N4

Super markets are unfortunately terrible.

Other shit you shouldn't skip :

http://www.shakespearesglobe.com - assuming the youngun can cope - buy standing tickets, and only for an actual shakespeare play.
http://www.tate.org.uk/visit/tate-modern
http://www.londoneye.com/
http://www.nhm.ac.uk/ - the science museum is cool too, but not as cool as this.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/proms - if in season and there is a concert that isn't too heavy

They aren't really objectively that amazing, but I'm also a big fan of the maritime museums in Greenwich. The refurbed cutty sark and observatory espeicially.

http://www.rmg.co.uk/


What time of year are we talking about?

[pants]

I'll put in an ad for the British museum too.  I can still remember the shock of "What do you mean thats the real fucking Rosetta stone just over there?  THE Rosetta stone?" when I was there.  A lot of great stuff from the days when the Victorians gladly grabbed stuff from the brown people around the world, and Britain is still refusing to give it back.

[ghost]

Also, a good deal of the Parthenon Frieze is there.