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Author Topic: Oooga Booga (Witch Doctor Thread)  (Read 21068 times)
Cheddar
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Noob Sauce


Reply #35 on: May 18, 2012, 04:41:52 PM

It helps if you pick your gear with an eye for stuff with a lot of vitality since that passes through to them.

THAT is what I'm doing wrong. I didn't realize that vitality passed through to pets - thanks!

Ditto here.  Just upped my vit by 100 and already seeing the difference!

No Nerf, but I put a link to this very thread and I said that you all can guarantee for my purity. I even mentioned your case, and see if they can take a look at your lawn from a Michigan perspective.
Sjofn
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Reply #36 on: May 18, 2012, 04:45:37 PM

Ingmar's WD is so fat. SO FAT.

God Save the Horn Players
Xanthippe
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Reply #37 on: May 18, 2012, 10:56:04 PM

Plague of Toads is awesome.
Xanthippe
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Reply #38 on: May 19, 2012, 12:13:29 PM

Hitting a Wall at 45. Can't seem to kill any blue packs or yellow mobs without dying many times first.

I wish I could pick a group to join instead of randomly being tossed in, since the difficulty of the mobs goes way up with more than 1 person. I keep finding 1groups of wizards and WDs instead of 3groups of barbs and monks.
MuffinMan
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Reply #39 on: May 19, 2012, 12:16:20 PM

You'd probably have some F13ers to group with if you weren't level one million.

I'm very mysterious when I'm inside you.
Xanthippe
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Reply #40 on: May 19, 2012, 02:06:42 PM

I was too low for where I was trying to be. I got clued in by the equipment dropping, it was too high for me to use. Ohhhhh, I see.

So I went back to the beginning of Act 4 and all is good. It's easy peasy now again.
amiable
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Reply #41 on: May 20, 2012, 04:37:24 PM

It helps if you pick your gear with an eye for stuff with a lot of vitality since that passes through to them.

THAT is what I'm doing wrong. I didn't realize that vitality passed through to pets - thanks!

Ditto here.  Just upped my vit by 100 and already seeing the difference!

Does anyone know how pets stats are keyed to gear?  Does our armor help them?  Does vitality?  Where did you get the info?
Raknor
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Reply #42 on: May 21, 2012, 08:50:01 AM

Loving my WD solo so far. I've hit level 45 and the manaless build is pretty amazing.  But it does seem to be pretty dependent on gear. I usually do a complete overhaul of gear every 10 levels (25/35/45) and I'm starting to feel the pain.  Time to go shopping again.

Manaless build
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/witch-doctor#aSYdhT!ZcW!aaaYaZ

This build is really more for AE type packs but I haven't had any issues using darts on the boss for single target stuff. The best part about this build is the crazy ability to continue to kill mobs that aren't even on the screen.  There have been countless pulls where my locust swarm with pestilence will spread in the next room and kill everything there before I even enter.  So I just run in and scoop up the loot.  I love nothing more than seeing 30-40 mobs coming at me. I can kill them as fast as I can a pack of 4 and get way more loot.

The way I play it, let the pets run in and grab initial agro while also gathering them into a group.  I dip in to get max stacks of soul harvest then locust swarm and back out a few steps.  Spam fire bombs (which bounce to 6 targets) until all are dead. Fires that bounce to 6 targets also hit all the non combat pots and stuff around the walls. Which is helpful for getting more gold and not increasing my time hitting them. Also if blues take down your 3 dogs, its always available to kick out 3 more.  If you go through 6 dogs in one fight you're doing it wrong or need more gear. (Solo I use the Templar for an extra meatshield/heal)

Now as much as I love this build, I had someone jump into my game while I was farming a boss in Act 2 for some power leveling and holly crap my pets got face rolled.  This is definitely not a nightmare level multiplayer spec. Unless you're just out leveling the content.

Obviously the gear I'm looking for is high INT/Vitality with what ever other perks you're in to.  I think for a WD the run speed to boots is a must. Vitality didn't seem overly necessary until I got to nightmare mode.  Then a healthy amount of HP became apparent pretty fast. Keeping your weapon up to date (as with all classes) makes a huge difference. Red gems for your weapons are your friend.
Khaldun
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Reply #43 on: May 21, 2012, 10:13:26 AM

I'm trying to avoid going too quickly to cookie-cutter builds, but what I've settled on for Act III so far: explosive toads, acid cloud, humongous zombie, fetish shaman, grasping hands w/the damage buff. Passives the 20%-less damage one and the mana boosting one. I have the templar as companion. Works pretty well--I use the root to stack shit up w/the zombie and templar generally bottling stuff up more at a chokepoint, drop three clouds of acid on a big group which melts them totally, toads do the cleaning up. Fetish shaman will often chicken a purple or yellow mob if I drop it, and I have it with the heal rune so it and the templar help with emergency healing.

I went into Act II with dogs and they just started to suck hard even with some of the abilities that power them up. I did find that my gear was pretty bad at that point so I bought a few things off of AH, but even with that power-up the dogs were still not impressing me that much.
Segoris
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Reply #44 on: May 21, 2012, 10:51:43 AM

Yeah, I agree and think Weapon DPS>>>> Vit > Int >>>>>> everything else imo for stats

That said, I was running around with 12k+ hit points around level 42-44 or so (think I'm around 20-22k at level 51) and just steamrolled anything in my way. Been using the same build post 40 and even using it in Hell. Unfortunately, in a Vision Quest build (which sadly seems to be what a WD is balanced around) there isn't much room for GoTD, thus making +run speed even more valuable and is a stat I won't go without. I just won't equip any boots without run speed even if it boosts every other stat, since without GoTD I need some movement besides using Spirit Walk.

Anyways, here's my build that has worked wonderfully. The only change I'm considering is switching Grusome Feast for Bad Medicine to try to make up for groupmates dying in public games in Hell mode, and on certain bosses I'll switch Hex out and bring in Big Bad Voodoo, though sometimes the +hp from hex over time is better than using BBV for the dps increase and/or the full heal every 2min. It seems like it is more of an AE and group build, but even against bosses, champions, rares, etc in 4player mode I've ended up soloing packs without too much issue (I was having some bad luck in public groups lately with the exception of one monk leaving me to solo these mobs). Also, I may switch for ZomBears to try them out, but I don't like that idea since I don't like only having one type of damage for a slight dps increase of one ability.

General strategy:
-Spirit Walk+Soul Harvest+Hex to open and on cooldown there after. This locks down 1+ mobs as they're now hexed (almost all mobs can be hexed, even some minor boss-types). Every 15seconds you regain 15% mana and a lot of health (depending on how many enemies are left when you refresh SH since it isn't limited to the 5x SH stack cap, but rather how many mobs are in the area when SH is cast it seems). I also use this to kite back and forth through mobs and keep them clustered and centered around a hexed mob or back and forth across bridges. Example: kite a group to the west, then at the 15 second mark, hit my 15s cooldowns and spirit walk through mobs to the east and kite in that direction back and forth as needed in hell. This keeps them in a line instead of a circle making Bats the more viable DPS which are also more mana friendly
-Use Bats when mobs are lined up or clustered enough for bats to hit everything, otherwise Acid Cloud if they're fast movers or spread out a little bit more. Acid Cloud can drain my mana if I hold it down for about 12 seconds (if no health globes drop which refill mana thanks to Grusome Feast) but by the time that happens I have about 1-3seconds left on my cooldowns when I'll regain 15% mana instantly and it gives me a slight break, so at worst I have about 3seconds of downtime with Acid Cloud spam.
-Garg is just there to run interference, though I've noticed Barbs complaining my Garg tank better than they do (granted, my WD tanks better than some barbs since I have more hp than most people I've come across and this transfers to my pet).
-Garg is also great dps vs boss/elites with his enrage. Though if I do switch out for Bad Medicine passive, I'll also switch his rune to Big Stinker


Also - Acid Cloud may be the best Destroyer-Of-Jars-rararararararrr!!! ability I've found on any class with it's 24 yard range and instant cast time.
amiable
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Reply #45 on: May 21, 2012, 02:36:06 PM

One thing I have noticed about witch doctor gearing, and I guess to the same extent all other classes, is that the removal of the ability to assign attribute points shifts all the focus of the character buils into the gear.  As a hardcore character if a piece of gear has no vitality it is useless to me (unless the other stats are overwhelmingly terrific).  The result is 99% of all items (including rares and uniques) are total junk, and wading through the other ones is an enourmous chore.
Cheddar
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Reply #46 on: May 21, 2012, 05:38:43 PM

One thing I love about WD- I have yet to see the same build twice.  Ever.

No Nerf, but I put a link to this very thread and I said that you all can guarantee for my purity. I even mentioned your case, and see if they can take a look at your lawn from a Michigan perspective.
Hoax
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Reply #47 on: May 21, 2012, 05:51:34 PM

One thing I love about WD- I have yet to see the same build twice.  Ever.

Seriously? Its been the most predictable class BY FAR from my play experience. Every single one takes acid vomit. Every single one takes big idiot pet. Most have dogs. All have a secondary aoe (either fire bombs or the other big fire thingy). All take soul harvest.

That's so much less variety than Wizard, Monk and DH and imo a little less than Barb but that may be biased because I know all the barb abilities.

A nation consists of its laws. A nation does not consist of its situation at a given time. If an individual's morals are situational, then that individual is without morals. If a nation's laws are situational, that nation has no laws, and soon isn't a nation.
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Ingmar
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Reply #48 on: May 21, 2012, 06:00:31 PM

This is me at the moment:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/witch-doctor#hZYRkT!ZdW!aYbaaZ

I'm not sure I'm sold on the wall of zombies, but I'm giving it a chance (if I'm grouped I swap it out for Big Bad Voodoo), pretty happy with everything else as it currently stands - there's a lot I don't have access to at 35 still.

The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT.
Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
Ragnoros
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Reply #49 on: May 22, 2012, 03:58:27 AM

tl;dr I'm whining about my Witch Doctor.

I am a bit disappoint in my WD. Playing in a group with monks/barbs to tank it is mostly spell spam fun like with all ranged class. But alone or without a good tank things are a bit dicey. I was really hoping for Necro 2.0 but the pets just don't have near the survivability of my old skeletons, that and there are fewer of them. Granted I am in hell now, but my monk tanks like a boss in hell so why not my pets? I am told gear helps, I shall have to try and get some more.

Additionally, the available get out of jail spells just seem inferior to the Wiz/DH/etc versions. Unlike frost nova or stomp holding mobs in place to die, horrify sends them scattering all over the place to come hit you in the back later, and spirit walk is far inferior to smoke screen, given the latters immunity and spamability. Confusion is nice, but on far too long a cool down. I do like hex, and the little fetish is usually rather good about picking a target, but not always, and it sucks when you have a champion whacking on you and he hexes some random critter.

Locust Swarm almost makes up for all that by itself though. I love that spell so much!

"At this point it wouldn't surprise most of the world if the US was secretly building star destroyers." -Arthur_Parker

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Segoris
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Reply #50 on: May 22, 2012, 09:26:39 AM

Tried Zombie Bears last night, I'm not a fan. The damage is really good, but it's very short range. By the time you get that spell, which will be the end of NM or start of Hell modes, you don't want to be that close to champs/elites or be stationary for too long to use the bears. Additionally, when you cast them, they come out of the ground from behind you which helps to lower their range, and is not helping the situation at all.

Besides awesomeness factor of them being zombie bears (which could only be more awesome if each bear wore a top hat and a tuxedo or a cape), I just don't see what all the raving is about when not grouped with a vortex using tank. When you are grouped with a vortex user, the ability is really nice, as long as the WD has the vitality to stand in with the melee and take some damage (I haven't died yet doing this, even before using bears, but I do have quite a lot of hp and am a shield user).

I should add: I was in act 1 and outside a lot using bears, if indoors in smaller areas they will most likely be superior due to the bears being able to hit more often, when that happens the damage is almost triple of bats but usally only double at the risk of more frequent death.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2012, 09:37:52 AM by Segoris »
Khaldun
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Reply #51 on: May 22, 2012, 09:37:30 PM

One thing I love about WD- I have yet to see the same build twice.  Ever.

Seriously? Its been the most predictable class BY FAR from my play experience. Every single one takes acid vomit. Every single one takes big idiot pet. Most have dogs. All have a secondary aoe (either fire bombs or the other big fire thingy). All take soul harvest.

That's so much less variety than Wizard, Monk and DH and imo a little less than Barb but that may be biased because I know all the barb abilities.

Isn't soul harvest on the same tree as acid vomit?
Ingmar
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Reply #52 on: May 22, 2012, 10:13:16 PM

One thing I love about WD- I have yet to see the same build twice.  Ever.

Seriously? Its been the most predictable class BY FAR from my play experience. Every single one takes acid vomit. Every single one takes big idiot pet. Most have dogs. All have a secondary aoe (either fire bombs or the other big fire thingy). All take soul harvest.

That's so much less variety than Wizard, Monk and DH and imo a little less than Barb but that may be biased because I know all the barb abilities.

Isn't soul harvest on the same tree as acid vomit?

Turn elective mode on and you can break out of the category locks.

The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT.
Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
amiable
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Reply #53 on: May 23, 2012, 06:58:56 AM

Pet Testing


Basically:

Vitality has no effect on pet survivavability but stacking resitances and armor does!  so shop for magic rings/ammys of resist all with int or vit whenever you can and your pets will survive a LOT longer.
kildorn
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Reply #54 on: May 23, 2012, 08:56:02 AM

Physical Resist is such an odd stat, and I'm curious if there's any testing to how it stacks with armor DR in general. WDs and Wizards have a mess of it just by nature of it being tied to Int, and the difference seems really noticeable compared to say, DH's trying to take the same hits.
Xanthippe
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Reply #55 on: May 23, 2012, 10:40:00 AM

Does Resist All just resist all elements or also include Physical Resistance?
amiable
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Reply #56 on: May 23, 2012, 11:34:53 AM

Does Resist All just resist all elements or also include Physical Resistance?

It includes physical resist.  On a point basis resist all is worth 10x int for damage mitigation purposes.
Ingmar
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Reply #57 on: May 23, 2012, 01:27:52 PM

The more important takeaway IMO is that stacking int helps them live longer (because int raises your resistances), so as long as you err on the side of stuff with lots of int you should be OK.

EDIT: Also I'm just not sure I believe it given my experiences with vit increases.  Head scratch
« Last Edit: May 23, 2012, 04:17:52 PM by Ingmar »

The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT.
Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
Khaldun
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Reply #58 on: May 23, 2012, 07:37:58 PM

Yeah, I feel like when I've gone up in vit I see much more pet survivability. Just seems odd that the other stats should carry over to pets and not vitality.
Ingmar
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Reply #59 on: May 23, 2012, 07:39:39 PM

I suppose there's also not any particular reason to believe that all stats affect all pets in the same way.

The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT.
Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
Sir Fodder
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Reply #60 on: May 23, 2012, 10:21:00 PM

Playing solo I sort of defaulted into this mana-less build and haven't tried much else cause its so fun: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/witch-doctor#ZaYVUd!ZdV I use the templar with healer skills. The dogs are tough and sacrifice would be OP if not for the raise dog timer. So fun to set the snare while wading into masses of mobs to get them bunched on you and snared, soul harvest for humongous int boost and heal any initial damage, back off using spirit walk get out of jail if trapped by the mobs, then darts away to finish - detonate to hurry up in mass mob areas or strategically on bosses - sweet!
« Last Edit: May 24, 2012, 12:38:54 PM by Sir Fodder »
Raknor
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Reply #61 on: May 24, 2012, 04:56:09 PM

So are high damage 2h really the way to go end game? I keep reading its the damage on the weapon that makes your damage crazy. But with how hard stuff is hitting in Hell i'm scared to take my shield off.  Perhaps I need to kite more?

On the bright side I snagged an 844 dps 2h for 20k last night. What a steal.
Ingmar
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Reply #62 on: May 24, 2012, 05:24:19 PM

In the late stages you will probably want a shield yeah.

The weapon damage thing can be a little tricky to find your way around. The best gauge right now is probably just the 'dps' number on your character sheet since that takes into account attack speed rather than just weapon damage and it includes the boosts from all your other gear, etc. If you are just looking at the number on the weapon itself you're not getting the whole picture.

The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT.
Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
Phildo
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Reply #63 on: May 24, 2012, 06:32:27 PM

I just find it really, really pleasing to watch the locust swarm cover giant groups of enemies in the later levels.  Wish I'd started fiddling with it sooner, instead of being hung up on extreme kiting.
Outlawedprod
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Reply #64 on: May 26, 2012, 10:32:27 AM

Inferno Butcher 9 second kill.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzpRAUgyxaU

Official Blizz (Bashiok) forum reaction is classic.  Prepare for QQ from Wizards.
http://www.diablofans.com/blizz-tracker/topic/224787-witch-doctor-inferno-butcher-9-sec-kill/
« Last Edit: May 26, 2012, 10:34:18 AM by Outlawedprod »
Ironwood
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Reply #65 on: May 26, 2012, 03:03:26 PM

What the fuck happened there ?

 ACK!

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
kildorn
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Reply #66 on: May 26, 2012, 03:35:39 PM

Vision Quest combined with an ability that isn't supposed to be spammable due to the mana cost.
Ingmar
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Reply #67 on: May 26, 2012, 03:37:33 PM

And ridiculous gear.

The Transcendent One: AH... THE ROGUE CONSTRUCT.
Nordom: Sense of closure: imminent.
Segoris
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Reply #68 on: May 27, 2012, 09:37:44 AM

The build used to cheese bosses is useless outside of cheesing those bosses, meaning no Neph Valor buff since the build (and for some of the fast kills - even the gear) is different than normal farming setups.

Additionally, I'm not so sure Bears isn't supposed to be spammed at all, since WD have to give up A LOT to be able to spam that one ability AND all 3 bears have to hit. Having all 3 bears hit isn't always happening since sometimes you lose 1-2 bears (meaning 33-66% of the potential dps) is just lost to walls and any other geography outside of boss areas. That, and there really isn't much else to spam that costs mana. You have Zombie Charger (Bears), Dire Bats, Acid Cloud, and Spirit Barrage - those are the ONLY options the WD has that aren't damage over time spells with no cooldowns besides primaries (which outside of darts - really suck in inferno mode).


Edit: A Barbarian's response to fast WD butcher kills: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7X5oDsQ5oQ&feature=g-all-u 
« Last Edit: May 27, 2012, 09:52:56 AM by Segoris »
Ironwood
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Reply #69 on: May 28, 2012, 05:11:24 AM

 ACK!

"Mr Soft Owl has Seen Some Shit." - Sun Tzu
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