Mass Effect 3 - military effectiveness, endings, and you! (spoilers)

[MournelitheCalix]

I think there must be a bit more to it since I can't get that scene to trigger with 5234 EMS rating

[Kageru]

This thread has done even more than the "bad ending" thread in making me kind of happy this game didn't sell on steam... I might have bought it.

[tmp]

It's implied all your allies survive if you become a Reaper too since you see EDI in the Normandy post-crash scene

That's pretty much explicitly stated by the ghost reaper baby when you're asked to make choice -- the destruction option is said to eliminate "reapers, mass relays, and most technology" (along with you since you're mostly machine at this point) while the control option is said to only destroy the mass relays.

Dunno what the synnergy option says because i let the reaper rachni trick me and that costed me just enough points to lock the next tier by the looks of it 

[Sjofn]

The synergy option is just "blah blah space magic blah," you didn't miss anything. Except Joker and EDI having green eyes when they hope out of the Normandy. I think the leaves might look a little different too, it was hard for me to see since my eyes were blurry from eyeroll-strain.

[Koyasha]

I think the thing I find most odd about the ending is that it effectively ends the ME franchise.  When I first heard rumors of discontent about the ending, I thought the most likely reason was that Shepard probably dies.  I figured that part of the reason might be to make it easier to create future products in the franchise without Shepard constantly 'looming' as it were.  But as it stands, all the endings effectively destroy the setting.  All mass relays are destroyed, therefore the entire setting is pretty much done for.

[tmp]

The synergy option is just "blah blah space magic blah," you didn't miss anything. Except Joker and EDI having green eyes when they hope out of the Normandy. I think the leaves might look a little different too, it was hard for me to see since my eyes were blurry from eyeroll-strain.

Yeah, just meant i didn't know the exact wording used when that one was offered. Having read what variation (well, lack thereof) the endings have to offer i'm quite fine with the destruction one, feels most fitting.

(fresh ending impression: when i saw the sequence with Normandy trying to outrace the shockwave with the sadmusic in background, went all "ohgod i'm so sorry" because thought Joker was trying to save EDI from death in some fit of prescience, and they're about to die there together --what with EDI being Normandy and likely qualitfying for the 'most technology'-- so what actually followed... i dunno, kinda relieved to see Garrus and the Douchebag Prothean make it, but on the other hand think i'd prefer it that bleaker way)

[koro]

Not sure if it's been linked yet (why are there now three ME3 threads?), but this is pretty fuckin'

[Margalis]

All of these "it must have been indoctrination" things suffer from the same problem that they point out a bunch of things that make no sense but don't advance any plausible alternative.

It's kind of like watching "Hall Pass" then saying "this movie was terribly unfunny and stupid, it must be a commentary on shitty comedies!" Or, just a bad movie.

I think if you analyze the theory that this is some sort of indoctrination thing it makes just as little sense, including lacking in basics like motive. So Shep is indoctrinated and this child and device is a plot blah blah...to what end? if they trick Shep into doing something that benefits the reapers you still have to explain the existence of this fucking device, if synthesis actually aids the reapers you still have to believe that this device and it's space magic exists, was built for some reason (by who and why?), that Shep is somehow the key to it, etc...

The sad part is Bioware will probably put out some DLC that points to it being indoctrination and everyone will say "see, it was their plan all along! Bravo!"

I'd like to see one of these "it must be indoctrination!" things that has a bit more logic that "the ending was fucking dumb - therefore indoctrination!"

[Sjofn]

The synergy option is just "blah blah space magic blah," you didn't miss anything. Except Joker and EDI having green eyes when they hope out of the Normandy. I think the leaves might look a little different too, it was hard for me to see since my eyes were blurry from eyeroll-strain.

Yeah, just meant i didn't know the exact wording used when that one was offered. Having read what variation (well, lack thereof) the endings have to offer i'm quite fine with the destruction one, feels most fitting.

(fresh ending impression: when i saw the sequence with Normandy trying to outrace the shockwave with the sadmusic in background, went all "ohgod i'm so sorry" because thought Joker was trying to save EDI from death in some fit of prescience, and they're about to die there together --what with EDI being Normandy and likely qualitfying for the 'most technology'-- so what actually followed... i dunno, kinda relieved to see Garrus and the Douchebag Prothean make it, but on the other hand think i'd prefer it that bleaker way)

As I think I've said before, I almost wish that little coda didn't exist just because Kaidan hopped out of the ship. Kaidan who had been in my group. I actually would've prefered the thought he died, because at least that would've made sense. And he's going to do it AGAIN in my Manshep playthrough, because he and Manshep are going to finally admit WHAT I KNEW ALL ALONG, BITCHES.

[tmp]

As I think I've said before, I almost wish that little coda didn't exist just because Kaidan hopped out of the ship. Kaidan who had been in my group.

Come to think of it, both Garrus and the Douchebag Prothean hopped out of the ship for me and they both were in my group. All three of us ate that reaper beam.

New theory that i'm sticking with: that sequence in the paradise planet actually does take place in paradise. Shepard will just catch up with them both (and Joker, and the rest) in short while. They'll be waiting in the bar, like she and Garrus arranged before their last mission

[Sjofn]

Yeah if I just imagine "They're deeeeeeead," that last scene is still derp but makes a tiny bit of sense. Sadly, it's pretty clear in the synth ending that they're supposed to be ALIVE and now they're ... whatever the fuck they are now. GO TEAM!


EDIT: Also if Bioware is going to be making fanservice DLCs now, they need to add one where I can make out with Douche Prothean. Don't judge me.

[Koyasha]

The synergy option is just "blah blah space magic blah," you didn't miss anything. Except Joker and EDI having green eyes when they hope out of the Normandy. I think the leaves might look a little different too, it was hard for me to see since my eyes were blurry from eyeroll-strain.

Yeah, just meant i didn't know the exact wording used when that one was offered. Having read what variation (well, lack thereof) the endings have to offer i'm quite fine with the destruction one, feels most fitting.

(fresh ending impression: when i saw the sequence with Normandy trying to outrace the shockwave with the sadmusic in background, went all "ohgod i'm so sorry" because thought Joker was trying to save EDI from death in some fit of prescience, and they're about to die there together --what with EDI being Normandy and likely qualitfying for the 'most technology'-- so what actually followed... i dunno, kinda relieved to see Garrus and the Douchebag Prothean make it, but on the other hand think i'd prefer it that bleaker way)

Keep in mind that if Garrus/Tali and Joker/everyone else crashed on the same planet, one of those two categories is going to starve to death.  Just putting that out there.   

[Tebonas]

Wasn't there a throwaway line that they stocked the ship with ridiculous amounts of food Tali can eat?

[Jeff Kelly]

But does it come with emergency induction ports?

[Lantyssa]

Emergency... induction port.

[Sjofn]

Her drunk dialing the Douche Prothean after that conversation was soooooo greeeeeat. 

[tmp]

Aww i missed the phone call followup.

The induction straw was great. Port. You know.

[Sjofn]

Oh man, definitely run down to Douche Prothean's room after that conversation if you ever play through again. It's adorable. 

[Miasma]

I talked with drunk tali but didn't know about the drunk dial to javik afterwards, had to look it up:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQd5qjOxGnI&feature=related

[tmp]

Oh, lol. I think i went to Javik first and then the call is slightly different, with Tali not yet drunk and she just thanks him for cheering Liara up, or something to that effect.

But yes, he does mention quite a few times how quarians were considered very attractive

[Sjofn]

I was just pleased that Shepard could probably get Tali on board the Javik/Liara ship. 

[tmp]

He certainly has enough eyes for both of them, if nothing else.

[Sjofn]

That reminds me, I liked when he was all "how do you even see with only two eyes? Fuck, is this cycle LAME."

[tmp]

Or that bit when we talked about Mordin and he's like, "... they used to lick their eyeballs."

Heck, liked pretty much all from him. Guy is pure gold.

edit: ohh or when he gives Liara pep talk at some point and then you can ask him after she leaves, "Did you mean any of that?" and the rest... mhm, so good.

[koro]

All of these "it must have been indoctrination" things suffer from the same problem that they point out a bunch of things that make no sense but don't advance any plausible alternative.

It's kind of like watching "Hall Pass" then saying "this movie was terribly unfunny and stupid, it must be a commentary on shitty comedies!" Or, just a bad movie.

I think if you analyze the theory that this is some sort of indoctrination thing it makes just as little sense, including lacking in basics like motive. So Shep is indoctrinated and this child and device is a plot blah blah...to what end? if they trick Shep into doing something that benefits the reapers you still have to explain the existence of this fucking device, if synthesis actually aids the reapers you still have to believe that this device and it's space magic exists, was built for some reason (by who and why?), that Shep is somehow the key to it, etc...

The gist of the whole essay is
I don't know what the policy for spoilers in this particular thread is, but I'm doing it to be safe.

[Ingmar]

It all makes decent enough sense until you ride the elevator up to stupid kid land, it is really only at that point that everything goes to shit.

[Simond]

Updated version of the Indoctrination Theory video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ythY_GkEBck
All twenty-one minutes thirty seconds of it.

[Miasma]

The indoctrination people are insane and grabbing wildly at straws in desperation.  They really want to believe something and will eat up any hare brained bullshit that fits their hopes.  It's people like this that start and join the craziest of conspiracy theories, cults and religions.

[Sjofn]

Yeah, they so desperately need the shitty ending to not be true, they will believe anything at this point, except the simplest answer: that yes, the ending blew it right out the ass.

[Koyasha]

Yeah I don't really see this being some complex 'trick' ending with Shepard being indoctrinated (they would have had the real ending afterward then).  Although the thing is, the entire time the first time I saw the ending I was confused, thinking this was some weird dream sequence.  So it's not as though that's a conclusion that's only come to after the disappointment, either.  After the flash of light with Harbinger's beam, my first thought was 'did I do something wrong?' and very shortly afterward they turned to 'is this a hallucination or another dream sequence?' (cause those guys tear me up normally since I play on Insanity, so being able to defeat him with no dodging, no biotics, and with a pistol instantly struck me as weird) and then during the conversation with the Illusive Man I wondered whether this was supposed to be Shepard being indoctrinated, what with all the black stuff clouding my screen.

It would actually fit well though.  If they did indeed decide to fix the ending, the current ending works really goddamn well as some indoctrination-induced hallucination 'bad ending' if you failed to get enough support in the war.

[Koyasha]

Grr.  Doublepost instead of edit.