Dragon Nest - AAA mmos should steal their combat system.

[LC]

Haven't seen a thread on this one. I did a search, but it's possible that I missed it. Anyway it's worth a shot if you have nothing else to play.

Pros
- Best combat system I have seen in a fantasy mmo so far.
- The story is amusing, and I actually read the quest dialogue.
Cons
- Heavily Instanced
- Very Little Character Customization
- Asian Grind
- Limited PVP (Arena)
- Nexon as publisher

Video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqSQn7OZkJU&hd=1
Site:
http://dragonnest.nexon.net

[luckton]

Because the casual-keyboard turners that keep the AAA MMOs afloat would have a conniption fit, pack up and take their money elsewhere.

/thread

[Mrbloodworth]

I like Vindictus much better.

Vindictus Class Intro - Lann

[LC]

Because the casual-keyboard turners that keep the AAA MMOs afloat would have a conniption fit, pack up and take their money elsewhere.

/thread

Keep churning out dem wow clones boys. Nobody will ever try something different. Change is Bad!

[LC]

I like Vindictus much better.

Vindictus Class Intro - Lann

I've watched several videos now and it looks like all you do is tap the left mouse button in combat.

[luckton]

Because the casual-keyboard turners that keep the AAA MMOs afloat would have a conniption fit, pack up and take their money elsewhere.

/thread

Keep churning out dem wow clones boys. Change is bad!

Don't get me wrong...I'd love to see some real-time active-skill combat in a main-stream MMO.  Someday, we'll see it.  Maybe not our generation, but in the future. 

[LC]

Don't get me wrong...I'd love to see some real-time active-skill combat in a main-stream MMO.  Someday, we'll see it.  Maybe not our generation, but in the future.  

I hope the wow clones continue to fail. I hope SW:TOR shuts down within a year or goes F2P. I'm tired of playing that game.

[luckton]

I hope SWG shuts down within a year or goes F2P. I'm tired of playing that game.

  It is shutting down?

[Mrbloodworth]

I like Vindictus much better.

Vindictus Class Intro - Lann

I've watched several videos now and it looks like all you do is tap the left mouse button in combat.

For basic attack, yes. IT's a combo/timing system,There are also the grapples, chain hooks, spears, blocks, counters, and spells/physics depending on class. As well as picking up a large variety of different weapons that all have different behaviors. Even broken environmental items can be used.

[LC]

I hope SWG shuts down within a year or goes F2P. I'm tired of playing that game.

  It is shutting down?

sorry meant TOR

[LC]

For basic attack, yes. IT's a combo/timing system,There are also the grapples, chain hooks, spears, blocks, counters, and spells/physics depending on class. As well as picking up a large variety of different weapons that all have different behaviors. Even broken environmental items can be used.

I will download it and give it a shot. It looks like it's a bit more limited than DN.

[Draegan]

There are room for all sorts of different games.  I'd like to see it as well. 

How does combat work in this game?  I played TERA when I visited their studios and it was all mouse button mashing.  How is this different?  Need a gamepad?

[HaemishM]

Why am I watching a video of two prepubescent girls doing gymnastics and throwing light globes at each other? 

[luckton]

Why am I watching a video of two prepubescent girls doing gymnastics and throwing light globes at each other? 

 

[LC]

There are room for all sorts of different games.  I'd like to see it as well.  

How does combat work in this game?  I played TERA when I visited their studios and it was all mouse button mashing.  How is this different?  Need a gamepad?

Left mouse is basic attack
Right mouse is special (usually a kick)
Double Tap Direction is a roll.
Tab does something...
Space bar is jump

Some special Skills are on the hotbar 1-0.
Others are activated by things like:
jump + left mouse
jump + right mouse
jump + jump
jump + tab
double tap direction key + tab
double tap direction key + jump
double tap direction key + right mouse
double tap direction key + left mouse
hold right mouse + jump
etc.

[koro]

That sounds horrific. Having to double-tap keyboard keys for commonly-used functions is terrible. My left hand twitches when I think about double-tap dodging in UT2k4 alone.

[luckton]

That sounds horrific. Having to double-tap keyboard keys for commonly-used functions is terrible. My left hand twitches when I think about double-tap dodging in UT2k4 alone.

Vindicated 

[LC]

That sounds horrific. Having to double-tap keyboard keys for commonly-used functions is terrible. My left hand twitches when I think about double-tap dodging in UT2k4 alone.

It works for me. It's a lot easier than trying to click buttons with a mouse during combat.

[Sky]

If people really wanted to be playing those games, we'd be playing those games.

Pwn on, tiny dancer. Pwn on.

[LC]

If people really wanted to be playing those games, we'd be playing those games.

Pwn on, tiny dancer. Pwn on.

The TAB 123 market is saturated already. It's time for something new.

[koro]

Want something different where player skill matters? Give me slightly faster-paced Mount & Blade combat with a few more "gamey" things like magic and a couple special attacks based on the weapon used. Keep it simple and don't present two dozen Gunz-style keyboard rituals you must memorize to pull off anything decent.

[Ard]

If people really wanted to be playing those games, we'd be playing those games.

People are playing those games, including me, it's just that they don't really exist in the subscription market right now.  There's a fairly sizable niche of these action rpgs in the f2p circuit though, of which I personally think Dragon Nest and Vindictus are the best of.  But the f2p vs sub discussion slap fight is over there -->

edit:  In my opinion, if people are going to dismiss either of these games without even trying them, when it costs nothing but time, that's just sad.  The controls aren't nearly as bad as LC is making it look, at least for Dragon Nest.  Most of it is pretty intuitive, and it has one of the least crippling cash shops I've seen in a f2p game.

[Paelos]

Want something different where player skill matters? Give me slightly faster-paced Mount & Blade combat with a few more "gamey" things like magic and a couple special attacks based on the weapon used. Keep it simple and don't present two dozen Gunz-style keyboard rituals you must memorize to pull off anything decent.

Mount and Blade online would be ridiculously bad ass if they hired like the 4 best modders and made it awesome!

A man can dream.

[Ingmar]

If people really wanted to be playing those games, we'd be playing those games.

Pwn on, tiny dancer. Pwn on.

The TAB 123 market is saturated already. It's time for something new.

Dude, have all the fun you want with that stuff. It's where you start wishing for games to fail, that other people like and want, that your stance gets annoying.

[Reg]

He has every reason to wish TOR to fail. It's a well known fact that Biowares' second choice was to develop a game with prepubescent girls and massive amounts of mouse clicking.

[Rokal]

He has every reason to wish TOR to fail. It's a well known fact that Biowares' second choice was to develop a game with prepubescent girls and massive amounts of mouse clicking.

I'm pretty sure this is the direction they're going with Dragon Age 3.

[Sky]

People are playing those games, including me, it's just that they don't really exist in the subscription market right now.  There's a fairly sizable niche of these action rpgs in the f2p circuit though, of which I personally think Dragon Nest and Vindictus are the best of.  But the f2p vs sub discussion slap fight is over there -->

edit:  In my opinion, if people are going to dismiss either of these games without even trying them, when it costs nothing but time, that's just sad.  The controls aren't nearly as bad as LC is making it look, at least for Dragon Nest.  Most of it is pretty intuitive, and it has one of the least crippling cash shops I've seen in a f2p game.

Fair enough, and put in a better fashion than LC. As Ingmar put my thoughts better than my smarmy comment could.

[kildorn]

Hm, unless this game got a lot different at higher levels, Vindictus is far more of an action MMO. My time in Dragon Nest was not TAB 1 2 3, but it was Point mouse at hostile, 1 2 3. I think I got to level 12 and decided it wasn't getting any more interesting.

Vindictus had a lot more going on with dodge/guard break/combo systems. Dragon Nest just seemed like a faster diku where positioning mattered to me. Both had fetch quests that would make diku designers cry (zone back and forth between these two non combat zones five times. Completed!)

Rusty Hearts is another random action-y MMO though, if you're looking in that vein. Sort of side scrolling beat em up style, I guess?

edit: Vindictus breaks out the soul crushing grind far more than I saw in Dragon Nest, though. Seriously, D:

[LC]

Dude, have all the fun you want with that stuff. It's where you start wishing for games to fail, that other people like and want, that your stance gets annoying.

It's funny because every time a pvp mmo with twitchy combat is mentioned, a million TAB123 dikutards jump out of the bushes to slam it for not being more like EQ/WOW. BUT DONT SAY NUTTIN BOUT MY GAME MR PVP TWITCH DUDE.

I still hope it fails. I hope the next wow clone fails too. The more often these things fail, the greater the chance someone will try something new.

[LC]

Hm, unless this game got a lot different at higher levels, Vindictus is far more of an action MMO. My time in Dragon Nest was not TAB 1 2 3, but it was Point mouse at hostile, 1 2 3. I think I got to level 12 and decided it wasn't getting any more interesting.

You should have played until the class change. You get a lot more options at that point.

[PalmTrees]

I've been having fun with Dragon's Nest. It is point crosshairs at enemy  and use number keys for abilities but it is much more actiony and mobile than a diku. Having alot of fun with my elementalist and sharpshooter.

Vindictus is more realistic looking and has fun physics but saddled with a crippling, sadistic gear grind that made me quit. DN is only bad if you go after the highest tier gear, I do solo abyss missions just fine with a mix of green and blue gear.

[LC]

I just hit level 20 on my acrobat. I really need to reset my skills though. My character is named Awfuru if anyone plays on Argenta.

[luckton]

I still say it's a generational thing.  There are many players out there whom I'm sure would have no problem with Dragon Nest's mechanics, but they have to share the current landscape with gamers of the previous generation that cut their teeth on the TAB123 gameplay, and a good chunk had a hard enough time doing that.

You can't say that overall gameplay/combat for MMOs hasn't evolved at all over the last 15 years.  Baby steps for sure in some cases, but that's what it takes.  

[LC]

I still say it's a generational thing.  There are many players out there whom I'm sure would have no problem with Dragon Nest's mechanics, but they have to share the current landscape with gamers of the previous generation that cut their teeth on the TAB123 gameplay, and a good chunk had a hard enough time doing that.

You can't say that overall gameplay/combat for MMOs hasn't evolved at all over the last 15 years.  Baby steps for sure in some cases, but that's what it takes.  

UO didnt have TAB123. Maybe thats why I can adapt to anything.

[Ard]

Honestly, for me, this and Vindictus are games that I don't really think of as MMO's.  The social aspect isn't really there.  They're more coop action rpgs not that much unlike Borderlands, just with a graphical lobby.  It's closest MMO analog is DDO (which also isn't really an MMO in my mind), but with more monsters.