Good character for a total newb

[Rasix]

How do people have bad games with Tryndamere?.

I've seen players play Trynd and die all the time without ever getting kills. How do you do that?

It seems that if he loses early, it snowballs a bit and he'll just keep losing. Trynd needs items.  A lot of people have the misconception that you're really, really strong early.  You're not.  That being said, if you play like a complete weenie, you're useless.  I played with one that was so passive he just built GP5 items because he couldn't/wouldn't farm for shit.  Another one was GO GO GO fight early on and was 0-6 in a heart beat and 3 levels down in lane.

Then, I played against one the other day that some idiots fed hard in a dual lane.  Guy was a goddamned nightmare afterwards.  Run in wreck someone, get focused, pop ult, spin out, heal, live.  LAME.  I had to build primarily not to get wrecked by this guy.  
He seems like he'd fit my style pretty well as I tend to play bruisers (GP, Irelia, Jax, Garen, Singed) better than ranged carries.   But, I don't want to be a Trynd player, as they're all childish assholes, and I think he'd bring out my inner retard like Garen does.  Although, I suppose there's no time like free time to check him out.

Most of my deaths were from my overconfidence and over aggressiveness.

   

I could use to be a bit more aggressive.  A more passive style really isn't helping when my entire team sucks balls.  However, I'm really not sure what I should do in this case.  I mean, what the fuck are you supposed to do when your jungler dies to minions, your mid lane dies and your bot lane gets double killed in the first minute or two of action? Wait for 20 minutes to be up or just.. practice last hitting?

[Rasix]

Malzahar suffers from the same problem as Jax; beaten by a single item.

What's the item that deters Jax?

Sword of the divine.

http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Sword_of_the_Divine

[HaemishM]

Holy monkey shit, I don't think I've ever seen that item in-game. For 60% attack speed and a passive 100 magic damage bonus every 4th attack at less than 2000 gold? WTF? I might have to think about that for my Jungling Yi build.

[Viin]

Yeah I don't remember seeing it either, but I usually don't look at Attack Speed items that often. Do items unlock as you go up in level tiers?

[statisticalfool]

Nope. People just never buy it, because the other AS items are generally much better.

[Der Helm]

Malzahar suffers from the same problem as Jax; beaten by a single item.

What's the item that deters Jax?

Divine blade's acvtive renders his dodge useless for a few seconds.

[Malakili]

I use that item regularly with Vayne.   It just synergizes so well with her w.  Its also pretty scary on Teemo.

[Rasix]

Wouldn't a Wit's End probably be a bit better?  You get a nice survivability boost as well.  I'd rather spend the money on a Black Cleaver, Phantom Dancer, or if they're health stacking: bloodrazor.  

[Slayerik]

Sword of the Divine I think, active makes it so you can't be dodged.

[Malakili]

Sword of the Divine I think, active makes it so you can't be dodged.

Yeah, 8 seconds of no dodge and 30 armor penetration, on a 40 second cooldown.

[Rasix]

Sword of the Divine I think, active makes it so you can't be dodged.

[Rasix]

Gragas sale now.  Woot.  Skarner too (semi intriguing).

[HaemishM]

Tried Graves tonight. He definitely feels a bit overpowered. I was laning against the WORST Warwick I've ever seen. He'd get caught up attacking minions in the lane and just ignore the fact that I was absolutely hammering his ass. He died twice before the first minion wave was done. The only guy on the other team that gave me trouble was a Brand that went middle lane and held it well 1v1 and 1v2 considering his other lanes were getting slaughtered.

[Slayerik]

Played one game as Sona last night for the first time and I was impressed, and went 2/0/8. She can poke, sustain, speed up, AOE stun, and can do just fine with gp/10 items. I see why she is such a high rated support.  Now I just gotta get the 'power chord' thing down.

[statisticalfool]

your avatar is clearly not rocking hard enough

[Rasix]

Tried Trynd and it felt weird.  I'm used to have a better initiator/gap closer/poke than he has (didn't really dig the spin).  Not sure I can play him, but it could be that I just had a bad game against a good team.  Lane partner was a useless Garen as well.

Farms like a beast though.  Auto attack + go get a drink.

[Slayerik]

He's good outta the jungle. His ganks are solid with a distance closer, and a long duration slow. With coordination, he can gank at low levels.  Rumor has it he can solo top, but still haven't seen it really happen.

[Strazos]

Trynd mostly sucks early. I imagine it'd be even worse paired with Garen if your facing ranged.

Also, he's an old champ, so he doesn't get all the crazy tricks new characters get.

[HaemishM]

I had a really bad Trynd game last night. Got capped twice in bot lane paired up with a very passive Galio against a Miss Fortune and a good Xin Zhao. Fortune would plink me and Xin would come in and hammer the damage home. I fed them almost the entire game as I couldn't ever get much traction going. He can catch up if he takes an early game soaking like I did, but you really have to pile on the items with him or he can get hammered. The spin initiate is great for farming, and only so-so against anything but a solo squishy. I think he works terribly as an initiator, better as a cleanup guy.

[Malakili]

I had a really bad Trynd game last night. Got capped twice in bot lane paired up with a very passive Galio against a Miss Fortune and a good Xin Zhao. Fortune would plink me and Xin would come in and hammer the damage home. I fed them almost the entire game as I couldn't ever get much traction going. He can catch up if he takes an early game soaking like I did, but you really have to pile on the items with him or he can get hammered. The spin initiate is great for farming, and only so-so against anything but a solo squishy. I think he works terribly as an initiator, better as a cleanup guy.

Once you get his ult, initiating is a lot more viable.  I see a lot of Tryndamere's going for lots of early game kills, and sometimes they even get a few, but it seems to me that smarter way to play is just extremely passive in the early game, farm up kills, and then really start putting on pressure.  As near as I can tell there is almost not reason to leave your tower or go far from it in the early game.  Trying to force things to happen in the early game always most seems to end poorly in my experience, whereas playing passively almost always sets you up for a strong mid game.  In other words, you can't really win the game in the first 10 minutes, but you can sure as hell LOSE the game in the first ten minutes.  People just seem impatient.

[Rasix]

Trynd mostly sucks early. I imagine it'd be even worse paired with Garen if your facing ranged.

Also, he's an old champ, so he doesn't get all the crazy tricks new characters get.

Lane I was against was Talon + Janna combo.  The Talon was fairly bad, but the Janna was good.  I didn't really die early, but Garen did his Garen thing and charged in like a retard.   Dude fed them pretty hard, so late game we were way behind despite me being top CS by quite a large margin.   Other lanes were getting it worse, so, it just wasn't a good game in general.

Afterwards, I ate some oranges, and it was OK. AKA I hopped on GP and stomped the next game.  Had two of the people from the last game in it and they were getting rolled so bad that at the end they just started intentionally feeding because their team wouldn't surrender.

Here's a dumb noob question:  will you get a leaver mark on your account if you bow out of your own custom game against bots?  I want to try Gragas out and get accustomed to his skill shots before I inflict him upon the solo queue.

[K9]

I am fairly sure that custom games are not tracked for your won/lost/left stats.

[statisticalfool]

Yeah, custom games have no penalties whatsoever: doesn't even matter if there are people in it.

Good for practicing jungle routes.

[Ice Cream Emperor]

In other words, you can't really win the game in the first 10 minutes, but you can sure as hell LOSE the game in the first ten minutes.  People just seem impatient.

This is good advice for Trynd, but more generally, if one side can lose the game in 10 minutes, then it follows that somebody has won it in tha same span of time, and strictly speaking there is no reason it could not be you.

[Rasix]

This is good advice for Trynd, but more generally, if one side can lose the game in 10 minutes, then it follows that somebody has won it in tha same span of time, and strictly speaking there is no reason it could not be you.

Go mid, hope you get a favorable matchup (retard or just champ mismatch), proceed to carry very hard.  You'll be up in levels, up in CS, and probably have a few kills or assists.  I find it's a bit harder to seal the deal in middle, but it can happen if top or bot can push our their lanes and gank (I don't count yet on having a jungler).  After the turret is down, go run around being a goddamn menace.

Seems like 1/4 of my games are won or loss to someone getting pasted early and often by Caitlyn and turning her into an unstoppable monster.   You can replace Cait in that statement with any carry (AD especially it seems) .   You're going back to get your boots and Cait already has a BF sword and will autoattack into godliness.

edit:

/Offtopic  AP Sion seems pretty retarded.  Seems like there's one in every solo queue stream I watch.

[Rasix]

Gragas is a lot of fun.  I can see myself playing him well.  Pretty easy to build too.  Still need to get better at remembering to use ignite, otherwise I'm just better off doing flash/tele.  Still, I finished with top CS by at least 50, finished positive (3/2/ton of assists),  and lost my lane badly to Cait    (didn't die, just lost tower with no help)  I don't know if I can win against ranged AD in mid, but it'll probably get easier as I get better with my Q.

[Malakili]

  You can replace Cait in that statement with any carry (AD especially it seems) .   You're going back to get your boots and Cait already has a BF sword and will autoattack into godliness.

I can't tell of AD carries are just supposed to be THE damage dealers in the late game, or if people just don't build thornmail often enough in my newbie bracket. 

[Ice Cream Emperor]

The role of an AD carry (vs. an AP carry) is to have high damage through auto-attacks, as opposed to high damage through ability use. There's no cooldown on an auto-attack (or I suppose, there is, but it's really really short) so an AD carry who gets to auto-attack all fight will put out a lot more damage than a comparable AP carry, the longer the fight goes. Attack speed and damage scales a lot better than ap and CDR.

So yes, basically, it's their job to do most of the damage late-game. If they get to their late-game items when everyone else is still struggling into the mid-game then it's going to be even more alarming, provided their team can keep them alive (or the other team sucks at focusing.)

[Ice Cream Emperor]

Also I'm kind of skeptical of a thornmail on anyone who isn't already pretty tanky, but I am willing to hear opinions otherwise. Obviously, armour is nice, but the damage return seems like a waste of gold if you're going to die in four hits anyways.

[jakonovski]

Thornmail can be powerful but it's kind of hit and miss if it's not thought out beforehand. What tends to happen is that the enemy carry just vaporizes someone who doesn't have it and your team collapses, at which point it doesn't matter if their carry gets a bit worse for wear or even dead.  

[Rasix]

Thornmail goes situationally on already tanky characters for me.  Usually if I'm playing Singed, tankplank (atmogs + mix of offensive/defensive), or another tanky DPS.  Sometimes it's a just a goddamn necessity to keep a fed as hell Cait/Trynd/Yi (haven't seen one of these in a while) in check.  Plus with Singed, it's just like pouring lemon juice on their paper cut of annoyance. 

[Slayerik]

So for people that like support, or want to learn one, I am damn impressed with Sona. She is good throughout the game, has a decent (if a bit short) AoE stun ult that is great, and even packs a wee bit of burst with Blue, power chord, ult. Her early phase poke can really zone out people that aren't expecting the damage, or can go strong healing instead keeping that AD carry happily farming. She seems easy to me, as I don't think I've had a bad game with her yet, even with loses.

[HaemishM]

Yeah, Sona is just awesome. If she travels with even a moderately coordinated team, they can rape face. Not a lot of people know to focus fire her down first and if the Sona is competent, she'll never get close enough for you to have a shot. You'll jump in, be pounding on something expecting that something to die and suddenly you'll be worm food and be like "HOW DID THAT HAPPEN?" The chords are a dead giveaway.

I had a game at lunch as Alistar laning top with a Vayne against a Sona/Warwick combo. Even with a Warwick that was too aggressive, they still managed to push us off and destroy our turret before we got to theirs. I think we'd probably have lost the game if the Warwick and Sona had not disconnected at exactly the same time (I think they must have been duoing from the same house). 5v3 made it an easy romp, even with a Fiddlesticks that seemed to be pretty damn good against our Vlad who was really not good at all.

[Margalis]

In DOTA certain carries are the guys that deal out the vast majority of the damage late-game. In LOL it's not that pronounced, AD carries can do the most damage over a long fight but are also generally the easiest to shut down. AP guys do more front-loaded damage and tanky chars can stay alive, while AD carries have to be alive and in position for decent amounts of time to deal a lot of damage.

Actually "carrying" as a carry in LoL isn't all that common. Not like DOTA where late game some guys can just 1 v 5 a team.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Sona is my ranked game go to character, with a halfway decent team you can really carry them through proper support/items.

With a terrible team? You just sort of stand around holding your dick in your hand cause she can't do shit on her own.