Good character for a total newb

[Rasix]

Did pretty good with my first game as Wukong.  Opponents were pretty bad though.  In my 2v1 lane (we had jungle Lee Sin), the AP Sion looked like he was playing while reading notes and the Nid was pretty terrible.  They only managed to get me once and Lee Sin never felt like he needed to gank my lane.  Finished 11/2/16 with the last death coming at the very end when I was tower diving 3 of them at Nexus.  

Good damage and great escapes.  His E -> Q combo hits pretty damn hard.  People aren't expecting it (I wasn't).  Kept fat fingering his damn ulti due to his initiator being an e.  So used to leading with a q.  That w is so fun to have.

Still, very positive experience and seems like a summoner I'll be able to play pretty well.  Of course, could have just been luck and playing a bunch of muppets.

edit: Dragon lady is hard as fuck to chase down. 

Man, I've followed that up by playing him pretty mediocre to outright bad lately.  I think I need to put the monkey down or pull my head out of my ass, one of the two.  Went 8/10/x in one game and took endless shit from my team.. who were all vastly negative as well, except for our Brand.  Man, this fucking LeBlanc would not get off my ass (she was like 11/16/x).  I think I'm just not totally sure what I'm supposed to be doing with him.  Burn squishies (don't seem to have the burst for that)?  Hit and run?  Build tanky (damage goes to shit)?

Could be though, that lately I just don't seem to be playing great in general.  My ult timing and spatial awareness have been awful. 

Still winning though; 16 game swing from where I was a week or two ago.  Found Ryze to be pretty solid and easy to play. Damage seemed to taper off a bit toward the end of the game.  Just needed to get my RoA/AS out, I think.

[HaemishM]

Could be though, that lately I just don't seem to be playing great in general.  My ult timing and spatial awareness have been awful. 

I seem to be hitting the same patches at times. I was on like a 5 game losing streak where shit just was not working no matter what I did. I think part of it was that I'd just hit 20 and haven't had a chance to fill up on T3 runes yet. Playing Brand, I'd run up against a Brand of the same level and get owned 1v1 and I couldn't understand why until I realized the summoner was 3 levels above me and probably had more T3 runes than I did. That could make a HUGE difference apparently.

[HaemishM]

Yeah, so I fucking SUCK with Gragas. I mean yuckypoo shittastically awful. He has some serious damage potential late game if you play him right, but he's so farmable early, especially in my hands. I had a bad game last night with what was in essence a bad team of chattering fucktards. Our Katarina really wasn't that great but she kept nattering on and talking shit with the Twitch on the other side who was killing me repeatedly and relentlessly. Our Sion kept talking in some weird abbreviated fucktard English that I couldn't understand him at all. It would be like one or two coherent words followed by two-letter Mongoloid-isms like "feed team fk fggg" or some such Tourette's level mish mash. I kept asking him if English was a first language but never got an answer I could understand. I ended up with like 3/20 but at least I had 17 assists to show I wasn't totally worthless? Just an awful fucking game.

Then I played Annie. It was like fucking EASY MODE in comparison. She is such a beast.

[Rasix]

Yeah, so I fucking SUCK with Gragas. I mean yuckypoo shittastically awful. He has some serious damage potential late game if you play him right, but he's so farmable early, especially in my hands. I had a bad game last night with what was in essence a bad team of chattering fucktards. Our Katarina really wasn't that great but she kept nattering on and talking shit with the Twitch on the other side who was killing me repeatedly and relentlessly. Our Sion kept talking in some weird abbreviated fucktard English that I couldn't understand him at all. It would be like one or two coherent words followed by two-letter Mongoloid-isms like "feed team fk fggg" or some such Tourette's level mish mash. I kept asking him if English was a first language but never got an answer I could understand. I ended up with like 3/20 but at least I had 17 assists to show I wasn't totally worthless? Just an awful fucking game.

Then I played Annie. It was like fucking EASY MODE in comparison. She is such a beast.

Hehe, don't build Phantom Dancer on Gragas.

Gragas is all about the poke.  I'll write up some more on this later, but my son's making some noise right now.

edit:  You need to change something about the dying thing.  If someone died 25 times on my team, I'd be a little miffed.  Maybe even a bit bothered.  

For an item build:

Start:  Boots, 3 health pots.

First back:  2 Dorans rings.  Refill pots.  If Twitch/Eve(laugh) is in your lane/game.  PINK WARD.  Slap that fucker in the middle of the lane. Laugh at Twitch when you toss a barrel on his hidden ass. If they have a solid ganker as a jungler, ward your river bushes.

Start rushing your Rabadons.  Finish your boots as you do this.  Probably sorc.

Lich Bane.  Void Staff.  Bashee's Veil is pretty helpful for someone that will be doing a lot of poking.  I don't get RoA, and don't usually feel like it'd help me.  Perhaps another defensive item or a DFG. 


Skill priority:  R > Q > E > W.  Get one point in W at 2 and leave it there. 

More perhaps later. 

[Arinon]

I never realized how good Zilean is in mid.  Been playing him bottom mostly or solo-top (when no one else on the team wants to deal with a 2v1 lane) and the games really depend on how well the carries do.  Getting pressed into mid a lot more and finding out can really zone people hard and push em around.  Haven't had a match-up there where I felt I was at a disadvantage.

Playing almost exclusively with support or tanks when it's needed but I still haven't found a killer I'm really good with.  I like the poke-style play more than the charge in and face-wreck.  Seems most of the carries are built to face check.  Tried Gragas.  Didn't go so well.  Is Lux competative?  Her kit looks sweet.

[Rasix]

I always hear people bitch that Lux's cool downs are way too high.  Your first few Gragas games will be ultrabad.  But he is made for the poke-poke.  

My Wukong is getting respectable. Better than my Gangplank, which has seemed to slip a bit. I think I've gone 3 matches without fat fingering my ulti.  

Thinking about getting Udyr or Trundle for another bruiser that can top lane (or jungle when I get courageous and feel like getting yelled at for an entire game).

[Slayerik]

Playing almost exclusively with support or tanks when it's needed but I still haven't found a killer I'm really good with.  I like the poke-style play more than the charge in and face-wreck.  Seems most of the carries are built to face check.  Tried Gragas.  Didn't go so well.  Is Lux competative?  Her kit looks sweet.

Lux as a carry is underwhelming. Lux as support is decent, but lacks a heal. That being said, I have seen her played well and wreck some shit, but there are a lot more powerful solo mids than her.

[Malakili]

Playing almost exclusively with support or tanks when it's needed but I still haven't found a killer I'm really good with.  I like the poke-style play more than the charge in and face-wreck.  Seems most of the carries are built to face check.  Tried Gragas.  Didn't go so well.  Is Lux competative?  Her kit looks sweet.

Lux as a carry is underwhelming. Lux as support is decent, but lacks a heal. That being said, I have seen her played well and wreck some shit, but there are a lot more powerful solo mids than her.

I like Kennen quite a lot as a "killer."  His sustain is amazing if you take Doran's Shield first as well, and he his damage output gets scary in the mid and late game.  Great solo mid character.   One note that, he is super reliant (especially during laning) on his skill shot, which is fairly easy to land.

[statisticalfool]

I always hear people bitch that Lux's cool downs are way too high.  Your first few Gragas games will be ultrabad.  But he is made for the poke-poke.  

My Wukong is getting respectable. Better than my Gangplank, which has seemed to slip a bit. I think I've gone 3 matches without fat fingering my ulti.  

Thinking about getting Udyr or Trundle for another bruiser that can top lane (or jungle when I get courageous and feel like getting yelled at for an entire game).

Lane trundle seems like it'd be pretty underwhelming, and Udyr is a constant headache for me.

Cho`gath fits the solo top bruiser or jungle pretty well. He wants AS runes for jungling, but that's not too crazy and who knows what he'll need after today.

[Rasix]

Yah, I have Cho.  Used to play him a lot. Maybe I should start putting him back into rotation.  I just don't seem to kill as well, but you end up insanely tanky.   I could use my Singed runes with him pretty effectively and probably just switch out the quints.

[Arinon]

I love Cho, he's my go to for tanks.  Even with mediocre last-hits and dicey Ruptures I can still do well with him.

People play Trundle?  I've literally never seen him in any of my games, ever.

I like Kennen quite a lot as a "killer."  His sustain is amazing if you take Doran's Shield first as well, and he his damage output gets scary in the mid and late game.  Great solo mid character.   One note that, he is super reliant (especially during laning) on his skill shot, which is fairly easy to land.

Looked at Kennen, may give him a whirl.  I know from the other end that he can be a real bitch to lane against.  May also try Miss Fortune, who I picked up in that triple sale a couple weeks ago.

[Rasix]

People play Trundle?  I've literally never seen him in any of my games, ever.

I've played against him once.  It was like my 2nd time jungling and he kicked my ass all over the place.  Otherwise, the only place I see him is in competitive play.  Seems to range from pretty effective to downright ignorable.  Seems like his kit is pretty useful.  You've got a spammable Q that has pretty good scaling, a steroid, a wall/slow, and good sustain.  Ulti is a little odd, but seems to make him a decent duelist or good for going after a carry.

Hate laning against Kennen.  He is a bitch.

edit:
Always kind of fun to play someone people don't see a lot.  I get a lot of strange reactions with Gragas even though you do seem him some.  "ARE U TANK, GRAG?"

[Rasix]

So, thinking of picking up a couple more quints to change stuff up and to fit some more champs better.  Movement speed or health quints? Mostly going to go on solo top/solo mid characters.

[statisticalfool]

So, thinking of picking up a couple more quints to change stuff up and to fit some more champs better.  Movement speed or health quints? Mostly going to go on solo top/solo mid characters.

flat health quints for those lanes especially.

[Mosesandstick]

Health quints could be used by both, I generally run MS quints for top. If you're patient, wait for the Christmas sales and see what pops up.

[Rasix]

It'll mostly go on Ryze, Wukong, GP.  Gragas, I'll keep with flat AP.  

I got absolutely shit on by a Kassadin mid playing as Ryze yesterday.  Of course, I'm somewhat convinced that's a crap matchup for me until I get a BV out.  I start my combo, and he just silences and goes to town.  The flat AP quints I've got on him right now are nearly useless (bought for Gragas).

[Mosesandstick]

I'd definitely go with the MS. I only use health quints now against very strong early game champs.

[Margalis]

Gragas is one of the few mage characters who can initiate fights and he's a great counter to squishier mid champs. For example against Leblanc you can push the lane against her safely and make her try to last hit under the tower, each barrel hurts her a lot and she can't really get close enough to do much to you. He has a 1.0 AP ratio on his Q and R, which is just insane.

His downside is that he is all burt and zero sustained damage, which means against tanky teams he falls off pretty badly.

[Rasix]

Do people play normal mode draft or usually just blind pick if they're doing normals at 30?  Because yah, sometimes you can end up making a pick that's going to end up being completely useless later in the game (or the entire one, heh).

[Thrawn]

Do people play normal mode draft or usually just blind pick if they're doing normals at 30?  Because yah, sometimes you can end up making a pick that's going to end up being completely useless later in the game (or the entire one, heh).

Both, I've watched 2000ish ELO streams where the person only plays blind pick normals.

[Rasix]

OK, another decision to make.  Garen or Trynd?  Trynd seems to be a lot stronger as the game goes along and seems to be more valid in competitive play (not like that matters much for me), but Garen was easier to play and more intuitive for me than Tryn during free weeks.  Garen also seems not to carry as hard or at least has a more definite ceiling to what he can do.  Seems like you can bully a lane easier with Garen.

[statisticalfool]

Garen seems easier than Trynd in a number of ways, but most importantly, easier to safely pick up CS on. So you know, if you like Garen, get garen.

Also, they're 1350 IP. You'll be able to fix this decision quickly.

[Setanta]

I'm still trying to settle on a champion. I was doing ok with Ashe but hit L11 and found out how fragile she is endgame. Annie was a lot of fun in the first matches I played using her, then I got smashed again. I played around with Volibear to see if it was my playstyle as ranged that was sucking but found myself falling behind. Then of course I realised I was using ranged mastery and runes. I'm still not taken with him although I did get one win where I went 5/7/5 - but I might have to mess around with a few other Champions to really get a feel for it.

I think my biggest mistake was leveling using the vsUI games - great up to L10 but after that the weaknesses show.

I'm very tempted to create an alt account and replay against people.

I really need to settle on one char soon - my win/loss ratio is appalling and while I don't mind getting assists rather than kills, I'm falling behind on them too.

WTB a means to stop sucking

[Cadaverine]

Stupid question time!  

So I've spent the day playing bot matches trying to get a feel for things.  I tried out a few characters, and my preference is for ranged over melee.  My primary problem is that I suck at last hitting, so my primary source of money is killing enemy champs/towers.  I've been playing Ashe/Tristana/Miss Fortune, but I seem to play too aggressively, as I often over-extend myself, while not being able to take out my target.  I'm guessing that the problem lies with my playing a carry as if it were a pusher?  Is there a ranged character that would be better suited to my more aggressive playstyle, or am I on the right track, and I just need to switch up some items for something more tanky-ish?

[Arinon]

I think my biggest mistake was leveling using the vsUI games - great up to L10 but after that the weaknesses show.

WTB a means to stop sucking

I feel like I'm still paying for starting with a lot of AI games as well.  Should have known better but wanted to 'get comfortable with the mechanics' first.  Big mistake.

Tried to catch up on the mid/late game dynamics by playing support or support-ish champs (Zilean, Morgana, Janna, Sona) and just not dying during laning.  Once that breaks up, scope out the best dude on my team and roll with them as much as possible.  Use wards, which I don't remember seeing much of at ALL until level 20ish, and just watch the flow of the game.  Worked reasonably well for me but you can end up at the mercy of your team, which obviously isn't for everybody.

Can't help you with k/d ratios on carries though as I'm having the same issues myself.  Despite feeling incompetent half the time my win/loss is well over 50%, somehow.

[Rasix]

Stupid question time!  

So I've spent the day playing bot matches trying to get a feel for things.  I tried out a few characters, and my preference is for ranged over melee.  My primary problem is that I suck at last hitting, so my primary source of money is killing enemy champs/towers.  I've been playing Ashe/Tristana/Miss Fortune, but I seem to play too aggressively, as I often over-extend myself, while not being able to take out my target.  I'm guessing that the problem lies with my playing a carry as if it were a pusher?  Is there a ranged character that would be better suited to my more aggressive playstyle, or am I on the right track, and I just need to switch up some items for something more tanky-ish?

You can play a mage like Ryze pretty aggressively if you build him with mana items that'll give you a good deal of durability as well.  Plus, he's got a noob stomp combo you can throw on unsuspecting people.  I don't last hit with him very well and I'm usually a bit underfarmed until mid game, but then I catch up quite well. Your ulti will help you clear creep waves and due to your passive it's up a lot, so you don't need to feel guilty about using it.  But, he's AP and you might be more accustomed to right clickers at this time. 

Trist's passive on her E can help you get some farm even if you're bad at getting last hits. 

I think a good think to do would be to get better at harassing.  Forcing them to back or blow a summoner is worth the effort.  You can get some free farm or up the chances that the next engage will end in a kill. 

But in the end, you'll just have to get better at last hitting.  I'm still pretty bad at it.  As you get more levels, it'll get harder to CS as the level of harass and jungle pressure will increase. Doesn't get easier, so it's a decent idea to practice now.  I'm probably the worst person to jump in here with advice, however, since I don't play ranged AD at all (not for a long time). 

[Arinon]

I learned this lesson pretty hard once junglers started to become commonplace:  You don't push the lane just because you can.  Unless you have a good reason you want the creep line just beyond your tower.

I'm also not the best guy for this sort of advice.

[Rasix]

I really need to settle on one char soon - my win/loss ratio is appalling and while I don't mind getting assists rather than kills, I'm falling behind on them too.

WTB a means to stop sucking

Find out what role or two you're better at or have more fun playing and focus on that.  Play a couple champs that are good at that role. Don't try too hard to synergize with your team, don't try Cho'gath for the first time because they want a tank.  Playing just a couple champs at a time seems to up my success.  Once I start branching out too much, I don't play as well.  Don't play wierd champs.  Gragas is not for noobs.  Gangplank is great for noobs.  Avoid someone that's all skillshots.

Don't do bot games.  No more AI.  If you need to practice mechanics, make a custom game, add a single bot and then exit when you've accomplished what you want to. Playing a full game against AI is just pointless if you want to play people.

Nothing wrong with a smurf account if you want to try out a free champ v. a real person.  Just realize that if you find yourself owning, it's because they're terrible little nooblets.  But at least your mechanics will be tested in a live fire scenario.  

Also, watch some streams if you can.  Helps me a lot, even if they're way above what I aspire.  Just seeing some of the things they do and how aware they are of the game will help you start to see some of the same things.  

edit: 

Best single piece of advice:  Know when you're outclassed and play accordingly. A fight you can't win is a pretty dumb fight (most of the time).

[ezrast]

Stupid question time!  

So I've spent the day playing bot matches trying to get a feel for things.  I tried out a few characters, and my preference is for ranged over melee.  My primary problem is that I suck at last hitting, so my primary source of money is killing enemy champs/towers.  I've been playing Ashe/Tristana/Miss Fortune, but I seem to play too aggressively, as I often over-extend myself, while not being able to take out my target.  I'm guessing that the problem lies with my playing a carry as if it were a pusher?  Is there a ranged character that would be better suited to my more aggressive playstyle, or am I on the right track, and I just need to switch up some items for something more tanky-ish?

Going to be harsh and say: no, no, and no. Your problems with last hitting and overextending aren't due to your champ or build, they're due to you not knowing how to last hit or when to be aggressive. Which is fine - these are core skills that you see high-level players screw up regularly. Basically it comes down to a) knowing when you can secure a kill, which only comes with time and experience, and b) having the discipline not to jump in unless you know you can secure the kill, which is something you can start working on now. Trist is probably a great champ to learn this on actually, since her kit comes with really high risk/reward - after you W in on someone one of you is almost guaranteed to die.

[statisticalfool]

I'm still trying to settle on a champion. I was doing ok with Ashe but hit L11 and found out how fragile she is endgame. Annie was a lot of fun in the first matches I played using her, then I got smashed again.

I think you've got to accept that the game can be swingy, and just focus down on like two or three champions. Morgana's my best, but sometimes I will still just muck it up for a few games.

Out of those characters, Annie is a really solid champion who can carry games (she's no supercarry, but still good enough) has a fairly low skillfloor. I find Ashe a lot trickier (although to be note, I'm sucky with ADs), just because what you offer isn't necessarily tons of damage, but a ton of utility.

So just find three characters who are reasonable and you like, and play the hell out of them. You'll eventually just zoom past the people who are playing a different five characters each free week.

[Margalis]

Ranged AD carries, more than any other champion type, need items to do damage, which means you need to last hit to get money to get items.

[Malakili]

So just find three characters who are reasonable and you like, and play the hell out of them.

More than anything this last part is the key, you just need to play a lot.  I have a friend who is frequently trying to find new builds, new champions, etc, to make up for something if he isn't playing well, and I've been gently steering him to "just play more."  Good decision making (probably one of the most under rated skills in any multiplayer game from the perspective of most players) only comes from just getting a lot of experience, and good decision making counts for a TON in this game.

[Dark_MadMax]

Yeah, so I fucking SUCK with Gragas. I mean yuckypoo shittastically awful. He has some serious damage potential late game if you play him right, but he's so farmable early, especially in my hands. I had a bad game last night with what was in essence a bad team of chattering fucktards. Our Katarina really wasn't that great but she kept nattering on and talking shit with the Twitch on the other side who was killing me repeatedly and relentlessly. Our Sion kept talking in some weird abbreviated fucktard English that I couldn't understand him at all. It would be like one or two coherent words followed by two-letter Mongoloid-isms like "feed team fk fggg" or some such Tourette's level mish mash. I kept asking him if English was a first language but never got an answer I could understand. I ended up with like 3/20 but at least I had 17 assists to show I wasn't totally worthless? Just an awful fucking game.

Then I played Annie. It was like fucking EASY MODE in comparison. She is such a beast.

Gragas actually is pretty imba. You can farm from distan using your barrels, body slam is awesome escape mechanism  ( you can go trough walls). My only problem with him is dealing damage (as once you barrel is gone you pretty much just wait for cd)

[Rasix]

Yay, Udyr sale.

Still waiting for the following to go on sale at some point:

Rumble
Yorick
Trundle

Feels like I'm playing bruiser pokemon.  

I want to play Swain top lane at some point, but everyone wants me to mid with him and certain mid champs can abuse his range/lack of burst.  I'm sure some top laners will just completely poop all over me, but I think I'll do pretty decent in a lot of match ups.  I could always try convincing my team, but that usually doesn't go over very well.  

edit:
Any suggestions for laning against the following champs:  Ryze (I know, I play him, still do bad), Kennen, Riven, Xerath, Volibear (lane).   I always seem to do exceptionally poor against them. With Volibear, it's not a huge sample size as I almost never see him.  Few times I've had him up top, I think it's been when I haven't been on GP.  Without the poke, he just tends to be like a bursty Singed with a really annoying passive.  Ryze just tends to have a ton of burst and harasses me out of lane.  Kennen, you just can't get out of lane and at 6 he can kill you if he feels like blowing a flash. Xerath just has unreal poke AND burst.  And Riven is fucking broken unless played by a retard.

[Megrim]

Who are you playing against those characters with? Swain?