Hi-Rez buys Tribes IP; plans MMO

[Malakili]

I would agree that it has grown on me as well.  I think the change from 12 classes to 10 and giving some options for customization within each went a long way.  Still inferior to Tribes 2, but it is good enough at this point.

Oh also - does anyone else miss the targeting laser?  I loved playing with my friend, me going as a light and getting in position of the enemy and then painting targets so he could lob mortars from a safe position right on target.

[Thrawn]

Oh also - does anyone else miss the targeting laser?  I loved playing with my friend, me going as a light and getting in position of the enemy and then painting targets so he could lob mortars from a safe position right on target.

Yes, but doesn't the Ascend mortar have less range and AOE than the classic ones?

[MahrinSkel]

I don't think it actually does.  I think nostalgia has made people forget how close the fog limit was in those games.  On many of them you could shoot the mortar past anything you could see, what they don't remember is that you could fly to the same distance in 15 seconds.  Remember that it could barely reach from base to base on Broadside (you could *almost* jump that from balcony to balcony in Light without a disc jump or a ski ramp, you could make it from one roof to the other balcony fairly easily).  Scarabrae *seemed* huge, but it was really smaller than Drydock.

--Dave

[Malakili]

Oh also - does anyone else miss the targeting laser?  I loved playing with my friend, me going as a light and getting in position of the enemy and then painting targets so he could lob mortars from a safe position right on target.

Yes, but doesn't the Ascend mortar have less range and AOE than the classic ones?

I know the upped the AoE radius in one of the patches, and it feels a bit more like the old version to me since then.  I don't know about the actual radius, but it feels about right at this point.  Also, there are still plenty of places on the current set of maps where you might want to mortar from a relatively safe position and you can't because you have no good way to judge where the mortars are landing.   The laser targeter also lets you hit accurately right off the bat instead of having to use a couple of practice shots to judge the distance - which is balanced out by the fact that it takes two people to do so.

[Thrawn]

You're probably right on the fog of war/nostolgia factor then.

Speaking of the targeting laser, don't forget also having homing beacons or whatever they were called.    Place one on the underside of a platform or something, go suit up into heavy and mortar spam away with perfect accuracy!

*edit* Also, haven't confirmed yet, but just read that they increased mortar range in this patch.  Apparently they also unintentionaly doubled the rate of fire of light turrets.  

[MahrinSkel]

The problem is that it could easily be botted.  One actual human with a targeting laser could have four bots dropping one mortar/MIRV round every half a second or so, waving it around in a rolling wave of green death.

--Dave

[Thrawn]

So Infiltrator + Super Heavy (maxed) is the most fun I've had in a while.    I have this mental picture of an invisible man just clotheslining pathfinders to death as them come in on the flag.

[Malakili]

The turret bug is pretty  - every server I've joined has like 5 techs per team now too.

[MahrinSkel]

Just FYI: Don't play on the Europe servers right now.  I was checking out various foreign servers, trying to find out how lag-tolerant T:A is (answer: 200 ping is very playable, 300 isn't), and I found that Europe was completely taken over by hackers.  I spent a few hours just watching them, it was...interesting.  Anyone who tells you that you can't aimbot a ballistic weapon is full of crap, not only in theory but in practice.  I saw someone with the Grenade Launcher breeze past a base turret at 150, hitting it dead on with every shot, including two in the middle that had to bounce off the ground to arm.  The Grenade Launcher is the most arcing of the weapons, and notoriously hard to use effectively outside of a corridor fight, where you just flood the target area with explosions.  With nearly perfect accuracy, the only defense was to fly too high for splash damage and too erratically for mid-airs (it has huge DPS to go with the inaccuracy).

Definitely saw that not all aimbots were equal.  A lot of them were just old-school dead-on aimbots, which are godlike with hitscan weapons but easily defeated by keeping a high deflection on anything with a travel time (and nearly useless for arcing weapons).  But there were two varieties of ballistic aimbot, one was so good that it could lay a long-range mortar shot right where the target would wind up if they didn't change any of their directional controls (also seemed to work for leading with bullet weapons), I saw a guy mid-airing lights from midfield with it.  The other wasn't quite as good at moving targets, but could easily compensate for your own vector inheritance and bounce the rounds off of the terrain to reach the target ready to blow.  The guys with the predicting aimbots were completely dominating the ones with the more primitive versions (who had to try to reduce deflection to zero or get very close to get the benefit of their cybernetic assistance).

One match, on Drydock, 3 Juggernauts were skiing around while launching MIRV's almost straight up into the air, all of the submunitions were landing on the flagstand while they toured all around the map.  I dunno if Hi-Rez just aren't monitoring the foreign servers the way they do the US ones, but these guys were not even trying to be subtle, I was sure more than half of them were cheating, and there was only one guy besides myself I was certain wasn't (he was the Sentinel who kept missing).  Actually, there were nearly no snipers, apparently even cheaters find that too easy and unfun and would swarm and spawn-camp anyone who sniped.

So, there you have it: What T:A would look like if it were just another boxed game.

--Dave

[Nightblade]

Ive been meaning to mention this: Does anyone else notice any weird mouse acceleration with this game?

[Malakili]

Ive been meaning to mention is: Does anyone else notice any weird mouse acceleration with this game?

I've not noticed that.

[Nightblade]

Ive been meaning to mention is: Does anyone else notice any weird mouse acceleration with this game?

I've not noticed that.

Guess Im the only one, high speed flick shots are nearly impossible because I never know where my mouse is going to go. Despite this I can still do ok; but its still nothing you want to deal with.

[MahrinSkel]

Check around in your settings, there are a few options for the mouse that might be causing you problems (including an acceleration one I disabled).

--Dave

EDIT: Against my normal practice, I followed someone's advice and reduced my sensitivity by about a third.  I normally set for about a 1/2 inch 360, which serves me fine for flick shots with splash weapons, but the Raider I normally play needs precise placement for effective use of the sticky-grenade shooter, and the bullet weapons (which I had been ignoring except for taking the last sliver off a fleeing opponent or flag carrier) are much more effective with lower sensitivity.  I'm actually getting kills with the bullets alone now, and it's gotten easier to lay down the patterns with the ARX Buster that bounce a target from one into the next or cover *all* the ways he might dodge.

[Nightblade]

Its amazing really, at first glance certain classes didnt really interest me, but the more I poke around in the games different classes the more Im liking about this game.

[Malakili]

SAN FRANCISCO. March 9, 2012.  Today, at the Game Developers Conference in San Francisco, Hi-Rez Studios announced that Tribes: Ascend will be released on April 12, 2012.

http://www.hirezstudios.com/hirezwp/?p=1825

I guess in a free to play release there isn't a huge difference between open beta and release, but there we go.

[Thrawn]

SAN FRANCISCO. March 9, 2012.  Today, at the Game Developers Conference in San Francisco, Hi-Rez Studios announced that Tribes: Ascend will be released on April 12, 2012.

http://www.hirezstudios.com/hirezwp/?p=1825

I guess in a free to play release there isn't a huge difference between open beta and release, but there we go.

Meh, the fact that they think the game in its current setup is "release ready" makes me much less interested in it.  Was hoping for at least a few more gameplay changes before they considered it done aside from all the issues that need to be fixed.

C'mon Planetside 2!

[Mrbloodworth]

Tribes: Ascend’s "Llama Island" Trailer

 

[Malakili]

Tribes: Ascend’s "Llama Island" Trailer

 

There have been a rash of llama grabbers lately.  I hate coming in to a flag stand screaming vff vff vff and having that totally helpless feeling of watching some guy walk up to the flag, pick it up, and jet off.

[Malakili]

I'm pretty sad they removed Bella Omega completely.  Not for more iteration, just nuking it altogether from what I can tell.  It felt very "tribesy" to me, but I guess a lot of people didn't like the importance of the generator and base defense (which is exactly what I DID like).  I understand that they are trying to make this game very flag-centric and I know it is CTF, but it seems to me the older Tribes games weren't all about flag running.  Flag running was important, but you sort of built up to being able to grab the flag through sustained offense rather than just sending cappers over and over and over until one makes it out - which is where Tribes: Ascend is right now.  I'm enjoying T:A don't get me wrong, but I am going to miss some of the more strategic stuff.

[Thrawn]

I'm pretty sad they removed Bella Omega completely.  Not for more iteration, just nuking it altogether from what I can tell.  It felt very "tribesy" to me, but I guess a lot of people didn't like the importance of the generator and base defense (which is exactly what I DID like).  I understand that they are trying to make this game very flag-centric and I know it is CTF, but it seems to me the older Tribes games weren't all about flag running.  Flag running was important, but you sort of built up to being able to grab the flag through sustained offense rather than just sending cappers over and over and over until one makes it out - which is where Tribes: Ascend is right now.  I'm enjoying T:A don't get me wrong, but I am going to miss some of the more strategic stuff.

This is pretty much why I'm losing interest in the game the more I play it.  Like you said, Hi-Rez seems to be focusing the game on being able to go fast and capture a flag every time you spawn as often as possible.  Except it feels like thats ALL they care about.  They don't seem interested in making other objectives matter, they keep only make maps where you can easily fly through the flag from multiple directions at 300 and aren't adding any other game mode that isn't at it's core just some sort of dueling arena (team deathmatch, arena, rabbit).  I'm guessing this is also why they've made generators mostly not matter and inventory stations pointless, if someone has to worry about fixing a gen or going 30 seconds out of their way it slows down how often they can make a flag run.  Then they even had the terrible idea of throwing in regenerating health to make even more friendly.  

[Malakili]

I'm pretty sad they removed Bella Omega completely.  Not for more iteration, just nuking it altogether from what I can tell.  It felt very "tribesy" to me, but I guess a lot of people didn't like the importance of the generator and base defense (which is exactly what I DID like).  I understand that they are trying to make this game very flag-centric and I know it is CTF, but it seems to me the older Tribes games weren't all about flag running.  Flag running was important, but you sort of built up to being able to grab the flag through sustained offense rather than just sending cappers over and over and over until one makes it out - which is where Tribes: Ascend is right now.  I'm enjoying T:A don't get me wrong, but I am going to miss some of the more strategic stuff.

This is pretty much why I'm losing interest in the game the more I play it.  Like you said, Hi-Rez seems to be focusing the game on being able to go fast and capture a flag every time you spawn as often as possible.  Except it feels like thats ALL they care about.  They don't seem interested in making other objectives matter, making maps where you can easily fly through the flag from multiple directions at 300 or adding any other game mode that isn't at it's core just some sort of dueling arena (team deathmatch, arena, rabbit).  I'm guessing this is also why they've made generators mostly not matter and inventory stations pointless, if someone has to worry about fixing a gen or going 30 seconds out of their way it slows down how often they can make a flag run.  Then they even had the terrible idea of throwing in regenerating health to make even more friendly. 

I just fired up Tribes: Next for a few maps (which is a community run version of Tribes 2, since T2 login servers are no longer supported: http://www.tribesnext.com/ for more info).   It was amazingly epic feeling by comparison to Tribes: Ascend.  I've played Tribes 2 for a long time, and in the last few years I go on Tribes: Next kicks every so often, so it isn't like I haven't played it semi recently, but damned if the differences don't just jump right out at you when you play one next to the other.  The strategic layer to T2 really made the game, and while there was still plenty of high speed flag running and chasing, I really miss being able to set up the Jericho to give yourself an extra turret whereever you want/a forward base, I miss the vehicles being an integral part of the game because you spawn them immediately with a hard team limit on numbers for balance rather than relying on credits.  Hell, I even miss the frantic attempt to get a few heavies spamming mortars out of your gen room so you can repair up and get your desired loadout.

Some of this has to do with core mechanics (like spawning "naked"), but some of it also has to do with map design.  In an hour of Tribes Next I played 2 maps in which the flag stand was a bit more open, 1 map where grabs were much harder and defense was tough, and 1 map where the majority of the level was actually underground.  Its not that Tribes: Ascend does what it does poorly, it is that previous versions of Tribes tended to do all that, plus a lot else.  It seems like a step backward in that regard.  I know Hi Rez is pushing this thing out the door kind of fast, its really only been in development a year and a few months, and what they've done in that time is pretty solid, but I am really hoping they expand on what they ahve in the future.  Maybe the free to play model will work in our favor in this regard, because continued development is pretty assured. 

Also, we haven't seen the private servers yet.  Supposedly a lot of rules tweaking will be allowed in server settings.  If they release the map editor and then combine that with private servers the core is good enough that the community could really put together some good stuff, even if Hi Rez wants to focus on the high speed version only.

[Thrawn]

Yeah, that does sum it up pretty nicely.  Tribes: Ascend is by no means a terrible game, but 11 year old Tribes: 2 is still more fun.

[MahrinSkel]

I'm pretty sad they removed Bella Omega completely.  Not for more iteration, just nuking it altogether from what I can tell.  It felt very "tribesy" to me, but I guess a lot of people didn't like the importance of the generator and base defense (which is exactly what I DID like).  I understand that they are trying to make this game very flag-centric and I know it is CTF, but it seems to me the older Tribes games weren't all about flag running.  Flag running was important, but you sort of built up to being able to grab the flag through sustained offense rather than just sending cappers over and over and over until one makes it out - which is where Tribes: Ascend is right now.  I'm enjoying T:A don't get me wrong, but I am going to miss some of the more strategic stuff.

I think HiRez is used to taking player feedback fairly seriously, "squeaky wheel gets the grease", which worked well enough for Global Agenda where they had a comparatively smaller and more committed community.  They seem to be a little overwhelmed by the tactical bitching of a larger, less attached playerbase that only comes to the forums to complain.  Bella Omega was the map that was most different from the others, with the most important and complex generator defense aspects, so it was the one that attracted the most complaints until they made it literally the simplest generator layout possible (so much that "defending the generator" was parking a pair of Beowulfs next to it) at which point it became everyone else's least favorite map.

I didn't like the new Bella Omega very well, but it was one of only two where "defense disruption" for me wasn't fitting out in Raider (skating Juggernaut instead). 

--Dave

[Malakili]

I'm pretty sad they removed Bella Omega completely.  Not for more iteration, just nuking it altogether from what I can tell.  It felt very "tribesy" to me, but I guess a lot of people didn't like the importance of the generator and base defense (which is exactly what I DID like).  I understand that they are trying to make this game very flag-centric and I know it is CTF, but it seems to me the older Tribes games weren't all about flag running.  Flag running was important, but you sort of built up to being able to grab the flag through sustained offense rather than just sending cappers over and over and over until one makes it out - which is where Tribes: Ascend is right now.  I'm enjoying T:A don't get me wrong, but I am going to miss some of the more strategic stuff.

I think HiRez is used to taking player feedback fairly seriously, "squeaky wheel gets the grease", which worked well enough for Global Agenda where they had a comparatively smaller and more committed community.  They seem to be a little overwhelmed by the tactical bitching of a larger, less attached playerbase that only comes to the forums to complain.  Bella Omega was the map that was most different from the others, with the most important and complex generator defense aspects, so it was the one that attracted the most complaints until they made it literally the simplest generator layout possible (so much that "defending the generator" was parking a pair of Beowulfs next to it) at which point it became everyone else's least favorite map.

I didn't like the new Bella Omega very well, but it was one of only two where "defense disruption" for me wasn't fitting out in Raider (skating Juggernaut instead). 

--Dave

I actually never got a chance to play the newest version.  I thought the third(?) version, with the base layout pretty much like the original, with the full tower, the vehicle station on the low ground and with the 2 entrances to the basement was really quite good. 

Anyway, I realized playing T2 that the small population playing that game at this point actually understands how to play which greatly improves the experience.   So many people playing Tribes: Ascend treat the CTF like team deathmatch and don't really understand what something like Heavy on Flag even means.  You really need to understand more than what skiing is to play Tribes well, and I think there are just still a lot of players (especially noticeable since open beta) that really don't have any idea how to play - and that has caused me a lot of frustration in the last week or so playing the game.

[Nightblade]

Did they release some kind of weird patch today or something? I jump in the game today to see all of my controls and settings erased, after I finally get back in game there's this random but subtle stuttering that screws over how I do pretty much everything in the game.

[MahrinSkel]

The stuttering is probably the server running in debug mode.  They've had some crash bugs they can only isolate by turning up the debug logging to 11 and seeing when the log stops.  Side effect is "frame dragging", the server is running slower so everything feels off and sometimes the action stutters/desyncs.

--Dave

[Malakili]

Just for fun since we've been mentioning Tribes 2 in this thread: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AB-mEvbj404

[Malakili]

I've been testing out the viability of chasing using a Pathfinder with the following loadout: Bolt Launcher, Light Assault Rifle, Thrust Pack, Impact Nitron, and the Rage and Potential Energy Perks.   You can accelerate VERY quickly from a stand still.  Rage gives you increased energy regen for 10 seconds after an enemy grabs your flag near you, and Potential Energy gives you Energy back as a percentage of AoE damage taken (including from your own impact nitron jumps).   Rage + Thrust pack + impact nitron jump Leaves you at ~200 sanics + a full energy bar in about 1-2 seconds.  Its still hard to catch really good cappers, but I've actually been fairly successful with this setup.  The only exception is on Crossfire, where there is really no room to chase because the map is so small that you can't possibly catch a back to front route if they get away cleanly.

[MahrinSkel]

The fun part about Crossfire is that if you have Reach maxed out, you can actually cap over the top of the ship (skid down the angled side over the top of the flag, run like hell).  Do it right and you can miss a forcefield that is actually overlapping the flag.

Straight back-to-front routes are sniper bait on that map, chances you'll make it to the other side are not great.  Not to mention that you have to go through the ship, and it's hard to clear mines and forcefields in there (I normally play Raider, and unless I've run out of things to do, I won't go into the flag bay).

--Dave

[Malakili]

The fun part about Crossfire is that if you have Reach maxed out, you can actually cap over the top of the ship (skid down the angled side over the top of the flag, run like hell).  Do it right and you can miss a forcefield that is actually overlapping the flag.

Straight back-to-front routes are sniper bait on that map, chances you'll make it to the other side are not great.  Not to mention that you have to go through the ship, and it's hard to clear mines and forcefields in there (I normally play Raider, and unless I've run out of things to do, I won't go into the flag bay).

--Dave

Yeah, Crossfire can definitely be defended if you have a competent doombringer and a competent sentinel - which seems to be asking a lot of most players in my experience.  I like to play offense, but find myself frequently having to play defense or else my team has literally none.  I remember always having lots of defenders in Tribes 2, but I really rarely see a good defense by comparison, and VERY VERY rarely see 2 teams which actually both have reasonable defense.  Maybe I'm just unlucky in this regard.   

Have you tried chasing in general? What is your favorite loadout for it if you have?  Disc jumps are pitiful compared to their previous counter parts, so it seems much more difficult.

[MahrinSkel]

Chaser: Pathfinder, whether to use Thrust or Energy pack depends on the map and the balance (if it's lots of standoffs with the carriers playing Rabbit then Energy, if it's quick dashes to turtle up or cap then Thrust).  Disc jumps don't work as well as Impact Nitrons (both give about the same impulse, but disc/bolt will do twice the self damage).  The flip side is that nitrons are very useful for knocking the flag away from a carrier who is just too damned fast and agile (EDIT: alternatively too well armored, heavy capping is possible on some maps) to reliably disc/bolt to death, so if you use them all up catching him you've got none to use against him.

What's under-appreciated is firing your shotgun or LAR at him whenever you get the chance, every little bit of damage helps since carriers don't regenerate.

I've seen some good chasers who used Infiltrator or even Sentinel (with the energy regen pack but the BXT rifle).  And a grav bike with a sentinel, doombringer, or juggernaut on the back is a serious pain in the ass to run from (you almost have to turtle against that).  Non-light armors are otherwise pretty useless for chasing (just can't keep up).

--Dave

[Thrawn]

New CTF map added, it looks really, really terrible.  Haven't been home to try it yet though.

[Malakili]

New CTF map added, it looks really, really terrible.  Haven't been home to try it yet though.

This is basically their try at redoing Bella Omega from scratch rather than trying to modify the other one any further into obliviion.  I'll reserve judgement until tonight when I can give it a go.

[climbjtree]

Apparently nitron jumping with the flag will make you drop the flag. This is lame.

[MahrinSkel]

Apparently nitron jumping with the flag will make you drop the flag. This is lame.

Ehh....  The fact that nitrons made you drop the flag *except* when you were doing it to yourself was always a bit of a wierd thing, to tell the truth.  It also made it nearly impossible to chase a good Pathfinder, you had until he set off that first nitron jump (which for a good one was before he left the stand) and then you could forget it, he was gone and only the snipers could do anything about it.

It's still going to be possible to nitron yourself right before you grab, if you're good enough to time it and not screw up your line.  But it will restrict a lot of the high-speed routes that had slow exits (because you won't be able to just nitron yourself back up to 250+, you'll have to disc-jump which does more self-damage).  The only drawback to high-speed routes is their predictability, and as more variants have been found that's been fading.  This will bring it back a bit.

--Dave