Cars for Noobs

[Raging Turtle]

I am not a car person. 

I've never flipped through magazines imagining what'd I buy if I had the money.  In fact, I'm pretty sure I've never bought a car magazine in my life.  I can change a tire and check the oil, but everything else I leave to People who Know Things.

Soooo when the family offered to buy me a (used) car because I'm actually going to be living the the States for a while, I had no idea where to start looking.  Still don't!  My dad is very much a car guy and has good infomation to offer, but I thought I'd ask you guys here to get a broader range of opinions.

Budget is roughly 15k.  The car needs to be able to survive Wisconsin winters, so maybe 4 wheel drive?  Although I've done a few winters in Wisconsin without 4 wheel drive, so maybe it's not required.  This is the type of thing I don't know!  Again, I'm not looking for a new car, but a decent used car that will last a while.

Maybe a medium sized SUV?  Something else?  What would you do in my situation?

[Evildrider]

Umm, if you have 15k, I'd suggest really buying a new car.  Most used cars can end up costing you a pretty penny in hidden repairs and such.


However if you are set on a used car, definitely go to a reliable dealer.  Like Carmax or something.  4wd is nice, but not totally necessary, just make sure you don't buy a rear wheel drive.  Front wheel drive will get you by in most situations. 

I'm not a huge car guy so I don't know lots of makes and models in my head, but one thing you can do is just look at what most of the people drive in your area.  It'll generally give you a good idea of what kind of car to look for.

[Viin]

There are lots of new cars for 15kish, but it'd be hard to get a new allwheel/4x4 for that much. If you expect to be driving when it's snowy (ie: you can't wait for the storm to pass and the roads to get thoroughly plowed) I would recommend a 4x4 - however, Wisconsin is fairly flat, so it's probably not a huge deal to go with a front-wheel drive car.

Personally, I'd look for a 4-5yo all-wheel-drive sedan/wagon/mini-SUV.

I'm partial to Subaru's, so something like this is nice: http://denver.craigslist.org/cto/1525474330.html

Buying used will take more research (carfax) and test drives, but you'll get more for your money, IMO.

[schild]

15k?

Find a 2006/7 Honda Civic SI.

If you buy an SUV you're part of the fucking problem.

Edit: If 4WD is NECESSARY (lol Wisconsin), get a 2006 Subaru WRX.

Edit 2: If you aren't a pussy (FWD on Snow), get a 2006 Acura RSX Type-S. Was the last year they made them.

[bhodi]

That has got to be the worst advice I have seen on this forum, ever (buy a new car). You don't buy a new car, ever, if you care at all about getting a deal, because the thing loses 1/4th it's value just driving it off the lot. Furthermore, IN THE OP he said he wasn't looking for a new car.

You buy a car with lower miles, (<30k) that's a year or two old; just a reliable sedan that maybe came off a lease. If you get a fairly boring commuter car, you don't generally have to worry about them abusing it.

Ignore schild, he's telling you what HE drives (a sports car) which is entirely outside your requirements or desires.

[Big Gulp]

Although I've done a few winters in Wisconsin without 4 wheel drive, so maybe it's not required. 

Dude, get a Kia Rio.  Starts at $11K and it'd be NEW.  As a Michigander I'm throwing down the gauntlet to your lame Wisconsin ass; 4WD is for pussies.

[schild]

I don't throw this term around lightly, mostly because many of my friends would get angry about it.

But a Kia Rio is for faggots.

[Viin]

Dude, get a Kia Rio.  Starts at $11K and it'd be NEW.  As a Michigander I'm throwing down the gauntlet to your lame Wisconsin ass; 4WD is for pussies.

God they make ugly cars.

[schild]

You don't have to listen for me, but I spent 6 months shopping for a used car and have driven both Toyotas and Hondas in terrible snow and can tell you flat out they're just fine. And if you're spending $15k of someone else's money, you might as well get a car that will retain it's value and not be a piece of shit ever.

[Evildrider]

That has got to be the worst advice I have seen on this forum, ever. You don't buy a new car, ever, if you care at all about getting a deal, because the thing loses 1/4th it's value just driving it off the lot.

You buy a car with lower miles, (<30k) that's a year or two old; just a reliable sedan that maybe came off a lease. If you get a fairly boring commuter car, you don't generally have to worry about them abusing it.

Ignore schild, he's telling you what HE drives (a sports car) which is entirely outside your requirements or desires.

Eh, I've twice bought cars that you are talking about and had to put more money into them after I got them.  It's really a matter of choice.  I'm not mechanically inclined at all, so if something goes wrong I like having a decent warranty to go off of.

[Big Gulp]

I don't throw this term around lightly, mostly because many of my friends would get angry about it.

But a Kia Rio is for faggots.

Dude, I don't give a shit about cars.  It's strictly point a to point b for me.  That said, Kia has become a really reliable company, and they're cheap.

[schild]

Yea, well, America doesn't need more people that don't give a fuck about cars. Put a man in a nice car and he'll get nice cars forever. Put him in a fucking ugly beater and he'll be the asshole you want to kill on the road forever.

[MahrinSkel]

I grew up and learned to drive in Rockies and the NW (Colorado, Montana, Washington), so I know a little about driving in snow and ice.  I'm going to echo the advice for a small import sedan with front wheel drive, the newest your budget can manage.  Not a Kia, but any other manufacturer is fine (not because they're ugly, but because I've never driven one and don't know how they handle or hold up).  Anti-lock brakes are a *must*, traction control is nice but not essential.  If it has slightly higher ground clearance, that's a good thing.

Forget 4WD.  If you aren't used to it, it can give you misplaced feelings of control and invulnerability, then you find out 4WD means you just spin all four tires at once and make a good impression of Bambi and Thumper on the frozen lake.  Get new tires (just a decent all-weather radial) on the front each winter, move the old front pair to the back.

Best snow car I ever had was a 78 Dodge Colt (actually a rebadged Mitsubishi Lancer).  Front wheel drive, high ground clearance and short wheelbase, had a 2-range transmission for when I wanted to creep along, and handled great in a skid.  Too bad they didn't have anti-lock brakes that far back.  Seriously, get the anti-lock brakes, using standard brakes in snow and ice is a skill that usually requires a couple of dents to acquire.

--Dave

[Bzalthek]

Yea, well, America doesn't need more people that don't give a fuck about cars. Put a man in a nice car and he'll get nice cars forever. Put him in a fucking ugly beater and he'll be the asshole you want to kill on the road forever.

You have spinners, don't you?  Admit it!

[Salamok]

That has got to be the worst advice I have seen on this forum, ever (buy a new car). You don't buy a new car, ever, if you care at all about getting a deal, because the thing loses 1/4th it's value just driving it off the lot. Furthermore, IN THE OP he said he wasn't looking for a new car.

This is false, If you purchase a new car at the right time (heavy manufacturer+dealer rebates) you can avoid the hit.  Also with a new car you know exactly what it has been through.  When I purchased my Tundra the used 2 year old ones with under 40k mileage were going for just over 21k (sticker not including tax/license/ext warranty), my new Tundra was 23.5k out the door (after 5k in rebates, tax/license included).  Even assuming you could talk them down 15% off the sticker on a used model I would only have been saving under 3-4k and 3-4k < 40,000 miles (or 2-3 years extra of driving).

The best way to minimize your losses on any car is to drive it until it dies (unless maybe you are one of those people that drives insane distances per year).  

That all said if you have 15k to spend I would recommend a FWD (no need for a 4WD) and shoot for something that is at most 2 years old, I would definitely check out Carmax and stay clear of anything domestic (Honda>Toyota>Nissan being my personal preference).  I seriously doubt you will find a Acura, Lexus or Infiniti that is under 2 years old for 15k or less.  A Nissan Altima might be a good choice, it has plenty of power, is front wheel drive and you can probably pick one up that is under 2 years old.

[Raging Turtle]

Hoooly crap this thread filled up fast.

A couple more things:

- My dad (who will be the person actually buying the car) has done this before, many times.  I've got a lot of siblings, and they've pretty much all gotten a used car at high school or college graduation; the only reason I haven't is because I've been living abroad off and on for a while.  He's a smart guy, knows cars, and really enjoys getting the best deal possible. 

- Probably don't want a sports car.  Not really my thing.  You can try to change my mind though.  On the other side, a normal sedan sounds kind of boring, but probably can't be too choosy at this point in life!

Anyway.  Good stuff so far.  Looking forward to more.

[squirrel]

Edit: If 4WD is NECESSARY (lol Wisconsin), get a 2006 Subaru WRX.

Hard to go wrong with this regardless of climate.

[schild]

Edit: If 4WD is NECESSARY (lol Wisconsin), get a 2006 Subaru WRX.

Hard to go wrong with this regardless of climate.

Agreed, but old people keep them a long time and young people drive them too hard. So finding one in good shape may be hard.

[Sky]

Yeehaw!

Reliable, good value for it's class, can go anywhere. I think they just bumped it from compact to mid-size, where it kicks even more butt for the dollar.

Or if you like pickups, the Tundra mentioned is nice, so is the Tacoma for a smaller pickup. I miss my pickup, but the SUV package just works better for me for the most part. If I were going Subaru, I'd go for the Forester, though it's a bit station wagony imo. Heck of a car, my father loved his and he was a beemer/porsche guy in an earlier life (and a nascar racer before that lulz).

[Yegolev]

I really, really like Nissan.  My 2005 Altima is great.  The 2000 Maxima was great.  Hell, I liked the 1996 Maxima my wife had.  I drive hard and fast, and those cars support my habit.  I do hear good things about Honda, however, and I'd probably get one if I didn't have a Nissan handy.  Reliable, too... my Altima was totaled and salvaged and, other than a leaky sunroof, weird rattle and having to pry open the gas cover with my key, it's really keen.

[Abagadro]

I'm on my second Altima, currently at 102,000 miles with almost no problems (has to replace the exhaust gasket which was a problem on my model year).

[Bzalthek]

I know I'll sound like an ass, but here goes nothing.

Why are you asking random people on the internet?
1) Your father is paying for the car
2) Your father knows a lot about cars
3) Your father is experienced in specifically buying used cars (for your siblings)
4) Assuming you are returning home to roost for a while, I assume he knows what you will need for the glacial movements of Wisconsin.
5) Your father probably has a vested interest in keeping you out of a burning inferno or stranded in a blizzard.
6) Typical Internet responses are those of fans.  There are cars that people trend toward, and their preference is usually based on a limited scope of actual experience, and a technical information base that has been cherry-picked to enforce those preferences.
7) Typical Internet peoples have a vested interest in seeing you end up on the Darwin Awards, just cuz.

Let your father handle the details.  At best, let him find what's available from trusted sources and give you options to choose from.  That way you can pick what looks "cool" to you, and it probably won't leave you in a ditch somewhere if you know how to drive.

[Sky]

Typical Internet responses are those of fans.  There are cars that people trend toward, and their preference is usually based on a limited scope of actual experience, and a technical information base that has been cherry-picked to enforce those preferences.

HOW DARE YOU IMPUGN OUR SUGGESTIONS, SIR!?

[lamaros]

I know I'll sound like an ass, but here goes nothing.

Why are you asking random people on the internet?
1) Your father is paying for the car
2) Your father knows a lot about cars
3) Your father is experienced in specifically buying used cars (for your siblings)
4) Assuming you are returning home to roost for a while, I assume he knows what you will need for the glacial movements of Wisconsin.
5) Your father probably has a vested interest in keeping you out of a burning inferno or stranded in a blizzard.
6) Typical Internet responses are those of fans.  There are cars that people trend toward, and their preference is usually based on a limited scope of actual experience, and a technical information base that has been cherry-picked to enforce those preferences.
7) Typical Internet peoples have a vested interest in seeing you end up on the Darwin Awards, just cuz.

Let your father handle the details.  At best, let him find what's available from trusted sources and give you options to choose from.  That way you can pick what looks "cool" to you, and it probably won't leave you in a ditch somewhere if you know how to drive.

Saved me having to type it. Thanks.

[Numtini]

The correct answer on buying a car is always the same: your best value is a used 1-3 year old (depending on budget) Toyota Corolla.

If you want 4wd I think the Matrix (which is a corolla with a different shell) comes with it.

If you stick with Toyota, Honda, or for 4wheel Suburu, it's hard to go wrong.

Subaru's are the car that people who drive in snow all the time drive. They're not just 4wheel, they're also heavy set and balanced well. I used to laugh while driving past 4x4 jeeps stuck in snow banks in my 2 wheel drive subie. if you hit a state like Vermont, they're one of the biggest brands and during a snowstorm, make up 2/3rds of what's still on the road.

Unless you're living 20 miles outside of town, you probably don't need 4 wheel drive and it's a pricey add on.

Buy used. You can frequently get new car bargains that are cheaper than used, but usually not with a quality brand.

[Lantyssa]

Yeehaw!

Reliable, good value for it's class, can go anywhere. I think they just bumped it from compact to mid-size, where it kicks even more butt for the dollar.

Yeah, but it looks like a Tonka Truck.

[Raging Turtle]

Guys, don't worry.  I found an 2005 Acura on Craigslist that looks awesome, the seller seems legit, but he said some other guys were interested too so I've already sent him the money on paypal.

...

...

...

 

I'm asking for advice here because I legitimately don't know anything about the car market, but that doesn't mean I'm stupid.  I've looked around a lot of websites but they're mostly speaking a language I don't know, and I figured you guys would make suggestions that I could actually understand and give me a starting point for my own research.  Which is actuall exactly what's happened, so thanks!  And keep the suggestions coming.

Honestly, I might make an investment thread next just to troll some of you.  

[NiX]

I'd say 4WD over AWD. Typically you can turn off 4WD and you don't want to be stuck with AWD during the summer. Especially with gas getting crazy expensive.

[MisterNoisy]

I'll second Numtini's recommendation.  Also, buying a set of snow tires on a cheap set of steel wheels (assuming you have a place to store the other wheels) will go a long way towards making snow and ice less dangerous.

[Selby]

As an actual car person who maintains and repairs their own car until it's completely gone and unable to be saved, I can ditto alot of the advice here.  4WD is fine if you are driving from 15-20+ miles outside of town on somewhat poorly maintained roads, but in town just save the money and get a FWD car.  A used Corolla or Accord is an easy gimme car to get, since they have high reliability records over many years (even if they aren't particularly exciting to drive).  When buying one used though people can ask premiums on the price AND will get it due to their reputation, so keep that in mind.  Keep whatever you do get maintained and make sure to not perform said maintenance when the car has finally broken down ;-)  If you ever intend to take anyone besides you anywhere, a 4 door is another good idea (unless you hate giving people rides).

Subarus are great for snow and reliability, but I have no idea how badly it snows where you live and what you would have to be driving in on those days.  Toyota\Nissan\Honda are all pretty much interchangeable cars and you really can't go wrong.  Kias are not my favorite because I hate the way they ride and how cheaply made they are (granted, the last new Kia I rode in was a 2007).  I tried to do 70MPH to keep up with freeway traffic and the vibrations and road noise really turned me off.  Remember, if a new car price is ultra low, there's a reason for it (cheaply made or they can't give them away). 

As far as cars to avoid, I would specifically recommend against any GM product outside of Cadillac (outside your budget definitely) and some lower end Dodge and Fords as well.  Not because they are particularly the crap-boxes of yore everyone remembers, but because GM has a reputation of late as putting out products that are cheaply made but appear quality just long enough to get you shortly beyond the warrranty period when problems start to occur.  And they aren't the most serviceable vehicles anymore, which means any repairs (like a horribly designed plastic intake that WILL fail in 60-75k miles, ECM failure, transmission or suspension parts not designed to be serviced, etc) will cost you big bucks outside of the warranty period. 

[Quinton]

If you stick with Toyota, Honda, or for 4wheel Suburu, it's hard to go wrong.

This.  A Toyota Corolla or Honda Accord or Civic will run forever if you take care of it.  Suburu makes some nice little wagons if you want something that's a bit roomier for hauling people/stuff around but don't want to buy some absurd SUV.

Hell, the low end Civics are 15-16K new, it looks like, so I'd imagine if you're looking at 1-3 years old you can probably get something that's pretty nice for 15K.

[schild]

Annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd, we're back around to my recommendation.

2006/2007 Civic SI.

Just saying.

Edit: I just assume you can drive stick since you're European btw.

[Hoax]

I'll tell you in the Bay Area I couldn't find a used Civic basic version for less then I paid for my Accord EX with leather seats.  Civic owners are stupid and insane when it comes to pricing their cars.  But I was at the bottom of the budget (under 6k) things are undoubtedly different towards the top (15k).

thread delivers though.

[Sir T]

Serious question. What Car would you guys recommend for an overweight really tall guy. I'm 6 and a half feel tall. Have really long body lenght but the legs are on the long side too. One of the reasons I've held off on getting a car is simply the sheer agony of sitting in the bloody things. But frankly the bus isn;t much better these days.

[schild]

Serious question. What Car would you guys recommend for an overweight really tall guy. I'm 6 and a half feel tall. Have really long body lenght but the legs are on the long side too. One of the reasons I've held off on getting a car is simply the sheer agony of sitting in the bloody things. But frankly the bus isn;t much better these days.

How overweight? No, this isn't a dick question.