StarCraft II Beta

[K9]

I'm awful at Terran 

[Ironwood]

Done playing Random;  done playing Zerg.

If you're up against Protoss, you're fucked by either voidys or stalkers or an early zealot harrass. 

If you're up against Terran, you're pretty much just marking time until the siege cannons or vikings arrive.

This is, of course, assuming a good player.  I've won as Zerg against retards, but really, where's the fun in that ?

[Wolf]

the two asian zergs I've seen play recently (on the eu vs asia thing - sen on sunday vs protoss and check on saturday vs terran) have been DOMINANT. They not only won, check destroyed strelok (strelok did played kinda bad); and the games that Sen won (didn't die to early agression) he won dominantly.


In any case, I'm done with Random too, i'm just picking zerg nowadays :)

[Ironwood]

Give me replays or give me death.

[Ironwood]

I also think I've finally figured out how that Vortex utterly fucked K9 and I.

[Wolf]

Replays are not made public afaik, here's videos:

Check vs Strelok:

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/6940845
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/6941348
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/6941600
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/6941968


WhiteRa vs Sen:

for some reason it's not up yet, but should show up on Day9's account soon - http://www.ustream.tv/channel/day9tv


also, Protoss is broken: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8B16eAS1dwA

[Thrawn]

I could be way off since I don't play a ton, but it seems to me like a tweak Zerg could use is a small buff to zerglings.

[K9]

The point of Zerg is that they're supposed to have swarms of cheap units that overwhelm their opponents, that are quickly replaced and keep up continuous pressure; or so I think. The basic problem is that you need to expand a lot and micomanage your bases like crazy to keep your forces up. Protoss on the other hand have the easiest time in the world with warp gates. Terrans can mass production easier than Zerg too I feel.

[Ironwood]

Yeah.  Unless you have multiple mains and can be arsed with Queen Micro, you're stuck actually being SLOWER in production than the other races.

For Protoss, I know I can pump out shitloads of units and, frankly, never really need to bother with anything other than Gateways.  Zerg have a different unit for each building, which is more time and another bloody drone.  Why, for example, is the Baneling nest a seperate building ?  That one makes no sense to me.

[LK]

Why, for example, is the Baneling nest a seperate building ? 

Tradition.

[Thrawn]

Interesting thought, just make banelings an upgrade option at the pool.

[K9]

Why, for example, is the Baneling nest a seperate building ? 

Tradition.

Yet we don't have a brood lord roost or overseer hostel. Banelings should be a tech researched at the spawning pool.

Warp Gates are the easiest production mechanism ever though <3

[Malakili]

Why, for example, is the Baneling nest a seperate building ?  That one makes no sense to me.

Important tech building.  Lets your opponent know you have baneling capability if they scout it, where an upgrade at the pool would not.

[Fordel]

Why, for example, is the Baneling nest a seperate building ?  That one makes no sense to me.

Important tech building.  Lets your opponent know you have baneling capability if they scout it, where an upgrade at the pool would not.

Yea, same reason why there is a Dark Templar shrine building, even though it has zero upgrades or use otherwise.

[K9]

Doing 14 pool to 15 Hatch and then making about 30 zerglings seems to be a reasonably effective way to win down here in the copper leagues. Particularly against zerg and protoss. Have two hatcheries in the mane base with a single queen infusing each in turn and you can rebuild your army really fast. Wipe out the enemy probe or drone line and you win. Doesn't work so well against turtling terran, but you can use your army to keep map control and squash expansions while you tech to roaches and hydras.

I doubt it has any longevity, but it's a fun rush build.

[Thrawn]

Why, for example, is the Baneling nest a seperate building ?  That one makes no sense to me.

Important tech building.  Lets your opponent know you have baneling capability if they scout it, where an upgrade at the pool would not.

Yea, same reason why there is a Dark Templar shrine building, even though it has zero upgrades or use otherwise.

It's Zerg, just have the spawning pool evolve into the baneling nest like spire>greater spire! 

[Thrawn]

So I had a game I was pretty proud of where protoss rushed void rays and I shut him down as terran (I'm only Silver).  On the advice of someone I then went to watch my own replay and see what I could of done better, how I could of won earlier, lost earlier, etc. etc.  It is AMAZING how many of your own mistakes you find watching yourself play.  Seriously, you should try it sometime.  I had such bad micro in so many places and half of them I didn't even realize in game.  I was considering posting the replay until I noticed a few huge mistakes I was making. 

[Rasix]

I am now King of the Gimps aka #1 div rank in copper.  6 wins in a row.

Mainly I'm just going 2-3 barracks of marines and marauders early to keep some early pressure on or deal with their initial push then hit back.  Then depending on what they do, I either go full marine/marauder blob or tech to Thors.  If they go air, I just start throwing down barracks with reactors and pump marines.  Against zerg sometimes I'll go barracks on 10 just because I know I'm going to see lings pretty early and 3-4 marines will shut down that shit fast.  I don't usually end up building any air until it's mop up/chase-down-the-secret-base time. 

Played a very odd game against what appeared to be a competent protoss player.. until he started mass producing phoenixes to deal with my.. non existant air. I guess they have some attack where they can hit me on ground, but it's just highly ineffective when I can just make it rain marines.

My macro in the middle is still aweful, I end up having huge gobs of resources during my attacks.  Watching my replays would make me gag.  I'm not sure I'll get much better as Terrans as I'll never be able to micro worth anything.  Are zerg and protoss decent without a lot of micro involved?

[Ironwood]

I've seen some really good play where you micro the Phoenix 'up in the air bubble' and then shoot the shit out of what you're raising.

Alas, it won't work on 15 Barracks full of marines.

 

[K9]

Are zerg and protoss decent without a lot of micro involved?

Protoss are by far the easiest race to dump resources with. Warp gates make building a ton of units while in battle pretty damn easy.

[Elerion]

What? Building with warpgates is more micro intensive than building with any other building in the game. It's powerful due to the ability to warp in units "anywhere", but it requires vision of a pylon and twice as many inputs as building with any other race, so it's noticably harder to build units while fighting.

Building while fighting as the three races goes:
Terran:
5aaaTABaaaTABddd - Keep microing fight

Zerg:
5srrrrrrhhh - Keep microing fight

Protoss:
Zoom to pylon - wzCLICKzCLICKzCLICKzCLICKzCLICKzCLICKsCLICKsCLICKsCLICK - Zoom to fight - Keep microing fight

[K9]

You are omitting the need to go back to your queen every 20s or so at every hatchery to keep your larva vomit up. Also the fact that you can proxy a pylon with remarkable ease and bring stuff in much closer to the action. Different strokes for different folks I guess.

[Malakili]

You are omitting the need to go back to your queen every 20s or so at every hatchery to keep your larva vomit up. Also the fact that you can proxy a pylon with remarkable ease and bring stuff in much closer to the action. Different strokes for different folks I guess.

You can keep your queen in the same control group as a hatch then you can use her spawn larvae without ever having to go back to your base.  so, 1 control group per hatch/queen combo is the easiest.  plus another control group with just all your hatcheries for production purposes.  You'll never even need to return to your base for macro this way.

[Elerion]

Keep all your queens hotkeyed on one key, then you just go:
4v - click minimap over hatch 1 - v - click minimap over hatch 2 - etc

I'm not saying Protoss in general is harder to play, I'm just saying that the warpgate mechanic specifically is much more micro intensive than unit production with other races, due to needing pylon vision, more inputs and the fact that you can't queue stuff at all.

Of course, that is counteracted by how powerful warpgates are.

[bhodi]

You can keep your queen in the same control group as a hatch then you can use her spawn larvae without ever having to go back to your base.  so, 1 control group per hatch/queen combo is the easiest.  plus another control group with just all your hatcheries for production purposes.  You'll never even need to return to your base for macro this way.

If you're talking about using the minimap to spawn larvae, that will be fixed in a patch. Blizzard has stated that they want you to have to go back to your base to use the ability, much like cronoboost/mule.

The damn ability needs to be fixed, however - being penalized for not having a stopwatch in your head makes it simply unfun to play zerg.

[Malakili]

You can keep your queen in the same control group as a hatch then you can use her spawn larvae without ever having to go back to your base.  so, 1 control group per hatch/queen combo is the easiest.  plus another control group with just all your hatcheries for production purposes.  You'll never even need to return to your base for macro this way.

If you're talking about using the minimap to spawn larvae, that will be fixed in a patch. Blizzard has stated that they want you to have to go back to your base to use the ability, much like cronoboost/mule.

The damn ability needs to be fixed, however - being penalized for not having a stopwatch in your head makes it simply unfun to play zerg.

Frankly the entire spawn larvae, chrono boost, mule thing isn't all that great an addition to begin with if you ask me.  Sad to hear they are "fixing" this.  Purely academic at this point though, I really haven't played SC2 in quite a while now, I usually play 1 or 2 games when a new patch comes just to see, but frankly, I just don't find it nearly as fun to play as DoW2.

[Wolf]

I like the macro mechanics. They keep me busy and clicking, even when there's not much going on. Spawn larva is becoming an automatic, and I'm getting pretty ocd about checking my nexuses/orbital's energy. It's fun for me, there's a trick with backspace apparently (to jump you back to your bases), but I've not tried it yet (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4MDb_hzuyo - this, but slower).

[KallDrexx]

Cool stuff done with the map editor

[K9]

That stuff is just awesome

[Teleku]

Wow, that guy did a really good job recreating the Diablo UI in that mod.

[Vaiti]

Umm. Wow. Ok, I don't think I've ever seen a game that lets you mod it THAT extensively. Or apparently "easily". RTS, FPS, Tetris, A Bullet Hell shooter? Huh. I expect we'll be seeing DOTA for this of course, but I also expect we'll see an entire commercial game get spawned out of this map editor ala Counter Strike or the like.

[Fordel]

Umm. Wow. Ok, I don't think I've ever seen a game that lets you mod it THAT extensively. Or apparently "easily". RTS, FPS, Tetris, A Bullet Hell shooter? Huh. I expect we'll be seeing DOTA for this of course, but I also expect we'll see an entire commercial game get spawned out of this map editor ala Counter Strike or the like.

Blizzard is banking on it, the SC2 BNet interface will be able to sell and distribute the best and most popular custom maps/games created with the editor and stuff.


All future PC games will be Sc2 mods 

[Teleku]

Blizzard was the only company to survive the video game wars.  Now all games are made by Blizzard.

[Murgos]

Blizzard was the only company to survive the video game wars.  Now all games are made by Blizzard.

Now I want Taco Bell.

[Ironwood]

Due to the day I'm having, I'd quite like to go home and own noobs.

Anyone feel free to hit me up for some games.