StarCraft II Beta

[trias_e]

Been playing some 2v2 with bhodi.  We have a pretty nasty reaper+speedling early game harass that seems very tough to stop.  Unfortunately, if that fails, I suck at the middle game quite badly ><

[bhodi]

Fortunately, it's rarely stopped! :)

But no, it's seriously ugly - I can micro the reapers against zerglings/zealots without losses and anything that's a danger to me (stalkers, marines, queen) die under the zergling onslaught. The zerglings are a terrific screen.

10 rax
10 ref
move 2 scvs when ref finishes
11 depot with the rax scv
11 tech lab
11 orbital
11 reaper

It's a killer opening. Build another rax while the reaper builds, send the reaper away and rally both barracks. Send a scv to build a depot, then a refinery, build the 2nd tech lab when possible and you can pump reapers and scvs for a while without needing to do anything heavy in your base. Econ isn't completely gimped since you get the orbital early, use the mule.

[Wolf]

I can give you an awesome 2v2 zergling build that beatufully transitions into mid-game :)

14 Pool
14 Extractor
15 Overlord
when pool pops, start pumping zerglings and a queen right away.
at 100 gas, start speed and pull drones off gas
right as queen is popping, you should have 300minerals for a second hatch - put it down at your natural
just continue pumping zerglings and don't miss vomits - you have enough income to continuously pump zerglings from the vomited main hatch and the secondary at the expansion with some left over (if you're fighting a lot and don't have to pump overlords, you should have enough for a second queen at the hatch).

Early game this build DESTROYS a zerg going Roach, especialy with some terran help.

As soon as you're done pushing (make sure you don't lose your zerglings, they're amazing for map control) you instantly pop something like 10 drones, go back to mining gas and you're incredibly strong for the mid-game with an expansion running right away. You have to be careful about one base air harass, but if you've pushed hard enough the other team is probably about as developed as you are just from one base.

From there you have two options for midgame - mass mutas, or roach/hydra with upgrades. I prefer the second, especially with a terran that can take care of pesky colossus :)

ps: don't miss vomits! the hotkey is V now  
pss: don't go zerglings against terran/toss or terran/terran; toss/toss is fine, zerg/anything is perfect :)

[Rendakor]

Um, this might be a noob question but, what do the numbers mean before the buildings?

[Ceryse]

Um, this might be a noob question but, what do the numbers mean before the buildings?

Harvester count, if I'm not mistaken.

[eldaec]

14 Pool
14 Extractor
15 Overlord
when pool pops, start pumping zerglings and a queen right away.
at 100 gas, start speed and pull drones off gas
right as queen is popping, you should have 300minerals for a second hatch - put it down at your natural
just continue pumping zerglings and don't miss vomits - you have enough income to continuously pump zerglings from the vomited main hatch and the secondary at the expansion with some left over (if you're fighting a lot and don't have to pump overlords, you should have enough for a second queen at the hatch).

I don't understand a word of this but can at least appreciate the remarkable diversity of our people when I see that it makes sense to someone.

[Rendakor]

Ahh ok; so "14 Pool" means make a Spawning Pool with your 14th drone, and so on?

[Astorax]

Ahh ok; so "14 Pool" means make a Spawning Pool with your 14th drone, and so on?

Yup.

[Fordel]

You know that someone, somewhere, reads 14 pool and spawns fourteen spawning pools. 

[Astorax]

You know that someone, somewhere, reads 14 pool and spawns fourteen spawning pools. 

*goes to find the youtube video*

[bhodi]

You know that someone, somewhere, reads 14 pool and spawns fourteen spawning pools. 

*goes to find the youtube video*

How about http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-XXF2ypoVA :P

[Thrawn]

At last - Thrawn.thrawn

[trias_e]

solid 14 pool build

Yeah, that would undoubtedly transition better to mid game than what I've been doing.  I've been going 10 overpool, as I can get 6 zerglings out right around the same time he gets his first reaper, but admittedly this does hurt the economy somewhat.  But its so absurdly strong in that first few minutes that it might be worth it, at least considering our win rate at that point.

And against terran...well, just make banelings and speedlings!  Zerglings forever!

[Hoax]

I thought that the numbers would be supply count, which is effectively the same thing early game I suppose...

[Margalis]

Ahh ok; so "14 Pool" means make a Spawning Pool with your 14th drone, and so on?

It does mean supply count, which is subtly different. (By the way am I the only one who HATES it when people call supply 'food'?) For example you might see something like this:

10 Overlord
13 Spawning Pool
12 Extractor

In this case the extractor is morphed by the 14th drone produced, but the supply is only 12 as the 13th guy became a pool and was not replaced before the extractor went up.

2v2 I use a very similar build, although I usually 13 pool and get a second hatch a tad later.

[lamaros]

Anywhere else to dl the beta from apart from blizzard downloader? It's massively slow...

[Margalis]

There's actually no other place on the internet that has it. Looks like you're out of luck.

[bhodi]

You can download torrents of it if you like.

I have a key to give away, first person to post here gets it (that is a member with posts)

[Wolf]

did you guys see this? Made with the map editor.

re-zerglings: Trias, if you start with 10 pool and 6 zerglings you're missing a queen, aren't you? While Bhodi is still getting his orbital command and catching up rather quick. If you don't kill or do terrible, terrible damage you're basically done right there.

btw - beta with pre-order is all but confirmed for Europe at this point. Starting at some point next week. There are whispers about a July release (previously slated for Q2)

[Mosesandstick]

Key please! 

[Ceryse]

Key please! 

Damn, heh.

Didn't know the count referred to supply, but it makes more sense. Never was much of one for the in-depth SC play/jargon, but with the brackets and such and how the map editor looks, this is pretty much a guaranteed buy for me when it comes out.

[Margalis]

Starcraft is actually pretty light on jargon and a lot of it is just obvious shorthand like hatch = hatchery and rax = barracks. Especially compared to fighting games which are ridiculous in that respect.

[lamaros]

Just realised that if I turn off peer-to-peer the download goes lightyears faster. Thought I'd share that for anyone else dumb like me.

Can't wait to play some games! 30min!

Oh and I'm lamaros.lamaros, do say hello!

[Rasix]

Bah, I never get into betas.  This is starting to look really interesting from the conversations here and oddly from the YouTube videos of tournament games.  Just strange considering Starcraft is what got me to stop playing competitive RTS (ladder matches were ass) and almost RTS altogether.

[trias_e]

did you guys see this? Made with the map editor.

re-zerglings: Trias, if you start with 10 pool and 6 zerglings you're missing a queen, aren't you? While Bhodi is still getting his orbital command and catching up rather quick. If you don't kill or do terrible, terrible damage you're basically done right there.

btw - beta with pre-order is all but confirmed for Europe at this point. Starting at some point next week. There are whispers about a July release (previously slated for Q2)

I get 6 zerglings out right when the spawning pool is built, then a queen about 15 seconds later.  Considering I still end up getting my queen before a 13 or 14 pool does (at least I believe), I don't think that's a big deal.  Let me link a replay.  It's certainly not an 'all-in' strategy.

What is a problem with that build is that I have no idea when I should expand, or pump drones really.  I need a plan!

[trias_e]

Grr, cant attach .replay files in f13.  Bhodi, is it cool if I upload one of our games to sc2rc.com?

[Wolf]

you can put it on rapidshare or whatever :)

DO EET I have 1 hour to kill at work, this will be a distraction :P

[bhodi]

Grr, cant attach .replay files in f13.  Bhodi, is it cool if I upload one of our games to sc2rc.com?

sc2rc.com is meant to be used by all. It isn't a SA-only thing. It might be sorta-broke with the new patch, though.

Yeah, feel free to upload your replays if you are looking for build feedback. Wolf is good, I'm pretty decent, I'm sure we have some other "plat level" people around.

[trias_e]

Ok, here ya go.  http://www.sc2rc.com/index.php/replay/show/2596

Having 10 larva and 900 minerals in the bank ftw!

   Micro+Macro is HARD IMO.

[Malakili]

   Micro+Macro is HARD IMO.

Yes it is.  Hot keys are your friend,

[Teleku]

I've had pretty good luck opening up with a 2-3 drop ship filled with marines rush onto their workers.  I just won 4 out of 5 games with that!  The losing game was against the only Zerg player, who had a bunch of Muta's out already when I came flying in...

[Wolf]

"pro"-tip just make sure you have all your hatcheries hotkeyed at 4, 5 and 6 and just smash the middle of the keyboard during fight to produce stuff :)

Watched the rep - so basically you get your set of 6 at around the 3 minute mark and your attack starts at about the 4 minute mark. At that time my build has 6 lings and a Queen, plus 4 producing, larvae on their way and 15 workers. Your speed comes a bit late too (5:50), mine came at 5:21 with 20 lings (I generally try not to attack without speed). At this point you have map control vs any match up ('cept possibly mass zealots/MM, but like I said I really don't like lings vs PT).  Here's the rapidshit link - http://rapidshare.com/files/381219931/build.SC2Replay.html

Yay time to go home :D HDH is live in an hour (TLO FIGHTING~~) and later Nazgul vs WhiteRa for the razer thing :)

[Malakili]

"pro"-tip just make sure you have all your hatcheries hotkeyed at 4, 5 and 6 and just smash the middle of the keyboard during fight to produce stuff :)

I play as Random, but when I am playing zerg i tend to just hotkey all my hatcheries onto the same hotkey.

[trias_e]

"pro"-tip just make sure you have all your hatcheries hotkeyed at 4, 5 and 6 and just smash the middle of the keyboard during fight to produce stuff :)

Watched the rep - so basically you get your set of 6 at around the 3 minute mark and your attack starts at about the 4 minute mark. At that time my build has 6 lings and a Queen, plus 4 producing, larvae on their way and 15 workers. Your speed comes a bit late too (5:50), mine came at 5:21 with 20 lings (I generally try not to attack without speed). At this point you have map control vs any match up ('cept possibly mass zealots/MM, but like I said I really don't like lings vs PT).  Here's the rapidshit link - http://rapidshare.com/files/381219931/build.SC2Replay.html

Yay time to go home :D HDH is live in an hour (TLO FIGHTING~~) and later Nazgul vs WhiteRa for the razer thing :)

Cool, thanks for the insight!  I figured that if I waited for a 14 pool I wouldn't get my lings out in time to go with his first reaper, but if thats not the case then 14 pool is definitely superior.  

I always hotkey my first hatchery...do I actually use this hotkey?  Usually not, lol.  I seriously need a timer every 40 seconds to go off that screams at me 'MACRO NOW'.  And remembering to hotkey my second or this hatcheries seems beyond me at this point.  I am seriously in a constant state of panic in thiis game.  It's a relief when the game is over.

I'll actually be watching the HDH as well!  Hopefully they will not have such terrible stream issues as the first time.

[Wolf]

No you get your first set faster. Like 1 min, but it's very slow after that and doesn't have a good transition (basically too rushy).

Hatcheries - I meant all to multiple hotkeys so you don't have to aim :)

I'm actually random too but zergs my strongest race by far.