Final Fantasy XIII gameplay footage - 40 minutes

[raydeen]

Chocofro.

Wish I could take credit for that. Saw it on Digg this morning.

[justdave]

He really should be using nunchucks.

Only if he has poor balance. 

[justdave]

Also, they make all the 3D ones look horrible in terms of pure enjoyment.

Idunno, VII is the only one that's caused me to hunt someone down after they moved out of the geek house of that era and show up at their doorstep, brand-new Playstation memory card in hand, to demand a trade since they 'moved out just after I had gotten Knights of the Round, you motherfucker'.

[Velorath]

Reddas didn't use any guns that I can recall.

Lantyssa, FFV's entire character roster ends up with 75% women, one of them a cross-dressing pirate.  Also: job system > esper system.  You should play that before FFVI.

Too bad plot-wise FFV was the blandest of the bunch (aside from the NES games).

[Sheepherder]

Auron is cooler than everyone else, but he's an adult.

Yes, Auron was awesome. He was the only reason I finished FF10, I couldn't have given 2 shits about the Sin story, I wanted to see what happened to him.

I Googled the name, I really didn't need to, I could guess who you were talking about.  Out of twelve main Final Fantasy games, I've completed none of them, despite having played half (and having the option of playing more than half).  The only Square game I know of that I've finished is the first Final Fantasy Tactics.  Part of that is the miserable characters, and the other is that combat in all the main games feels like a menu system slapped on a tech demo.

[stray]

Menus or not, there's at least some tactical thinking involved in the encounters. Not that Square's stuff is particularly difficult or anything, but it's definitely more than a menu system at least. Or are you just being facetious? Perhaps you should try out the Shin Megami Tensei and/or Persona games. [edit] assuming you're knocking "menus" and tb jrpgs in general, and not just Square.

[Kail]

Menus or not, there's at least some tactical thinking involved in the encounters.

In FFXIII, you mean, or in FF/JRPGs in general?  Because I think I'm coming from the same place; I just don't get a kick out of selecting "fight" ten times in a row every time I take four steps down a hallway.  FFXII seemed to be a step in the right direction (not that it was difficult, but at least the "combat" game wasn't so isolated from the "story" world), but from what I saw in that video, FF13 looks like a step back.  Didn't watch the whole thing though, did I get the wrong impression?

[stray]

I mean JRPG's in general. They aren't so easy as to just seem like a demo and menu affair. It all varies though. Some games can be easy, because encounters aren't very well balanced. FF hasn't really had this problem though in awhile. Enemies scale properly.

As for all of the random fights, that's another issue, but yeah, it can get bothersome. Some games implement it better than others though.

As for FF12, I think the combat was trying too hard to cater to both action and tb mindsets. I mean, if you're going to go action, make it intense and combo heavy.. even tiring to forge through. F12 otoh was just a little too laid back for an action rpg, but a little too real time to have the same tactical feel of a turn based game, and by virtue, the feel of a Final Fantasy game (to me at least). If they're going back to something turn based, then it's all good with me. I'd welcome a proper action RPG version too, but that's probably too radical a change for most fans.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Reddas didn't use any guns that I can recall.

Lantyssa, FFV's entire character roster ends up with 75% women, one of them a cross-dressing pirate.  Also: job system > esper system.  You should play that before FFVI.

Bad mouth Setzer again and I will reach through the internet and slap you. 

[ahoythematey]

Ahhh...good old seltzer and his slot machine.  But no, I was talking about Faris in FFV.  I'm pretty sure Setzer is actually a dude.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Heh, I know. Anyways VI was by far my favorite, then maybe VII and XII after it. XII was actually A pretty good step forward though it had a lot of star wars parallels it was also a game that favored strong female roles. Some would argue Vaan was always the co-star of that one since none of the story really had much to do with him at all.

[ahoythematey]

VI was awesome.  Strangely enough, XII is my favorite "numbered" FF, despite having an unhealthy love of the series staples that it so elegantly discarded.  I'd argue as well that XII was ensemble-driven in much the same way as VI.  I didn't mind Vaan, but he just wasn't that interesting compared to the other characters.

[Lakov_Sanite]

Vaan was more the chrono of XII. You sort of watch events unfold through him but he has little to nothing at all to do with them, the whole game is the stories of the other characters.

[Triforcer]

VI.  VI.  VI!!  The only one in the series worth playing.  And schild is right,  Kefka is the best FF villain ever. 

[ahoythematey]

Ridiculous nonsense.

[Triforcer]

No, u. 

[Sheepherder]

Menus or not, there's at least some tactical thinking involved in the encounters. Not that Square's stuff is particularly difficult or anything, but it's definitely more than a menu system at least. Or are you just being facetious? Perhaps you should try out the Shin Megami Tensei and/or Persona games. [edit] assuming you're knocking "menus" and tb jrpgs in general, and not just Square.

I like maneuver warfare as a gameplay mechanic, I hate angsty androgynous heroes.  That's all I really need to say, isn't it?

[Rasix]

Edit: woah, almost got myself into a FF argument.   

[Murgos]

I like maneuver warfare as a gameplay mechanic, I hate angsty androgynous heroes.  That's all I really need to say, isn't it?

Why are you posting in a Final Fantasy thread then?

Hey, get over yourself, it's not for you.

[NiX]

Edit: woah, almost got myself into a FF argument.   

That was a close one, Jim.

[stray]

on a sidenote, this is a weak "generation" for jrpg's so far, quantity wise. :\ maybe jap games in general. even the ones that do exist don't seem to be distributed well. i had to go far and wide just to pick up the relatively new valkyria chronicles. also, someone needs to give atlus some money. at this point, i'd be more excited about their titles than square's...

[ahoythematey]

Spend your time waiting for the good crop by playing what you missed of the last crop.  There were so damn many that you had to have missed at least a couple.  My to-do list includes: finishing Okami, Valkyria Chronicles, actually opening my copy of Odin Sphere, and picking up either Persona 3 or 4.

[Hindenburg]

on a sidenote, this is a weak "generation" for jrpg's so far, quantity wise. :\ maybe jap games in general. even the ones that do exist don't seem to be distributed well. i had to go far and wide just to pick up the relatively new valkyria chronicles. also, someone needs to give atlus some money. at this point, i'd be more excited about their titles than square's...

This generation has Demon's Souls.
/argument.

[stray]

yeah, there are quite a few i'd still like to play, but i'm a graphics whore too. would be nice :)

[Lakov_Sanite]

I really can't say enough good things about Okami. Go. Play it.

[Sheepherder]

Why are you posting in a Final Fantasy thread then?

Hey, get over yourself, it's not for you.

I was actually going to say exactly that, then I decided not to.  I figured someone else would, and link the comic.  I like that comic.

Problem is, I could probably play through a main series FF game if they weren't so hell-bent on scrolling through lists with the D-pad for every single option, or promised never to use "active time" systems in conjuntion with long menus ever again, or added more depth to their combat system than <Move> -> <Target>, or did something new that wasn't changing the triggering conditions of limit break.

It's not like I'm alone in thinking the gameplay is incredibly stale and not particularly inspired to begin with, and that this looks very "more of the same".

[ahoythematey]

Get over yourself, or please get out of the FF thread.  It's clear you don't like the way the games have been designed in the past, but millions upon millions of other gamers do.  My suggestion: play something else.

Edit: If I may elaborate, you should try Valkyria Chronicles, or go farther back in time and give Lost Kingdoms/Lost Kingdoms II a whirl.  Shit, Crisis Core:FF7 might even have the kind of game mechanics you would dig more than something traditionally menu-driven.

I would also like to back up what Lakov_Sanite said about Okami.  Absolutely a must-play title.

[stray]

I really can't say enough good things about Okami. Go. Play it.

I've played it (not sure if that's directed at me tho.. if not, my bad). I've played a ton of things on PS2, save for the lesser known jrpg's.

--

The gameplay isn't stale. No more than it isn't stale, say, with other turnbased games in different genres, like X-Com or Civ. Or freaking Chess! I don't think you've stuck around long enough to see the depth of that sort of design. Just because there are "menus" and not a lot of real time movements doesn't mean there isn't gameplay.

[Kail]

The gameplay isn't stale. No more than it isn't stale, say, with other turnbased games in different genres, like X-Com or Civ. Or freaking Chess! I don't think you've stuck around long enough to see the depth of that sort of design. Just because there are "menus" and not a lot of real time movements doesn't mean there isn't gameplay.

Did you seriously just compare Final Fantasy to Chess?  Seriously?

[Hindenburg]

A bit odd that his other turn-based examples have positioning that actually matters.

[stray]

The gameplay isn't stale. No more than it isn't stale, say, with other turnbased games in different genres, like X-Com or Civ. Or freaking Chess! I don't think you've stuck around long enough to see the depth of that sort of design. Just because there are "menus" and not a lot of real time movements doesn't mean there isn't gameplay.

Did you seriously just compare Final Fantasy to Chess?  Seriously?

Yes I did. Just a general turn-based comparison though, don't have a cow man.

As for positioning, well it's an RPG, y'know. Of course it's different if you're going to be extend my comparisons to their furthest limit and shit. All my point was was that there is "gameplay" involved, and it's more than just flipping through menus. You wouldn't judge Chess on it's sparse presentation, and neither should you with anything else. There's usually more to it.

I will say though that there is an order of attack "positioning" of sorts. Who and what you open up with is important. Some rpgs account for more factors like terrain and such, or require you to pre-build your parties so as to limit any future strategies, or have multiple target areas on a single monster.. Among god knows what else. So it's possible for them to be just as complex as a game with "spatial positioning", just in a different way.

[Kail]

I'm feeling a bit confused about what you're trying to say here.  That it's possible for a menu based RPG to be tactically deep and engaging?  That previous FF games have been tactically deep and engaging?  That FFXIII will be tactically deep and engaging?

[stray]

What I'm saying here is a direct response to sheepherder. He thinks these games have no depth and are just "demos" with menu systems. At first I thought he was just trying to be funny, but it seems like he actually believes that. So I'm just touching on their most basic qualities.

[schild]

NSFW language. Funniest thing IGN has ever done? Yea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nG_Z0rd7eK0

[Sheepherder]

My problem with menus is that they're used by Square to ameliorate piss-poor control mapping.  When you have more options than you have buttons on the controller you need menus or modifier buttons, conversely, every button should be mapped to something useful.  Most of the FF games could be played on the original NES controller.  In the meantime, I seem to recall that VII, VIII, and IX (maybe others) had you press two of the shoulder buttons for running from combat, leaving all four buttons otherwise mostly unused.  Here's a novel idea: pressing and holding a shoulder button selects an enemy, then pressing one of the four main buttons (maybe the directional buttons as well) executes a move / macro.