Bad Groups

[ezrast]

Neither does GS. I've been accused of lying about my gear because the raid leader was on a different continent and his data on me was from a week earlier when I had been in holiday event gear.

[Rendakor]

You guys do know that the GS addon covers more than just a single number right? It gives kill history to track experience, and will indicate if gear is spec-inappropriate. You just need to be near them and actually type /gs instead of just mousing over them to see it. Does EG do substantially more than that?

[ezrast]

I had forgotten that GS does that, but it undermines all that info by giving a completely different number upon mouseover, which is the one everybody uses. IIRC EG does a slightly better job at checking gems/enchants (detracts points for low-level stuff) but a slightly worse one at checking gear (doesn't weight chests more heavily than boots when averaging ilvl). Aside from that it's just a nicer presenation/interface - the summary view puts your whole raid's info in one window and is great.

Short answer: no.

[Rendakor]

The latest update to GS actually fixed that; when you /gs someone it gives you the same number if everything is appropriate, and subtracts a % for all inappropriate stats. Before, it took the base number then increased it by a percentage for appropriate stats, giving you some absurdly high number.

[Selby]

My raid leader and I still use wow-heroes.com for pre-judging people's gear.  We are more interested in correct gemming, enchants, and matches of gear than some arbitrary number.

Like the dude with the white vendor items or poorly matched PVP gear or things like +SP gems on a warrior doesn't get invited.  Someone with all blues who is trying or at least has a clue on spec and whatnot, they get a chance.

[Simond]

The latest update to GS actually fixed that; when you /gs someone it gives you the same number if everything is appropriate, and subtracts a % for all inappropriate stats. Before, it took the base number then increased it by a percentage for appropriate stats, giving you some absurdly high number.

What does it do when someone is using the gearscore-faker mods? 

Also, GS has shitty, shitty netcode so it actually makes borderline fights even more likely to implode into a flaming ball of fail just because of the extra lag.

[ezrast]

The latest update to GS actually fixed that; when you /gs someone it gives you the same number if everything is appropriate, and subtracts a % for all inappropriate stats. Before, it took the base number then increased it by a percentage for appropriate stats, giving you some absurdly high number.

What does it do when someone is using the gearscore-faker mods?  

Exactly the same thing. Those mods only screw up remote gear checks (which as I've said are inaccurate anyway); when you're in inspection range GS just checks the target by itself.

[Rendakor]

Also, GS has shitty, shitty netcode so it actually makes borderline fights even more likely to implode into a flaming ball of fail just because of the extra lag.

This, I'll give you. I always turn GS off once we get to the first boss because otherwise it's been known to DC me from time to time.

[Zetor]

Wow, this just solved the mystery-of-the-week for me; I was getting 0.1 to 0.5 fps and occasional disconnects in super serious boss fights like voa-25 recently even after pushing details to the minimum (I installed GS because pug raids wouldn't give me the time of day otherwise). I disabled GS and presto, everything is playable again!

[proudft]

Yeah I can't run GS - every time I mouse over anyone it would freeze up my system for like 2 seconds, in-combat or out.  They saaaaaay they don't check in combat and they saaaaaaaay they fixed their network code a while ago, but not for me they didn't.

[Slyfeind]

I just gotta say, playing a healer makes it ok to shout at people. I like that. As DPS, I just gotta go with the flow and if I die it's my own damn fault. But as a healer, I get to say things like "I DO NOT CARE YOUR LEET DPS YOU SHOULD STILL NOT TAKE AGRO FROM TANKS PLZKTHX" and everybody shuts the fuck up after that. Usually. Sometimes they take that as an excuse to be bigger dicks, at which point I let them die and then "/tell deadplayer lol" which also feels good.

[Sjofn]

Yeah, tanks and healers get a lot more Prick Leeway than DPS. It's like DPS is easily replaced or something!

Last night I had a healer ditch our group one pull in because he didn't look at the tank's GS before then and he was all OH GOD GEAR TOO SHITTY ABORT ABORT. Now. We were doing Gundrak. Dude was in better gear than I was when *I* started doing heroic Gundrak. It was going to be fine! Well, we got a new healer and banged it out in like 15 minutes. Conclusion: That first healer was a giant pussy.

[Selby]

I have noticed lately some VERY impatient DPS.  They are always telling me how to tank and running off and pulling other mobs.  As the tank I let them deal with it.  Then they get mad about it and I tell them if they want to tank go right ahead and I'll DPS.  My healer has let idiots die to this foolishness too.

[Shrike]

After a two week hiatus, I logged my bracket pally back in last night. Dropped into LFG and got...shitty healers. Plural. Went through three before getting one that had a clue. First guy disappeared in the second pull. No clue why. Hit /lfg to find another and kept pulling (CoS, pally could easily stay up and the enh shaman even threw me a few heals). Second healer showed up. Tree druid. Started bitching about something or other in the first couple of minutes, so we kicked his ass and kept on pulling. Third guy shows up and steps up, so the rest of the run went flawlessly.

Shaman time. As luck would have it, we got HHoR. Joy. First healer was of the "won't heal dps" variety, so we didn't last long after Malwin (I think...fear guy) showed up. Dumbass. Was informed he was a dumbass. Dumbass leaves in shame (probably not, but a nice thought nevertheless). Get a healer than will actually heal and finish flawlessly.

DK time. I'm blood, so I don't give a shit if I get heals. This is essentially a PvP toon, so she rolls in about half T10 and half various PvP pieces when in PvE stuff (buttload of hps and sitll does about 5.5k in heroics). We get HHoS (joy). I guess the healer was doing his job, never really noticed and we steamrolled the place easily (as expected).

Tanks were all OK. Dps were well behaved (except maybe me). 3 out of 6 healers were wankers. You can draw your own conclusions.

[Selby]

Shaman time. As luck would have it, we got HHoR. Joy. First healer was of the "won't heal dps" variety, so we didn't last long after Malwin (I think...fear guy) showed up. Dumbass. Was informed he was a dumbass. Dumbass leaves in shame (probably not, but a nice thought nevertheless). Get a healer than will actually heal and finish flawlessly.

We had this tonight in H-HoR.  Our guild's 6kGS tank, my DPS warrior, and another guild DPS.  The random healer was REALLY poorly geared and we wondered how he even got in.  Proceeds to ONLY heal the tank unless a DPS is down in the sub1k range.  We had to explain to him that yes, you DO have to heal DPS in this instance.  And yes, as a shaman your cleansing totems SHOULD be down in this instance...  We managed to finish it, but I was wondering...

[Slyfeind]

Man. No wonder I get tells of "You're amaaaazing!!!" It's because a lot of other healers just suck. That makes more sense, because I always figure I'm merely ok by just keeping people live.

[Wolf]

I was doing my daily dungeon on my lvl75 hunter, got VH and was in a "boost group" apparently (no idea how, what or why they're boosting tbh). A level 80 6k GS Mage, a lvl80 4k GS shadow priest for a healer (was dispersing for mana). The mage was doing sub 4k DPS, no idea how that is even possible. And no mobs weren't dying too fast they were up for 20+ secs at a time.

Also can I use that thread to whine about the new fail guild I got into? Had 10+ wipes on heroic 10m princes last night, every single one due to some silliness - like Taldaram tank getting hit by Valanar's empowered vortex, Kinetic bombs hitting the ground left and right, most of the raid bouncing around from regular vortexes. It was an exercise in frustration.

[Ingmar]

How fail can they really be in the grand scheme of things if they're doing hard modes? 

[Wolf]

plenty :)

It's heroic, not hard modes. It really isn't hard with the 25% buff. The difference between my current setup (mostly 10m/10mh) and a full 25mh 277 godliness gives me about 20% increase in damage. So everyone should be overpowering content at this point. But here we are, barely making the enrage timer on festergut hc 

[SurfD]

plenty :)

It's heroic, not hard modes. . But here we are, barely making the enrage timer on festergut hc 

Umm, It's ICC not Ulduar.  Heroic IS the hardmode.

[Wolf]

I meant it's not hard. As in it's easy.

[WindupAtheist]

I have a good friend who tries really hard and still only manages to pull like 1k DPS. I think some kind of intervention is required.

[Ironwood]

Fairly hard to judge without more info.

If he's level 20, for example, he's doing great.

[Selby]

How fail can they really be in the grand scheme of things if they're doing hard modes? 

I will say that Princes is one of the harder of the heroic ICC bosses, merely because you are extremely limited in your movements.  I am solely on kinetic bomb patrol in that fight, and rarely if ever DPS the bosses.  We wiped a good 5-6 times the first time we fought it trying to make everything go right, but now while it isn't on farm it is definitely close to that.

[Wolf]

Like princes normal it's much more about survival than DPS. The thing is, there aren't that many things you have to pay attention to, especially if you've done it numerous times on normal. After that the hard part is that it is an inherently RNG-y fight. Bombs at the same time in different corners, nuclei spawn, etc.

[Merusk]

Nah, it's hard for mid-tier guilds where not every member is a focused, driven raider.  I know my guild that was 6th on the server had a rough time of it just because the damned ranged ALL had to pay attention instead of just a few dedicated ball-bouncers.  That frequently didn't happen.  Or they'd spend too much time watching for balls and not enough making sure they weren't too close to a healer/ tank/ other ranged.  OR they'd line up right behind one of the floor explosions and Taldaram's ball of fire would vap them because melee couldn't run to absorb enough empowered fireball charges.

As for embarrassing fails.. how about hitting the enrage timer on BQL after killing the Lich King AND while having a 20% damage buff.  That happened a few times, too.  How, I haven't a fucking clue, since we'd downed her before the buffs even started happening.

[Evildrider]

I think a handful of the ICC bosses can be screwed up by bad luck or someone just making a silly mistake.

[SurfD]

As for embarrassing fails.. how about hitting the enrage timer on BQL after killing the Lich King AND while having a 20% damage buff.  That happened a few times, too.  How, I haven't a fucking clue, since we'd downed her before the buffs even started happening.

Hitting the BQL enrage timer is actually pretty easy, especially if something happens to fuck with your bite progression early in the fight.  Having one of your Vampires die when you only have 2 up pretty much kllls the fight, as you have basicly lost 50% of your increased DPS output for the fight from that point on.

[WoopeeTuralyon]

Sooo H UK. I'm the healer, and the tank and two dps are from the same guild. Apparently their guild was wanting for gold, because the druid rolled need on EVERY item. He said it was accidental, bullshit. I tried to votekick him but no! He and his goons shoot it down(they're pulling under 2k each btw), and he continues to needroll every item... it was 15 minutes before the instance locks expired, otherwise I would've been gone. Annoyed the heck out of me anyway.

Another story, Naxx 10. My pug group decided to run in and grab Noth while BOTH healers were outside the chamber.... have fun with no heals. At least standing outside saved me from a repair bill

One more, REG HoR with all three dps under 2k. I had to heal each boss with less than 5k mana because stuff took such a long time to die. And... LK caught us. On reg. 'Nuff said.                                                                                                                               

[fuser]

I have a good friend who tries really hard and still only manages to pull like 1k DPS. I think some kind of intervention is required.

I've had this talk, it never goes well. Recount is horrible in some situations because leveling up my lock in UK a boomkin was constantly using starfall soon as it was up to try to keep up with me on DPS. Poor tank was all over the place trying to aggro things.

[Zetor]

This wasn't really a -bad- group, but when I logged on my lock to do my one-heroic-a-week, it turned out to be Gundrak with half the party going "can we do all achievements plz?". Nothing special happened until the last boss (we narrowly missed less-rabi, but that was expected), then we figured we would just play the waiting game to get the 'share the love' achievement, the one that requires the rhino to impale everyone in the group.

Of course he doesn't impale the person who's #1 on threat, but none of us knew that, so we just stood around for 6-7 minutes figuring we were just getting unlucky. Then we tried devising elaborate taunt strategies (I go into demonform and use my taunt and port, rogue tricks boss onto healer just when mage iceblocks and vanishes after, I get a bop and/or a pally taunt just when the boss reaches me, etc). After a few phase changes, we finally got the timing down, I went into demonform and taunted with the pally getting ready with the bop and a taunt.

... except it didn't really work. The tank DID get impaled, but then the rhino KB'd the pally into one of those little cubbies out of line-of-sight and gibbed me out in the open (if my reflexes weren't crap, I could've used a healthstone or insta-summoned a void for the shield, oh well). The pally was so surprised she couldn't heal the tank (who was impaled on the rhino and thus also out of LOS) that she forgot to heal herself, couldn't bubble due to forbearance from an earlier attempt and died 2 seconds later, so it was the 50% hp warrior, mage and rogue against a 96% hp boss who still had to die for us to get the achievement.

The following minute was intense, to say the least (no, we didn't have a soulstone... who the hell uses soulstones in heroics nowadays?! pffft.) since both the mage's and the rogue's oh-crap buttons were already down. In the end, the warrior died after cycling through a full set of tanking cooldowns and the rogue was just running out of evasion when they brought him down with both of them having barely a sliver of health left.

I gotta say, even though two of us failed, the fight felt more epic than a lot of raids I've been on. 

[SurfD]

This wasn't really a -bad- group, but when I logged on my lock to do my one-heroic-a-week, it turned out to be Gundrak with half the party going "can we do all achievements plz?". Nothing special happened until the last boss (we narrowly missed less-rabi, but that was expected), then we figured we would just play the waiting game to get the 'share the love' achievement, the one that requires the rhino to impale everyone in the group.

I remember doing that achievement.   I seem to recall there was also a trick to getting him to target specific "Non tank" individuals for the impale.  Think it had to do with being a certain distance away from him (he does a knockback to everyone in mele range, and i think 90% of the time he will impale the person who is farthest away that was not hit by the knockback).

[Merusk]

As for embarrassing fails.. how about hitting the enrage timer on BQL after killing the Lich King AND while having a 20% damage buff.  That happened a few times, too.  How, I haven't a fucking clue, since we'd downed her before the buffs even started happening.

Hitting the BQL enrage timer is actually pretty easy, especially if something happens to fuck with your bite progression early in the fight.  Having one of your Vampires die when you only have 2 up pretty much kllls the fight, as you have basicly lost 50% of your increased DPS output for the fight from that point on.

Oh yeah, absolutely. However we just wipe it if something happens like a healer gets bitten because someone couldn't find their target, or a Vamp gets MC'd or dies before the last 30s.   No, this was just a complete and utter cock-up of a failure.   At times I think it's because of the GL's reliance on using trash or Fester DPs parses to set-up the bite order, since that was the wing we ran first.    

[WoopeeTuralyon]

This isn't a bad group, I just found it funny that my bear tank for HOK dropped group because I was meleeing mobs with my Hammer of the Naaru rather than healing. He had 47k hp, and never dropped more than a few thousand down with my earth shield on him for the whole 3 pulls before he left.

Also got screwed over by my own guild today. ICC10 group two was intended to run from 8 to 12. Instead, it started two hours LATE. I could only stay for the originally scheduled duration of the raid, and as a result, was not allowed to go at all. Thanks, guildies!

I actually read this ENTIRE thread, and had many lols over the various failures. I've seen my fair share, but you guys have some real winners. Bravo!

[Wolf]

So, I sign up for my daily and get FOS. I'm all like, yeah baby, a quickie. First pull takes forever to die, which is weird because the other two dps are a rogue and a hunter. I look at recount, and I shit you not, both are below 1k. At around 4k gearscore, both of them. I ask them if they're going to push buttons, no response. Ended up basically soloing the dungeon with the tank and tree. At the end the rogue was 1300 overal, the hunter 1100, both below the warrior tank. The hunter actually had the snake trap in his "rotation".