Patch 3.08

[Dren]

Judgement of Wisdom: Now returns a percentage of base mana instead of a percentage of max mana.

That's a pretty big nerf for my holy paladin.  I use that a lot.

[kildorn]

Resto shaman are nuts right now, as far as healing throughput goes. They're also the only AE heal not looking to get murdered in upcoming patches.

That said, enhance has survival issues and elemental has generic issues (though it's actually pretty good in pvp, fuck the haters..) and totems are a pain in the fucking ass.

Oh, and getting used to imp water shield is Hard. Great talent, but I had to setup an alert to yell at me if water shield is down, because my brain was too used to "I'm not getting hit by anything, why would water shield be down!"

I hated riptide when I first got it, the mana cost is insanity. Then I figured out that riptide's purpose in life is tidal waves and was happy.

[Fabricated]

Thank god ore is cheaper and easier to get in WotLK. I was tired of playing "hunt the Khorium" or battling over shitty adamantite nodes.

Are you mining Titanium yet?

I'm currently using 2 epic Titansteel items I crafted, and I've made Titanium Rods and other stuff for a lot of my guildies. Just trying to mine Saronite I've found more than enough Titanium.

The same can definitely not be said about Khorium. That shit sucked.

[JWIV]

I can't spoiler stuff so I won't post the whole thing.

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/13/7536073945-ptr-patch-308-notes.html

My Favorite:

Mining

    * Mining veins and deposits no longer require multiple hits to receive all the ore. Players will receive around the same amount of ore, stone, and gems they would have received from multiple hits.
    * Weakened Giants and Iron Rune Sentinels can now be correctly mined.

This is pretty rad - the only downside is no more multiple skillups off the same node.  I always figured that was the tradeoff.

[kildorn]

The instaclick WG orb really fucks over defense of that keep room. I'm not entirely sure how I feel about that.

[Ratman_tf]

Thank god ore is cheaper and easier to get in WotLK. I was tired of playing "hunt the Khorium" or battling over shitty adamantite nodes.

Are you mining Titanium yet?

I'm currently using 2 epic Titansteel items I crafted, and I've made Titanium Rods and other stuff for a lot of my guildies. Just trying to mine Saronite I've found more than enough Titanium.

The same can definitely not be said about Khorium. That shit sucked.

Huh. I've found titanium to be pretty rare. Then again, I still don't have an epic flyer, which would help when I'm out gathering.

[Draegan]

This is pretty rad - the only downside is no more multiple skillups off the same node.  I always figured that was the tradeoff.

You never could.

[Tairnyn]

I think he's referring to the mechanic that allowed multiple people to hit the same node and each get one skillup.

[JWIV]

I think he's referring to the mechanic that allowed multiple people to hit the same node and each get one skillup.

No, i could have sworn I had gotten more than 1 skill-up point off a node, but I guess I'm high.

[Merusk]

Judgement of Wisdom: Now returns a percentage of base mana instead of a percentage of max mana.

That's a pretty big nerf for my holy paladin.  I use that a lot.

Yeah it's meant to be a ret nerf I think,  but, uh. Whoops.  Holy pallies are so fucked, I feel for them.

[Dren]

Judgement of Wisdom: Now returns a percentage of base mana instead of a percentage of max mana.

That's a pretty big nerf for my holy paladin.  I use that a lot.

Yeah it's meant to be a ret nerf I think,  but, uh. Whoops.  Holy pallies are so fucked, I feel for them.

Doesn't do well for prot either.  A pally tank without mana isn't very effective and tends to cause wipes.

[Merusk]

Pally tanks don't use JOW unless soloing and doing it wrong.  Blessing of Sanc and - if you need it - seal of wisdom are more than enough.  When tanking for realz you also have the piddly regen off of Spiritual attunement.

[Dren]

Pally tanks don't use JOW unless soloing and doing it wrong.  Blessing of Sanc and - if you need it - seal of wisdom are more than enough.  When tanking for realz you also have the piddly regen off of Spiritual attunement.

Are you saying you don't see prot pally's judging anything?

[Shrike]

Seal of wisdom is enough, but only just. Prot pallies simply spend a lot of time drinking or slamming pots. Just the way it is.

The only thing I can think why anyone would consider enhance "to feel weak" in Northrend is the armor degradation and an increased need to heal up after a fight. I did go from about 46% mitigation to what is now around 36% with my level 80 gear. Not too thrilled about that, but it'll go up as I move from T7 to T8 and on. As for the ability to do what I damned well pleased in Northrend, well, that's better than ever. I can solo lvl80 elites, what more do you want?

I still consider DKs squishier than their warrior or paladin counterparts. I don't like seeing them as instance tanks in groups. For my specific DK, I think I'm just not quite tuned into the class. Maybe a UI issue. I have to think too much about what I'm doing, which slows my reactions, a problem I don't have with my warrior or paladin. More time in the saddle, I guess. Also, I"m going back to unholy. I like frost, but unholy seems a bit more suited to my playstyle.

[LK]

The instaclick WG orb really fucks over defense of that keep room. I'm not entirely sure how I feel about that.

I find the phase after the doors go down to be the most annoying part of WG and where the game tends to lag out pretty hard with everyone clustering in one spot (taking the entire server with it). I believe that was a conscious decision to put more of the defense on the walls and courtyard (where the fight is more fun) and speed the WG game along if the doors go down. Thumbs up to this change.

[Merusk]

Pally tanks don't use JOW unless soloing and doing it wrong.  Blessing of Sanc and - if you need it - seal of wisdom are more than enough.  When tanking for realz you also have the piddly regen off of Spiritual attunement.

Are you saying you don't see prot pally's judging anything?

No, just not wisdom. I was always judging light myself because I try to keep at least 4 mobs on me.  All the dodges,  Parrys and Blocks were more than enough to keep me mana'd up, but there was a definite need to keep healthy.

I still consider DKs squishier than their warrior or paladin counterparts. I don't like seeing them as instance tanks in groups. For my specific DK, I think I'm just not quite tuned into the class. Maybe a UI issue. I have to think too much about what I'm doing, which slows my reactions, a problem I don't have with my warrior or paladin. More time in the saddle, I guess. Also, I"m going back to unholy. I like frost, but unholy seems a bit more suited to my playstyle.

At the moment they are, which is why Frost Presence is getting its buffs.  They're still killing machines solo and able to take on normal dungeons without a problem, and only have a few troubles in heroics - in my experience.  I can't speak for tanking raid stuff, as the only one I've tanked is Archavon and he's a wuss.

[Vash]

That mining change is great in the sense that they finally made it equal to herbalism and skinning with the 1 hit and done, it even has the added benefit of preventing people from coming up and stealing the rest of your node after you've already got a hit in.  I'm just afraid it's gonna increase the amount of ore that can hit the market and drive the price down even more than it is now with the rapid drop in prices that seem to be happening on my server and many others. 

Well, they would have gotten the same amount of ore whether they hit it once or multiple times. Assuming Blizz doesn't change the drop rate from mining.

I think the price drops were inevitable. More and more people are hitting 80 and that's going to change both the amount of ore mined and the demand for it.

I just meant that with the change there will be a nice increase in ore/time for all miners.  Before this patch if you go mining for 30 min. for example you are slowed down quite a bit by the time it takes you to harvest each node.  Normal nodes with 2-4 taps at several seconds each hit, Rich nodes with 5-7 taps.  I mean on a rich node you literally spend 15-20+ seconds just harvesting it, when the patch hits that will all be in 1 hit taking 1 cast.

I'd be shocked if there wasn't an increase in ore hitting the market because now each miner will be able to gather more ore in the time they spend gathering, unless node respawn times become a limiting factor, but I'm skeptical that will happen since the respawn seems to be quite quick for Northrend ore from what I've seen so far.

[Ingmar]

The difference between base and max mana for ret/prot pallies isn't very big anyway. The people thare are actually nerfed by this change are the ranged dpsers.

[Ingmar]

At the moment they are, which is why Frost Presence is getting its buffs.  They're still killing machines solo and able to take on normal dungeons without a problem, and only have a few troubles in heroics - in my experience.  I can't speak for tanking raid stuff, as the only one I've tanked is Archavon and he's a wuss.

The funny(?) thing is, there is at least one raid encounter where a DK is going to be worse at tanking it after this change - Anub'rekhan. The easy way to do him is have a DK tank him and pop icebound fortitude every time he does his locust swarm, and just heal through it, because icebound fortitude only has a 1 minute cooldown. Now that IBF is going to be worse DR, that is going to be harder. Probably still doable that way, but it will definitely stress the healers more. As we gear up I guess it won't be a problem, but we're finally just now starting actual raiding.

[Koyasha]

I'm not into the 25-man raid stuff yet, but I've tanked Patchwerk's hateful strikes on 10-man so far, as well as main and off-tanking most of Naxx (somehow, we're having trouble with Grobbulus, I think we need more DPS cause we can survive for a good 7-8 minutes yet he doesn't die by then) and the healers said they did not have much trouble keeping me up, although they had to watch for when my cooldowns were off to apply additional healing.  The smoothing out of that damage in the next patch should be helpful, but either way it's really just something that healers had to get used to.  Healers that can adapt well say they don't have a problem healing me, although it takes a different way of going about it than other classes.

[bhodikhan]

"Reduced the spell power on the Titansteel Guardian to bring it in line with its item level. "

God dammit. I bought the stupid mace because it had great stats. This really pisses me off.

[Azaroth]

They're nerfing the titansteel helmet too.

[Ingmar]

They're nerfing the titansteel helmet too.

The DPS one only. The other two titansteel helmets are net improving. I believe the spellpower reduction on the guardian still leaves it a bit ahead of similar weapons in spellpower at least?

[Fordel]

Judge of Wisdom is having its percentage adjusted accordingly to keep a similar amount of return for the classes that actually have mana pools, last I read.


IE: Instead of 1% Total Mana return, it would be something like 3-4% base return. Roughly the same amount for casters with actual mana pools and a increase for the specs that use only base pools (ret/prot etc)



It is a nerf in the sense that when everyone is raiding Ice Crown and has 4k Intellect, it won't scale like it would currently.


-edit- how u engrish

[Lt.Dan]

I think he's referring to the mechanic that allowed multiple people to hit the same node and each get one skillup.

No, i could have sworn I had gotten more than 1 skill-up point off a node, but I guess I'm high.

Occassionally you would get a "double yoke" node where either two nodes had spawned on top of each other or on spawns as you clear the other one.  But this has only happened to me a handful of times since release.

[Ingmar]

The only place that I noticed that happening with any frequency is copper nodes in Dun Morogh, it seemed to happen constantly there - but I haven't mined any copper since the start of TBC so maybe they fixed it.

[Lt.Dan]

I just meant that with the change there will be a nice increase in ore/time for all miners.  Before this patch if you go mining for 30 min. for example you are slowed down quite a bit by the time it takes you to harvest each node.  Normal nodes with 2-4 taps at several seconds each hit, Rich nodes with 5-7 taps.  I mean on a rich node you literally spend 15-20+ seconds just harvesting it, when the patch hits that will all be in 1 hit taking 1 cast.

I'd be shocked if there wasn't an increase in ore hitting the market because now each miner will be able to gather more ore in the time they spend gathering, unless node respawn times become a limiting factor, but I'm skeptical that will happen since the respawn seems to be quite quick for Northrend ore from what I've seen so far.

I suspect you'd only get more supply if the nodes spawned faster.  I'd be flabbergasted if the bottle-neck in ore supply was 20 seconds harvesting :P

[Lt.Dan]

The only place that I noticed that happening with any frequency is copper nodes in Dun Morogh, it seemed to happen constantly there - but I haven't mined any copper since the start of TBC so maybe they fixed it.

That might explain it - I'm a dwarf lover 

[Fordel]

Careful, I hear the ladies flatten steel with their thighs!

[Ratman_tf]

I think he's referring to the mechanic that allowed multiple people to hit the same node and each get one skillup.

No, i could have sworn I had gotten more than 1 skill-up point off a node, but I guess I'm high.

I've heard if you wait like 5 minutes between gathers you can get more than one skill hit. Never had the patience to test it though.

[Montague]

I think he's referring to the mechanic that allowed multiple people to hit the same node and each get one skillup.

No, i could have sworn I had gotten more than 1 skill-up point off a node, but I guess I'm high.

I've heard if you wait like 5 minutes between gathers you can get more than one skill hit. Never had the patience to test it though.

It happened to me once in Elwynn Forest years ago when I got ganked by kobolds while mining. Got killed, rezzed, node was still there. Mined it again and got another skillup. Not really exploitable though I dont think, as nodes in NR don't generally last 5 minutes on my server.

[Azazel]

I think he's referring to the mechanic that allowed multiple people to hit the same node and each get one skillup.

You can still do that, you just don't loot. Works for Herby.

[K9]

2H Tanking Weapons have been taken out of this patch according to a new Blue post.

[Geki]

2H Tanking Weapons have been taken out of this patch according to a new Blue post.

What's the motivation for this?  To get the .01% of DKs that are actually decent players who might like to tank to drop the class?

[Dren]

Judge of Wisdom is having its percentage adjusted accordingly to keep a similar amount of return for the classes that actually have mana pools, last I read.

IE: Instead of 1% Total Mana return, it would be something like 3-4% base return. Roughly the same amount for casters with actual mana pools and a increase for the specs that use only base pools (ret/prot etc)

If this is the case, I'm fine with it.  My holy pally has around 20k mana when all buffed up in a raid, so it impacts him more than most I expect.  However, that would certainly be an actual boost to prot and ret pally's instead of what most people thought.  When I put my tank or melee gear on, my mana drops to something like 5k or lower from an unbuffed 17k (healing gear.)