Rolling a Death Knight as a New Main? Infos to help!

[AcidCat]

DK's just tear up Outlands, it's pretty fun. Especially with the quicker leveling, it's like a high speed tour. I solo'd three of the elite quests in the bone wastes in terrokar yesterday without breaking a sweat - last time I attempted to solo one of these was on my Pallie at the same level and I was spanked hard. Rounding up 4-6 mobs and taking them all down at once also really never gets old. I'm sure this power won't last through Northrend but for now it's fun to just power through these quests even though I've done them all like 5 times.

[Merusk]

If you pay attention to your gear and are making sure you keep it updated you'll continue to be able to kill at least 3 mobs at once in Northrend.  I've also managed to solo a few (2) person elites, but the 3& ups have all needed at least one other.  (I'm Unholy atm.)

Keeping your gear updated isn't hard, either.  The quest rewards almost always give a piece of DPS plate armor. Spellpower bits for pallies are few and far between this time around. Just keep in mind that the diminishing returns penalties of defense and armor pen seem to have flip-flopped.  I was tanking The Old Kingom at 74 andhad 408 def, but it only reduced my to-be-crit chance by 1.28%  Meanwhile, the single piece of armor pen gear I had with a 55 rating gave me a ~4% armor reduction. Ob. you don't need to stack a lot of it.

There's a shitload of haste and crit on all on the items, too. I was able to hit a 30% crit rate and something like 2.5 swing speed with my 3.5speed axe using just quest greens at one point, but noticed that I was killing shit so slowly it was sad.   Then I read and discovered  thse stats are "meh" for DKs, since we really prefer a lot of STR and the haste doesn't to a lot for us.  It's all about raw AP, since our dots and other effects are the majority of our damage, scale with AP and haste only helps your white damage.  (Which is only like 25% of my total output according to recount.)

As for weapons, run Utgarde Keep and see if you can get the axe that drops. That was better than any quest reward until I hit Storm Peaks, where I got a 131dps sword.   (There was one early blue reward that had more weapon damage, but the 75 to-hit on that axe was fucking awesome.)

[Polysorbate80]

Spellpower bits for pallies are few and far between this time around.

Yeah, it's sparse.  There's the Brilliant Saronite crafted set starting around lvl 74, but it's an odd mix of stats.  I'm using mostly the tempered Saronite myself until 78 when I can whip up a set of the Ret PVP armor to solo in, since I'm starting to get hit by random fly-by ganker attacks again.

[Draegan]

Code:

Stat  	Unholy 	Blood 	Frost 
1 AP	1.0000	1.0000	1.0000
1STR	2.4847	2.5570	2.3650
1HIT	2.4748	2.6609	2.4046
1APR	0.5447	1.0456	0.7628
1EXP	1.3914	1.7023	1.2453
1CRT	1.1240	1.1453	1.1894
1HASTE	0.6214	0.5640	0.4978
1DPS 	7.5670	8.9665	10.3610
Spec	17/0/54	51/13/7	17/54/0
DPS TTL	3114.42	3278.62	3152.79

Here's the Stat to DPS weight you should consider for yourself.  Pre-cap you should really go for Str > Hit > Exp > Crit > AP.  Crit and haste are pretty useless for DK's.  The percentage of our damage from white attacks (auto attack) is around 12-18% depending on buffs and gear.

Using Unholy stat weights, you can do this in wowhead:
Stat Weighted List with Epics and Rares

You can adjust the search parameters for just Rares or whatever.

[Dewdrop]

Crit isnt worthless..  Its in the right spot in terms of value, you want to stack str and get hit capped (9%) and have 6.5% worth of expertise but dont forget that for unholy wandering plague, which as of now accounts for 10% of my dps in 5 mans, is based on crit and scouge strike, if you are following an optimized rotation, will generally be #1 dmg dealer and it scales with crit a rediculous amount (230% crit).

Dont get me wrong, I totally agree with the stat weighting, I just disagree with you saying crit is useless and then using white dmg as an argument as if SS, Wandering Plague, BS, and IT dont account for much dmg.

Crit also gains more traction in Blood and Frost builds but is still behind str, hit, expertise in valuation.

And yeah, Haste + ArP is pretty much a wasted stat on us. No appreciable benefit.

[Draegan]

I meant to say Armor Pene not Crit.  So I agree with you.

[Morfiend]

I agree with your breakdown, but I believe that white damage is still higher than 18%. Most of the WWS posted on EJ show White Damage to be accounting for around 35%, which is still lower than just about any other melee DPS.

[Venkman]

So the moment I land in Chillwind on the Blightcaller quest series, I completely lose interest At 58 should I hit Hellfire Peninsula or should I tough it out EP/WP until I hit 60?

[WindupAtheist]

Just go to Hellfire if that sounds like more fun. There's much more content in Outland than you'll need to level into the Northrend range anyway.

[Merusk]

The quests in Old World are shitty xp and too far between with an assload of "get on a bird and fly over here for this step!" quests.  If you assembled the list of items in the starter post, do that.  If not, go to Outland and get on board the speed train.

[Koyasha]

Silithus is sorta worth doing, cause you get some faction and the exp isn't that bad since the entire zone was designed primarily for 60's.  But if you don't care about the faction, don't bother.

On a faction-related sidenote, 77 is the highest level you can be and get most all the kill rep from level 70 instances.  At 78, all the 69's in those instances go grey and stop giving full reputation.  At 79, everything goes grey.  If you want any Burning Crusade dungeon reputations, either for the achievements or because of the tabard or because of a cool thing you want, try to get them to exalted before you hit 79.

The same applies to level 66-68 for old world stuff, except a lot of the 60 dungeons have level 58 mobs as well as 59, so drop it down a level.

[Morfiend]

I went straight to Outlands. My zone to level went like this.

58 - 68 Outlands. I hit 68 about the time I finished Nagrand. Completely solo except for random groupings with people on the same quest as me to share quest mobs. No instances.

68 - 71 Howling Fjord.

71 - 73 - Borean Tundra.

73 to current (74.7) Drangonblight.

[Draegan]

I did 58-60 in WPL since I followed the guide I linked in the OP.  Then Outlands to 70, then Borean and I hit 72 last night after finishing all the quests except the 3 man quest in the NE section of the map.  Also did a Nexus run as well.

[Dewdrop]

I followed a similar pattern to Morfiend except I didn't get far into Nagrand before hitting 68 and my starting zone was different.

58-68 Outland (HFP, ZM, Terokar + The first couple rounds of Garadar quests in Nagrand)

68-71.5 Borean Tundra (started here to get the quest reward axe, takes 90min) - Got the achievement for quests completed

71.5-73.5 Howling Fjord - Achievement as well

73.5-76 Dragonblight (had a few 5 mans to help with XP so i was able to stretch this out) - All quests in the zone through the whole 'Retaking UC' deal, which by the way was FUCKING AWESOME. If there was ever a "Must Do" questline its that. Of course it requires you to basically do every single quest in Dragonblight.

Currently 76 and tooling away in Zul'Drak which, so far, is a pretty awesome zone.

Ninja-Edit: By finishing off DB and getting all the 5 man quests done from UK, Nexus, AzjolNerub and AhnKahet + group quests and such Im in all blue gear now. I have one 'drop' from a 5 man. Every single thing Im wearing is quest reward of some sort + the DPS Plate BP from Kalu'ak honored rep (which you should have no problem, im revered just from doing quests in HF, BT, DB). I must say its pretty nice. Im easily T6 equivalent geared and my stats are pretty rediculous, as is DPS. Im pissing off level 80's in my guild who I've done 5 mans with. Either they really suck, or DK's are just that powerful. Also the set doesnt look like a clownsuit, its actually pretty awesome looking.

On a side note: My wife is level 78.5 and maybe, at most, 1/2 way through Dragonblight. She has gotten more than 1/2 her XP from 5 mans (Healy Priest, damn good one). Im expecting she'll hit 80 around the time she finishes Dragonblight and have All of ZD, Grizzly, Sholazar, Storm Peaks, and Icecrown for cash-cow quests. Should be an insane amount of gold laying there for her to take.

[Draegan]

I think I'm going to start HF tonight after I finish up one or two quests in BT.

[Venkman]

Story question. After all of the talk about needing to finish the DK startup storyline, I was expecting some crazy CGI cutscene that clearly laid things out. I didn't get either.

I'm not spoilering this. If you're in the thread this long you've already past this point.

As I understand it, we attack Light's Hope with far superior numbers but somehow lose anyway. Big bad Paladin guy comes out with Ashbringer, converts the DK squad leader guy (Firion?), Lich King shows up, casts aside DK squad leader, prods Big bad Paladin guy to attack him, somehow his Apocolypse spell doesn't work, he's all shocked and teleports out.

So, the Lich King sent us there to get something that was buried underneath the Chapel. I guess that something somehow makes him weaker?

Or is there more to it than that?

[Mazakiel]

The Lich King sensed Tirion's presence, and wanted to draw him out so he could kill him, and basically sent in all the Acherus Death Knights as sacrificial lambs to draw him out.  He couldn't just stroll in and kill him inside the chapel because of what was in there.  Ashbringer being redeemed wasn't something he'd counted on, which is why he ended up running away wounded. 

[Koyasha]

There's -something- somewhat unspecified (Tirion calls it the souls of whatever number of people) in the area around Light's Hope that supposedly keeps it safe.  That's the glowy shit you see coming out of the ground as the battle for Light's Hope proceeds, and why Darion winds up having to fight with his sword.  Perhaps it's the spirit of Alexandros Mograine himself that's the focal point of all this light energy.  Either way, Light's Hope is a very powerful bastion of the Light.

Once Alexandros Mograine's spirit appears, the Lich King comes in and does something to Mograine.  This seems rather unspecified, he could be banishing him away, destroying him or worse.  It's difficult to say.  By this point, Alexandros had freed Darion of the Lich King's iron will, making it possible for him to attack the Lich King at all, not that it did him any good.  But when Darion tosses Ashbringer to Tirion Fordring, and the sword is redeemed by this act, and being wielded by one of the three greatest Paladins that ever lived, this, along with being at Light's Hope Chapel, allows Tirion to soundly thrash the Lich King and force him into retreat.

The entire attack, bringing Acherus, fighting the Scarlet Crusade, and the Battle for Light's Hope had but one true purpose - to bring forth Tirion Fordring so he could be defeated.  It basically backfired completely, accomplishing squat for the Lich King, freeing some of his forces, and worst of all, putting Ashbringer in Tirion Fordring's hands.  The only way this could possibly have gone worse for the Lich King would have been if Alexandros Mograine himself had been resurrected.

[Venkman]

Ah ok that makes much sense. I had forgotten the backstory of the Ashbringer. And that explains the shadowy form of a sword flying from Darion to Tirion.

In all I appreciate they tried this. Reminds me of the WC3 in-engine cutscenes. I just feel like there was a bit missing in the explanation part. Maybe it was supposed to prompt this type of discussion, but I'm forced to wonder how much the average player is going to understand just from watching the pretty.

[DraconianOne]

I got around to finishing the DK starting area last night and yeah, overall, it was pretty cool.  That being said, I didn't like the last mission - retaking the Ebon Hold.  Admittedly I had to solo Patchwerk (with the aid of the NPCs obviously) but it was a tediously dull fight.  Especially off the back of the epic scene at LHC before hand. I don't know how it would have done but it just felt like not much was made of the revolt against Arthas and I would have preferred perhaps a few more quests or subquests to really make it feel like we had to retake the Ebon Hold.  That's just me though.

Also how come I have to leave the Scourge too?  His will is my will and all that. I serve and suffer for his glory. My life/un-death is his to do with as he desires.  He is my master, not that fucking traitorous cur Morgraine?  There's a world full of life and I can't wait to see it burn. Why can't I go back to Icecrown with the Lich King and continue to be part of the Scourge.  Especially as there's a position open at the top now...

But I did like having to walk through Orgrimmar with all the jeering and rotten fruit though.  It finally explains why some of my characters could hear the Grunts having a go at someone but why I couldn't see anything. That was cool.

[WindupAtheist]

Also how come I have to leave the Scourge too?  His will is my will and all that. I serve and suffer for his glory. My life/un-death is his to do with as he desires.  He is my master, not that fucking traitorous cur Morgraine?  There's a world full of life and I can't wait to see it burn. Why can't I go back to Icecrown with the Lich King and continue to be part of the Scourge.  Especially as there's a position open at the top now...

This. WTB third faction plz.

[Draegan]

I hated leaving the scourge too!  Bah.  I'm not in a guild so PUGing with NPC zombies would be the same thing as PUGing normally anyway.

[DraconianOne]

Bit late for most people but I cocked up my talent choice while levelling in Archerus and decided to respec.  Turns out I could do it for free.  I'm guessing once I'm back in the normal world it won't be but it was nice to know that if I had wanted to try a different spec, I could have done.

Either that or I never realised that first talent respec was free across the board.

[ahoythematey]

Any word on whether cryptfever+ebonplaguebringer+wandering plague has an incoming nerf?

[tkinnun0]

to bring forth Tirion Fordring so he could be defeated.

The ridiculous thing is that, as I'm also following the guide from OP, I got to see Tirion soon afterwards in his true form. He is a pathetic L61 elite who can't even kill a few plaquebats without help. I would've killed him there and then if I could have attacked.

[apocrypha]

Either that or I never realised that first talent respec was free across the board.

Pretty certain that your first respec is always free, then 1g then 5g etc. Could just be that it's always just been 1g and that was so small that I considered it effectively free 

Any word on whether cryptfever+ebonplaguebringer+wandering plague has an incoming nerf?

I would suspect that DKs in general will get a nerf at some point in the future but it will be a while coming. This is their first hero class and Blizzard will be perfectly happy with them being overpowered for a while yet, to maintain the special feeling of the class. I would be very surprised if the next arena season isn't completely dominated by DKs.

[Zetor]

to bring forth Tirion Fordring so he could be defeated.

The ridiculous thing is that, as I'm also following the guide from OP, I got to see Tirion soon afterwards in his true form. He is a pathetic L61 elite who can't even kill a few plaquebats without help. I would've killed him there and then if I could have attacked.

There's a bit of a timeline discrepancy there (and a bit of retconning), which WOW doesn't handle well.

The Tirion you meet in EPL (who asks you to kill plaguebats etc) is just living a hermit's life and not particularly interested in fighting the scourge. After you do that long questline for him (omitting various spoilery things here), he eventually storms off to recreate the Silver Hand, which eventually turns into the Argent Crusade... of course this questline was created waaaay before WOTLK, or even BC.


-- Z.

[ahoythematey]

All I know is I roll into shit with that combo and roll out a second later, wondering if I'm the warcraft version of a demi-god.  I get five or six adds and shrug it off as an interesting scenario and nothing more.  Lovin' it.

[Merusk]

to bring forth Tirion Fordring so he could be defeated.

The ridiculous thing is that, as I'm also following the guide from OP, I got to see Tirion soon afterwards in his true form. He is a pathetic L61 elite who can't even kill a few plaquebats without help. I would've killed him there and then if I could have attacked.

There's a bit of a timeline discrepancy there (and a bit of retconning), which WOW doesn't handle well.

The Tirion you meet in EPL (who asks you to kill plaguebats etc) is just living a hermit's life and not particularly interested in fighting the scourge. After you do that long questline for him (omitting various spoilery things here), he eventually storms off to recreate the Silver Hand, which eventually turns into the Argent Crusade... of course this questline was created waaaay before WOTLK, or even BC.

Yeah, the Timeline stuff goes kind of wonky there.  The general flow of the game seems to be making the assumption that your level = time passed.  Since the quests in EPL are level 50ish, and you're a 58 DK, that version of Tirion is 'in the past' even though you can still interact with him.  Similar problems occour with your ability to see Stoutmantle and Old Blanchy in Grizzly Hills who mentions that the Defias have been defeated, but you can still go to Sentinel hill in Westfall and run the quets.

[Draegan]

All I know is I roll into shit with that combo and roll out a second later, wondering if I'm the warcraft version of a demi-god.  I get five or six adds and shrug it off as an interesting scenario and nothing more.  Lovin' it.

You can do the same as a Warlock, Prot Warrior, Prot Paladin as well.  My level 70 Prot Paladin AOE grinded quests/mobs all the way from 60 to 70.  With the new stuff, hunters with a gorilla pet can do the same as well.  A buddy of mine who never played WOW before is doing just that.

DK's arn't gods.  They have good dps, and can tank decently as well if you know what you're doing.  There will be a huge difference between a good and bad DK.  Also in PVP paladins and mages eat me for breakfast most of the time.

[DraconianOne]

You can do the same as a Warlock, Prot Warrior, Prot Paladin as well.

I concur. I respecced my 'lock into God mode and find I can take on multiples constantly with little to no downtime beside the odd having to go to single mobs so I can bandage.  I just need to sort out some targetting macros so that I don't keep tabbing to the mobs that are nearly dead.

[ahoythematey]

Ahh, okay.  It's been, literally, at least two years since I played my warlock(Down with Alliance!), and since then the only thing's I've played are my current main, an assasination rogue, and my horde alts, of which none of which are above 30 apart from my DK now.

[Vash]

DK's arn't gods.  They have good dps, and can tank decently as well if you know what you're doing.  There will be a huge difference between a good and bad DK.  Also in PVP paladins and mages eat me for breakfast most of the time.

Not gods but they're quite strong since they're basically ret pallys with a limitless resource pool thanks to the healing they can generate with blood aura, rune tap, and death strike.  I know it isn't worth the points if your purely leveling spec but Anti-Magic Zone will make paladins and every other caster despise you in pvp.  With that, bone shield, and mark of blood DK's can be nearly unkillable in any 1v1 situation.

If they get nerfed I suspect it will just be a slight reduction in how much they can heal themselves.

[Merusk]

I need to read some pointers on Unholy DK pvp, anyone got some links?  I keep getting rolled by Rogues 2-3 levels below me and that just shouldn't happen.  Then again, said rogues also had ~16k hps because they were in full S3 crap as I mucked about with as many hps in just greens/ quest crap. Hooray.

[Zetor]

Yeah. Whenever my 'overpowered' unholy DK got ganked in the tundra, I ended up losing because the attackers are always in at least full s2, and I'm in half BC and half-northrend greens gear. Before going to northrend, everyone who tried to gank my cuddly gnome death machine ended up dying either before or after me (shadow of death is an awesome "haha no" world pvp ability ).

On the other hand, my holy [not even disc!] priest in full greens hasn't died to horde yet... blessed resilience + lightwell (overpowered!) is too much for them to dps through and they end up running. I'm sure this will change at 80. :P


-- Z.