Dr. Who

[HaemishM]

This was my face the entire goddamn episode - 

Just... what the fuck?


Fuck me. The minute I saw Moffat's name as the writer I just sighed.

[NowhereMan]

  x 10

[Ironwood]

See ?  That's how I've felt for ages.

And you all thought I was mad.  MAD I TELL YOU.

[palmer_eldritch]

Nobody would dare call the real Zod mad.

That fake fucker you've been using recently, I'd slap him round the face and call him a mummy's boy. But now that the real Zod is back, no.

[palmer_eldritch]

This is a bit morbid but have any of you ever actually wondered if when you die maybe your brain kind of stays alive for a bit and you're still conscious and it's really horrible?

That has occurred to me and blimey it's a really horrible thought and something you don't want to imagine.

I reckon it occurred to Moffat too and he decided it would be a nice scary thing to throw into Doctor Who so he literally just threw it in to a story without any real attempt to write a narrative which made sense. Let's have the cybermen, they're cool, and let's recreate that scene from The Invasion, the fans will like it, and oh that horrible nightmare idea I had last week, let's throw that in there too.

And has Clara never noticed the Doctor can open the Tardis doors by clicking his fingers?

[Ironwood]

That was the first thing I said during that scene.  "Is she really threatening a bloke who can open a door by clicking with throwing away the keys to said door ?'

It was fucking retarded.  Also, not so cool for the kids who just had Granny cremated, eh ?

In fact, pretty fucking not ok at all.

[HaemishM]

That's Moffat's entire run. OOOOH THIS WOULD BE WEIRD/SCARY! THAT'S WHAT THE SHOW IS ABOUT!!!

So how do we resolve it?

Fuck it, I don't care. Have him snap his fingers or something. Who gives a shit, THIS IS REALLY SCARY!!!!!!

The conception part is good. The execution and resolution? Lazy wankery.

[Evildrider]

More meh.  This has been the worst season for me of the new Who.

[Cadaverine]

Just when I think they can't get any stupider, they prove me wrong.

[NowhereMan]

 

[Raguel]

I haven't watched this show since the Robin Hood episode. Sounds like I haven't missed anything. 

[HaemishM]

Yeah, that was pretty much my face during the entire fucking episode. I knew they'd do the whole "LOVE CONQUERS ALL!!!!" thing but I didn't think they'd possibly make it even more horribly cliched and terrible - yet somehow that's exactly what they did. Terrible way to send off Clara and especially terrible way to send off Danny Pink who as a character was just criminally underserved. About the only good thing was the bit of fan service they gave to the Brigadier but even that was a bit shit. The main meta message for the whole season just kept getting hammered over and over into my head like a rusty fucking nail. WE GET IT, MOFFAT. WE GET IT.

[Surlyboi]

The only thing I get is that Moffat's a fucking hack.

[NowhereMan]

Yeah, that was pretty much my face during the entire fucking episode. I knew they'd do the whole "LOVE CONQUERS ALL!!!!" thing but I didn't think they'd possibly make it even more horribly cliched and terrible - yet somehow that's exactly what they did. Terrible way to send off Clara and especially terrible way to send off Danny Pink who as a character was just criminally underserved. About the only good thing was the bit of fan service they gave to the Brigadier but even that was a bit shit. The main meta message for the whole season just kept getting hammered over and over into my head like a rusty fucking nail. WE GET IT, MOFFAT. WE GET IT.

I actually quite liked the Brigadier portrait fan service. They did not need to then turn him into a fucking super Cyberman that's still out there. The whole episode was just stuff like that though, it didn't feel anything like Dr. Who. It didn't even really feel like nu-Who (probably because it didn't have any of the good bits). The Master/Mistress character managed to be terrible despite some decent acting, Moffat summed the whole thing up best with her going 'bananas' just before killing that scientist woman. None of it made sense right down to the bad guy being defeated just because they didn't want to win or something?

Personally my favourite part of all of it is that since apparently love can conquer Cyberman programming (as evidenced by Danny and the Brigadier) clearly no other dead people really gave a shit about humanity. There's still no explanation for the Nethersphere stuff. I feel like IW now, there really isn't any need to keep saying this kind of stuff. I'm just disappointed that apparently the good writing is the variable while they seem to be pretty adept at keeping the bullshit fully packed in there. Moffat cannot write an action movie type episode to save his life, every season finale has been ultimately disappointing this one was exceptional in managing to have a build up as dumb as the finale part.

[Tebonas]

They really didn't think that one through. So either there are some good Cybermen still out there protecting Earth like a squad of Ironmen, or people like Mahatma Ghandi or Martin Luther King were shittier people than everybody thought. Because when the Brigadier can overcome his programming with the power of love alone, why couldn't those pretenders?

[NowhereMan]

Also why couldn't Cyber-Hitler use his love of racial purity to overcome the programming? Also also if Danny voluntarily gave up on love to squash the feelings of pain how come he was still motivated by love? Also, also, also...........................................

[Ironwood]

 I feel like IW now, there really isn't any need to keep saying this kind of stuff.

Yup.

 

[HaemishM]

Also why couldn't Cyber-Hitler use his love of racial purity to overcome the programming?

This made me choke on a swig of water. BRA... VO.

[slog]

Also why couldn't Cyber-Hitler use his love of racial purity to overcome the programming? Also also if Danny voluntarily gave up on love to squash the feelings of pain how come he was still motivated by love? Also, also, also...........................................

Because love conquers all or something.

There comes a point in every series where they just run out of ideas.  You kids were too young to remember MASH, but that was a classic example of a TV show that went 5 seasons too long.  DR Who appears to be heading in the same direction.  Too bad, because I thought this season started out really well.

[Tmon]

I mostly watch now purely out of inertia, if my DVR stopped recording it, I'd stop watching it. 

[NowhereMan]

At this stage it's clear the show really needs more new writing talent and someone who can sift Moffat's really good concepts from his 'interesting but impossible to execute or follow up' ones. There are still hints of really good ideas and some of the concepts shown early on in this series were good, primarily the Mistress as an obsessed stalker type and some of the effects of the Doctor's early life on him now. These however didn't really get any development or play and were ignored in favour of stuff like the Nethersphere, which was a fun idea (the afterlife as an undramatic bureaucratic shuffle) if not utterly original, but one that was never really going to work out satisfactorily. Seriously, I just don't see any way it could have paid off well. Even some of the sillier stuff early on was ok for me, the Robin Hood episode was silly but at least felt vaguely like Doctor Who. The finale not only made no sense, it didn't feel like any particular show I could name.

Also what was with the Doctor suddenly having a thing against policemen with that guy on the plane?

[palmer_eldritch]

As well as the plot basically making no sense the whole thing seemed sort of cruel and horrible. The show is meant to be frightening and the villain is meant to be evil but in this story just about every character suffered physically or emotionally in some way without any purpose to it all. Even the Brigadier being ressurected as a cyberman, which I guess was meant to be a nice moment, seemed horrible.

Also, the Mistress was not very interesting and despite snogging the Doctor when she pretended to be a robot (though pretending to be a robot was pretty funny) she didn't seem to have any sort of relationship with him. What was fun about the original Master and his Doctor (Roger Degaldo and Jon Pertwee) was the fact that they were clearly enjoying their battles on some level. In one episode I think one of the Master's henchmen ties the Doctor up, and when the Master comes in the room he apologises and immediately frees him - the Doctor says something like "That's alright old chap, now tell me about this dastardly plan of yours" or something. I may be remembering the details wrong but that's the type of relationship they had and you could see it in the Tennant/Sims characters too, but the new one is just an overacted psychopath (so back to Anthony Ainley then I guess, but he wasn't a great master imho!:)
 

Also what was with the Doctor suddenly having a thing against policemen with that guy on the plane?

If you mean Sanjeev Bhaskar's character, he was an army officer not a policeman, although the uniform does look a bit like a Chief Constable's uniform.

[NowhereMan]

Ah my mistake then, definitely looked like a police navy when I was watching it.

[Bunk]

I have to agree with Palmer in that the episode felt unnecessarily cruel in spots. If they wanted to give the Master a Joker-esque feel with the Bananas scene and telling the girl she was about to kill her, I get it. But then it feels like the only reason they even setup that UNIT character last year was so they could "shockingly" kill her off in this episode. The other kills the Master made worked well to show her state of lunacy, but that one just rubbed me the wrong way. I think it bugged me because most of the other kills the Master made were presented as being almost comical. The whole tone of the episode was really all over the place.

Thinking back on the whole Clara run, I'm kind of torn. I think the actress was fine, I think the character was reasonably strong, but for whatever reason I didn't connect with her at all. I think they shot themselves in the foot somewhat with introducing one version of her in Asylum of the Daleks, that was actually something a little different from the origin of the last five companions, and then saying "forget about her - here's a less interesting version of her from modern day London we're going to use as the companion instead!"

[HaemishM]

Well, the biggest problem with Clara was the same problem Moffat has infected the show with all along. The show isn't about the Doctor anymore, it's about the goddamn companions and how they interact with the Doctor. He's incidental to the story. The whole goddamn season was about Clara dealing with the new personality of the Doctor and trying to have a life outside of the Doctor. I much preferred it when the Companions just lived with the Doctor over multiple episodes rather than popping in and out of the Tardis when the Doctor felt like it.

Also, this Doctor felt more like Eric Roberts version - just a crazy over the top homicidal psycho. I liked Anthony Ainley's Master (and Sims - at least until the End of Time but that was also poor writing rather than anything Sims did). The "bananas" thing was funny but didn't really help the story. And her whole reason for all this centuries-spanning planning was to prove that the Doctor would use power the same way the Mistress would? Utter shit. He might have used the army if given a reason to (thinking about what he originally did or thought he did to Galifrey), but there wasn't any reason to use it, no greater evil that made him feel conflicted. So in the end, it was just stupid and crazy.  Or in other words, lazy writing - also known as Moffating.

[Segoris]

Just caught up, and now I wish I could forget it all I feel so fucking bad for Capaldi after watching him carry all of that dead weight from the writers/Moffat for the last 12 episodes. and what a shitty sendoff for Clara and an overall waste of Danny who was awesome in his own right and would have been great long term

[Ironwood]

Yes.

[Special J]

Welp. Finally watched the finale.


I'm a little easier on Moffat's run than some (not all) and I found some enjoyable stuff in this season, but this was terrible.

Ugh. Just ugh.

[HaemishM]

I got the feeling Moffat did that part just to make fun of Americans.


The episode was just fucking stupid from start to finish.

[MrHat]

The episode was just fucking stupid from start to finish.

It really was Final-Season-True-Blood bad.

[Special J]

I also enjoyed the fact that Danny Pink's love for a woman who has lied to him constantly is apparently stronger than, well, everyone.

Except for Cyber-Brigadier. Man that one really bugs me.

I hate this finale so much.

[satael]

(what the finale felt like; all kinds of nifty ideas put together into a hodgepodge of a bad plot)

[slog]

I watched the 2 "the silence" episodes today.  It really jumps out at me how much the series has changed.  Although I did like the Mummy episode this season.

[Khaldun]

Lots of familiar Moffat tropes, but that was fairly good. Apparently Jenna Coleman was ready to be written out but likes working with Capaldi so much that she signed up for another round. I'm sure it helped that she became an actual human being in the last season as opposed to a plot device.

[NowhereMan]

I probably don't need to repeat but I will. Some good acting and a couple of fun scenes but the overall plot idea was a bit tiresome. I guess at least there was a semi decent excuse for having Santa in it.