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Author Topic: Digital Camera & Photoshop tips  (Read 118214 times)
Bunk
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Reply #35 on: September 17, 2008, 12:48:12 PM

Since my buddy just got that new Canon 40D, we went out and took some shots in a local park last night.

This shot was taken on the 40D at 1600 ISO:



I wouldn't even consider shooting at 1600 ISO on my camera because of the noise, so I'm really impressed by the improvements in this new processor

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stray
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Reply #36 on: September 17, 2008, 12:51:04 PM

Was he doing it just to test, or is it actually darker than it seems there?

[edit] Also, is there a lower iso version? looks like a cool place for pics
Stewie
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Reply #37 on: September 17, 2008, 01:01:32 PM

Hi, I'm Bunks buddy with the 40d.
I can't emphasize enough how much I love this camera. The feel is great, it is so well sorted, everything is easy to access(seperate shutter, f-stop and iso buttons all at your fingertips) it is oh so fast, the colour is great the 6.5fps and large buffer (17 frames raw, 75 frames jpg) are awesome.
Did I mention that I love my new 40D!
Here is another image taken at 1600 ISO. I dont have the exact info on it at work but I believe I took it a 1/60 second f5.6 (handheld). Also this was saved in PS for the web so it has been compressed quite a bit.

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Reply #38 on: September 17, 2008, 01:06:03 PM

Stray,
For the most part I was just putting the camera through its paces and expecting to get somewhat unusable results at 1600iso.
Needless to say when I got home and opened em up in PS I was floored by how little noise there was at 1600iso.
The camera has an ISO range of 100-1600 normally and and goes up by 1/4 iso for teh most part. (ie: 100, 125, 150...)
I am going to head back there with my tripod once I get my new wireless remote and get some serious shots.

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Bunk
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Reply #39 on: September 17, 2008, 02:26:29 PM

Was he doing it just to test, or is it actually darker than it seems there?

[edit] Also, is there a lower iso version? looks like a cool place for pics

It was in the late afternoon and rather dark actually. If I were shooting indoor in the same lighting I would have been using a flash.


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Trippy
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Reply #40 on: September 17, 2008, 07:00:41 PM

OK then.. How about something that bridges the gap. A P&S that isn't complete crap?

[edit] Uh nevermind. Apparently, Canon does a good job in this category too. The G9 is supposed to be good, but the G10 is out next month. Just in time.

Either that, or a Panasonic LX-3. Anyone use one of these yet?
The Panasonic stuff was very noisy. Dunno if that's still true (check dpreview.com).
stray
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Reply #41 on: September 17, 2008, 09:47:38 PM

I haven't read anything about sounds yet, but it seems like the the way to go. Lots of good image samples. And instead of upping the megapixel count (like Canon), they've up everything else. And it trumps Canon on consumer features as well, like being more compact and doing 720p video. Seems perfect for my "amateur, fairly lazy and poor, yet deeply in need of good quality in low light" requirements ( awesome, for real).

[edit] omfg, i can't believe i interpreted "noisy" as referring to sounds. haha

anyways, apparently, it does pretty good with noise, even in 800 iso (here's one good review that touches on it.). even my non-pro eyes are impressed. it's a nifty little p&s. it might even be useful to you guys..just for having a good convenience camera. i'm gonna wait and see just exactly what else is released after this big photo convention passes, but it looks like a good buy without fully going dslr.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2008, 10:33:08 PM by Stray »
Stewie
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Reply #42 on: September 17, 2008, 10:40:49 PM

If you are looking for good independent camera reviews I'd suggest dpreview

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Reply #43 on: September 17, 2008, 10:48:15 PM

Yeah, I've been reading up there. They're all fans of the LX3 it seems. The Canon G10 hasn't been released yet though, but they tend to diss it just for falling short on specs (in comparison to the Panny). The f2.0 seems to be the main kicker (?).
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Reply #44 on: September 18, 2008, 02:00:17 AM

Funny that this thread should appear now; I'm just about to turn in a pile of points from my sony credit card for a camera.  At the moment I'm looking at the DSC-W170 as my best option; I had been planning on the brand-new DSC-T77, but the first review that popped up on it a couple days ago showed absolutely horrifying JPEG compression damage on its photos.  So I'm opting instead for the less-small and hopefully better-image-qualitied W series camera, unless I spy anything in the next couple of weeks to change my mind on the issue.

Given that it's a sony reward card, I'm rather restricted to sony product here.  I'm willing to accept rather less than perfection, given the sub-$300 price tag and the fact that I'm looking for a constant-carry camera that by necessity will be much smaller than a SLR, but I do at least want the pictures to not be ugly with pixel blotches on everything.
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Reply #45 on: September 18, 2008, 02:24:50 AM

OK then.. How about something that bridges the gap. A P&S that isn't complete crap?

[edit] Uh nevermind. Apparently, Canon does a good job in this category too. The G9 is supposed to be good, but the G10 is out next month. Just in time.

Either that, or a Panasonic LX-3. Anyone use one of these yet?



Sorry, bit late to this, but thought I'd chip in with a thumbs-up for the Canon G's. I've had a G6 for a few years now as a smaller alternative to my SLR's and I adore it. The G6/7/9 are perfect bridges between the compacts & SLR's and I've even used my G6 for some freelance work. I deeply want a G9 (awesome screen on the back!) and I'm intrigued to see what the G10 will be like. I'm a Nikon guy with my "proper" cameras, but the G6 is a RAW-shooting, fully manual camera with ISO50, flash sync at up to 1/2000s and an f2.0 lens and that's just awesome.

On the subject of quality and noise with small-sensor cameras one thing that can make a huge difference is good light. ISO800 with good good lighting looks way better than ISO100 with bad light on pretty much any camera!

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Reply #46 on: September 18, 2008, 05:14:22 AM

Yet another cam that has come to my attention is the Sigma DP1. The sensor is dslr sized.

Some interesting samples of what people have done with it.


Anyways, I don't mean to carry on about the subject, but it seems to me that this is sort of the holy grail for non-pros -- high quality point and shoots.

[edit] Bah! It looks like the wide angle of the LX3 is bogus for portraits. And the DP1 is supposedly sluggish, however good the iq.

This is bullshit. Just need a good camera for lowlight, that works fast for candids, doesn't make people look wide and distorted, and is sufficiently versatile for scenic shots.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 06:14:47 AM by Stray »
Salamok
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Reply #47 on: September 18, 2008, 08:37:45 AM

OK then.. How about something that bridges the gap. A P&S that isn't complete crap?

[edit] Uh nevermind. Apparently, Canon does a good job in this category too. The G9 is supposed to be good, but the G10 is out next month. Just in time.

Either that, or a Panasonic LX-3. Anyone use one of these yet?

I think if I was going to go non slr i'd have to say the casio exilim pro, then again it costs as much as an slr and is about as big as an slr so I suppose that sort of defeats the purpose...

Man, I'm so getting a DSLR asap. My camera (p&s 7 megapixel) is shit. Shit. How does anyone get a good photo out of these damn things? Kinda wish I didn't purchase a new guitar recently, but hey..

Just for reference, what's a good start? Under $500 if possible (not including mem card).

go get a nikon d70s, this is what I have had for a few years now and last time I looked it could be had cheap due to it being 2 models out of date.  6 megapixels of awesome >>>>> whatever megapixels of pure shit yer standard point and shoots are up to.  I suppose the d40 is now a camera with similar specs as well and I think you can grab that for under $500.

Of course the nikon d80 is like 2x the camera as the d70 and the upcoming d90 looks to be as large a leap forward from the d80 as it was to the d70.
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Reply #48 on: September 18, 2008, 08:52:17 AM

Those look cool, but as I was leading on to, I think I'm better off with something more compact. Something not too bulky, good for many uses, candid shots, low light situations like parties or the occasional gig, basic scenery pics... Just like any compact, but something with an image quality that isn't complete shit. DSLR would be nice, but it's bulky (along with pricey and sort of high maintenance).

The cams I've been listing seem to fall under this category at first, but I've discovered that they all have a wide lens. Excluding the G9, but that's about to be superceded by the G10 (which will have a wide lens as well, supposedly). People would be my main subject, so it's not a good choice (?). Seems like the G9 may be my best bet -- but apparently, it's going to start getting pulled after the G10 release...so now I have to hurry.  swamp poop
« Last Edit: September 18, 2008, 09:00:11 AM by Stray »
Bunk
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Reply #49 on: September 18, 2008, 01:20:32 PM

Took a quick look at the G10 review, looks like a nice setup. Uses the new digic 4 processor, 28 - 140mm equivilent lens (140 is long enough for portrait shots), RAW format, and a nice 3" screen on back. It's not a compact point and shoot, but it's not huge or heavy either.

No idea what it will cost though.

Looking at the G9, it does have longer range with the 35mm to 210mm equiv, but you lose out on the wideangle of the G10.

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Reply #50 on: September 18, 2008, 05:41:36 PM

Hey Stray, from reading the thread and getting an idea of what you are looking for Id strongly recommend the canon G series. Don't get to caught up on the whole mega pixel issue. i was pretty happy at 6MP and was able to squeeze out a 3'x2' poster from that. anything that is 8mp and up will serve your purpose just fine. 
Seeing as you are not looking for a pro or even a prosumer level camera. the big things you want are easy to use, quality images and colour across a wide range of lighting and other than that a quality build of the camera. The canon will alway have all this in spades.

As for the range of the zoom anything in the 24-100ish range would be great for portraits (most of the time you will probably be in the 50mm range for a good portrait) The one thing you do want to make sure, is that the zoom is optical and not digital (optical means the glass is doing the work, digital means the camera is artificially "zooming")
Another thing you want to take into consideration is the company that is making the camera. For Canon and Nikkon, cameras are their prime focus and I always found that theirs were always a notch above the rest.

If you do want a DSLR at any point the main thing is to look at the lenses that you want because once you go down one road there is no real turning back (unless you want to spend a shitload of money) whenever buying a SLR camera you are buying into a whole system of gear and lenses.

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Reply #51 on: September 18, 2008, 06:39:52 PM

Thanks guys. Yeah, I think I'll do just that (G9 or 10).

I still can't get over the flickr samples from that Sigma DP1 though. They look as good as some DSLRs.. Even better in cases.. Definitely better than all of these other P&S models. Something clear, with a lot of depth, but smooth and silky about the pics. If it wasn't for all of the supposed operational faults and the wide angle, I'd get it. The imagery is distinctive. Not the typical, dare I say, clinical look, that a lot of cameras limit you with.

And again, sorry for carrying on. You can't blame me for not keeping this thread alive, I guess!  Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly?
« Last Edit: September 19, 2008, 12:18:09 AM by Stray »
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Reply #52 on: September 19, 2008, 10:53:19 AM

You should do well with a G9/G10.  Its the next step up from the camera I used for a few years, the S60, which is a bit more compact shape (Still big and bulky, but I could jam it into a pocket).  Even though it was a point and shoot, I felt I was able to do some good shots with it:
http://picasaweb.google.com/Telekuu/Photos#

All of those except for the last 2 rows were taking with my S60.  Once you get the feel of any camera, you can do good things with it.

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Trippy
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Reply #53 on: September 19, 2008, 05:58:21 PM

The problem with the G9/G10 is that it's still large enough that you have to consciously make a decision to take it with you everytime you think you might want to take a picture somewhere, unless you carry a backpack around with you all the time. With a smaller camera that can slide into a pocket you can just carry it around with you all the time like an extra slightly bulky cell phone.
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Reply #54 on: September 19, 2008, 06:20:12 PM

I'm thinking I'm ready to go up to a DSLR, I'm just a bit paralyzed by all the different models, lenses, product lines. I've liked Canon so far--my first digital was a S40.

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Reply #55 on: September 19, 2008, 06:35:39 PM

What's your budget and what do you plan on using the camera for?

My preference is Canon (been a Canon guy since the AE-1 days) but you can't go wrong with either that or Nikon. The Canon Digital Rebel set the benchmark for entry-level DSLRs (actually it invented the entire category) so some recent form of that (e.g. XS or XSi) is what you should compare other cameras in that price range to.

If you have existing Flash memory cards that may influence which camera you'll want. E.g. cameras that take CF cards typically don't take SD as well and vice versa.
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Reply #56 on: September 19, 2008, 07:16:53 PM

The problem with the G9/G10 is that it's still large enough that you have to consciously make a decision to take it with you everytime you think you might want to take a picture somewhere, unless you carry a backpack around with you all the time. With a smaller camera that can slide into a pocket you can just carry it around with you all the time like an extra slightly bulky cell phone.


Ugh, yeah.. I know. The G9 quality is decent enough, and the lens is just right, but it's pretty bulky.

I keep talking about it, but I really am blown away by that Sigma DP1. The image quality is so damn good, I want to ignore the faults. The size of the camera is thin as well. I took a closer look at "people" pics, and the wide angle doesn't seem too bad at all (except for closeups, of course). In fact, 24mm may be cool anyways, if I'm gonna be shooting multiple people and such (Example). Plus, the whole idea of street photography (another thing I'd like to do) is to get candid shots. Having some bulky thing around is counter-productive to that.

Still not sure though.

I'm gonna wait maybe, and see if they release a DP2 or 3 this year (there are rumors). Something without a fixed lenses, or something that can do 50mm would be an easier sell to me.
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Reply #57 on: September 19, 2008, 07:45:13 PM

One of the things I actually want to do are some still-life set-ups, actually. I have a tripod, even. It's just that my current camera really doesn't take shots quite of the quality that I like and might want to do more with. But also, I'm interested in getting better action shots of children, dogs, life, and better shots at lower-light conditions. I'm thinking at the lower end of the price range: $700-800.
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Reply #58 on: September 19, 2008, 08:14:18 PM

One of the things I actually want to do are some still-life set-ups, actually. I have a tripod, even. It's just that my current camera really doesn't take shots quite of the quality that I like and might want to do more with. But also, I'm interested in getting better action shots of children, dogs, life, and better shots at lower-light conditions. I'm thinking at the lower end of the price range: $700-800.

Start here:

http://www.amazon.com/Canon-Digital-Camera-18-55mm-3-5-5-6/dp/B0012YA85A

However, if you are looking for something to capture "spur of the moment" shots around the house a fast operating P&S (something that can go from off to "ready to take a picture" as fast as possible) is actually more handy than a DSLR.

For still life and composed shots a DSLR will give you better quality/control than your typical P&S.
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Reply #59 on: September 19, 2008, 08:56:02 PM

One of the p&s cameras I keep hearing being talked about is the Fuji f-20/30/31d models. They were supposed to be the best of the best at low light and quick shooting, but have been superseded by inferior models. Now they're so coveted, they're selling over $400 on ebay (and they were mere dinky, ho-hum looking compacts).
« Last Edit: September 19, 2008, 08:57:37 PM by Stray »
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Reply #60 on: September 20, 2008, 12:29:18 PM

One of the things I actually want to do are some still-life set-ups, actually. I have a tripod, even. It's just that my current camera really doesn't take shots quite of the quality that I like and might want to do more with. But also, I'm interested in getting better action shots of children, dogs, life, and better shots at lower-light conditions. I'm thinking at the lower end of the price range: $700-800.


IF the release of the nikon D90 drives the price down for the D80 you MIGHT be able to pick one up for under $800.  It is certainly something worth keeping an eye on.  The biggest problem I had with the digital rebel was it's size, it's too big to be considered convenient to carry around (like a point and shoot) and yet it just felt too small when holding it.  My hand felt alot more at home wrapped around the Nikon d70 (which is sort of mid way in size between the pro level stuff and a rebel).
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Reply #61 on: September 21, 2008, 09:02:41 AM

Digital camera tip to Canon: STOP RELEASING A NEW MIDRANGE MODEL EVERY TWO MONTHS GODDAMMIT.


I had my 20D stolen a couple of months back.

Yay - new camera on insurance I thought.

All set up to buy the 40D, which by all accounts was the pure robot jesus returned to us in camera form, and was only launched at the end of last year, then BAM. 50D released with DIGIC 4, and apparently a new super-splenda auto-focus system hand built by the camera gnomes of Antioch.

I don't think I'll be able to wait long enough for the 50 to fall to reasonable prices, depends when I next go somewhere that requires me to take pictures I guess...

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Reply #62 on: September 21, 2008, 10:11:03 AM

Digital camera tip to Canon: STOP RELEASING A NEW MIDRANGE MODEL EVERY TWO MONTHS GODDAMMIT.

You just have to ignore them. Whenever you buy a new camera you know that there'll be a new model with more whizzbangkablooie than the last one any minute now. 99% of the whizzbangkablooie is totally unimportant when it comes to taking good pictures. That snazzy new DSLR you bought just after it was released 2 years ago when it was the ultranewubercamera still takes pictures just as well now that there's one with 2.6 gigadoohickies more on the shelves as it did back then when 1.2 gigadoohickeys was the holy grail.

Canon and Nikon are both very good at two things: making good cameras and SELLING good cameras.

My current fave cameras are the Nikon D70s (2+ years old, has an electronic shutter so I can sync it with flash at just about any shutter speed) and Canon G6 (3+ years old). These are now so cheap on eBay that I can almost consider them disposable yet they're both awesome cameras that do everything I need. Sure, I'd love a D3 and a 5DmkII but the existence of new models doesn't turn old ones into shit overnight ;)

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Reply #63 on: September 23, 2008, 02:20:12 AM

I'm gonna wait maybe, and see if they release a DP2 or 3 this year (there are rumors). Something without a fixed lenses, or something that can do 50mm would be an easier sell to me.

Sigma DP2 announced.

24.2mm f2.8 lens (equiv to a 41mm on 35mm film), 14 megapix FOVEON sensor (same groovy type as the DP1). Hopefully they'll have fixed the excruciatingly slow performance of the DP1 :)

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Reply #64 on: September 23, 2008, 02:34:58 AM

Ah, badass. I'll get it then. It's not exactly the ideal lens, but it's more versatile than before. Good enough. I don't think I'll be all that happy with these other compact cams when I know such a thing as the DP1/2 exists. That Foveon seems to shit out art, even with mundane imagery.
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Reply #65 on: September 26, 2008, 04:33:00 AM

The Sigma DP1's performance (speedwise) is hte only reason I didn't bite the bullet when I wasn't flat broke. When I have money again I'll get the DP2 or whatever is out. I'm still using a 4-5 year old Sony DSC (which I think stands for dicksuckingcrap).
Bunk
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Reply #66 on: September 26, 2008, 12:05:26 PM

I'll just recomend that if the first one in the line was known for speed issues, make sure to check the specs on the new version. A 14MP camera is great, until you find out the buffer is so slow that you can only take 5 pictures inside of a minute.

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Reply #67 on: September 26, 2008, 12:58:38 PM

They're actually not 14 MP. The Foveon sensor is strange. Technically, they're only 4MP or something, but colors are taken in via a different method. But the results speak for themselves.

The speed on the dp1 was apparently due to RAW processing apparently. Not JPG's. Also, a lot of people seemed to alleviate it by getting SanDisk Extreme III's.
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Reply #68 on: September 27, 2008, 03:34:44 PM

If you are getting a camera strictly because of it's color capabilites, you are going to be wanting to shoot in RAW. Just saying, check the reviews in detail before you jump in.

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Reply #69 on: September 27, 2008, 03:48:06 PM

Yeah, I've checked dozens of em out. I want it. I never had a problem with the speed too much in the first place. Schild did. I just didn't like the wide angle on the first model too much.
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