2008/2009 Football (Soccer) Thread

[Xuri]

The only player I can think of who plays for them is Pedersen so must be a few handy unknowns in your team. Good one for stuffing the Germans, Brazil are funny like that in Euro friendlies they don't tend to shine Ireland have had pretty good results against them aswell. Speaking of which Ireland won 2-1 yesterday with a little generosity from the ref  =) Our pal Robbie Keane grabbed a brace despite having a fairly lacklustre game against some tenacious Georgian defending.

A couple other high-profile players who play regularly that you may/may not know of:
-Ex-"Wannabe Liverpudlian" and left-back/winger John Arne Riise (now in Roma, but injured so didn't play against Germany)
-Aston Villa striker John Carew (also injured for this match)
-Fulham-defender Brede Hangeland (born in Houston, US!)

Also, Robbie Keane - he never got the chance he deserved at Liverpool :( Just when it looked like his goal-scoring form was on it's way, Rafa benched him for good.

[sigil]

I thought they said Bradley was loaned out to Heerneveen or some other unpronouncable (by my crude American tongue) Scandie club.

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/players/stats?id=41952&cc=5901

Yep, Heerenveen.

Soccernet? BWAHAHAHAHAH

http://www.borussia.de/en/first_team,118917,0.html

He's at Monchegladbach.

Heerenveen is Eredivisie,  Freeky deaky dutch. And he was there, but no more.

Also We really miss Cherundolo, and if we had Subotic with Bocanegra on the left, I'd be feeling a damn sight better about making noise in the cup.

[Hoax]

Random friendly thoughts:

-Fucking Robinho, holy shit, Italy got owned, that was 2 defenders + gigi = nothing versus him.  What is he 23?  Younger?  Fuck me, Brazil might take South Africa even though they are playing flaky in the qualifiers.

-Meanwhile, France = shit.  Hahaha makes me so happy.  Their keeper didn't have a good game but still Argentina was playing like crap and they still took em out.  If they can clog the middle and swarm on defense while playing with their usual flair and creativity on attack...  Too bad whenever I see Argentina players up close I want to punch them.

-I saw the goal versus Germany, very nice to bury that cross.

Thoughts on USA v Mexico:

I know that I don't follow MLS, nor the qualifiers prior to this point but what the heavenly fuck.  I sat there wondering if people were hurt or if the US federation told Bradley to make it seem like soccer was a white kid's game as much as possible.  No Adu, no Altidore until garbage time and no Edu, no Eddie Johnson?  Wtf was going on there?  What have I missed?

Ching played a shit second half, Dempsey is a sulky cunt and barely played 20 minutes of decent football.  Frankie has always been my man, Donovan plays well versus Mexico every time.  Beasley had some pep in his step but I just don't think he can do that versus a side with quality.

Sadly the US suffered from some same as its ever been problems.  The crosses were for the most part wasted, though I was happy they were using the space found on the left flank very well in the first half.  The backs still broadcast their passes hella much and only make the simplest pass into midfield, they are also nowhere to be found on the overlap.  Also I saw every US player collapse to the middle of the top of the box like 4 times in the game.  Seriously, must have been 3+ players going to the same spot.  Fuck.

That second half after the red card was so sad.  I wanted them to step on Mexico's throat and instead we turtle?  Fuck that.

[sigil]

Thoughts on USA v Mexico:

I know that I don't follow MLS, nor the qualifiers prior to this point but what the heavenly fuck.  I sat there wondering if people were hurt or if the US federation told Bradley to make it seem like soccer was a white kid's game as much as possible.  No Adu, no Altidore until garbage time and no Edu, no Eddie Johnson?  Wtf was going on there?  What have I missed?

Ching played a shit second half, Dempsey is a sulky cunt and barely played 20 minutes of decent football.  Frankie has always been my man, Donovan plays well versus Mexico every time.  Beasley had some pep in his step but I just don't think he can do that versus a side with quality.

Sadly the US suffered from some same as its ever been problems.  The crosses were for the most part wasted, though I was happy they were using the space found on the left flank very well in the first half.  The backs still broadcast their passes hella much and only make the simplest pass into midfield, they are also nowhere to be found on the overlap.  Also I saw every US player collapse to the middle of the top of the box like 4 times in the game.  Seriously, must have been 3+ players going to the same spot.  Fuck.

That second half after the red card was so sad.  I wanted them to step on Mexico's throat and instead we turtle?  Fuck that.

Johnson can't got a whiff from cardiff city, Edu is further on the pine than Beasley at Ibrox, Adu is stuck on the bench at monaco. Altidore is riding pine at xeres now, but Villareal will see to it that he gets quality minutes.

Ching is still working on match fitness and has always been a defensive aid at the international level rather than a goal scorer

Dempsey has started tracking back for the ball, he has improved greatly over the past year, but needed some better help from the wings.

Bradley was screaming at the guys to be more agressive. That's a team mind set that we have to get past. We're good enough to put a 4-0 score on Mexico. we're good enough to draw Italy. We were good enough to deserve to beat Germany in 02. We just need to believe that we can do it and eventually we will.


This might be the year we win at azteca. If it is, holy shit at the change that could bring.

This team, more than any other team in the world right now is  bigger than the sum of its parts. I think it's time we start to understand that. It's time for them to play  like it as well. Finish off teams decisively, with no chance to come back.

We've got a pretty good squad right now. I look forward to seeing what Jose Francisco Torres will do. He's a great player for Pachuca. Again, I miss the ones who got away.  I feel really good about the overall team development. MLS continues its gradual improvement.Americansare testing the european waters in bigger number, but the key will be to continue to grow the game here. That's happening in a way it never really has before, but it's still early in the cycle of growth.


This is a great time to be an American soccer fan.

[Mr_PeaCH]

Having said that, we know why Gio's on the back bench at Tottenham now. Wow, he couldn't finish for shit.

You know, I was sort of hoping that he'd do something good for Mexico but that USA would win the game... missed a sitter in the opening minutes and then later, literally was sitting down with a chance from 2 feet to score.  Dreadful.  (OTOH he is only 19...)

[HaemishM]

Sitting on the bench at Spurs really doesn't do much good for developing talent. Rafa Benitez has been very critical of the EPL's reserve system for developing talent and he may have a point.

[Amarr HM]

Cudicini on Scolari,
"It just didn't work out," the Italian told the Sunday Times. "I didn't say he was the wrong man the day he was appointed because I didn't know him then but now I know he was a mistake.
"He had been an international coach, not a club manager, for far too long. It was a different culture for him too. English football is totally different to what he knew and he found it difficult to adapt to the style and speed of the game. He was a very nice guy but not the right person. Jose Mourinho won two Premier League titles with Chelsea and Cudicini admits he was able to adjust to the demands of English football much quicker than Scolari."

I always believed him to be the wrong man for the job and yes I am gloating a little but hey sometimes you call it right.

[HaemishM]

Welp, there goes the fucking title. 7 points isn't insurmountable, but seriously at home against a side with super shitty away form and you can't manage to pot 2 goals to win?

At least second place will get them out of Champions League qualifying rounds next season.

[Amarr HM]

Paddy power started paying out on a domestic treble already.

[sigil]

On a side note, Madrid beat the everliving shit out of Betis. 6-1 at the half and just coasted.  The fifth goal, a brilliant diagonal ball to an even better scooped finish by Raul was a thing of absolute beauty.

[HaemishM]

Goddamnit, I am so fucking disgusted. What team was that on pitch today at the Riverside in gray? Did someone bring up a League Two side without my knowing it and give them Liverpool masks? That wasn't worth a Carling Cup first round match. Fucking awful play and awful team selection. Why is Benayoun on the fucking bench? He's been carrying the goddamn team the last month. Donkey-Legs Kuyt (thank you to whoever gave him that nickname) was useless, El Zhar isn't even a good bench choice and Babel is worse than useless. His new nickname is Fumblestiltskin, because he cannot fucking keep the ball if there is anyone within 5 feet of him. If he can't run around you, he has no fucking idea what to do with the ball. He can't cross from wide areas worth a shit, which doesn't matter because the minute he gets the ball on the wing, he'll go towards the middle without fail (and without fail lose the fucking ball). Skrtel is now on my shit list. Why is he continually picked ahead of Daniel Agger? Agger is just as good defensively AND he's 100 times better coming out of the back with the ball.

Why is Liverpool so absolutely devoid of depth at most positions? Arbeloa goes down and Carragher or Skrtel has to play out there (because Degen got hurt, but Rafa never picked him anyway). Keane gets shipped off right when he was  getting in form and suddenly the only choices behind Torres are Donkey Legs and the Frenchie. It's fucking obscene how badly the Rafa/Parry tandem have brought in players - they overpay for people they turn around and ship off, they leave decent options like Crouch on the bench until they HAVE to sell him, and their depth players wouldn't be great on relegation sides.

It isn't like Boro put on a display of football acumen. They were fucking awful, especially at the back. Yet they were never even tested. Congrats Alex on your 3rd straight title.

[Endie]

I subscribe to the opinions of the above poster.

[naum]

On a side note, Madrid beat the everliving shit out of Betis. 6-1 at the half and just coasted.  The fifth goal, a brilliant diagonal ball to an even better scooped finish by Raul was a thing of absolute beauty.

Barcelona crumbling, losing the past 2 matches…

[HaemishM]

Unfortunately, Valencia started fading before 2008 was out and has been out of the title race for a while. As it is, they'll be lucky to be challenging for a UEFA spot. I guess not paying your players does have an effect on the pitch after all!

[Hoax]

If Blackburn can stay up (Fucking do it Big Sam!) and at least one of Spurs/Newcastle/Boro can fall out of the EPL I'll be fucking thrilled with this season's results.

[HaemishM]

Based on how badly they played in beating Liverpool, I would definitely put even odds on Boro. I think Big Sam can save Rovers - a team with Roque Santa Cruz should not be a candidate for relegation.

[Amarr HM]

WBA, Portsmouth and Boro would be my bet, tightcall though.

[HaemishM]

I actually think it'll be WBA and Boro for sure, with either Stoke or Newcastle being the third team. Toon fans deserve the kick in the bollocks of taking the drop after the way they've shit on managers and the owner for the last few years.

[Endie]

I actually think it'll be WBA and Boro for sure, with either Stoke or Newcastle being the third team. Toon fans deserve the kick in the bollocks of taking the drop after the way they've shit on managers and the owner for the last few years.

Totally.  I'm  a Liverpool fan, but like a lot of Scots I had a soft spot for Newcastle for a long time, and popped down from Edinburgh for the odd match at St James, courtesy of a toon fan friend with contacts for tickets.

But their massive sense of entitlement, combined with an absolute rage at anyone who doesn't preface any comment on them with the words "best fans in the country/world/game", has me hoping they go down, Leeds-style.

[sigil]

A little MLS news for you. . .

Looks like the  two new expansion cities have been selected, from all accounts it's going to be Portland and Vancouver.

So all you Sounders fans now have your ready made rivals. this also to me sounds like a deathknell for USL 1.

Also, if DC United can't find a stadium home, expect them to move to Saint Louis. Normally I'd be pissy with this sort of thing, but it's been going on a decade they've had to work with the local government, and it wasn't like they were asking for a total handout, either.

Season starts next  Thursday :)

[WayAbvPar]

I am looking forward to having a local team to follow. Should be fun!

[Hoax]

I actually think it'll be WBA and Boro for sure, with either Stoke or Newcastle being the third team. Toon fans deserve the kick in the bollocks of taking the drop after the way they've shit on managers and the owner for the last few years.

Totally.  I'm  a Liverpool fan, but like a lot of Scots I had a soft spot for Newcastle for a long time, and popped down from Edinburgh for the odd match at St James, courtesy of a toon fan friend with contacts for tickets.

But their massive sense of entitlement, combined with an absolute rage at anyone who doesn't preface any comment on them with the words "best fans in the country/world/game", has me hoping they go down, Leeds-style.

Something needs to clean out that fucking pathetic organization.  I've hated Newcastle with a passion for the last 5 years it feels like.  Terrible waste of the talent they have, awful moves, sacking all sorts of coaches, just a cesspool that seems to fuck  up anyone who gets involved and all the time people acting like they are owed a top 6 finish just for being Newcastle.  Pricks

[HaemishM]

Also, if DC United can't find a stadium home, expect them to move to Saint Louis. Normally I'd be pissy with this sort of thing, but it's been going on a decade they've had to work with the local government, and it wasn't like they were asking for a total handout, either.

The Nats had the same problem in baseball. The city is just fuckstupid for building any sort of stadium.

[WayAbvPar]

Unless it is for the Redskins.

[HaemishM]

Synder had money to piss away for the Skins (and broken down overpriced free agents). The Nats had to deal with Peter Angelos being a cockgobbler about the Baltimore market. DC United is soccer - even in a market where the team is loved, it's still soccer.

[sigil]

yes. and there you have it. DCU does well, but it's not a huge operation like the other two.

Although, Season tickets are up across the board and things continue to grow.  In this economy, that's saying something.

[WayAbvPar]

Buh Bye, Inter. Woot.

[Hoax]

I'm pretty gay for Ronaldo, but that Utd team is scary, systemically they are just so fucking solid.  Inter had pretty much everything shut down, except Giggs who went bananas for whatever reason but it still never seemed like there was any doubt on Utd's side who was going to win.  I just fucking wish that Anderson and/or Nani would put me out of the misery of seeing Scholes play football.  Fuck I hate that guy.  Four English teams advance?  Weak.  Please don't make me root for Bayern...

[WayAbvPar]

Giggs is apparently a direct descendant of Ponce De Leon...he is playing like he is 25, not 35. He can't handle the grind of multiple 90 minute games every week, but he is has been spectacular in a variety of roles recently. I wonder if his prominence is related to Ronaldo's relatively quiet season. The team seems to be running through Giggs these days instead of Ronaldo. I think they will sell him off over the summer. Heard a rumor that they would try to buy Frank Ribery if they dumped Ronaldo. That guy is fun as hell to watch, but pretty much the polar opposite of Ronaldo in terms of looks. 

[Trippy]

I moved the entire Liverpool thread to the Den cause some of you guys are being fucktards.

[sigil]

LOL Awesome 

Normally I have to go to bigsoccer to get my dose of people a little too personally invested in their soccer.

[lamaros]

The FA Cup Semis are confirmed, and:

[Amarr HM]

Same old again..

[Amarr HM]

In the words of Benitez himself, “I do think they have weaknesses,” Benitez continued. “We knew they are really good at playing between the lines with penetrating passes, so we needed to stop those passes and put their midfielders under pressure every time they received the ball. After that, we had to play simple passes and go forward quickly because they are an offensive team and always high up the pitch."

This was actually taken from the Guardian yesterday related article here

No tactics eh?

[lamaros]

I believe I said a number of times that the tactic was to pressure them in the final third and then counter. Which is a different thing to trying to flood the midfield. So I'm not sure exactly what you're trying to say here?

Liverpool wasn't crowding out the Utd Midfield. The opposite is actually true. Utd played Tevez and Rooney and often had no one leading the line up front. This is the reason way Park was often the guy furthers forward. Both Rooney and Tevez were dropping back into the midfield and combined with Ronaldo, Anderson, Park and Carrick Utd was all over this area. Liverpool was actually defending deeper and trying to catch utd on the counter, with Torres being Torres and Gerrard surging forward. Liverpool did not boss the midfield at any time during the game.

Which is pretty much exactly what Benetiz said he did. Tried to take advantage of Utd playing high up the pitch to counter quickly and get in behind them. I expect if Alonso played instead of Lucas that Liverpool would have been able to apply that pressure further up the pitch, but as it turned out Liverpool played deeper and moved the ball a lot down the wings.

Maybe we have different ideas of what "crowd out the midfield" means. I take that to mean dominate possession in the midfield through numbers and break up the other teams play by not letting them play through that area. This is also the general terminology I am familiar with from soccer commentators, with 'pressure' or a 'pressing game' being the word used to harassing the other side. In the Utd Liverpool game Liverpool tried to play a pressing game in their final defensive third, with players like Macherano who excel at it, then move the ball quickly up to to the other end and unsettle the defenders (which worked well as it turned out, though I'm not entirely sure if it's a real weakness of Utd or just the fact O'Shae was playing and Vidic had a bad day). Utd on the other had tried to play their more normal game with an emphasis on pressuring the opponent all over. This is what Rooney and Tevez do very well.