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cevik
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Reply #35 on: July 05, 2008, 08:23:43 AM

Here is a decent post I read on the AoC forums about what was promised by Funcom for the release of this game.

Quote
So far, this game has been one giant Bait & Switch. We were promised many features, and given few. This is a post dedicated to outlining those features, in the hopes that they get fixed. I don't hate Age of Conan, but I do believe that we've been sold on something that we aren't getting, and that's something that I'm hoping will change in the future.

-We were given voice acting and a copious supply of soloable quests to play with during the public beta and first 20 levels of the game, yet the "real" Age of Conan lacks these features past newbie island.

-We were told that questing would be more time effective for leveling than grinding, even when grinding at 100% efficiency. What we get instead is a game that mandates all players to grinding if they ever hope to reach 80.

-We were told that this game would provide thousands of different cosmetic armor choices for the various classes. Instead, most classes get one armor choice at 80.

-We were told that this game would have "massive" endgame PVP, Battlekeeps worth fighting over, sieges, mines, mini-keep towers, PVP zones, and more. We were told that owning a Battlekeep would require a massive investment, but that smaller guilds would serve a purpose too. Instead, we get Border Kingdoms that are carbon copies of the gathering zones, but devoid of any resources or NPCs. We get Battlekeeps that are impossible to victoriously conquer, siege attacks that have no attackers, and a game that grinds to a hault when more than two raids engage one another. We get a game where BK owners have to sit on their asses for hours every week, "defending" their BKs against attackers that never show up. We get a game where you gain nothing from having a battlekeep, where there is no PVP content worth fighting over, and where only the biggest guilds are even capable of participating in this so called "end game".

*Hey, here's an idea! Let's replace all of the battlekeeps with giant E-Peen statues! I don't think the players should notice much of a difference, because currently, that's all the BKs are good for.

-We were lead into believing that this game was going to have a revolutionary combat system, yet it doesn't. It has a casting system that's identical to any other MMORPG that's been released, and a half baked melee system that hinders melee more than it helps.

-We were told that this game would have revolution mounted combat, where velocity effected damage, mounted combat is effectively non-existant.

-We were told about a revolutionary spellcasting system, where spellcasters could weave their spells together to create new, powerful spells. Instead, we got a limited-use nuker stance.

-We were told there would be no tabbing, no targeting, and no need for a 1 through 0 skillbar. Instead, we got the exact same targeting system & user interface as every other game.


Basically, we've been given a bullshit watered down MMORPG that provides nothing new to the genre, aside from access to FFA PVP servers. We've been sold HYPE, and while hype might sell boxes, it unfortunately does not sell subscriptions. Funcom needs to get their game in gear, fix PVP, and deliver and experience worth subscribing to. As it stands, this game is circling the drains, and if nothing is done, it will be on life-support before the end of the year.

What's funny to me, I heard someone say Funcom was developing a new mmog and I laughed.  Then I heard it was a Conan mmog and I laughed more.   The only thing I can think that would shove a mmog off my radar more than a Funcom Conan mmog is a NetDevil Lego mmog, and it's a pretty close race.

So having never read anything about the game, and not ever expecting to play it, I was blissfully unaware.  When I picked it up two days after release I expected, well, a mmog.  I've played every one since UO so it's not like I don't know what a mmog looks like.  I've played almost all of them on release.

When I logged in, I found a mmog.  

I'd say where they went wrong is apparently while I was ignoring them because it was a mmog about Conan created by Funcom, pretty much the most worthless thing I could imagine, they were promising you guys a bunch of stuff that could never happen.  I came in expecting a mmog and found pretty much a slightly above average mmog, you guys came in expecting that stuff up there and exploded in a fit of nerdrage when it didn't happen.  I now understand where our different perspectives were created.

I think this board is the most horrible place to start a "where it went wrong" thread, and I pray to fucking god no one ever puts a focus group of you guys together to discuss mmogs.  You all hate them, there is a large market for mmogs (see:  Blizzard) but you guys are the anti-mmog people.  You rush into every mmog, pick it apart for not being the Baby Jesus mmog, and then leave in the first month.  Look at the gaming graveyard.  You are not mmog experts, you, for the most part hate mmogs.  You just need to sit back and realize you don't like playing mmogs and move on. ;)

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Count Nerfedalot
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Reply #36 on: July 05, 2008, 09:27:35 AM


I think this board is the most horrible place to start a "where it went wrong" thread, and I pray to fucking god no one ever puts a focus group of you guys together to discuss mmogs.  You all hate them, there is a large market for mmogs (see:  Blizzard) but you guys are the anti-mmog people.  You rush into every mmog, pick it apart for not being the Baby Jesus mmog, and then leave in the first month.  Look at the gaming graveyard.  You are not mmog experts, you, for the most part hate mmogs.  You just need to sit back and realize you don't like playing mmogs and move on. ;)

Nah, I think it's just jaded mmogweariness.  It's not that folks here hate or even dislike mmogs, it's that we've all busted our mmog cherry, and are now only interested in quality experiences.  As in fun, reasonably balanced, reasonably complete and, most importantly, at least 95% working.  And there's only a couple of them that have ever existed, only one that was there at launch, and we're pretty much tired of all of them or are otherwise not interested for some other reason (pvp flavor not to our liking or whatever).

And while our criticisms may be far more picky and vocieferous than that of the mass market, that doesn't make them inaccurate or otherwise invalid.  If you compare with real-world/mass-market results, I think any consensus (or at least supermajority) opinion from this group would track very well.  And do a better job of explaining WHY something did or didn't work rather than just that it didn't work.

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cevik
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Reply #37 on: July 05, 2008, 09:32:31 AM

And do a better job of explaining WHY something did or didn't work rather than just that it didn't work.


And because you actually believe this, I rest my case. ;)

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Reply #38 on: July 05, 2008, 12:28:20 PM

I think this board is the most horrible place to start a "where it went wrong" thread, and I pray to fucking god no one ever puts a focus group of you guys together to discuss mmogs.  You all hate them, there is a large market for mmogs (see:  Blizzard) but you guys are the anti-mmog people.  You rush into every mmog, pick it apart for not being the Baby Jesus mmog, and then leave in the first month.  Look at the gaming graveyard.  You are not mmog experts, you, for the most part hate mmogs.  You just need to sit back and realize you don't like playing mmogs and move on. ;)
No there are people here that are experts. Go take a look at the WoW board and read some of the end-game analyses. Same for EVE and CoH. Many of us have played these games well into "end game" phases.

It is true that for some of the games people will leave soon after trying it. It's a consequence of having played so many it doesn't take long to figure out if the game has long-term potential or not, not that we hate MMORPGs.
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Reply #39 on: July 05, 2008, 12:33:23 PM

What's funny to me, I heard someone say Funcom was developing a new mmog and I laughed.  Then I heard it was a Conan mmog and I laughed more.   The only thing I can think that would shove a mmog off my radar more than a Funcom Conan mmog is a NetDevil Lego mmog, and it's a pretty close race.

So having never read anything about the game, and not ever expecting to play it, I was blissfully unaware.  When I picked it up two days after release I expected, well, a mmog.  I've played every one since UO so it's not like I don't know what a mmog looks like.  I've played almost all of them on release.

When I logged in, I found a mmog. 

I'd say where they went wrong is apparently while I was ignoring them because it was a mmog about Conan created by Funcom, pretty much the most worthless thing I could imagine, they were promising you guys a bunch of stuff that could never happen.  I came in expecting a mmog and found pretty much a slightly above average mmog, you guys came in expecting that stuff up there and exploded in a fit of nerdrage when it didn't happen.  I now understand where our different perspectives were created.

I think this board is the most horrible place to start a "where it went wrong" thread, and I pray to fucking god no one ever puts a focus group of you guys together to discuss mmogs.  You all hate them, there is a large market for mmogs (see:  Blizzard) but you guys are the anti-mmog people.  You rush into every mmog, pick it apart for not being the Baby Jesus mmog, and then leave in the first month.  Look at the gaming graveyard.  You are not mmog experts, you, for the most part hate mmogs.  You just need to sit back and realize you don't like playing mmogs and move on. ;)
Your posts are proof positive that long term drug and alcohol abuse does permanent damage to brain tissue which causes warped, nonsensical thoughts to take hold.  Your opinions are entirely worthless but you are so diseased that you actually think of yourself as some sort of infallible messiah.  Tell me, do you think God talks to you cevik, does he whisper truths in your ear as you slumber, truths you feel compelled to spew out on the internet like so much textual diarrhea?

No one here "exploded in a fit of nerdrage" you overdramatic hack.  You could cherry pick sentences with profanity where funcom screwed up but the overall assessment was positive.  Very few expected to even like AoC upon logging in, it was quite a surprise that many of us enjoyed it.  Even schild liked it, I honestly never thought I'd see him post something positive about an MMO ever again.  Funcom offered hope for a slight change in how an MMO would play out and didn't succeed, heaven forbid we discuss that as a fact and proceed to question why.  The main reason people are expressing their disappointment is because AoC actually came close, the first part of the game is great but as you play more all of the problems start to overwhelm you until you want to leave.

The people on this site would make an amazing focus group, the games in the MMO forum versus the graveyard are a perfect mirror to where those games are in reality.  Worthwhile MMOs that are actually healthy and have subscriptions numbers that go up like WoW and EvE are on top, all the failed rejects are right where they belong.  AoC is being given a chance, only time will tell where it lands.  You can go to the beginning of any of the graveyard MMO games and find posts describing exactly what was wrong with the games and why they eventually failed, the posts are prophetic.  This isn't rocket science, I don't think we're any smarter than other people, figuring out what's wrong with an MMO is easy, you play it and find what isn't fun.  Fun is hard to get right though, even if you rip out all the suck you still have to create fun and very few companies can manage that.  It being so hard is why I rarely hold anything against these companies and am willing to try the next MMO they put out, hoping for the best.

And putting pathetic little ;) emoticons at the end of your bitter AoC fanboi trollings doesn't make you sound any more reasonable, we all know what you're like.  Or at least those of us who have been around long enough to have experienced your other sudden, manic amount of posts after another six month disappearance.  I anxiously look forward to the next time you drag yourself out of a gutter and deign to bless us with your presence again, I find your descent into madness fascinating.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2008, 12:41:02 PM by Miasma »
Sparky
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Reply #40 on: July 05, 2008, 02:19:27 PM

Even a shit MMO is usually good for a fortnight of fun, which is more than I can say about many single player games.  We gripe because we care  Heartbreak
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Reply #41 on: July 05, 2008, 03:50:40 PM

Even a shit MMO is usually good for a fortnight of fun, which is more than I can say about many single player games.  We gripe because we care  Heartbreak

It's true.  It's why I don't complain too much when I buy a game, play it for a month or so and move on. 

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stu
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Reply #42 on: July 05, 2008, 06:55:22 PM

This thread was a disaster at launch, and yet, it still lives! In that spirit, go Conan! If AoC can start ramping up the good word of mouth as it progresses through the coming months, I'll give it a shot.

Instead of anticipating MMO launches, I've moved on to looking forward to what these games become six months after release.

What went wrong?

4. Itemization. Itemization was so stupid in the first 3 weeks that I think the game retained more player than expected. Everything was SO brown that, realism or not, you felt nauseous about it. Now things are slightly better, but a level 30-ish player is stuck in brown mode and he has no way to think things will get any better. Nausea, disappointment, quit. Also, stats and bonus are so moronic they don't make items cool at all, not even in the numbers dept. People like big numbers, +50 Defense Bonus, so there's nothing more depressing than getting a +0.1% defense bonus jacket at level 1 and a +0.2% defense bonus shirt at level 30. Even numbers are brown in AoC, and the UI (see below) doesn't help.

5. User Interface. Totally uninspired. Icons are great honestly, but the inventory/character sheet are WAY uglier than 7 years old Anarchy Online ones just to mention something Funcom. Fonts are ugly, "rolling 3d item thumbs" are SWG ugly, inventory pages is just IDIOT and numbers are once again too sparse, too small and too brown/white. This game needed a little more coloring for item descriptions, better fonts, better icons for items (skills/spells/combo ones are fine). When you get a blue/purple item you don't want a smallish dull list of 0.6 bonus, you want some noticeable figures that stands out when mousing over it.

6. Lacking features. For a PvP oriented game, the total lack of incentives made is depressing both for hardcore killers and casual battlegrounders. No reasons to play leads to empty battlegrounds, or empty wins in the open areas.

These three points are a big deal for me- especially the bit about itemization. +0.1%??? Bah.

/crossesfingers

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sinij
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Reply #43 on: July 05, 2008, 10:07:40 PM

I think creating NA mmorpg with as much grind as AoC is outright stupid. This isn't Korea, people don't want to grind.

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Reply #44 on: July 05, 2008, 10:19:27 PM

When I logged in, I found a mmog. 

This.

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Reply #45 on: July 06, 2008, 01:38:23 AM

I think creating NA mmorpg with as much grind as AoC is outright stupid. This isn't Korea, people don't want to grind.

Trolling much? Missing green? Conan is the western MMORPG with the fastest "0 to max" leveling curve ever and with at least 7/8 of the game completely questable without a group and you complain about grinding?

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Reply #46 on: July 06, 2008, 05:18:27 AM

He's not trolling, he's saying "More questy, less grindy" I believe.   As in, fill out the content, bitches, not that it's a never ending treadmill of gloom.

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Reply #47 on: July 06, 2008, 05:25:02 AM

I know what went wrong.  Funcom is a bunch of business amateurs who really know how to write games really well.  Unfortunately, they don't know how to run one.  The last MMO needed a 3rd party to dig them out of their hack hole.  Some big company needs to buy them.  Not SOE though.  They're too hands on, I think.  They should just sit there and write and not try to do anything else, not even chew gum.

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Reply #48 on: July 06, 2008, 06:33:45 AM

He's not trolling, he's saying "More questy, less grindy" I believe.   As in, fill out the content, bitches, not that it's a never ending treadmill of gloom.

There's a difference between "more questy, less grindy" and "I think creating NA mmorpg with as much grind as AoC is outright stupid. This isn't Korea, people don't want to grind."

Plus, don't know what your perception tells you people, but this is already the case. Conan is already more questy and less grindy, and "as much grind as AoC" sounds like sarcasm given the laughable amount of grind required to levelup.

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Reply #49 on: July 06, 2008, 07:40:53 AM

Grind in AoC is way too much, this isn't 97 and shit like that doesn't fly. You know it is broken when you have to hit EVERY zone in your level range, finish 90% of the quests AND still just barely make it to the higher zone. On top of that there are still substantial gaps on the way to 80 where you still can only grind.

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Reply #50 on: July 06, 2008, 07:56:57 AM

I know this is supposed to change soon, but up to 47 I have never needed to grind.  I still have quests to do, and lots of dungeons I've never touched.  Doing okay so far.

Hahahaha!  I'm really good at this!
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Reply #51 on: July 06, 2008, 08:11:17 AM

In this day and age an MMO gamer should always have a full quest log at ANY level.  Solo or grouped.  If there is only one story line to follow or one quest line to pursue, the game still needs work. 

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lamaros
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Reply #52 on: July 06, 2008, 08:20:52 AM

In this day and age an MMO gamer should always have a full quest log at ANY level.  Solo or grouped.  If there is only one story line to follow or one quest line to pursue, the game still needs work.

Better yet, they should have many more quests than they can ever do (WoW is like this), so they have to pick and choose. Much better for replayability.

On top of this, though, I would argue that the game should also be fun even when you choose not to do quests at all. You should be able to level just as fast by running around exploring dungeons and areas in your level range and just killing things too. I think quests should be optional as well as plentiful; if you feel compelled to go around ticking things off a list rather than doing so because the list sounds like fun then the game has some problems. If you don't so any quests at all and the game feel empty and strange then it has problems. (I hate questing).
cevik
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Reply #53 on: July 06, 2008, 08:56:45 AM

What's funny to me, I heard someone say Funcom was developing a new mmog and I laughed.  Then I heard it was a Conan mmog and I laughed more.   The only thing I can think that would shove a mmog off my radar more than a Funcom Conan mmog is a NetDevil Lego mmog, and it's a pretty close race.

So having never read anything about the game, and not ever expecting to play it, I was blissfully unaware.  When I picked it up two days after release I expected, well, a mmog.  I've played every one since UO so it's not like I don't know what a mmog looks like.  I've played almost all of them on release.

When I logged in, I found a mmog. 

I'd say where they went wrong is apparently while I was ignoring them because it was a mmog about Conan created by Funcom, pretty much the most worthless thing I could imagine, they were promising you guys a bunch of stuff that could never happen.  I came in expecting a mmog and found pretty much a slightly above average mmog, you guys came in expecting that stuff up there and exploded in a fit of nerdrage when it didn't happen.  I now understand where our different perspectives were created.

I think this board is the most horrible place to start a "where it went wrong" thread, and I pray to fucking god no one ever puts a focus group of you guys together to discuss mmogs.  You all hate them, there is a large market for mmogs (see:  Blizzard) but you guys are the anti-mmog people.  You rush into every mmog, pick it apart for not being the Baby Jesus mmog, and then leave in the first month.  Look at the gaming graveyard.  You are not mmog experts, you, for the most part hate mmogs.  You just need to sit back and realize you don't like playing mmogs and move on. ;)
Your posts are proof positive that long term drug and alcohol abuse does permanent damage to brain tissue which causes warped, nonsensical thoughts to take hold.  Your opinions are entirely worthless but you are so diseased that you actually think of yourself as some sort of infallible messiah.  Tell me, do you think God talks to you cevik, does he whisper truths in your ear as you slumber, truths you feel compelled to spew out on the internet like so much textual diarrhea?

No one here "exploded in a fit of nerdrage" you overdramatic hack.  You could cherry pick sentences with profanity where funcom screwed up but the overall assessment was positive.  Very few expected to even like AoC upon logging in, it was quite a surprise that many of us enjoyed it.  Even schild liked it, I honestly never thought I'd see him post something positive about an MMO ever again.  Funcom offered hope for a slight change in how an MMO would play out and didn't succeed, heaven forbid we discuss that as a fact and proceed to question why.  The main reason people are expressing their disappointment is because AoC actually came close, the first part of the game is great but as you play more all of the problems start to overwhelm you until you want to leave.

The people on this site would make an amazing focus group, the games in the MMO forum versus the graveyard are a perfect mirror to where those games are in reality.  Worthwhile MMOs that are actually healthy and have subscriptions numbers that go up like WoW and EvE are on top, all the failed rejects are right where they belong.  AoC is being given a chance, only time will tell where it lands.  You can go to the beginning of any of the graveyard MMO games and find posts describing exactly what was wrong with the games and why they eventually failed, the posts are prophetic.  This isn't rocket science, I don't think we're any smarter than other people, figuring out what's wrong with an MMO is easy, you play it and find what isn't fun.  Fun is hard to get right though, even if you rip out all the suck you still have to create fun and very few companies can manage that.  It being so hard is why I rarely hold anything against these companies and am willing to try the next MMO they put out, hoping for the best.

And putting pathetic little ;) emoticons at the end of your bitter AoC fanboi trollings doesn't make you sound any more reasonable, we all know what you're like.  Or at least those of us who have been around long enough to have experienced your other sudden, manic amount of posts after another six month disappearance.  I anxiously look forward to the next time you drag yourself out of a gutter and deign to bless us with your presence again, I find your descent into madness fascinating.

tl;dr

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Reply #54 on: July 06, 2008, 09:25:53 AM


If you are trying to say it should have more and more quests, then I agree. The more the better, that's a given.

If you say shit like "I think creating NA mmorpg with as much grind as AoC is outright stupid. This isn't Korea, people don't want to grind." well that's a good and substantial example of the not flying kind. Grind isn't a factor in AoC. The leveling curve is too fast and there's plenty of quest to avoid that unless you play it as a single player uo to 80.

That said, as usual, YMMV as I left WoW 2 months after release when I was about level 40 because it was definitely too grindy for my tastes.

Quote
In this day and age an MMO gamer should always have a full quest log at ANY level.

Bingo. It's EXACTLY like that in Conan, it's always full, at EVERY level. Thing is, some of those quests are group ones, and apparently when the time to bash Conan comes, everyone just forget about them. Group quests don't count as quests anymore apparently, they count as grind. Weeeee.....

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Reply #55 on: July 06, 2008, 09:44:15 AM

Quote
Bingo. It's EXACTLY like that in Conan, it's always full, at EVERY level. Thing is, some of those quests are group ones, and apparently when the time to bash Conan comes, everyone just forget about them. Group quests don't count as quests anymore apparently, they count as grind. Weeeee.....

They counted as quests up until the moment mobs got that heroic buff and people couldn't just plow through those areas if a group couldn't or wasn't desired. My toon was 60 something and had never run system or cistern because of that.
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Reply #56 on: July 06, 2008, 10:26:33 AM

And putting pathetic little ;) emoticons at the end of your bitter AoC fanboi trollings doesn't make you sound any more reasonable, we all know what you're like.  Or at least those of us who have been around long enough to have experienced your other sudden, manic amount of posts after another six month disappearance.  I anxiously look forward to the next time you drag yourself out of a gutter and deign to bless us with your presence again, I find your descent into madness fascinating.

At least he doesn't post little flame bait gems like this:

The game catered to PvP players.  Now I don't want to get into a whole PvE versus PvP thing, I happen to think that there is a market for a PvP focused game and that lots of people would play it.  But making that game is going to be much harder because there are far more issues to try and work out and if you don't get it just right the players are going to bitch and moan endlessly.  Funcom does not have the talent to pull off a PvP game.  I feel they are compounding this folly by focusing on their "Massive PvP" update.  Their systems will not work, it's too difficult to get MMO PvP right.  No matter what they release the PvP players will express their disgust and continue to leave.

Also while I think Cevik did a shitty job of making a good point he was at least making a good point.  Every one of you who /quit without it being because of some glaring error that was just too much?  Its just plain burnout.  These diku game systems are fucking old hat.  Many posters here dont like them at all anymore.  But while the MMO market continues to offer up only more saminess bullshit we keep pretending that this time it'll be different.  Instead everyone quits with even less then the half a reason they had last time around.

There is an odd delusion that I think f13 suffers from with regards to mmo's but I'm not the one to try to spell it out.

As someone who hasn't tried AoC yet, thx for the threads though, interesting read in a bunch of them including this one.

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Reply #57 on: July 06, 2008, 11:39:38 AM

He's not trolling, he's saying "More questy, less grindy" I believe.   As in, fill out the content, bitches, not that it's a never ending treadmill of gloom.

There's a difference between "more questy, less grindy" and "I think creating NA mmorpg with as much grind as AoC is outright stupid. This isn't Korea, people don't want to grind."

Plus, don't know what your perception tells you people, but this is already the case. Conan is already more questy and less grindy, and "as much grind as AoC" sounds like sarcasm given the laughable amount of grind required to levelup.

Others said it better than I expressed.  I agree with the "Put more quests than you can complete at a range" in.  WoW wasn't like this until they upped the low-level XP, and it made the game drag a bit.  Now you can skip whole zones you dislike, or quests that are a pain in the ass and not have a problem.

No, "GROUP ONLY" quests don't count as quests.  Not if you're selling your game on the soloability, as others have said AoC was doing.  I really don't know if they were or not, I wasn't paying attention since the game never captured my imagination to begin with.  It's like selling a game to PvPers and then saying "Oh, but you have to PvE for all your gear!"  It's fucking stupid.

You haven't frothed this much about a game since Vanguard, Falcon.  It's funny in a completely broken kind of way.

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Morfiend
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Reply #58 on: July 06, 2008, 12:01:09 PM

Every one of you who /quit without it being because of some glaring error that was just too much?  Its just plain burnout. 

Thats the thing. There isn't one big glaring problem, its just that the longer you play, all the amazing little problems just build up and build up until its to much and all of a sudden you can't stand the thought of logging in.
Falconeer
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Reply #59 on: July 06, 2008, 12:08:35 PM

You haven't frothed this much about a game since Vanguard, Falcon.  It's funny in a completely broken kind of way.

What's your point?
I wanted to like Vanguard, and I failed.

I DO like Conan, and I am having tons of unhoped for (English?) fun.

Sometimes a game is good, what's the funny broken part?

Signe
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Reply #60 on: July 06, 2008, 03:45:38 PM

Don't fret, Falconeer.  I find your enthusiasm sweet, even when I don't like the game.  There is nothing wrong with frothy.  Look how nice cappuccino is!

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Merusk
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Reply #61 on: July 06, 2008, 04:57:37 PM

Sometimes a game is good, what's the funny broken part?

My enjoyment of your froth would be the broken part.

The past cannot be changed. The future is yet within your power.
Musashi
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Reply #62 on: July 06, 2008, 05:08:58 PM

Very tired of foolishly paying for unfinished games.  Very tired, indeed.

AKA Gyoza
Sir T
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Reply #63 on: July 06, 2008, 05:13:29 PM

(a) The inability for people to play on servers catering for people across the pond. That killed my enthusiasm from the get go and from what I'm hearing my rage was not unique. I also heard rumors of people getting banned for altering their client to play on different national servers so they could play with their friends.

(b) The jump from the great Tortuga setting to the comparatively vacant khemi. Simply losing all that great voice acting sucked all the atmosphere away, and losing the destiny quest made it all seen so pointless.

(c) The system requirements. I SERIOUSLY still think they shot themselves in the foot with their system requirements. My machine can play Supreme Commander smoothly on medium settings yet AOC stutters along on "looks like a dog" mode and is laggy responding to commands. I seriously think if they had dropped the system requirements right down there would be a lot more playability as I found the actual play is quite fun if I hit a spot where it runs smoothly. Fix that and they would have a lot more replayability.

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Numtini
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Reply #64 on: July 06, 2008, 07:27:45 PM

Quote
Thats the thing. There isn't one big glaring problem, its just that the longer you play, all the amazing little problems just build up and build up until its to much and all of a sudden you can't stand the thought of logging in.

Not just all the little things, but the fact that there are numerous live vibrant alternatives where everything actually works.

If you can read this, you're on a board populated by misogynist assholes.
UnSub
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Reply #65 on: July 06, 2008, 08:02:19 PM

You cannot launch half assed, or in this case, quarter assed.  There is no recovery for a horrible launch.

Eve is the exception.

As a developer, having your game launch go so horribly that your publisher takes a financial bath and dumps it for pennies on the dollar is not a successful business model. 


I agree. But I like to remind people that 1) Eve failed at launch and 2) it had a horrible launch and recovered. There IS a recovery for a horrible launch, but you really have to be catering to a unique area of the market or offer something very different.

Eve serves as a good example of what is possible in the MMO genre, but tends to serve only as a spectacle for those of us who like e-drama.

Sir T
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Reply #66 on: July 07, 2008, 02:06:29 AM

Personally I think eve serves as a fascinating psychological study on what people will do when they are addicted to something, not to mention the massive power of self justification and self delusion. For instance, I cant stand the thought of playing eve ever again and find nearly every other space game much more fun, but even now its takes real physical effort for me not to reopen my account and start playing again.

But, on topic, betting on getting a room full of addicted assholes into a pyramid scheme to keep your business afloat is a very unsafe bet to make, generally.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2008, 02:16:58 AM by Sir T »

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Jamiko
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Reply #67 on: July 07, 2008, 07:30:29 AM

For me, it seems like it is getting more buggy with each patch. I am getting stuck while running quite frequently and need to jump to continue moving (this did not happen to me at launch at all) and lately this 10,000 ping lockup is happening more and more and that one really sucks.
cevik
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Reply #68 on: July 07, 2008, 08:08:03 AM

But, on topic, betting on getting a room full of addicted assholes into a pyramid scheme to keep your business afloat is a very unsafe bet to make, generally.

What exactly do you have against the gambling industry?

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Lum
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Hellfire Games


Reply #69 on: July 07, 2008, 08:48:56 AM

In this day and age an MMO gamer should always have a full quest log at ANY level.  Solo or grouped.  If there is only one story line to follow or one quest line to pursue, the game still needs work. 

Better yet, they should have many more quests than they can ever do (WoW is like this), so they have to pick and choose. Much better for replayability.

This is one fairly large reason why MMO budgets are exploding into the stratosphere. World of Warcraft has set the benchmark pretty high; if you're going to do an MMO like WoW, you're going to need to deliver a *lot* of content.
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