WotLK spoilerfication

[lamaros]

THEY'RE DOING A BETA. 2 IS KINDA THE POINT OF THE BETA OMG?

Not sure why you are yelling or acting like a valley girl.  Beta's do not guarantee complete success.  In fact, they rarely do.

schild says I should try to be nice, so can you stop being fucking stupid?

[Dren]

THEY'RE DOING A BETA. 2 IS KINDA THE POINT OF THE BETA OMG?

Not sure why you are yelling or acting like a valley girl.  Beta's do not guarantee complete success.  In fact, they rarely do.

schild says I should try to be nice, so can you stop being fucking stupid?

So this is your way of saying you have board management's approval to insult people?

Fine, I'll concede my point.  You're right.  The people that pay subs should get screwed.  The box sales on the expansion are worth it.  Your intelligent and well thought out responses to my post have made me see the light.

[Lightstalker]

No really, he was right at the first instance.  You are dumb and until your little whine fest here I hadn't bothered to read anything you wrote for several months - a mistake I'll not soon make again.

The people still paying their subs will not see any more resources dumped on them than is necessary to keep the servers up and the players from hacking each other's computers through the WoW client.  If they churn or not has been demonstrated to be irrelevant based on the historic model of The Burning Crusade expansion.  Blizzard knows they'll be back, and keep coming back, until World of DiabloWarStarCraftEmporium is ready for mass consumption.

One doesn't increase revenues by dumping good money after bad e.g. fighting off attrition and churn.  One increases revenues by putting new product on the shelves and pulling in new customers (much of the churned wow subscription base is already waiting on the expansion no matter what you do in the interim).  Keeping the potential churners engaged by inviting them to the Beta provides playtesting while keeping those subscriptions ticking over (even the chance to win a beta slot will be enough for some to stick around - as silly as that is).  Writing this post just cost me more than my WoW subscription for the month.  I save enough money to keep playing WoW regardless of what WoW does every time I avoid responding to a stupid post.  So really, why would Blizzard throw money into current dynamics when everything will reset with the expansion?  They don't charge a high enough monthly subscription to make these lame duck months worth fighting for retention.

Now if they started locking subscriptions in for a 2 year contract...

[dusematic]

You are dumb

I was right!

[Lakov_Sanite]

No really, he was right at the first instance.  You are dumb and until your little whine fest here I hadn't bothered to read anything you wrote for several months - a mistake I'll not soon make again.

The people still paying their subs will not see any more resources dumped on them than is necessary to keep the servers up and the players from hacking each other's computers through the WoW client.  If they churn or not has been demonstrated to be irrelevant based on the historic model of The Burning Crusade expansion.  Blizzard knows they'll be back, and keep coming back, until World of DiabloWarStarCraftEmporium is ready for mass consumption.

One doesn't increase revenues by dumping good money after bad e.g. fighting off attrition and churn.  One increases revenues by putting new product on the shelves and pulling in new customers (much of the churned wow subscription base is already waiting on the expansion no matter what you do in the interim).  Keeping the potential churners engaged by inviting them to the Beta provides playtesting while keeping those subscriptions ticking over (even the chance to win a beta slot will be enough for some to stick around - as silly as that is).  Writing this post just cost me more than my WoW subscription for the month.  I save enough money to keep playing WoW regardless of what WoW does every time I avoid responding to a stupid post.  So really, why would Blizzard throw money into current dynamics when everything will reset with the expansion?  They don't charge a high enough monthly subscription to make these lame duck months worth fighting for retention.

Now if they started locking subscriptions in for a 2 year contract...

If this was the case than there would be no content released between expansions, nor would there be any class balancing between expansions which...is quite the opposite of what blizzard has done post BC

[Paelos]

Yall are arguing over something that has already been decided. They are going to put the content in with the expansion. It would be nice if I saw the talents now, and I think it doesn't make much logical sense to keep all of them for the expansion given the mechanics involved.

All that has nothing to do with their business plan or their retention plans. That's something none of us know or can really make many eduated guesses at. In the end, frothing about their business decisions only matters if it costs them money.

[Dren]

No really, he was right at the first instance.  You are dumb and until your little whine fest here I hadn't bothered to read anything you wrote for several months - a mistake I'll not soon make again.

Another great troll.  Ok, I'm going to bite.  I'm not sure what has gotten posters here so agitated and trollish.  Boring workdays?  Frustrated that you can't get out and enjoy the weather?

I really don't get the rage here.  I gave two scenarios.  I said I like the the first one.  I stated it is my opinion not a hard fast fact of how they will do it.  Then I say, let's see what they will do.  You label that as a whine fest?  Was it dumb?  Perhaps.  It is still my opinion.

Yes, I would like to see the non-expansion critical changes put in now.  Will I live if they don't?  Certainly.  Some of you people need to seriously check your perspective meter.  Maybe nerd - rage to the extreme has come into style lately.  I missed the memo.

That threat of reading my posts certainly is scary though.  RAWR.

[Typhon]

No really, he was right at the first instance.  You are dumb and until your little whine fest here I hadn't bothered to read anything you wrote for several months - a mistake I'll not soon make again.

[...]  I'm not sure what has gotten posters here so agitated and trollish.  Boring workdays?  [...]

It's a summertime thing here at f13, there are no games out that anyone is really excited about playing, so they come to the forums to play "who wants to be a douchebaginairre".  There are a lot of pro-level players of that game here (see just about any thread involving AoC or WoW in the past month).

[lamaros]

random random

No one is trolling you, really. You're just saying stupid shit and there is no point pointing out why it is stupid as you have aptly demonstrated your inability to grasp logic. So people trying a new tack: Calling you stupid until you at least shut up.

[Musashi]

This thread got gay.

Rerail.

Tier 11
Dancing Rune Weapon (Rank 0/1, Requires 50 points in Blood Talents, Requires Runic Power, Instant - Requires Melee Weapon - 1 min cooldown)
Unleashes all available runic power to summon a second rune weapon that fights on its own for 1 sec per 5 runic power, doing the same attacks that you do.

 

[Paelos]

So you can essentially double your DPS. That's........slighly OP.

[cevik]

So you can essentially double your DPS. That's........slighly OP.

Ehh, while it sounds like that when reading the tool tip I doubt it will be true in reality.  There is no guarantee that I read in the tool tip that the second blade will fight at the same gear level/stat level that you do (just that it mimics your moves).  I suspect that it will be a glorified Tier 11 equivalent DoT, cool concept but not really any more OP than any other Tier 11 ability.

[Chimpy]

2 things: A) Alpha talent

B) IIRC Runic power is how you do all your good tricks if you are a DK, and you have to use it all up for this spell, so your DPS would not be doubled.

[Merusk]

B) IIRC Runic power is how you do all your good tricks if you are a DK, and you have to use it all up for this spell, so your DPS would not be doubled.

You are correct.  It's as useful as the Warrior "You can execute even though the target is > 20% health" talent. You just blew all your rage/mana/energy.. but it's on a DoT.

[Fordel]

   
Degeneration
Rank 1
Instantly attack the target, dealing 60% weapon damage and inflicting a disease dealing 91 over 21 sec. Any existing heal over time spells on the target become corrupted, dramatically increasing the damage done by the disease and removing the healing effect. Stacks up to 3 times.

That's one way to knock resto druids down a peg in arena 

[lamaros]

Runic power is not really like that. There are only a few DK abilities that use runic power, and most of them consume all of it. On top of that only few of them are straight damage abilities. The comparison to using all your rage and mana are not apt, nor really is energy.

Dancing Rune Weapon will be more or less useful depending on how it is implemented. If it just mirrors white attacks then it becomes pretty weak as most of the DKs damage at the moment is yellow. If it mirrors specials like blood strike and obliterate than it becomes much more powerful and would likely take over from Death Coil as the runic power dump for a Blood DPSer.

[Fordel]

WoW head has the  talents up http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent

Minus Hunters and Paladins. Nothing new as far as I can see, but you don't have to go fishing through all the leak sites for them anymore.

[SurfD]

Yeah, from what i can tell, Runic Power is more like some sort of Hybrid Rage Bar / Combo Point system.  You build up Runic Power by using your abilities (which work off of recharging runes) and then dump the Runic Power for certain special effects / finisher moves.

Basicly, Rogues in Plate.

[Ironwood]

12/0/59 for my warrior, looks like...

http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent=LA0czZZV0tGeGzf0sguAo

[K9]

WoW head has the  talents up http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent

Minus Hunters and Paladins. Nothing new as far as I can see, but you don't have to go fishing through all the leak sites for them anymore.

Some of these seem bugged. For instance, the tier 9 priest talent Improved Holy Concentration has a newer version at 1/3, and the older (and more OP) version for 2/3 and 3/3.

Anyhow, http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent=bVcbzsVZfbxcfzqVhVcsu doesn't look like my priest is going to see massive shifts in build as holy.

What I'm interested to see is whether deep-disc will now become a raid-viable spec. A lot of the new talents look rather nifty, the only problem is the large number of filler talents you need to wade through in the middle of the tree to get there. Grace seems pretty damn powerful, especially when you have other healers to take advantage of it. Deep disc priests look like they'll be mainly using penance, with GHeal and Flash Heal during the cooldown, probably as tank healers. Depending on the duration of grace I wonder whether we'll have priest + druid teams keeping up lifebloom and grace on 2-3 targets.

http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent=bVcfcsVVR0zoectbxxcc

edit: This also pushes priests towards spell crit, which if the rumoured itemisation homogenisation plans go through we'll have a lot more of.

[Fordel]

Some of these seem bugged.

Oh definitely! Take a look at the 51 point Elemental Talent for shamans. It's probably my favorite typo/error. If it isn't an error, well... 

[Ironwood]

I never figured out yards in WoW.  For all I know, it's correct.

[Fordel]

Max range (Heals, Talented Hunters/Mages) is 40yards.

[Chimpy]

Max range (Heals, Talented Hunters/Mages) is 40yards.

Hunters talented is 41.

[SurfD]

200 yards is about 5 times the max range of a talented fireball. (if you are horde, standing in the middle of Freewind Post in 1k Needles and popping this would punt an alliance member it hit clear off the plateau with room to spare).

Also: Improved Stormstrike: Reduces Cooldown on storm strike by 1000 seconds per point?  Did they borrow tech from the negative ping guys?

[Merusk]

Runic power is not really like that. There are only a few DK abilities that use runic power, and most of them consume all of it. On top of that only few of them are straight damage abilities. The comparison to using all your rage and mana are not apt, nor really is energy.

Huh. I haven't been following closely at all as more and more leaks started appearing.  The first time I heard about it, it sounded like you tapped runes to build power, then your abilities used runic power, OR also tapped runes. (Leading to an imagined nightmare of timer management.)  Good to know.

WoW head has the  talents up http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent

Minus Hunters and Paladins. Nothing new as far as I can see, but you don't have to go fishing through all the leak sites for them anymore.

Hunters and Paladins aren't in yet.  Don't expect to see either of them for a while, either.  As mentioned in the Pally overhaul thread, they want to work out the new mechanics for both classes and THEN figure talents out for them.    Another reason I'm shelving the hunter for a long, long time.

[slog]

What I'm interested to see is whether deep-disc will now become a raid-viable spec. A lot of the new talents look rather nifty, the only problem is the large number of filler talents you need to wade through in the middle of the tree to get there. Grace seems pretty damn powerful, especially when you have other healers to take advantage of it. Deep disc priests look like they'll be mainly using penance, with GHeal and Flash Heal during the cooldown, probably as tank healers. Depending on the duration of grace I wonder whether we'll have priest + druid teams keeping up lifebloom and grace on 2-3 targets.

We were talking about this in IRC a few weeks ago.  I  made a few disc raiding specs and came to the conclusion that Disc priests on raids are going to be like Shadowpriests are for regular DPS:  They will be almost as good as regular healers and will act as mana batteries for the raid.

Not sure how viable it's going to be though.

[K9]

I have a feeling deep-disc will be more like Ret Paladins or Survival Hunters. One per raid will be very very useful, but beyond that the benefits fall off. We'll have to see what the healing throughput on Penanace is like, because deep-disc priests are always going to lag significantly behind deep-holy on every other heal. I'm thinking most raids will probably have 1 penance, 1 CoH and a shadowpriest as standard, maybe adding an extra SPriest or CoH priest as availability dictates.

[slog]

I have a feeling deep-disc will be more like Ret Paladins or Survival Hunters. One per raid will be very very useful, but beyond that the benefits fall off. We'll have to see what the healing throughput on Penanace is like, because deep-disc priests are always going to lag significantly behind deep-holy on every other heal. I'm thinking most raids will probably have 1 penance, 1 CoH and a shadowpriest as standard, maybe adding an extra SPriest or CoH priest as availability dictates.

I can't imagine a 10 man having 3 priests.

[Chimpy]

I have a feeling deep-disc will be more like Ret Paladins or Survival Hunters. One per raid will be very very useful, but beyond that the benefits fall off. We'll have to see what the healing throughput on Penanace is like, because deep-disc priests are always going to lag significantly behind deep-holy on every other heal. I'm thinking most raids will probably have 1 penance, 1 CoH and a shadowpriest as standard, maybe adding an extra SPriest or CoH priest as availability dictates.

I can't imagine a 10 man having 3 priests.

10 man Naxx-2.0 will for Gothik unless they totally change the concept of the fight. Lots of undead mobs that need CC for teh suck.

We used to take 8 for the 40 man version.

[Simond]

Looking at those DK talents, every single DK is going to put at least 5 points into Blood for 5/5 Bladed Armour.

[Fabricated]

This is probably going to be my build as a prot warrior.

http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?talent=LV0cZZi0tMe0dfesguAo

Safeguard I'm taking since it screams, "We're going to make intervene a useful/crucial part of encounter mechanics."

[Chimpy]

Oh my holy raptor jesus.

I might just play my resto shaman and not bother with the hunter in LK.

Get a decurse/poison/disease in one button spell, a healing pet, and frickin Tidal Waves is hawt. Dunno how spirit link will work....seems, well, odd.

[Fordel]

Spirit Link is what you mash before you mash Chain Heal. 


-edit-

My Balance druid needs another like, 15-20 points 

[K9]

Ok, the Death Knight Trees make no sense whatsoever to me, I guess this is because I don't understand the class mechanics properly. It does seem though that DK tanks will want at least 23 points in Blood for the 3 parry talents, and then the rest in frost I guess. Frost seems to be more about DPS and target control overall, apart from a few magic-tanking talents. Unholy seems the least focused, offering all sorts of interesting-looking stuff.

I guess I'm hampered by a lack of understanding of which abilities are actually useful and what they actually do.

Overall the impression I'm getting is that this is a class designed to rape casters.