Live devblog - tons'o'changes

[Endie]

Latest live devblog has a crapload of exciting changes, some to do with balance, some new stuff.  Enjoy it, complete with unedited, amareutish, comedy-cutz beginning: listen to it here or just download it directly from the site.

Highlights

- Exploration to be pretty much totally rewritten, to be harder but less about dreary sitting around and waiting, and more about player (not character) skill.  Also, the ability to probe down most cloaked ships (except forcoverts, SBs, black ops, recons).  Unlucky, for the Chinese cloaking ravens.
- Some changes to salvaging.  I'll listen to this again but they want to make it less annoying, though I suspect that this can't mean much faster, since income-per-hour on salvaging is already pretty good.  More uses for salvage parts, too.
- Some improvements across the industrial side, mining in highsec etc but fuuuck knows what this Chronotus guy is saying.
- Changes to insurance (I hope they remove insurance payouts for self-destructing.  Sounds like it may be aimed at suicide ganks, though)
- More UI changes, supporting higher resolutions, less overlapping windows.  An end to "Windows 3.1 in space".  More abilities with key-bindings.
- Enhanced NPC AI, more variation in missions, enhanced smuggling and customs systems.  More Bounty hunting stuff, too, like tradable kill rights.
- More lowsec incentives, such as factional warfare, player sov of some sort etc.  Sounds fun for old UO-style pirates vs police type interactions.
- Assault frigates were going to get more speed and more dps.  Sensibly, they are not doing this now.  Looks like some resistance to webs, which will make for useful tackling capabilities up close.  Depends if they pair that with some nos/neut resistance, really.
- More useful ships that are easier to get into.  I like this one so much it gets bolded.  I like their idea of command frigates: The Groundskeeper now has Wing Command 4 and is moving towards Skirmish Warfare 5 and mindlinks for the end of next week.  It would be nice to be able to bring a small ship on Frigate Club ops rather than being the guy in the battlecruiser at the back.
- Capitals to be readdressed.  Titans and motherships to be redesigned as staging posts for the frontlines, with enhanced jump-cloning capabilities.  Tick tock.  Not only sounding like reduced offensive capabilities but also increased zerging possibilities.
- More nerfs to speed module stacking, especially poycarbs, which should be in just in time for my vagabond character :(

Edit:

- Local may be nerfed in some way to give less intel, either through delaying, making it constellation-wide or something.  Easier hunting?

Starting next month (perhaps), some of the big design ideas will be being published in dev blogs.

[Nerf]

Good thing I can suicide gank in a cruiser with my new char, no insurance payout just means less competion, which means the targets will get complacent..and then BAM, ISKIES FOR ME!

I approve wholeheartedly of these changes.

[Flinky]

Can the people you typically suicide gank actually GET more complacent?

[Nerf]

Had a dude get away with 100+ BPOs in a punisher (I was in a torp raven, d'oh!), he could've been in a noob ship i suppose :P

[Endie]

I approve wholeheartedly of these changes.

Me too.  CCP are definitely on an upwards curve at the moment, with their design team.  I now really look forward to reading the devblogs.

[Nerf]

About 15-20mins into it so far, so far everything sounds really great, I can't believe they havn't already converted all icons to vectorgraphs for scaling already.

The only problems are going to be:
a) how long it takes them to implement it (forever?)
b) How many tries it'll take to get it right (probably alot)
c) Amarr are still going to be pissed about lasers.

Edit: Changing local to constellation would be fucking awesome.

We want to change it from where empire is this nice fluffy land-- unless you get hit by 20 dominix or whatever it is these days

 

[Phred]

Maybe they've been listening in to rookie chat while this Steam promotion has been running. The crappy UI probably loses them a ton of ppl who might actually sign up for a month or two if they didnt quit in total frustration 2 days in.

[Endie]

Edit: Changing local to constellation would be fucking awesome.

Yes, yes and a hundred times yes.  I was just coming here to post this.

I mean, now we have access to 0.0 space BAT people might think "fuck ratting becomes more dangerous".  That's true.  But we're not, primarily, PvE types: it makes stalking, ambushing and ganking way easier if this happens, and that means less time roaming pointlessly looking for ganks.

Plus, where you have a high quality intel channel, like TheCitadel, you have a bit of an edge.

[lac]

Looks like they mention a lot of stuff they have been schmoozing about for a long time now. It has a lot of promise, let's see what happens in the next patches.

[Sparky]

If they nerf polys without touching snakes they're tarded.  All the other stuff sounds great though.  I expect suicide ganks to increase as more dumb people haul billions around in T1 industrials thinking they are safe now.

[Raging Turtle]

Good stuff all around.

[Slayerik]

Edit: Changing local to constellation would be fucking awesome.

Yes, yes and a hundred times yes.  I was just coming here to post this.

I mean, now we have access to 0.0 space BAT people might think "fuck ratting becomes more dangerous".  That's true.  But we're not, primarily, PvE types: it makes stalking, ambushing and ganking way easier if this happens, and that means less time roaming pointlessly looking for ganks.

Plus, where you have a high quality intel channel, like TheCitadel, you have a bit of an edge.

Im not sure I agree with this. In less populated constellations, its almost an early warning system when you see my -10 red ass jump in from 3 jumps away.  Fuck, for me I'd rather it just have local. This way I guess I'll have to try to catch people on constellation borders. I guess to me it sounds like ratting and mining in populated 0.0 becomes more dangerous, but in the drone regions you are gravy baby!

My guess is it will be better, but I like playing devil's advocate at times.

[Endie]

I think it makes lowsec and busy npc 0.0 space better for hunting in.  It'll really hurt the Chinese if they have to cloak up (or log out, with the probing change) whenever us honkeys roll into the same constellation.

[ajax34i]

I think that's a good thing for the gankee, though.  Currently, they only have a couple seconds TOPS to react to local spiking with reds, and I think that the constant concentration required for that is somewhat frustrating.  The constellation warning system will separate the smart ones from the dead ones, rather than the way it is now, where only the smart AND extremely nimble ones survive.

Plus, they may build in delays to the Constellation channel.  Or, even better, remove the pilots list.  Dunno.  We'll see.

Sounds like vaporware, for now, though.  All these promises, with only CCP's track record to bespeak for them.

[Phildo]

I don't understand how getting rid of system local is a good thing.  If you don't have scanning skills, you have no way of knowing when there are enemies near you right?  You know they're in the same constellation, but they mght be on the complete other side of it.  Isn't that what local defense channels are for?

[bhodi]

New changes / game mechanics that aren't mentioned above

system 'intel' revamp: possibly replacing/integrating the directional scanner, I suspect something along the lines of an 'overview' window in the solarsystem view that contains all that data.

Replacing / changing local: they don't like the idea of having the name of every person in the system automatically. Changing local to constellation would partially fix this (you wouldn't know WHICH system in the constellation the guy would be in), this ties into the cloaking mechanics below and the intel revamp above.

A baby rorqual for hisec mining to "give all the industrialists / logistics guys something else to do". Not the best way of putting it... people already know this one's coming so it's not news.

Salvage system: adding more things you can build with salvage parts outside rigs (Not mentioned, but drone parts perhaps?), changing salvaging to possibly require only one salvager per ship. They don't like the idea of a dedicated destroyer and they want to fix the mechanic to not require it. Some of the other ideas on this topic sound absolutely terrible, timeconsuming targeting minigames, this guy Chronotus or whatever shouldn't open his mouth until he's vetted his ideas with the other devs.

Doing something to make missions more interesting/challenging without being harder. Some mindless talk about intelligent NPCs, I suspect nothing of interest will be added to the game here for a long time. It strongly sounds like they are talking about 'randomizing' missions -- random spawns, random objectives, not just 30-40 or so specifically crafted missions. I suspect hilarity is on the way for this one.

lowsec revamp: they realize low-sec is generally higher risk than 0.0, and they want this reversed, they want more risk mitigation options for players who are willing to put their toe in the lowsec waters but aren't willing to go to 0.0.

Increased payouts for L5 missions to bring them more in line with what they should be.

Investigating making 'smuggling' profitable and other ways to lure people into lowsec

Bounty hunting revamp, giving a framework or system for players to trade/sell kill rights, other ways to make bounty hunting a viable profession (and lure people in to lowsec)

UI: They know it sucks. Changing the ship hud, replacing the huge 'locked targets' at the top, combining weapons into a single group / Fkey so you can have an alpha-strike. Moving to scaling vector graphics for customizable text sizes

They don't want to add heavy UI customization / scripting because they are afraid that people would be able to automate the game and would widen the divide between experienced players who would quickly add the latest addons and the newbies who would be stuck with the 'normal' one. Fuck CCP right in the ear on this one.

Lots of shortcuts - adding hotkeys for heat, different ammo types, among others. One of the devs would "Like to play only using the keyboard". Woot.

Changes to titans, possibly adding a special clone jump 'back' for titans that ignores the 1 per day jump limit (or possibly just add a 'back' for everyone? This would rock)

Forum changes -- splitting GTC / character forums into two forums shortly

More dev blogs; specifically community feedback on CCP game changes / directions and player feedback on them before they go live.

Recon/Blackops changes: Possibly adding a 'fuel' cargo bay for jumpfuel (as the cargo bay is too small to hold enough fuel for behind the lines maneuvers) and some slight buffs as they were released deliberately weak.

Assault Frigates changes: They had some changes ready, including AB/speed buffs, and they pulled it for future changes - changing roles to make them more useful, playing around with ideas such as webifier resistances and things to make them more useful in gang fleets and more than just a 'frigate plus'

Cloaking balance: non-covops cloaks are too powerful, they need to be balanced - either by removing local or some of those changes or allowing them to be probed out.

[Kamen]

Removing system local has been loudly called for by experienced pvper's, and those who have the ability to form decent sized blobs, for a long time.  These people hold a lot of sway with CCP, and it looks like they are going to finally get their wish.  After it's implemented, those players in any place other than high sec will now have to:

* be in a hunting pack
* hide when they see something in constellation
* be willing to put up with nonstop scanning.

Expect to see even less carebears, new players, solo players, and even smallish gangs in low sec/0.0 after this is implemented.

[ajax34i]

It forces anyone in low sec to use scouts, which I guess CCP wants for two reasons:  incentive to not solo, and something that the newbie can do thus keeping them busy. 

I'd like to see the list of pilots in the system appear in an overview-like style (small text, multiple columns of info, no pics), rather than the clumsy way it is presented now, with those fat pictures and unsortable and in the local channel.  But, if they don't add that, we'll just have to scout for the info we don't have.

[Murgos]

Basically, the change to the local channel from a system channel to a constellation channel moves 0.0 from being in favor of the defender (easy situational awareness, you know exactly what system the aggressors are not in, and that the total number of defenders available is unknown until there is a meeting engagement) to in favor of the aggressor (you know exactly what you are up against and if moderately fast moving are nearly impossible to find).

I doubt this idea makes it past the open testing phase as it's described here.  Additionally, adding a constellation channel along with the current local system would probably be far too helpful to defenders as it would make engagements entirely at the defenders discretion.

[Endie]

I doubt this idea makes it past the open testing phase as it's described here.  Additionally, adding a constellation channel along with the current local system would probably be far too helpful to defenders as it would make engagements entirely at the defenders discretion.

There is already a constellation channel, btw.

[Murgos]

I doubt this idea makes it past the open testing phase as it's described here.  Additionally, adding a constellation channel along with the current local system would probably be far too helpful to defenders as it would make engagements entirely at the defenders discretion.

There is already a constellation channel, btw.

news to me.

[Viin]

There is already a constellation channel, btw.

New characters get it turned on by default, but I've never seen it on my older char.

[Murgos]

Does every person in the Constellation get added to it automatically?  Because if not, it's not the same thing.

[ajax34i]

Well, you can close the constellation channel and thus leave it.  But if you have it on, as soon as you enter a constellation, everyone else in that constellation can see you in the channel (if they have it on).  Most people close it though.

[dwindlehop]

- Changes to insurance (I hope they remove insurance payouts for self-destructing.  Sounds like it may be aimed at suicide ganks, though)

Was this in the text or your between the lines reading? I listened to the devblog and all I got was changes being considered, not the direction of those changes. I was actually hoping they'd do something to rectify the insurance situation on T2 ships. I think both you and I are projecting our desires onto the devs' comments.

[bhodi]

The only thing they said are "We are going to be examining insurance payouts. It's a system that hasn't been looked at since the start of the game and has been around for 5 years. We believe there may be some room for improvement".

When they think a system that has been around for 5 years with no complaints suddenly needs "improvement", all you need to do is look at jihadswarm to see the mpetus of that thought.

[Kamen]

When they think a system that has been around for 5 years with no complaints suddenly needs "improvement", all you need to do is look at jihadswarm to see the mpetus of that thought.

There are plenty of people who have complained over the years that the entire concept of the insurance system was idiotic, and predicted its abuse.  They were shouted down by some, but usually simply ignored.

[Slayerik]

The only thing they said are "We are going to be examining insurance payouts. It's a system that hasn't been looked at since the start of the game and has been around for 5 years. We believe there may be some room for improvement".

When they think a system that has been around for 5 years with no complaints suddenly needs "improvement", all you need to do is look at jihadswarm to see the mpetus of that thought.

Always some noobs gotta ruin it for us 'honest pirates'.

But unless they come up with something drastic, I'll just gank without insurance and target juicier stuff.

[IainC]

The only thing they said are "We are going to be examining insurance payouts. It's a system that hasn't been looked at since the start of the game and has been around for 5 years. We believe there may be some room for improvement".

When they think a system that has been around for 5 years with no complaints suddenly needs "improvement", all you need to do is look at jihadswarm to see the mpetus of that thought.

CCP has always been pretty reactive to 'divergent gameplay'. Whether that's a good thing or not largely depends on whether it was your particular quasi-legal niche that just got nerfed. It's also a major contributor to the tinfoil hattery regarding dev bias as a lot of the divergent gameplay comes from a small part of the community.

[tazelbain]

I wonder if the issue is more econimic than social.  Insurance payouts must be a massive isk fountain.  Insurance must also skew the economy because the price of ships and goods are determined by the markets but insurance payouts are static.

[Reg]

If Jihadswarm gets big enough CCP won't have any choice but to end suicide ganking. And that will spoil everyone's fun.

[JoeTF]

Edit: Changing local to constellation would be fucking awesome.

Yes, yes and a hundred times yes.  I was just coming here to post this.

I mean, now we have access to 0.0 space BAT people might think "fuck ratting becomes more dangerous".  That's true.  But we're not, primarily, PvE types: it makes stalking, ambushing and ganking way easier if this happens, and that means less time roaming pointlessly looking for ganks.

Plus, where you have a high quality intel channel, like TheCitadel, you have a bit of an edge.

Im not sure I agree with this. In less populated constellations, its almost an early warning system when you see my -10 red ass jump in from 3 jumps away.  Fuck, for me I'd rather it just have local. This way I guess I'll have to try to catch people on constellation borders. I guess to me it sounds like ratting and mining in populated 0.0 becomes more dangerous, but in the drone regions you are gravy baby!

My guess is it will be better, but I like playing devil's advocate at times.

Some systems are going to become an utter crap for mining/ratting (namely every constellation with highway solarsystems). Lot of false warnings will make players ignore them and then die. Now you usually have at least 30 seconds to react - I have been mining on 2 hulk accounts for 6 hours straight and I still had good enough reaction time to the whole op intime. So it's not that of a burden.

It's also a boost for afk cloaking griefrs, now they can grief entire constellation, not just one solarsystem:D 

[JoeTF]

If Jihadswarm gets big enough CCP won't have any choice but to end suicide ganking. And that will spoil everyone's fun.

GoonFleet, destroying EVE one game system at time.

But yeah, stuff like that is the only way to get CCP to actually do something. They're incredibly lazy fucks. After all insurance system have been screaming for t2 insurance fix, 0.0 insurance fix, BS insurance fix, pvp insurance fix, etc. for fucking five years.

[Kamen]

After all insurance system have been screaming for t2 insurance fix, 0.0 insurance fix, BS insurance fix, pvp insurance fix, etc. for fucking five years.

You do realize that there are both players, and dev's, that not only are resisting those things but would like to see the entire insurance program removed from the game?  It's not a matter of dragging their feet, or being "lazy fucks", they don't know where they want to go yet.

[Quinton]

If Jihadswarm gets big enough CCP won't have any choice but to end suicide ganking. And that will spoil everyone's fun.

GoonFleet, destroying EVE one game system at time.

But yeah, stuff like that is the only way to get CCP to actually do something. They're incredibly lazy fucks. After all insurance system have been screaming for t2 insurance fix, 0.0 insurance fix, BS insurance fix, pvp insurance fix, etc. for fucking five years.

It's unlikely that you'll ever find a Project/Product Manager on any project, anywhere, who will prioritize changes to an existing "working" system over adding new features or fixing "really bad" bugs.