European Community to Microsoft "pwnd"

[Morfiend]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/BUSINESS/03/24/microsoft.eu/index.html

The European Union has found Microsoft guilty of abusing the "near-monopoly" of its Windows PC operating system and fined it a record 497 million euros ($613 million).

Ouch, thats not pocket change to even Microsoft. Lets see what happens.

They dont really elaborate about what Microsoft needs to do, but some thing about supplying a version of Windows with no Media Player. Humm.

Europeans comment?

[Jethro65]

I'd be surprised if they really collect all that.  MS will fight it as long as humanly possible I'm sure.

[Rodent]

Europeans comment?

Haha, the american infidels will pay! Preferably in cash.

[Hanzii]

It's approximately one percent of their ready cash - probably whatt Bill would find if he looked behind his couch.
They'll probably appeal and in the molasses that's EU law no final decission will be made in a years.

[HaemishM]

The article I read said the appeals process could take up to 4-5 years, and even then, they probably won't be paying nearly as much. And just like in the US antitrust case, they'll have ended up modifying out the offending bits of Windows by the time the punishments are actually required.

[nach0king]

What Hanzii said, with the following elaboration:

Surprise surprise, the EU *finally* gets the stones to make a decision, and it's a lawsuit against an American multinational. Clearly in the giddy adrenalin rush of actually DOING something other than endless reams of consultation and a prodigious paper-trail evocative of Latin America, the EU top brass became somewhat homesick and decided to return to what they do best by ensuring that a complex appeals process will take up the bulk of their time for years to come.

Never let it be said that the EU is over-reaching its grasp. It's simply doing what it does best: arguing.

[Rodent]

Surprise surprise, the EU *finally* gets the stones to make a decision, and it's a lawsuit against an American multinational.

They've also fined lot's of European companies and Nintendo.

I wonder if we'll use this money for something other then lawyer wages and farmers. /sigh

[XplOrOrOr]

Ouch, thats not pocket change to even Microsoft. Lets see what happens.

 Your right, it is not pocket change to MicroSoft.
It is pocket pennies!

 Bill Gates recently gave away to charity roughly that exact amount!

 Also, Bill Gates is NOT the only Billionaire who works at MicroSoft. He happens to be the richest billionaire, out of the many Billionaires who work at MicroSoft.

 I don't think any other company in the world has billionaires for the top 5-10 company positions.
 And then include the multi-millionaires in MicroSoft. People worth hundreds of millions!
 Then include the regular millionaires. Heheh.

 Just think, MS makes enough profit to keep on the bankroll a bunch of Billionaires, Multi-millionaires, and millionaires......... along with the "poor" workers who make 6 digit salaries.

[Tebonas]

Microsoft didn't bribe enough European officials yet. Give Microsoft time and this will be bribed away just like the consequences of the US lawsuits.

Of course I didn't mean bribe, I meant lobbying.

[Alluvian]

 Bill Gates recently gave away to charity roughly that exact amount!

Really.  Roughly that exact amount?  I am impressed.

I hope I don't need the sarcasm tags, but with this one you never know.

[nach0king]

That post made grammatical sense. If you find it amusing, it probably means you're metrosexual.

[Teleku]

Surprise surprise, the EU *finally* gets the stones to make a decision, and it's a lawsuit against an American multinational.

They've also fined lot's of European companies and Nintendo.

I wonder if we'll use this money for something other then lawyer wages and farmers. /sigh

Perhaps you could invest in a better jet than that dopy ass EuroFighter.

[Cyberpilgrim]

Well Bill has given away roughly 23 BILLION to charity
as reported here
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2003-11-21-big-gates-charity-total_x.htm

Report: Bill Gates tops list of charitable givers
NEW YORK (Reuters) — Microsoft founder and chairman Bill Gates and his wife Melinda are the most generous charitable donors in America, Business Week magazine said on Thursday, as the couple gave away or pledged a staggering $23 billion — more than half of their net worth.

So the fine really isnt any big deal to him.

Like someone roughly said Microsoft will just delay it in court for years and then make a settlement for a ton less.

[Rodent]

Perhaps you could invest in a better jet than that dopy ass EuroFighter.

Actually we swedes went with JAS 39 Gripen.

[NowhereMan]

And the Irish are sticking with Cessnas for the time being it seems...

[Alluvian]

Well Bill has given away roughly 23 BILLION to charity

Yeah, thats 'roughly exactly' what the europe settlement was for.  Oh, wait, no it wasn't.  And roughly exactly makes no damn sense,  grammatically correct or not.  No matter what kind of whitty banter you come up with regarding ____ sexuality.

[Delf]

NPR was saying that the fine is payable now, and not when the inevitable appeals are resolved. Apparently you get your money back if the decision is reversed on appeal, but you can't delay paying by dragging out the appeals.

[Tebonas]

Ah, I erred. Microsoft doesn't care to bribe European politicians, they send in pre-bribed US politicians to do the dirty work for them.

10 Senators wrote an open letter to Mario Monti, the man that is responsible for the fine. Eight of those ten Senators got payments from Microsoft in the past.

Senator Bill Frist sees this as the first shot in a Trade War between Europe and the USA. Guess he is deaf on one ear if he missed that Steel tax shot some time ago.

The department of Justice already commented on it as well, stating that the bad bad Europeans want to hurt Microsoft rather than help the competition. It truly pains me to know that a fucking department of JUSTICE doesn't know what fines are. "Hey Officer, you know by forcing me to pay for driving too fast you dont't help the other people, you hurt me. Stop this please!"

In short, I'm slowly preparing for the day your marines burst into my house to defend democracy. Any reccomendations how to sufficently greet them. A cold beer and some snacks or better cowering on the floor in a non-threatening position?

[Teleku]

You know, there is also the possibility that the EU is going overboard on this, and its not just another evil US world take over consperacy.  I don't like Microsoft, but I never bought those monopoly charges people throw at them, and was happy to see the case go down in the US.  The fines in this case are very high, especially for what they describe as abusing a "near monopoly".  I can't see the reasoning for sueing a company that makes its product too usefull.  What serious difference do these people think it will make if microsoft releases a retarded version of windows?  Who the fuck would buy it?  Also, demanding that you release source code to competitors seems to be alot to ask a software company.

What ever the reasons, this does feel like the EU going out of its way to attack a big name US company, and I'm very sure there will be retaliations.  But that seems to be the norm between the US and EU at this point.  I especially like the "you must pay fines now before you get a chance to appeal your case before a court of law" thing.  What happens to a company that doesn't have as much extra cash as Microsoft that gets fined?  They have to lay off workers and let the finacial damage happen to them before the court finaly says "Oops, we where wrong, heres your money back"?  Seems like a rather extreme approach to "Justice".

[Tebonas]

You know, its also the possibility that the USA gave Microsoft a slap to the wrist instead of the punishment that would have been due to them. Due to the rampant lobbying that is going on in the USA and the fact that large corporations basically own that country.

And Europe corrected that error for you because they are ten years behind and lobbying has not that power yet (but give us time, we make good progress in that regard).

If I want my justice given by the Unites States of America, I want to become a citizen of the United States of America. No jurisdiction without representation I say!

[Rodent]

What happens to a company that doesn't have as much extra cash as Microsoft that gets fined?  They have to lay off workers and let the finacial damage happen to them before the court finaly says "Oops, we where wrong, heres your money back"?  Seems like a rather extreme approach to "Justice".

Many European countries base their fines on the income of the defendant. This way the rich will hurt as much when they get a DUI as a poor man. It's a penalty not a death blow. The fine is huge because so's Microsoft.

MS does it's best to stop competition, that's fine so long as you do not violate any laws while doing so. MS did and is now crying "We didn't know it was illiegal in Europe?" one would think a company of MS size would have enough economists and lawyers to find out what they hell they should be doing.

[Teleku]

And what exactly is it they did illegal again?  The article just says the EU found them in violation of the EU trade laws, but doesn't really say what for.  What specific sections of the law (I'm actually curious)?  The article just says that it centers around media player, in which case I think the case is bullshit.  If MS was going around and forcefully buying out all the competing software companies and forcing everybody to only use their products, then I can see an abuse of monopoly complaint.  As it is, people have plenty of other options for OS and applications that are not Microsoft, but everybody just chooses not to buy them.  On top of that, the EU's fix for the situation, making MS release a dumbed down version of windows, will not fix the problem in the fucking slightest, and they damn well know it.  Again, so far with what I mentioned above and the landmark high fine they imposed, I can't help but see much of this case influenced by the EU wanting to take on a big US company, despite weather they actually do deserve just a slap on the wrist or not.

[daveNYC]

No link, but the article I read on The Register sounded like the case was basically the same as the US one, just replace integrated browser with integrated media player, and Netscape with Real Player.

[Tebonas]

Roughly, yes.

Quote from the press release:

The European Commission has concluded, after a five-year investigation, that Microsoft Corporation broke European Union competition law by leveraging its near monopoly in the market for PC operating systems (OS) onto the markets for work group server operating systems(1) and for media players(2). Because the illegal behaviour is still ongoing, the Commission has ordered Microsoft to disclose to competitors, within 120 days, the interfaces(3) required for their products to be able to 'talk' with the ubiquitous Windows OS. Microsoft is also required, within 90 days, to offer a version of its Windows OS without Windows Media Player to PC manufacturers (or when selling directly to end users). In addition, Microsoft is fined € 497 million for abusing its market power in the EU.

(1) These are operating systems running on central network computers that provide services to office workers around the world in their day-to-day work such as file and printer sharing, security and user identity management.

(2) A media player is a software product that is able to play back music and video content over the Internet.

(3) The interfaces do not concern the Windows source code as this is not necessary to achieve the development of interoperable products. The interfaces are the hooks at the edge of the source code which allow one product to talk to another.

The main problem the EU sees here is that Microsoft is trying to force new standards upon the IT world. Standards that can only be achieved by Microsoft because they are unknown to anybody else. So no, its not just about the Media Player on your home computer. Its about the fact that you HAVE to use a Windows Server as well to stream that shit. Same with group servers.

This isn't about the clients, but about the servers.

[Valle]

This is a plot of course. Thought up by the swedish guy behind IKEA,so that he can now claim the title of the richest man in the world.

Ha ha Bill Gates,sucks to be you!