Guitar Hero 3: The Boss Matches Suck, the Rest Rocks

[kaid]

My gripe with GH3 is similar to the other versions I have played. The "hard" songs are either just so damn spastic or crappy heavy metal that I just don't like them enough to really get good at them. It kinda sucks that the higher you get the worse the songs are it usually turns into a double whammy for me.

Rock bands choices seem at least a bit more consistant but will have to see how it plays.

[Samwise]

I didn't expect it to take long to finish it on Medium.  Finishing it on Hard will probably take me the rest of my life.   

Also, there are all those bonus tracks and whatnot.

[Sky]

If you don't plan on having people over to play it, I wouldn't get it.

My fiancee totally loved me playing GTA:SA, just because she liked the soundtrack (and grudgingly admitted it had some decent humor). So I'm hoping it'll get her interested a bit. She'll never be a gamer, but I like to have a few things she's interested in.

[Sky]

What an odd night. Bought GH3 (and the EQ2 expansion) and hit the bar for the blues jam. Learned a few new tricks, two of my favorite guitarists were playing and the house band was an import from the Capital District, a decent blues band (they normally play Allmans stuff).

So I get home, install GH3. While it's installing, I pick up my (real) Gibson and cement in some of the new tricks, as well as a new rhythym chording line for Whipping Post I lifted from one of the guys, I'm now almost 100% on Whipping Post (irl, heh).

Game is installed, I plug in the controller and launch the game. An aside about the controller, as has been mentioned, definitely Fisher-Price material. But for an $80 package, it'd have been nice if they at least would have removed the 360 branding so it wasn't quite so obvious the PC controllers are last year's 360 controller overstock. Hey, at least I paid $20 less than you console folks, I guess.

Work through the tutorial because I've never played GH before. Seems simple enough, though a bit finicky. After the tutorial, I jump into practice mode. Looking at the track list, I figure I'll  try a tune I already know. This is my first GH3 mistake.

Talk Dirty to Me. Fun tune to play, I've known it on guitar since it came out (I'm old). I figure since I know it, I'll try it on expert. What a mess. So I try on Hard. Then on Medium. Finally, I can get 80% on Easy if I ignore the guitar and just pretend I'm playing a video game with music in the background, because otherwise I fuck up.

On harder modes, the clownschool attempt to distill an entire fretboard into 5 buttons vexes the shit out of me. On easy mode, the rhythym parts are fucked up...sometimes you're playing the drum part, sometimes the bass part, sometimes the guitar, and sometimes just some basic rhythym barely connected to the song. I did try tweaking the visual lag thing, and it seemed a bit better, that's when I started getting 80% on easy. But whenever I let down my guard and started actually getting into the songs I'd bomb. I had to keep seperating the song from the game, it was really annoying, actually.

I ran through the first four songs in practice mode and got them all to 80% or so. My left hand hurt. It might actually be good for some grip strength training, or it might just be a shitty ergonomic design on the guitar, dunno yet.  I'd say the single worst part is the right hand stuff, though. I'm a very syncopated guitarist, I like to play around the beat. There were some sections, especially the triplets in Barracuda, where just hitting the beat rather than playing the figure was super bothersome, because it made me feel like all those shitty wannabe metal guitarists in the 80s that couldn't syncopate a rhythym and would distill any song into simple downbeats.

Any tips from GH vets? I'd be especially interested in what any of the musicians here have to say. I was pretty upset at how difficult it was simply because I had to treat it as playing tetris rather than just grooving to some tunes. Much easier to just play actual guitar imo.

[MisterNoisy]

Any tips from GH vets? I'd be especially interested in what any of the musicians here have to say. I was pretty upset at how difficult it was simply because I had to treat it as playing tetris rather than just grooving to some tunes. Much easier to just play actual guitar imo.

Honestly, I think that people that actually play guitar have a harder time of it than people that don't, and comically enough, it's their musical inclination and habits (as in that syncopation example you gave) that get in the way - I may not have your chops on the real deal, but I definitely ran into a lot of similar problems.  The best tip I can offer is to watch the screen instead of listening to the music (as tragic as that is) and play stuff you're not familiar with first.  Also, start with medium instead of easy - only go back to easy to pad your career score after you're done with medium.

[Driakos]

I've got 10 songs left on Expert (not counting The Store, or song packs).  The tier I hit now is causing me to fail some, but challenge is good.  Last weekend I finally beat GH2 on Expert.  Once I got past Psychobilly Freakout, I sling-shotted (shat?)  through the next 3 songs, then only Institutionalized gave me any real trouble.  I got past Psychobilly Freakout, by deciding to only hit half the notes in two sections, instead of scrambling to hit all of the notes, and hitting 10%.  Crazy how it worked out.

It is a lot easier for me to hit the hammers and pull-offs in GH3.  The layout sometimes has too much sparkle motion, but I'm just so used to GH2.  I'll get over that.  Aside from the initial loading of the 360 version, the songs load up insane fast, like 3-5 seconds.  Nice improvement over GH2 360.  I do like how the notes are laid out in GH3, it seems much more ...  natural than some of the GH2 spreads.  It'll take me awhile to get used to all of the 3-note chords.  Fast transitions between xx x's, and x xx 's, into xxx's. 

Tier 1 songs really suck.  Tier 2 is not much better.  GH2 the boring songs were spread out a bit better.  Story of My Life... god it drags.  Rock and Roll All Night, has 3 sections where you sit there doing nothing.  Not fun.  Tier 3 and up, great fun.  Knights of Cydonia is awesome to play on Expert.  My favorite song layout so far.  The main riff in Paint it Black is sweet too.

[schild]

by deciding to only hit half the notes in two sections, instead of scrambling to hit all of the notes, and hitting 10%.  Crazy how it worked out.

Standard technique when it guarantees success. Did this in GH1 on problem songs also.

[Phildo]

Freya!

[Samwise]

On harder modes, the clownschool attempt to distill an entire fretboard into 5 buttons vexes the shit out of me.

As a guitarist, the thing you'll have to accept in order to like GH at all is that there is no way in hell that playing a thing with one "string" and five frets (four if you cheat and capo the top one, which I haven't done yet but am sometimes tempted to try) is going to be like playing a guitar with six strings and umpteen frets.  In fact, it wouldn't even be possible to play most of the GH songs on such an instrument.  So you just have to kind of let that go and play make believe.

On the other hand, I don't think I'd be quite as enthralled with Guitar Hero if I was a remotely professional-quality guitarist in real life.  Half the fun is being able to briefly delude myself into thinking that I'm actually playing the song.  The fact that you can play these songs for reals means that's not going to be so much of a thrill for you.

[Phildo]

If you capo the green button, it'll break all your chords that don't include it.

Also, I just realized that I love playing that stupid Pat Benatar song.  I hate myself so much.

[Samwise]

If you capo the green button, it'll break all your chords that don't include it.

Ahhh, is that it?  I'd pretty well convinced myself that you could keep a note pressed down indefinitely as long as you didn't need to play anything lower than it, but I hadn't verified that it worked for chords too.  Good to know.

[Selby]

Finally, I can get 80% on Easy if I ignore the guitar and just pretend I'm playing a video game with music in the background, because otherwise I fuck up.

EXACTLY what you have to do.  I got into trouble on Raining Blood, Ace of Spades, etc because I can play the whole songs through on guitar and they have gimped the chord progression and either added parts that aren't in the real guitar version to make the game "harder" or they completely ignore other aspects of the rythm.  I find myself playing the real song instead of what the game wants me to play and I end up failing or screwing up my score.  So I just look at the pretty colors and try and make my fingers do that regardless of what they really want to do.

[Sky]

Tier 1 songs really suck.  Tier 2 is not much better.  GH2 the boring songs were spread out a bit better.  Story of My Life... god it drags.  Rock and Roll All Night, has 3 sections where you sit there doing nothing.  Not fun. 

You're out of your mind. Do you sing along and get into it, or are you just gaming it? Rock and Roll All Night is an absolute blast. The sections where you aren't playing are for singing, headbanging and throwing horns.

As a guitarist, the thing you'll have to accept in order to like GH at all is that there is no way in hell that playing a thing with one "string" and five frets.

On the other hand, I don't think I'd be quite as enthralled with Guitar Hero if I was a remotely professional-quality guitarist in real life.  Half the fun is being able to briefly delude myself into thinking that I'm actually playing the song.  The fact that you can play these songs for reals means that's not going to be so much of a thrill for you.

Well, I was able to put some more time in last night. Finished the initial practice tunes and tried a medium tune, which was kinda hectic but I got an 82% or something on it. Mostly it's just getting used to the buttons and translating the onscreen images to frets. I'm getting mid-high 90s on easy now, so I'm getting the hang of it. As Selby mentions, the toughest parts are where they really stray from the actual guitar part.

It's still a hell of a lot of fun, even though it's kinda silly compared to actually learning the tunes and just playing them. Talked to a couple librarians that play, we might have it set up with the projector at work for the xmas party this year.

[murdoc]

It's still a hell of a lot of fun, even though it's kinda silly compared to actually learning the tunes and just playing them. Talked to a couple librarians that play, we might have it set up with the projector at work for the xmas party this year.

GH3 is at it's most fun when you have a group of people playing it and taking turns imo. Add some alcohol to the mix and it's a riot.

[Stephen Zepp]

I have zero chops as a musician, and am not very good at any of the GH stuff myself, but one thing I found is that for songs you know, do not play on easy or medium. The technique they use for "making it easier" is to blow over actual notes, and if you actually know the song, you want to actually play those notes--which is the wrong thing to do.

The only difficulties where I can even begin to play a song I know decently is on hard, and I --really-- wish they had an interim difficulty level where you had 4 active frets, but more accuracy in the notes played--I can't get to that 5th fret very consistently, but on hard I still try to play changes that don't actually show up on the screen.

[Sky]

This is my first GH game, so the progression from easy to medium is really good, because it's easing the control scheme barrier by starting with 3 then 4 buttons. From a strictly gaming standpoint, I think they did an excellent job with the difficulty level progression.

[Bokonon]

This is my first GH game, so the progression from easy to medium is really good, because it's easing the control scheme barrier by starting with 3 then 4 buttons. From a strictly gaming standpoint, I think they did an excellent job with the difficulty level progression.

All the GHs do that, from Easy to Hard, they add a new fret button, and add more notes/chords. GH3 tends to be easier in the early tiers at the difficulty of its predecessors, and much harder on the last tier (speaking from my challenges with Hard). I'm not impressed. If they really wanted to give the grognards a challenge, they should have added a bonus "Legendary" or "Heroic" tier for the schild's of the world. Heck, most people I know can barely get by on medium. I'm considered the "expert" and I can't even complete hard in GH3, unlike the last 3 games.

[WayAbvPar]

Or they could just send someone to your house to stomp your cock while you play. 

[Samwise]

The jump from medium to hard is a lot bigger than the jump from easy to medium.

  <- me playing on Easy

  <- me playing on Medium

  <- me playing on Hard

[Abagadro]

I'm down to One and Raining Blood in Hard.  I hit those nutso sections and the hook is just too fast to survive them.

[Phildo]

I can beat nearly everything on Expert, but in an attempt to unlock all that crazy expensive crap in the game's store I spent some time playing through on hard.  Raining Blood dominated me several times, so I think I quit.  Also, their remake of Devil Went down to Georgia made me cry.

[DeathInABottle]

I've played guitar for about 15 years.  Used to teach guitar, saxophone, and theory.  Play the piano a bit, and I can sing.  And I didn't have any of the adjustment problems in coming to GH that some of you are talking about.  There are a few songs where they screw up the tab, like in the chorus to "Killing in the Name" in GH2, but I've found very little inconsistency between what you hear coming out of the speakers and what you play.  I haven't played GH3 yet, but from the YouTube videos of "Raining Blood" on expert, I'd say it's pretty accurate tab.

[Sky]

You're totally my new hero.

[stray]

I can play Raining Blood on bass. 

[edit] Actually, y'know what Slayer song is the hardest of all (on guitar)?

Behind the Crooked Cross. I can fake the more melodic riffs like Raining Blood OK, but that song wears me out...Despite it being slower than the average Slayer song. Lots of downpicking.

[Samwise]

I can play Blackbird!

[Sky]

Lots of downpicking.

That's the skill I miss the most, I used to have sick downpicking skills. I can live without the fast scalar or sweeping stuff, but I do miss the downpicking.

We used to play Master of Puppets almost double-time compared to the album version, downpicked. So much heavier than alternate picking, though I fake it ok.

[Samwise]

Hey, back on GH3 for a sec.  Does anyone know if the USB XBox controllers work with the PC version?  I'd assume so, but I'd like to be reasonably sure before putting money down for one.

[Prospero]

According to the GameTap review, you're good to go.

From GameTap

I know what you're thinking: Why the hell would I play Guitar Hero with a mouse and keyboard? First, you wouldn’t want to. The PC and Mac versions are fully compatible with any USB Guitar Hero peripherals, so if you're dying to play the game but don't own a console, it’s there for you.

Apparently even the wireless controller for the XBox 360 works with the PC

http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/49827

[Sky]

THe controller included with the pc game is still branded with a 360 logo, so I'd assume they're compatible (and all 360 stuff thus far has been afaik).

[bhodi]

What I want to know is why can't I play GH1 and GH2 on my PS3 with the GH3 guitar? :(

[Cory Jacobs]

What I want to know is why can't I play GH1 and GH2 on my PS3 with the GH3 guitar? :(

because god hates you.

[HAMMER FRENZY]

I play guitar as well and I find that the tab on expert is pretty close to the real thing. Granted you don't learn to play guitar from GH, you do learn guitar pacing and various techniques, at least in theory.

For example, you learn to break down parts in a way guitarist do, like I play intro, verse, chorus, verse, chorus, breakdown, solo, chorus outro, random wankery. You learn that in GH and if you know the verse or chorus you can play it without looking at the screen which is kinda neat.

I also like that common guitar techniques like power chords, scales, chords, bar chords and arpegios are all there, in there own dumbed down form. For example all the metal style songs have there share of power chord progressions with palm muting gallops and silly solos with arpegios or long bended notes, Etc. Then the blues style songs have their scale style note progressions and bar chord stuff and normal chord progressions.
so the theoretical techniques are all present, minus tremelo bar usage in the "floating" sense. I really wish the bar was floating so you can bend up or down, and I really really really wish that the tremelo options had forced tremelo forms, so sometimes you can bend it like you want, and sometimes that bend had to get to a certain pitch, and how close you were to it and how long you held that specific pitch increased your score accordingly.

Also, and I know this is kinda weird, but I would like some chords to be held and consequtive down strums would play the next note int he chord in a string pattern.... so for example, you have in succession, green-yellow-blue, that would look like a bar chord pretty much if you laid your fingers in that oder. You often get chords like this when you play.

If you got that note progression, and you caught that green-yellow-blue made that chord shape, I think that you should be able to fret that chord then do 3 down strokes and get those notes out of that chord. This would just be another way that GH could emulate actual guitar techniques. This could either be a completely unecessary but a fun way to add some depth or they could designate sections that play this way, (like the arpegio sections that are notated differetnly) and they could even give you some sort of multiplier or something for playing specific sections like that.

Last, I would love if the next GH has some fx pedal that you can attach that had multiple little pedals on it so you can have different fx and sections of the song would call out the required effect needed. the pedal can have like 2 normal pedals and a wah thingie... now I am just dreaming...     

[Grand Design]

I think that you should be able to fret that chord then do 3 down strokes and get those notes out of that chord. This would just be another way that GH could emulate actual guitar techniques. This could either be a completely unecessary but a fun way to add some depth or they could designate sections that play this way, (like the arpegio sections that are notated differetnly) and they could even give you some sort of multiplier or something for playing specific sections like that.   

I had this same thought when I first started playing.  It seemed less like Guitar Hero and more like Robot Guitar Player 2000 because you had to play the exact same way every time through a song.  It would be much more enjoyable with even a little bit of freedom, like the ability to get notes out of a chord as you mentioned.  But even that small change would affect the game mechanics in such a way that the follow-the-skittles fret board would be useless.  It would require a more guided and less precise visual cue system.  Freestyle Hero?

[Sky]

You know....good point. Part of my problem is that I'm considered a sloppy guitarist from a metal standpoint, always have been, because I'm a 'feel' player and play behind the beat alot. I'm used to improvising the hell out of things, I blame my ADHD :P No fills, no extra triplet strums, no playing in swing 8ths, just Robot Guitar Hero.

I messed around with the higher difficulties, and while I like the way they work better than the low difficulties (they make more sense), I find it takes some time to get down. Time I feel is wasted not learning real songs...bah.

[HAMMER FRENZY]

Sky: You hit the nail on the head. I really like GH. It is a good game. But I have the ability to play this crap for real, so putting any amount of practice or even a moderate amount of play time for fun, is time I am taking away from actually playing real guitar. In my crusade against buying GH3 I have played so much actual guitar that I am getting better everyday. Not to sound like a jerk but I would rather play guitar than pretend to. I am glad it is there for people who don't wish to play guitar, but seriously, after a certain amount of invested time, it turns into wasted time cause you really could have learned that crap on guitar.