WoW presses the big EZ button

[Calantus]

I think this is great.  It won't get me to re-sub, but it's great.  I know a lot of people who feel the same way.  I know relatively few dimwit, crybaby, douche bags who are complaining.  They also don't like ice cream, or America.

Not liking america is not really on the same level of abject stupidity as disliking icecream.

[Fabricated]

Reitemizing and speeding up the leveling process for the 20-60 game is a fucking godsend.

It was really awesome when it we all first did it, but the expansion's incredibly polished content and mountain of quests revealed how shitty certain level ranges were in old-world content.

30-58 is okay for 5-7 levels, then fucking miserable for 5-7 levels, then sort of okay, repeat/etc. due to lack of quests/decent instances. This doesn't devalue content, it actually gives you a reason to run the shit again! Yeah, it won't feel quite as zomgepic to run through Stormgarde on an alt after this as it did when you needed 4 other people in the terribly itemized equipment to get it done...but that was when 90% of your server was doing that content and you could just get a group for anything. Most of the old world is a boneyard now, more and easier old-world stuff will get people into those zones again.

[Ironwood]

Actually, the only thing that bothers me about it is the removal of Elite Mobs.

I liked Elite mobs.  They kinda encouraged grouping and, if done properly, rewarded Soloing 'harder'.

[Simond]

If you could get a group. Try doing "LFG Stromgarde quests" or "LFG Troll Hinterland quests" nowadays and see how many people bite. As for the reitemization - the plan is that pretty much every instance boss will drop blue loot, which will be upgraded versions of their old, green items.

Oh, and the Alliance is getting a flightpath in northern STV in 2.3 as well.

[AngryGumball]

I cannot help but laff when I see people talk about how Outlands is polished compared to Azeroth.

[Ironwood]

Is it a medical condition or do you actually have some contrary position ?

 

[Jayce]

I'm not clear on whether they are really removing all, some or just a few quest elite mobs.

I don't think it's all.  I think it's just some quest mobs, like the ones in Stromgarde.  They already did this with the dragonkin in Dustwallow marsh.  They are normal mobs now, but a friend of mine has screenshots from when they used to be elites.

I hope they keep the random wandering elites like Mor'Ladim and the occasional outdoor elite boss.

[Dren]

I cannot help but laff when I see people talk about how Outlands is polished compared to Azeroth.

LAFF - Love At First Fright (musical)

You break out into song?  Very strange.

I, on the other hand, agree with people that state Outlands was done better than Azeroth, because, well, I played through both of them.  4 times!

[Dren]

They already did this with the dragonkin in Dustwallow marsh.  They are normal mobs now, but a friend of mine has screenshots from when they used to be elites.

I can confirm.  They were elites when I was leveling up through my first time.  I recently went back there with a lower alt and they are normal now.  It was a major pain in the ass when they were elite.  It made no sense as fighting them in a group gained you nothing and they were just a block to some standard normal level quests.  Plus, it locked the whole zone from gathering herbs...herbs that weren't elite at all.  That was a nice change that made sense.

I agree that the wandering elites should just be left alone.  If you couldn't kill them, no big deal, just skip it.  Yes, I've fallen victim to them multiple times in the past, but it was kind of a fun element of, "Oh, you got me again, you bastard!," rather than making feel like I should just quit.

[Calantus]

I cannot help but laff when I see people talk about how Outlands is polished compared to Azeroth.

Get to 60 on alliance in the old world with minimal rested and without grinding. It's practically (and possibly, literally) impossible. Do the same with 58-70 in outland and it's easy. Hell, you'll have at least one zone completely untoucned by the time you hit 70 if you did any instances at all.

[stu]

They already did this with the dragonkin in Dustwallow marsh.  They are normal mobs now, but a friend of mine has screenshots from when they used to be elites.

I agree that the wandering elites should just be left alone.  If you couldn't kill them, no big deal, just skip it.  Yes, I've fallen victim to them multiple times in the past, but it was kind of a fun element of, "Oh, you got me again, you bastard!," rather than making feel like I should just quit.

I agree as well. I kind of liked having to watch that wandering elite out of the corner of my eye while I was in Dustwallow Marsh- on top of the fact that I'm on a PvP server and was in a dangerous zone.  Other than that, I'm all for the posted changes.

[murdoc]

Plus, I didn't find anything more satisfying then going back a few levels later and wtfpwning whatever wandering elite gave you troubles earlier.

[Ironwood]

Fairly sure those fucking Sons of Arugal would still find some way to own me at 70.


Evil bastards.

[angry.bob]

Plus, I didn't find anything more satisfying then going back a few levels later and wtfpwning whatever wandering elite gave you troubles earlier.

Not elite, but the most underconned motherfucker in the history of MMO's. I don't know how many level 20-somethings I saw come back to his camp for revenge, only to get their asses beat.

[Morat20]

I've said this before, but TBC (including the new starter areas) shows how much Blizzard learned from making and releasing WoW, and how much they incorporated that into their expansion.

The sad thing is that even before they learned all this, their newbie experience was head and shoulders above anything that came before.  Which is less a testament to Blizzard's genius and more a testament to the incompetency of the rest of the industry.

I think it's a fairly good sign. Their motto appears to be "We can do better" which certainly beats the shit out of the industry's prior motto of "Eh, Good Enough" and "Fuck you, assholes, you play my game MY WAY".

[Morat20]

If you could get a group. Try doing "LFG Stromgarde quests" or "LFG Troll Hinterland quests" nowadays and see how many people bite. As for the reitemization - the plan is that pretty much every instance boss will drop blue loot, which will be upgraded versions of their old, green items.

Oh, and the Alliance is getting a flightpath in northern STV in 2.3 as well.

About fucking time. Jeesus that whole zone sucks balls, even with a mount.

As for the elites -- the understanding I had of it was that they're getting rid of a lot of the outdoor group quests, not so much the occasional wandering elite. Stormgarde is a good damn example of a pointless cockblock.

Still, I hope they keep that level 35 gold elite that wanders Raven Hill. That fucker has caused more deaths than any other mob in the game (outside of AV, at least) and I made it a habit to go waste him every time I was on my way to ZG, back in the day.

[Musashi]

Fairly sure those fucking Sons of Arugal would still find some way to own me at 70.


Evil bastards.

Dude!  At the end of that 7 day pre-beta thing they had, around 10 of my friends and I who were all in the low 20's, gathered together and raided one.  Posted a killshot on the website and everything.  God damn were we noobs then.

So yea, I agree with you on the elite mob thing.  Some things shouldn't be fucked with.  Don't think the Sons of Arugal were involved in any quests.  But overall, these changes are good.

[Phred]

Actually, I generally avoid questing and mostly run instances. Even when I do quest, a serious hunk of the XP I gain is from mob killing.

I guess killing furbolgs in Feralas for the 7th time doesn't make me that horny.

But, I suppose I'll have to get in the mood again.

It's even worse than that. Now their faction is absolutely useless there's even less reason to do it.

[Morat20]

It's even worse than that. Now their faction is absolutely useless there's even less reason to do it.

Which reminds me -- I got to go grind CC rep and get the Moonglade flight path. I never did bother with those grinds at 60, but I suspect it'd be pretty easy now.

[Venkman]

That's the thing I hate about Factions. Every new content patch makes another one irrelevant.

The whole concept of speeding up the 20-60 game just makes all sorts of sense. It also makes me glad because it means they won't waste time making yet another 1-20 zone progression for some new race of class. A whole lotta people gonna be farming Hellfire though when Death Knight comes though :)

Question: anyone know if Northrend is for level 70-80 only? Or will it start lower?

I, on the other hand, agree with people that state Outlands was done better than Azeroth, because, well, I played through both of them.  4 times!

Completely agree. Heck, just Netherstorm blows away 90% of Azeroth. I wish I went there before 70. And when I got there I wondered how anyone would get there before it. BC was a whole new boxed game, just wrapped in the required-58 shell and called an "expansion". I'd love to know what percentage of the playerbase didn't get it, in those territories that could get it at all. Gotta be single-digits.

Not elite (B'Dynn), but the most underconned motherfucker in the history of MMO's. I don't know how many level 20-somethings I saw come back to his camp for revenge, only to get their asses beat.

Completely agree here too. I'd go back to him every 10th level with my Bard just to enact my revenge, and to break GF zoneline trains. Good times.

[Phred]

They already did this with the dragonkin in Dustwallow marsh.  They are normal mobs now, but a friend of mine has screenshots from when they used to be elites.

I can confirm.  They were elites when I was leveling up through my first time.  I recently went back there with a lower alt and they are normal now.  It was a major pain in the ass when they were elite.  It made no sense as fighting them in a group gained you nothing and they were just a block to some standard normal level quests.  Plus, it locked the whole zone from gathering herbs...herbs that weren't elite at all.  That was a nice change that made sense.

I agree that the wandering elites should just be left alone.  If you couldn't kill them, no big deal, just skip it.  Yes, I've fallen victim to them multiple times in the past, but it was kind of a fun element of, "Oh, you got me again, you bastard!," rather than making feel like I should just quit.

Swamp of Sorrows got a redo too and all the green elite dragonkin are now normal mobs. Same as Dustwallow it made no sense to have them non-elite, asit just made you have to dodge around them on your mount. I dont think I ever remember anyone even close to getting killed by one. Probably someone at Blizzard's office asked why they were elite and no one could remember or something.

[Phred]

It's even worse than that. Now their faction is absolutely useless there's even less reason to do it.

Which reminds me -- I got to go grind CC rep and get the Moonglade flight path. I never did bother with those grinds at 60, but I suspect it'd be pretty easy now.

Ya I did it on my shaman last week. 1 quest and a couple of feather hand ins and I was unfriendly already.

[Righ]

I think we're thinking the same thing, but in case we aren't - what Newbies?  They have 9 million customers.

What newbies? They had 8 million customers six months previously. That's more newbies (who've stuck around) in half a year than the largest MMORPG prior to WoW. Newbies are really important to them. The fact that they're making the mid-level experience more fun is an indication that they give a fuck. This isn't just about converting newbies into raiders, its about reducing the churn among newbies who don't have scores of people to run their alts through mid-level quests.

[Jayce]

If you don't think that there are real genuine newbies around, you clearly haven't started a new character lately.

[Musashi]

There's probably still genuine noobs buying eq1.

[Sogrinaugh]

Mixed feelings.  Some shit i hope the leave be, like the aforementioned sons of arugal, those guys are just a sacred part of noob UD leveling experience.

Others, like the giants in Azshara that are required for a few quests (notably the love potion that acts as a "key" to the second half of BRD) are fucking annoying.  NEVER found a group for those, 90%+ people don't give a rats ass about finishing an instance for its own sake.  By the time i could solo them, BRD didnt matter anymore and completing it would feel cheap because i massively outleveled it.

Outland vs Azeroth... i'd definately have to say more TLC was put into azeroth.  Outland is better at feeding you your happy pellets are percisely calculated intervals.  Azeroth doesn't have that same level of mechanic perfection, but it is far more memorable.  I see all this STV hate, and i can understand the opposing faction driving you nuts because to this day it is one of the choicest spots for people to camp, but the actaul design of the zone is amazing.  You have the port town with the goblins, the pirates they are at war with, Juarssic Park in the jungle, king kong off on an island (complete with captive), Venture Co outpost and the infamous (never spelt correctly, including now) Nessingway's Expedition with its grind-happy hunting quests.  Little troll ruins that block LoS (the entire zone obscures LoS actually), which increases the likelyhood of impromptu pvp conflict.

Also always thought Both EPL and WPL were very story-rich and immersive as well.  Searing Gorge was/is great (after they added all those quests).  The best thing about WoW was and still is the game world.  This is not to say that Outland doesn't have some cool areas, but overall does not provide as viscerally satisfying experience.

[Sjofn]

Hogger is apparently still elite, so I think that maybe what they meant were the mobs JUST outside dungeons got un-elited. I hope that's the case, deep down. Raven Hill wouldn't be the same without Mor'Ladim killing me 8 times.

[WindupAtheist]

This thread almost makes me wanna play WoW.  One of the best times I had was me and a bunch of guildmates going to STV and out to that island specifically to gank King Kong and take screenshots.  And then running around ganking Alliance afterward.

[Morat20]

This thread almost makes me wanna play WoW.  One of the best times I had was me and a bunch of guildmates going to STV and out to that island specifically to gank King Kong and take screenshots.  And then running around ganking Alliance afterward.

Shit, I missed that -- I never did go to that island. I guess my main has a trip to make.

[WindupAtheist]

He's like level 52 elite or something like that, so I guess a 70 could solo him?  You'll feel like a badass if you do, he's quite literally King Kong size.

[SurfD]

Heck, most level 56, or so people should be able to solo the Big Ape. Just depends on what your gear / spec is.  Pretty sure i solo killed him on both my mage and my shaman at around that level.  I soloed that annoying giant on the island out in front of booty bay at like 2 levels under him on my shaman by casting water walk, and frost shock kiteing him into BB where i let the town guards take him down for the kill :P

[Phred]

Heck, most level 56, or so people should be able to solo the Big Ape. Just depends on what your gear / spec is.  Pretty sure i solo killed him on both my mage and my shaman at around that level.  I soloed that annoying giant on the island out in front of booty bay at like 2 levels under him on my shaman by casting water walk, and frost shock kiteing him into BB where i let the town guards take him down for the kill :P

I thought water walk dropped the second you got in combat and couldnt be cast whiile in combat?

[Fabricated]

A few of Azeroth's zones have stronger/better presented stories that tie into the areas, I'll say that. Duskwood is my favorite zone in the whole game, and I could kill to have Blizzard revisit the story of the area because it was really well done and weaved into the lore of the area. I keep hoping to hear that we'll be able to run into Kara's basement to get the Scythe of Elune from the dark riders.

I think all of the SI:7->VC->Ravenholdt stuff was amazing but they kinda dropped that...

[Paelos]

Yes, Duskwood is like Halloween year round. It's really really cool looking and fun with great quests. Compared to a place like Red Ridge, it was a welcome change.

[Selby]

Compared to a place like Red Ridge, it was a welcome change.

Honestly, I considered Red Ridge to be the reason I stopped playing Alliance for almost a year because of how imbalanced and crappy that zone is.  They are changing aspects of it, but it still isn't that great of a place.  Poor quest rewards and low drop rates make it one place I desire skipping most of the time.