Help me with my new-computer problem.

[Chenghiz]

I built a new computer today and after surmounting a few problems like the motherboard not having enough power and so on I'm at the point where I'm trying to get Vista installed onto the fresh hard drive. However I keep running into various error messages which don't appear to have any correlation as to when they appear.

The first error I get is at the black screen where the system is loading the files to run the Vista installer. At that point I get an I/O error related to the DVD drive (I have been using this drive for a year or so in my old computer without any problems). Alternately at that point I have gotten (once) an error that the files may be corrupt (I bought this DVD on Friday and it is as far as I can see unmarred).

If I pass the gauntlet of these two errors I will get to Step 1 of the Vista install process, where I am greeted with a window that tells me that the computer is missing necessary drivers for that very drive and that I should insert a disc or floppy with said drivers therein. This is confusing because the drive is reading the disc, and I've never had do install drivers for a simple DVDR drive before with Windows, and don't have any discs for it.

I'd greatly appreciate it if any of you could shed some light on this terribly frustrating issue.

[Trippy]

If you have a working computer with a CD burner download a memtest ISO and burn it to a disc and run it on your new computer:

http://www.memtest.org/

[Engels]

So, I/O error on DVD drive. Corrupt stuff on vista disk, and then missing drivers for that DVD drive.. I smell a broken IDE controller on the DVD, or possibly the MOBO. So, basically, get another DVD/CD drive and test it out.

[Chenghiz]

Rereading my mobo manual more closely, it tells me I will need to install drivers for the IDE/SATA controller during the OS install, and that I shouls just insert the floppy at that point. I didn't get a floppy with the motherboard. I do have a CD with the drivers though, and Vista assures me that I can remove the Vista disc and put in the driver disc, so I do. But on the browse dialogue, Vista is showing me the Vista installer disc instead of the driver disc I put in. I tried putting the drivers from the CD onto a USB drive but that wasn't detected either. Any ideas on how to get Vista to see the driver cd?

[edit] @ Engels: I tried the other DVD drive I own but that wasn't even detected by the BIOS during the boot process. That certainly seems like a strong indicator of a borked controller. 

[Trippy]

Huh? What MB are you using? That sounds wrong.

During the Vista install did you manually eject the disc or did you do it through the dialog box?

[Chenghiz]

It's an ABit AB9 Pro. The driver install is somewhat understandable as the mobo's geared for SATA use, not IDE. I just can't afford to buy new SATA drives for it yet. I manually ejected the disc during install... I'll try the dialogue this time.

[Chenghiz]

The dialogue won't let me rightclick, so there's no other way to eject the disc other than manually. Here's a shot of the dialogue for reference:



I'm going to hit the hay and have a go at this again tomorrow after classes. Thanks for your help thus far. 

[Engels]

So, basically, its either a defective mobo, or you need to go to a 2nd computer with a floppy and a cd drive and make a floppy of the IDE controller drivers it wants.

Here's what suspicious to me, however; I've definately heard of IDE drivers that one installs after installing the OS that supposedly make the IDE interface faster. The computer I'm working on now itself has said feature. However, I have never heard of a mobo that required IDE drivers -to perform the installation of an OS-. I mean, it could be true, but its such a glaringly obvious design flaw that someone at A-Bit needs a bitchslap, especially since in this day and age, computers aren't made with floppys.

Another long winded work around would be to install Windows XP on the computer, and see how that goes. If it works, you can then install the Vista IDE drivers onto a floppy, and then install Vista.

[Murgos]

For what it's worth I agree with Trippy's first assessment.

Check your RAM.

edit: The DVD/IDE/SATA driver issues smell like nonsense.  When you POST do the drives in question show up?  If so, that is not the issue.

[Yegolev]

Just for completeness, what is your power supply rated and what hardware do you have hanging off of it?

[Engels]

edit: The DVD/IDE/SATA driver issues smell like nonsense.  When you POST do the drives in question show up?  If so, that is not the issue.

That's the thing; he put in a second CD drive that didn't show up in POST.

[Trippy]

edit: The DVD/IDE/SATA driver issues smell like nonsense.  When you POST do the drives in question show up?  If so, that is not the issue.

That's the thing; he put in a second CD drive that didn't show up in POST.

That's more likely just a jumper issue or he has the wrong type of IDE cable.

Really there should be no need to install any IDE driver on an install.

[Engels]

How many kinds of IDE cables are there? Do you mean a 40 pin vs an 80 pin, or is there some new standard I'm ignorant of?

[Sky]

The IDE driver install thing is bunk. There's another problem, probably mobo imo. Bad connectors, mebbe, if it's not showing in post.

Check BIOS make sure everything looks legit.

Maybe try ye olde win98 boot disc just to see if you can access cd drive from command prompt.

[Trippy]

How many kinds of IDE cables are there? Do you mean a 40 pin vs an 80 pin, or is there some new standard I'm ignorant of?

40 wire vs 80 wire (both have the same 40 pin connector).

[Engels]

http://oldfiles.org.uk/powerload/cdrom.htm

That might be of help in making a DVD/CD rom testing floppy. I've yet to hear of any IDE optical device that didn't work with the oakcdrom driver.

I still harbor a sneaking suspicion that during installation, its handing off control to another set of drivers, or is expecting to do so, in any case. I've had a similar problem with Vista back in beta on my computer; I had a second partition with WinXP on it, and I just dumped the vista contents onto that partition and when the DVD rom died after the initial boot, I redirected the install to the second partition and the install files there.

You could go old school, create a partition about the size of the Vista DVD, then boot from a floppy that allows both fast copying and reading of NTFS format on a hard drive and just copy the whole content of the Vista DVD to that small partition. Then, during install when the DVD flakes out, redirect the install to the small partition with the install files.

[Chenghiz]

Okay here's my hardware setup.

- motherboard: Abit AB9 Pro
- cpu: Intel Core2 Duo
- gpu: EVGA Geforce 8800 GTS
- ram: 2x Crucial 1GB sticks
- psu: FSP Group AX450-PN (450 watt)

One DVD drive is an older Sony model and the other is a Samsung.

As for jumpers and the IDE cable, the DVD is master on the cable for mechanical reasons (the cable comes from below and the HDD is below the optical in the case) and both drives' jumpers are on Cable Select. I'm using the (one) IDE cable that was provided with the motherboard so I'd be surprised if it was the wrong kind.

I noticed in the BIOS under 'Standard CMOS Features' there is a list that goes
> IDE Channel 1 Master: None
> IDE Channel 1 Slave: None
> IDE Channel 2 Master: None
> IDE Channel 2 Slave: None
and so on but the BIOS manual doesn't really elaborate on what that means. When I go into the options for each channel, it has a selection for 'IDE HDD Auto-Detection which will pop up a window saying 'Detecting Hard Drive' and then close without doing anything. Below that is The master (None, Auto, Manual) and Access Mode (CHS, LBA, Large, Auto). Both are at Auto currently in all channels.

The fact that they're all set to None seems suspicious to me, but I am only sort of knowledgeable about BIOS things.

Sorry I can't get any pictures for you right now but I hope you can follow what I'm talking about.

I`m thinking of just buying an SATA hard drive for now so I can just get the damn system working.

[Furiously]

I've had something like that happen before by not having a cable attached perfectly. I'd pull the ribbon cables off the HD and DVD and put them back on again. (Do it on both ends).

Then I'd run memtest.

[Sky]

Switch the drives on the cable (even if you have to remove them temporarily). Do you have another IDE cable? If so, slap the optical on the secondary channel. Also, make sure jumpers on the IDE devices are properly set.

[Bunk]

So it lets you insert a CD into a drive and start the installation, but that drive is not showing up on any of your IDE channels in your BIOS. That my friend is officially weird. Unfortunately, I have nothing more to add.

[Chenghiz]

I've had something like that happen before by not having a cable attached perfectly. I'd pull the ribbon cables off the HD and DVD and put them back on again. (Do it on both ends).

Then I'd run memtest.

I've been swapping the drives and cables around like a motherfucker, so if that was an issue I would have solved it by now. I will run a memtest though, later tonight I guess.

Switch the drives on the cable (even if you have to remove them temporarily). Do you have another IDE cable? If so, slap the optical on the secondary channel. Also, make sure jumpers on the IDE devices are properly set.

You know I feel kind of dumb that I haven't just taken the drives out of the case and wired them so the HDD was primary. I'll give all of these a shot after dinner and see how it goes.

[Murgos]

Yeah, dork around with the drive locations and cables and the jumpers on the drives and check if they autodetect in the BIOS UI.  What I mean is put the HDD on master and boot and check BIOS than do the same with DVD drive INDIVIDUALLY.

If they both show up in the BIOS as autodetected properly then what I imagine is going on is that you are using Cable Select with a non Cable Select cable in which case I wouldn't guarantee what kind of error you would see.  If that is the case all you have to do is designate one as master the other as slave and enjoy.  If neither drive gets autodetected try a different cable (and maybe even a third one, I've had several cables not work).  If neither drive shows up still then I would blame your IDE controller and RMA the MB.

If one drive shows and not the other then I would think one of the drives is frazzled.

If the drives are autodetected but you still can't install the OS then we can start looking for other culprits but first things first.  The first rule of troubleshooting is to isolate as many variables as possible which means make only 1 change at a time and go back to a neutral state between each change (well the real first rule is to check the power cord  :-D ).

[Chenghiz]

both drives' jumpers are on Cable Select

Okay, I claim the idiot of the month award. They weren't. I set em to that and it didn't work although POST finally showed both drives. I then set the DVD to master and HDD to Slave, and vista installed without a hitch and without asking for drivers.

[Engels]

heh

[Chenghiz]

First post from Vista itt. (Vista is shiny!)

[Sky]

idepwned

Glad to hear it was an easy one! :) I admit to consider Vista just because there's an extra 1% shiny in Bioshock. Sad.