*Official* 2007 College Football Thread

[SnakeCharmer]

What a stupid heisman vote, anyone with half a brain knows that Dixon deserved this.

Besides his stats versus Dixon, which Abagadro has listed, Tebow was the Florida Gators offense this year.  There is no more valuable player to the team than Tebow is to Florida, with the possible exception of McFadden to Arkansas.  The problem I had with McFadden being in the running is that, like Tebow, teams will gameplan to stop him because they know if they do, they win - and several teams stopped McFadden dead in his tracks this year.

Get over your reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeSECoveratedreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee hate.

Tebow:           
29 passing TD vs 6 Ints for 3,132 yards
22 rushing TD, rushed for 836 yards
Total:  51 TD, 3,968 yards

Dixon:
20 passing TD vs 4 Ints for 2,136 yards
9 rushing TD, rushed for 538 yards
Total:  29 TD, 2,674 yards

That's just a difference of 22 touchdowns and 1,294 yards.  Yeah, that's a close one!

Edit:  Not even worth sinking to his level of intelligence

[Paelos]

Tebow winning was a joke. The Heisman was a joke this year. Nobody should win the Heisman on a 3 loss season, ever. I don't care if you scored 50 TDs, you fucking lost.

IMO, Colt Brennan got screwed. Nobody played better to win games with quality stats. 4000+ yards? Check. 38 TDs? Check. Undefeated season? Check. Senior? Check.

Honestly, was Teebow worth more to Florida than Brennan was to Hawaii? I'd say no. Brennan should have walked away with this thing if it wasn't a cocksucking contest.

[SnakeCharmer]

Tebow winning was a joke. The Heisman was a joke this year. Nobody should win the Heisman on a 3 loss season, ever. I don't care if you scored 50 TDs, you fucking lost.

IMO, Colt Brennan got screwed. Nobody played better to win games with quality stats. 4000+ yards? Check. 38 TDs? Check. Undefeated season? Check. Senior? Check.

Honestly, was Teebow worth more to Florida than Brennan was to Hawaii? I'd say no. Brennan should have walked away with this thing if it wasn't a cocksucking contest.

Wrong.

In believing that, you'd have to believe that the defense is far more important than it should be to who wins the Heisman.  The Heisman is the award for the best college football player, not team/offense/defense.

Brennan was a victim of playing in a weak conference.  If he were to play in a real conference, and not the WAC, then maybe.  And didn't Tommy Chang set the mark for all time leader in NCAA passing and never got a nod for the Heisman?

Besides, I'd say the people that voted know a little bit more than a bunch of forum warriors anyway.

[Montague]

Grats to Tebow. Yes, the scheme in Florida is tailor made to him and inflates his stats but the Gators did reasonably well with it and very few players in the nation could pull it off.

[Murgos]

IMO, Colt Brennan got screwed. Nobody played better to win games with quality stats. 4000+ yards? Check. 38 TDs? Check. Undefeated season? Check. Senior? Check.

Glossed over rape charge?  Check.

He could have tripled his stats and been playing for OSU and still not won the Heisman.

On January 28, 2004, Brennan entered the dorm room of a University of Colorado coed uninvited and, according to the coed "exposed himself and fondled her."[3] Brennan, who was intoxicated at the time of the incident, was arrested and eventually pleaded guilty to charges of burglary and trespassing, but a guilty verdict for unlawful sexual contact was vacated by the court for lack of evidence.

Basically, he didn't ejaculate and no one else saw it otherwise he would be doing 5 in the state pen.

Go to jail, go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200.

[SnakeCharmer]

Grats to Tebow. Yes, the scheme in Florida is tailor made to him and inflates his stats but the Gators did reasonably well with it and very few players in the nation could pull it off.

Hows the 'scheme' for a qb like Tebow any different than say, a pro-style offense, that is tailored towards a drop back passer such as Matt Stafford of UGA or Sam Bradford of OU?  Matt Ryan of BC?  Every quarterback is in a system.  They're all system qbs.  They're all systems designed to maximize the effectiveness of a particular style of play of a particular player.

Inflates his stats?  What the fuck ever.  He's still got to make the runs, he's still got to make the throws.  Inflating it would imply that he didn't pass for x yards or run for y yards, or score z touchdowns doing it, that it's somehow manufactured.

The system qb argument is such a paper tiger....

[Paelos]

He's a showboating dick, a sophomore, and he plays for Florida.

Seriously, fuck that kid, and fuck this year's Heisman. Nobody will take it seriously in years to come. Everyone will look back on this year and think: yeah that was just shitty and bizarre.

[SnakeCharmer]

He's a showboating dick, a sophomore, and he plays for Florida.

Seriously, fuck that kid, and fuck this year's Heisman. Nobody will take it seriously in years to come. Everyone will look back on this year and think: yeah that was just shitty and bizarre.

It's only showboating if anyone besides UGA does it, amirite?

So what if he's a sophmore?  What does that have to do with it?

If helmet had a G on on instead of a Gator, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

[cmlancas]

He's a showboating dick, a sophomore, and he plays for Florida.

Seriously, fuck that kid, and fuck this year's Heisman. Nobody will take it seriously in years to come. Everyone will look back on this year and think: yeah that was just shitty and bizarre.

If a freshman came into a program, recorded 200 sacks at a D-I school/ran for 70 TDs, et al, would this be an issue?

What the fuck does class standing have to do with an award for overall performance? I don't even really like UF; I hate their fans and can't stand that such success comes to such shitty boosters, but I think Tebow played pretty amazingly this year.

I can only think of Dorsey at LSU who might be more deserving, but when was the last time a DE won a Heisman?

[Montague]

Grats to Tebow. Yes, the scheme in Florida is tailor made to him and inflates his stats but the Gators did reasonably well with it and very few players in the nation could pull it off.

Hows the 'scheme' for a qb like Tebow any different than say, a pro-style offense, that is tailored towards a drop back passer such as Matt Stafford of UGA or Sam Bradford of OU?  Matt Ryan of BC?  Every quarterback is in a system.  They're all system qbs.  They're all systems designed to maximize the effectiveness of a particular style of play of a particular player.

Inflates his stats?  What the fuck ever.  He's still got to make the runs, he's still got to make the throws.  Inflating it would imply that he didn't pass for x yards or run for y yards, or score z touchdowns doing it, that it's somehow manufactured.

The system qb argument is such a paper tiger....

Tebow has inflated stats in that he runs a modernized single-wing offense and has no running back to take away touches and touchdowns. The second leading rusher for Florida was a wide receiver. I don't know of any pro-style formation offense where the starting running back ran for 102 yards... all season.

I don't know if you noticed in your nerd rage but in my second sentence I gave him props for getting the numbers regardless. Sorry if I wasn't wearing my SEC kneepads. 

[Paelos]

He's a showboating dick, a sophomore, and he plays for Florida.

Seriously, fuck that kid, and fuck this year's Heisman. Nobody will take it seriously in years to come. Everyone will look back on this year and think: yeah that was just shitty and bizarre.

It's only showboating if anyone besides UGA does it, amirite?

So what if he's a sophmore?  What does that have to do with it?

If helmet had a G on on instead of a Gator, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Are you serious? You think I'd want that piece of shit on our team? You think I'm referring to the way he played in GA/FL? Hell no, he didn't get a lot of chances to jump around like an idiot anytime he got a first down while pumping his fists. I was happy to watch our guys dance in his face because it was a pre-emptive strike to every other game he played. No thanks, I like to win the Georgia/Florida game. Guess what? This kid has a lovely trophey to sit on and wasn't even close to a BCS bowl or an SEC championship. The Heisman is a joke and should be tucked way under the file of "Prom King" for the season.

There's a difference between a team celebration and being a grandstanding fool over and over and over again. The day I give that kid any credit at all is the day he hoists an SEC Championship Trophey over his head.

[SnakeCharmer]

You ARE aware that Florida won the SEC and NC last year, yes?  And that he played significantly as a freshman?

Interesting sidestep around the showboating thing, though.

Your hypocrisy is a shining beacon, sir.

[cmlancas]

Put down the



please. He played well. I still don't see who else stood out more.

[Paelos]

You ARE aware that Florida won the SEC and NC last year, yes?  And that he played significantly as a freshman?

Interesting sidestep around the showboating thing, though.

Your hypocrisy is a shining beacon, sir.

He ran the ball in 2006 and he wasn't a real QB. That's it. He wasn't the starter and Florida fans were idiots for shitting all over Chris Leak when he knew how to win big games. Florida has had a PATHETIC running game since 2004 when they had Ciatric Fason. The system QB argument is a legit one for Tebow's stats being inflated due to them having a single dimension.

Hyprocritcal? Hell yes it is, and I'm fine with that. You should be too. Nobody that watches a college football team religiously can claim to be devoid of hyprocrisy in an argument. That's what being a good fan is all about. I hate Florida, and I hate Tim Tebow, but I will give him credit if he actually wins ballgames as a starter and leads Florida to an SEC title. If he doesn't, he's a failure and no amount of hardware will convince me otherwise.

In that respect, I hold all SEC Quarterbacks to that standard, including UGA's. The jury is still out on whether Stafford will be considered a giant failure for UGA. I will say this though, UGA has a much better chance than Florida next season because we actually have a balanced attack with Moreno on the ground and Stafford in the air. A few teams will find a way to contain and outscore Tebow, and Florida will lose because that's all they have.

[Murgos]

             
Knowshon Moreno     239 carries 1273 yds 5.3 yds/car 80(TD) long 12 TD
Matthew Stafford     180 comp  325 att  2348 yds  55.4%  7.23 yds/att  18 TD 9 int  128.8 rat

Tim Tebow    194 carries  838 yds  4.3 yds/car  25 (long)  22 TD
Tim Tebow     217 comp  317 att  3132 yds  68.5%  9.88 yds/att  29 TD 6 int 177.8 rat

The award isn't for best offense, team with most wins or any other team related thing.  Quit being a dork and give the kid the credit he deserves for doing something NO ONE else has done.

[Paelos]

             
Knowshon Moreno     239 carries 1273 yds 5.3 yds/car 80(TD) long 12 TD
Matthew Stafford     180 comp  325 att  2348 yds  55.4%  7.23 yds/att  18 TD 9 int  128.8 rat

Tim Tebow    194 carries  838 yds  4.3 yds/car  25 (long)  22 TD
Tim Tebow     217 comp  317 att  3132 yds  68.5%  9.88 yds/att  29 TD 6 int 177.8 rat

The award isn't for best offense, team with most wins or any other team related thing.  Quit being a dork and give the kid the credit he deserves for doing something NO ONE else has done.

I told you exactly when he'll get my respect. Seriously, I can't believe anyone cares about anything besides winning games in college football.

[Zetleft]

             
Knowshon Moreno     239 carries 1273 yds 5.3 yds/car 80(TD) long 12 TD
Matthew Stafford     180 comp  325 att  2348 yds  55.4%  7.23 yds/att  18 TD 9 int  128.8 rat

Tim Tebow    194 carries  838 yds  4.3 yds/car  25 (long)  22 TD
Tim Tebow     217 comp  317 att  3132 yds  68.5%  9.88 yds/att  29 TD 6 int 177.8 rat

The award isn't for best offense, team with most wins or any other team related thing.  Quit being a dork and give the kid the credit he deserves for doing something NO ONE else has done.

I told you exactly when he'll get my respect. Seriously, I can't believe anyone cares about anything besides winning games in college football.

Cause the heisman isn't awarded to the best team.  Yes team records usually do factor in the voting and being in the title hunt is the norm  but ultimately its an individual award to the best player.   Plus you have to admit this year no team has dominated and just about everyone was in the hunt at some point :p   Hawaii has a weak schedule so he had little chance of getting it especially when Tebow put up such huge against tougher teams. 

[Nebu]

The Heisman is a glamor award given to players at the money positions.  As far as I recall, no interior lineman on offense or defense has ever won the award and I can think of many seasons where that position contained the best player in the NCAA.  Hell, there are like two other awards (Maxwell and Walter Camp) given to the "best player in college football" as well.  Arguing about Tebow winning is pretty silly as it's really tough to decide if any of the people on the ballot were really the "best player in college football" anyway.

[Paelos]

In reality, I just hate individual awards in a team sport like football. It's the ultimate team sport where every man has to be functioning well every play or you're going to suck. Then, we try to award "The Best" player out there. It's just too shallow for me. The fact that Tebow won it just makes me hate the Heisman more than I did before.

[WayAbvPar]

I just pray that McFadden somehow falls into Seattle's lap during the draft. After being passed over by the Heisman voters twice, he is going to hit The League with a giant chip on his shoulder and something to prove.

[cmlancas]

UGA QBs have been failures since Zaire. Sorry. 

[Zetleft]

The Heisman is a glamor award given to players at the money positions.  As far as I recall, no interior lineman on offense or defense has ever won the award and I can think of many seasons where that position contained the best player in the NCAA.  Hell, there are like two other awards (Maxwell and Walter Camp) given to the "best player in college football" as well.  Arguing about Tebow winning is pretty silly as it's really tough to decide if any of the people on the ballot were really the "best player in college football" anyway.

Well if you want to really get into it we can also bring the whole west coast bias into it as well but why go there.  It's an award to one person in a team that has alot of pull.  It's not an award that means much other then an ego stroke, hell it's not even a good indicator of who will have a good nfl career so may as well let him enjoy it and stop the whining. 

Only defensive player I can think of who won it all was Charles Woodson. 

[cmlancas]

http://football.about.com/cs/heismantrophy/a/heismantrophy.htm

If you were curious. I think I saw 3 or so defensive players in the list at first glance.

[Paelos]

UGA QBs have been failures since Zaire. Sorry. 

We're you talking about South Florida earlier in the thread? How did that work out for you? 

[cmlancas]

...coming from a UGA fan, making fun of me for a disappointing season. How soon you all forget. (Remember, half my family went to UGA  )

[Nebu]

http://football.about.com/cs/heismantrophy/a/heismantrophy.htm

If you were curious. I think I saw 3 or so defensive players in the list at first glance.

Not seeing any guards, centers, or defensive tackles is a cue that they aren't giving it to the best player every year.  Good centers are incredibly hard to come by.

[Hoax]

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/bowls07/bracket?lpos=spotlight&lid=tab1pos1

This is kind of fun, I spent about 30 min deciding how to rank things & ended up with surprising conference ranks using BCS bowls (easy to find on Wiki) as the barometer of conference schedule.  I went with it and ranked the teams as follows.

OSU
USC
OU
LSU
WVU
VT
Illini
Hawaii
ASU
Mizzou
Tenn
Wisc
Oregon State
UCONN
Kansas
UGA

My final 4:
ASU (def. Hawaii, UGA)
WVU (def. Wisc, LSU)
UCONN (def. OU, VT)
USC (def. Kan, Illini)

final was WVU versus USC, USC dominated them, in fact USC had a 68% chance or better to win throughout.

The whole thing was fucked up because I originally had gone back 6 years of BCS games, scoring 3pts for a win 1 for a loss for the conference.  I gave a bonus point for being in the nat'l championship.  Six years back had the Big10 beating SEC by 1 for top seed.  I figured, that's no good; SEC should be first right?  I'll go back 8 years, this dumped the SEC to 4th kept the Big10 in first, I was sort of surprised.  I mean sure SEC people can tell me how they don't get enough BCS games because they play such a tough conference schedule.  But that wasn't true, SEC teams lose most of their BCS Games.  I'd wager that they had the 2nd worst winning % behind the woeful ACC.  I was tired of fiddling at that point so I went with what I had.

This resulted in UGA being the final at large pick (In my head any conference champion of the non BCS conferences in the top16 get one of the 3 at-large) and kicking the shit out of Ohio State -hawhaw espn- with a 60% chance to win.  There were really upsets all over: WVU over LSU and UCONN over VT seemed esp rediculous to me.

[Paelos]

I ran it 10 times on the BCS rankings. There's definitely a bug with OSU. They hardly ever win even with a 75% rating. In fact, 9 times Tenn beat them in the first round. SEC teams won 3 times, VA Tech somehow won twice, and USC won once. Illinois NEVER made it to the final four. Georgia never won sadly.

I ran it 10 times on the ESPN rankings. The results here were a USC-OU love-in. Both teams combined for a total of 7/10. OSU, Hawaii, and Illinois never made the final four. Whoever wrote this format hates OSU and will never let them win. This format really crushed the SEC, but UGA won once.

I ran it 10 times on the Allstate rankings. This format produced some of the most WTF Champions. Missou won twice, Georgia won twice, Illinois won once, OSU finally started having a shot in this one and won twice. USC never won, which was pretty funny.

Overall, it's pretty insane. I like it.

[Montague]

Michigan hires RichRod. Not sure what to make of it at this point but if he shits the bed against the 'stache with the NC on the line I'd love to see what he's going to do with Tressel.

Oh and Paelos, there's a rumor going around that OSU and Georgia are in negotiations for a home and home.

[Paelos]

Michigan hires RichRod. Not sure what to make of it at this point but if he shits the bed against the 'stache with the NC on the line I'd love to see what he's going to do with Tressel.

Oh and Paelos, there's a rumor going around that OSU and Georgia are in negotiations for a home and home.

It'd be sweet, but I'd give it a snowball's chance of actually getting it done. I'm excited about UGA v. Arizona State next season though.

[Triforcer]

As an Ohio State fan, I'm not worried about the Richrod hire.  A few reasons:

1)  Remember Bill Callahan, Nebraska, and the West Coast offense?  Yeah.  Overcoming decades of philosophical inertia is hard. 

2)  Corollary to #1:  Even if you could change everything in the abstract, there's a reason Big 10 teams don't deviate much from the "three yards and a cloud of dust" mentality beyond stubborn fuddy-duddiness.  Hint: look out the window.

3)  Vince Youngs are hard to come by.  Pat Whites and Tim Tebows are hard to come by.  Hell, even Juice Williams's are hard to come by.  He'll have a recruiting advantage like almost no other at Michigan, but there aren't a lot of personnel that can run the spread to a T.

If he manages to get Terrelle Pryor (the current high school number 1 and a Vince Young type), however, I'll be very worried.   

[Montague]

As an Ohio State fan, I'm not worried about the Richrod hire.  A few reasons:

1)  Remember Bill Callahan, Nebraska, and the West Coast offense?  Yeah.  Overcoming decades of philosophical inertia is hard. 

2)  Corollary to #1:  Even if you could change everything in the abstract, there's a reason Big 10 teams don't deviate much from the "three yards and a cloud of dust" mentality beyond stubborn fuddy-duddiness.  Hint: look out the window.

3)  Vince Youngs are hard to come by.  Pat Whites and Tim Tebows are hard to come by.  Hell, even Juice Williams's are hard to come by.  He'll have a recruiting advantage like almost no other at Michigan, but there aren't a lot of personnel that can run the spread to a T.

If he manages to get Terrelle Pryor (the current high school number 1 and a Vince Young type), however, I'll be very worried.   

#1 isn't going to be an issue at all I don't think. Virtually every Michigan fan I know of is tired of Zone Run Left. Case in point:



#2 is true. But then Rodriguez will also have the recruiting base to actually recruit linemen who can convert a third and two in the freezing rain in Ann Arbor in the 4th quarter. I don't think you'll see the dedicated spread option like at W.Va, most likely some sort of hybrid.

#3 - Terrelle Pryor put Michigan at the top of his list when they hired Rodriguez. All the OSU insiders say he's still coming to OSU but I have a bad feeling about it. Build it and they will come.

I'm not scared of Richrod either, but I hope he turns them around. Yeah its nice winning 6 of 7 but if the conference doesn't shape up the SOS is going to come back and bite us in the rear end one day. Now we just need to get rid of Joe Pa.

[Abagadro]

That picture has to be of a play-action screen. Otherwise it is just sad.

Anyways,

GO UTES!!!!!!

EDIT: I can't believe how the Utes almost gave up that game. Unreal.

[Paelos]

If all the bowls are like that Utah/Navy game, I'm going to have a heart-attack over my bowl pool.

Thanks for not fucking up at the end Utes, you really really tried to screw me. 

[Paelos]

Damn Boise State. 10.5 point freaking favorites and you lose to Eastern Carolina? I hate the WAC so very very much.