Old Raid Content - no hope?

[Morat20]

Drama is really guild specific. My horde guild was drama-town more in the learning time than in the farming time, mainly because of the personalities and cliques in the guild.

My Alliance guild was more specific old-axe to grind small group drama than anything else. Most of that was leftover angst between the 4 rank 14s we had that had come to hate each other during their pvp grinds and had later ended up joining the same guild to raid. Just about everyone who ground out the ranks to 14 in my experience  had some major sanity issues anyway.

We just had class drama -- this was all pre-TBC, but the warlocks bitched that the hunter stings were pushing their DoTs off, the hunters bitched that the fucking mages were dragging AoEing mobs over their FD'd forms during a wipe or that no one would dispell or cure them when they pulled (that was a biggie -- we got tired real quick of dying on a pull because we had enough DoTs dropped on us to kill a horse before the tank grabbed aggro), the priests bitched that no one ever pulled ads off them , the raid leader bitched that people started firing before the attack call....

Nonetheless, we actually had fun. Quite a bit of it, but then we were learning MC less than 3 months before TBC came out. Hard-core we were not. (Although our class leads were generally raiding AQ and BWL with another guild)

[Paelos]

We never really had much drama in any of my raids, but that's mostly because I wouldn't let anybody get away with being a social misfit for very long. People could bitch all they wanted on their own time in tells, but if anybody caused shit during raids about someone's play or attitude in public channels, they got removed. I made it very clear that many of them were my friends, but you are not special and unique snowflakes who can't be replaced if you decided to act like a loot-whoring whiny douchebag.

Really, most drama I've seen is the direct result of very poor leadership either within the guild, or on the raid-leading level, or both.

[Morat20]

We never really had much drama in any of my raids, but that's mostly because I wouldn't let anybody get away with being a social misfit for very long. People could bitch all they wanted on their own time in tells, but if anybody caused shit during raids about someone's play or attitude in public channels, they got removed. I made it very clear that many of them were my friends, but you are not special and unique snowflakes who can't be replaced if you decided to act like a loot-whoring whiny douchebag.

Really, most drama I've seen is the direct result of very poor leadership either within the guild, or on the raid-leading level, or both.

Oh, that was never in TS/vent. That was in the class channels, and the class leads filtered it up selectively to the raid leader. So what you HEARD over TS was "Hunters, could you please not apply stings after we're onto the second row of debuffs?" and "If it's a wipe, just sit down and die please" or "Priests, we need a PW:S on the Hunters, and pallies, please cleanse your hunters as they tank takes aggro. We're going to need their DPS". (The last was some pull in MC -- we kept wiping on it because we'd lose four or five Hunters right off the bat. Didn't have enough DPS to burn down all the bosses' buddies before the healers ran dry. Once they started shielding us and removing the DoTs, the fight went smoothly).

What was amusing to me was that most of the sniping was between the 'locks and hunters, and as my wife played a 'lock I was sitting right there laughing about the shit both sides were saying. Even funnier was the constant "And I don't mean XXXXX!" when they remembered about the spouse. :)

[Merusk]

Really, most drama I've seen is the direct result of very poor leadership either within the guild, or on the raid-leading level, or both.

Yes, 100% dead on.   If you're going to take a leadership position, don't bitch when forced to make decisions and/or complain that you don't want to tell playerxyz to shut-up because then they'll get mad at you.  Or how about 'well you two just work it out between you and let me know what you decide.' 

 It's part of the job, welcome to management, bitchcake.  You want to sit back and do nothing, then put someone else in the lead.

Not that I have any experience.  :-D

[Chimpy]

Oh, that was never in TS/vent. That was in the class channels, and the class leads filtered it up selectively to the raid leader. So what you HEARD over TS was "Hunters, could you please not apply stings after we're onto the second row of debuffs?" and "If it's a wipe, just sit down and die please" or "Priests, we need a PW:S on the Hunters, and pallies, please cleanse your hunters as they tank takes aggro. We're going to need their DPS". (The last was some pull in MC -- we kept wiping on it because we'd lose four or five Hunters right off the bat. Didn't have enough DPS to burn down all the bosses' buddies before the healers ran dry. Once they started shielding us and removing the DoTs, the fight went smoothly).

Sulfuron Harbinger it sounds like. The SW:P that the adds have would hit for about 500-600 a tick. Try doing that on horde where the only class that could remove the debuff was a priest. I died so many times on that damn boss back in the day.

[SurfD]

Oh, that was never in TS/vent. That was in the class channels, and the class leads filtered it up selectively to the raid leader. So what you HEARD over TS was "Hunters, could you please not apply stings after we're onto the second row of debuffs?" and "If it's a wipe, just sit down and die please" or "Priests, we need a PW:S on the Hunters, and pallies, please cleanse your hunters as they tank takes aggro. We're going to need their DPS". (The last was some pull in MC -- we kept wiping on it because we'd lose four or five Hunters right off the bat. Didn't have enough DPS to burn down all the bosses' buddies before the healers ran dry. Once they started shielding us and removing the DoTs, the fight went smoothly).

Sulfuron Harbinger it sounds like. The SW:P that the adds have would hit for about 500-600 a tick. Try doing that on horde where the only class that could remove the debuff was a priest. I died so many times on that damn boss back in the day.

Warlocks with Felhounds were my personal gods on some of those fights :P

[ajax34i]

My experience was raid-spot drama, and the occasional loot issues (because we used a DKP system but the raid leader decided which classes could participate on any given item when the item wasn't class-specific).  What happened most often was I'd try to smooth things out or make a decision and have them abide by it, but the dissatisfied party always appealed my decision by whispering the guild leader, which pissed him off to no end because that's why he had class leads, so he wouldn't have to deal with the crap himself.  Oh well, after a while they learned that going to the top might have worse results than my decision.

[Selby]

Even funnier was the constant "And I don't mean XXXXX!" when they remembered about the spouse. :)

I had the same situation going on.  They knew better than to bitch to me about specific healers because the other half in the same room was one of them.  Of course, all of our healers HATED raiding with the guild because the guild leader put a guy who BOUGHT his characters and had never actually played intelligently in charge of the healing classes - who always gave stupid and contradictory directions, or no direction at all and then bitched at the rest when they didn't know what to do and asked.  This is the moron who would go into bear form in the middle of a fight and then complain when we wiped because no one was healing (douchebag, you ARE the healer).  Can't heal, can't win.  And when you only have 4-5 healers in a 40 man, you need to have some VERY good coordination on what to do (not to mention being a mage I was just expecting to die alot if I fucked up so I didn't).  I told him he was a retard and to quit buying characters and actually make one, but that didn't make me popular with the rest of the guild leadership.  When he got banned for botting was one of the happiest days of WoWing.

[Morat20]

Sulfuron Harbinger it sounds like. The SW:P that the adds have would hit for about 500-600 a tick. Try doing that on horde where the only class that could remove the debuff was a priest. I died so many times on that damn boss back in the day.

That was the one -- we wiped there for three weeks straight (and then occasionally thereafter, as the pallies forgot to cleanse us). Once the priests shielded us and the pallies cleansed as as we ran by, the fight was easy.

MC made me learn the importance of "Choosing the right shot for the job". On Sulferon, I just wanted enough aggro to get his attention -- arcane shot (even a down-ranked one) was enough. Later on, for another pull, I needed to use Arcane - Distracting - Arcane to make sure I really got it's attention (one of those big hell dog thingies had a taste for our primary healers -- you had to generate a lot of threat quickly or it'd just run down the healers).

I actually enjoyed the MC raids -- full of trash and crappy, but fun -- our raiding group didn't take the whole thing very seriously, we held collections to pay for our main tank's repair costs, and generally were there for fun. :)

[Chenghiz]

Goon Squad drama is like watching a nuke go off in the distance - don't get involved and it's pretty fun to watch.

[Oban]

Goon Squad drama is like watching a nuke go off in the distance - don't get involved and it's pretty fun to watch.

Eve forum is thata way->

[Jayce]

Goon Squad drama is like watching a nuke go off in the distance - don't get involved and it's pretty fun to watch.

Eve forum is thata way->

It's predictable now.

[Oban]

I really want to find a zombie rickroll with close-ups of feet.

[Chenghiz]

Goon Squad drama is like watching a nuke go off in the distance - don't get involved and it's pretty fun to watch.

Eve forum is thata way->

I meant wowgoons drama. It stays pretty internal though.

[Shavnir]

Goon Squad drama is like watching a nuke go off in the distance - don't get involved and it's pretty fun to watch.

Eve forum is thata way->

I meant wowgoons drama. It stays pretty internal though.

Except when they disband us, splinter and we laugh because only maybe 3 of them knew their head from their ass. :v:

[Chenghiz]

Well yeah but even then most of M'G didn't know what the fuck. :P