normal speaker wire vs Monster cable

[Riggswolfe]

Is the difference really that great? I've got an oldish Sony Home-Theater-in-a-Box system and have been trying to decide if I should buy some monster cables to replace the cheap-ass wires it came with. Would I really see that much of an improvement?

See my system here

The other thing I'm wondering is if a reciever upgrade might not be a good idea.

[Samwise]

[Arrrgh]

Expensive cables are snake oil. In double blind tests no one can ever tell the difference.


http://web.archive.org/web/20020214075205/http://www.oakland.edu/~djcarlst/abx_wire.htm

[Sky]

That said, you also don't want to use cheap cables, either. You want to have good connectors and whatnot, so your shit does not fall apart. If you already have cables, and they aren't falling apart, you don't need new cables. I use cheap cables for my speakers because they're bare-wire insert style. I use more expensive stuff for anything with jacks, because I've seen too many cheap jacks break or poorly soldered. I've resoldered enough jack in my time, kthx. But that's mostly on instrument cabling, where you also want kickass shielding.

In short, don't sweat it.

No idea on upgrading the receiver. I've never been much of an audiophile, even though I've dabbled in recording. If I can hear the music, I'm happy.

[Riggswolfe]

Mine insert as barewires under the little clamps on the back of the speakers and the reciever. They work but I've been hearing you get a measurable clearer and louder sound with the "fancy" wires.

My reciever is 840 watts and I've been hearing you should go with at least a 1000 watt reciever so I don't know. Thanks for the input guys. I know I'm not satisfied lately with the sound from my surround sound system and I'm trying to figure out what part would make the biggest difference (speakers, reciever, or wire)

[Nebu]

Expensive cables are snake oil. In double blind tests no one can ever tell the difference.


http://web.archive.org/web/20020214075205/http://www.oakland.edu/~djcarlst/abx_wire.htm

Number of listeners: 7, 1, 7, 2.  Statistics for reliable testing would require a wider array of cable type, controlled equipment and room acoustics, and an N greater than 40.  On excellent gear, people with a good ear can easily determine differences in cables and method of wiring.  I've been building cables for the last 20 years and people can hear a difference on my equipmnent 100% of the time.  The greatest difference is often due to length, proper phasing, and the development of good imaging. 

Riggs:  Overall, I think Sky nailed it.  You can get noticable changes in sound quality and imaging with good wires, but as all things in audio you'll need to spend a lot of money for very small changes in sound quality.  If you have some 16 gauge speaker wire with good connections, that's likely as good as anything Monster manufactures.  I'd say that a simple thing like planning the location of your speakers due to room acoustics and making sure that you have good wire-to-am connections are likely to bring you greater improvements in sound quality than buying monster cable.

Take a look here and here for some more specific information.

[Furiously]

My advice is upgrade your speakers and buy amps until you can finally hear the 60hz hum from your receiver then upgrade your receiver.

[Sky]

I definitely need new speakers, too. I'm too scared by the price of decent speakers, though. Been wanting a pair for years now, thinking about fixing up a pair of my dad's old Boston Acoustics he ditched (need some cone repair I could probably pull off if I got feisty).

[murdoc]

I get all my Home Theatre wiring from http://www.monoprice.com

So far, everything I've ordered (Speaker wire, HDMI cables, Component Cables, TV Mount) I have been very pleased with.

[Furiously]

I definitely need new speakers, too. I'm too scared by the price of decent speakers, though. Been wanting a pair for years now, thinking about fixing up a pair of my dad's old Boston Acoustics he ditched (need some cone repair I could probably pull off if I got feisty).

Your old band didn't have some monster stacks that would look good in your living room?

[Riggswolfe]

I've been wondering if I should shell out for Bose. Everyone seems to think they're the god of speakers.

[Morfiend]

I've been wondering if I should shell out for Bose. Everyone seems to think they're the god of speakers.

Im sure a lot of people can give reasons why Boss are a rip off, but Ill just say, personally I dont think they sound that good.

How does it go again?

No highs, no lows. Must be Boss.

[Miasma]

I've been wondering if I should shell out for Bose. Everyone seems to think they're the god of speakers.

Bose is the Monster Cable of speakers.

Edit: I'm trying to remember a joke or skit from some show where a guy asks if Bose are good and the other guy says something like "Yes, but only if you're a middle aged housewife".  I know that's not it, with my memory it's probably not even close.

[schild]

Bose is trash. Period.

Also, Everyone Is Retarded.

[Polysorbate80]

But that's mostly on instrument cabling, where you also want kickass shielding.

Good shielding is always a plus.  Nothing like picking up random radio broadcasts on a poorly-shielded audio line :P

Also, don't run your cables next to and parallel to AC lines, and watch out for ground loops.

[Chimpy]

Bose is trash. Period.

Agreed. They are just marketing geniuses.

As far as speaker wire goes, as long as you get a good copper wire of a big enough gauge to transmit the signal to the speakers, you will be fine. Lamp cord is the best for moderate powered home use, as you can buy it in white, black, or brown to blend in better. And you can usually buy it in 14 guage for 1/4 the price of 16 guage  generic "speaker wire". All that makes 95% of speaker wire different is the clear jacketing they use.

Power level signals are almost 100% dependant on having the proper size cable to transmit the signal.

For signal level stuff, buying higher quality wires (though still no need to go monster mega super gold, as with all consumer level audio you are using 50 ohm RCA connectors and a 75 ohm coaxial cable in between) will usually give you a better wuality sound as many have both a braided and a foil shield, as well as using higher quality solder connections on the ends.

If your speakers and reciever have 5-way binding posts, there is no reason not to use just a good quality copper wire and strip back/loop the ends around the posts. If you have the little spring loaded dealies, stripping back 3/8-1/2" of the ends and tinning them with a soldering iron makes them easier to work with.

For the system you linked, just pick up some 18 guage lamp wire at Home Depot. Last time I bought some it was literally like 6 cents a foot. Should work wonders.

[Arrrgh]

Take all the money you'll save not buying overpriced cables and buy decent speakers. That actually makes a difference.

Speaking of which I love my Hsu sub.

http://www.hsuresearch.com/packages.html

[Chimpy]

I've been wondering if I should shell out for Bose. Everyone seems to think they're the god of speakers.

Don't.

For the price you pay for a set of Bose speakers, you can get a much higher quality set of Paradigms, Klipsch, or any multitude of companies.

If you even mention Bose to an audiophile they will look at you cross eyed, and not because you just aren't with the program. Their speakers are the cheapest things for the price you could ever find. The cones usually are made of the cheapest paper, and the baffles break easily. They work well under low power output situations, but hell...most speakers are fine in that circumstance.

[Lt.Dan]

I saw a "demo" of monster cables at the local AV store. 

#1 connect source with bog-standard red/white AV cables to display
#2 connect source with incredible MONSTER s-video cable to display

Ta-da, impress everyone with the amazing picture difference.

[Chimpy]

I saw a "demo" of monster cables at the local AV store. 

#1 connect source with bog-standard red/white AV cables to display
#2 connect source with incredible MONSTER s-video cable to display

Ta-da, impress everyone with the amazing picture difference.

Take a 3 dollar s-video cable, and then the monster cable. Then the difference is going to be pretty hard to see, if there even is one.

S-video is a type of component video where each color channel has it's own conductor and pin in the connector. Your standard 'yellow' video cable is composite, where all 3 channels are mixed into one conductor/pin. It also has the added negative of using a cable and connector that do not share the same impedance with each other.

But, ya know, Monster cable demos in stores are meant to sell monster cable. They make HUGE profits by selling cables that are barely higher quality than "generic" brands selling them for many times the price.

[Trippy]

S-video is a type of component video where each color channel has it's own conductor and pin in the connector.

No, it doesn't.

[schild]

Off the top of my head, the only difference between Composite and S-Video is that S-Video has a luminance channel. S-Video still looks like dogshit btw.

Edit: Note, I haven't used anything below component in 7 years.

[Lt.Dan]

I saw a "demo" of monster cables at the local AV store. 

#1 connect source with bog-standard red/white AV cables to display
#2 connect source with incredible MONSTER s-video cable to display

Ta-da, impress everyone with the amazing picture difference.

Ta-da, impress everyone with the amazing picture difference.

Fixed.

[Viin]

Well you guys might not like Bose, but the Bose Wave Radio is actually pretty good for an oversized alarm clock.

[Riggswolfe]

For the system you linked, just pick up some 18 guage lamp wire at Home Depot. Last time I bought some it was literally like 6 cents a foot. Should work wonders.

Lamp wire? Really? Cool. So it will conduct the sound then? Interesting. Yeah, the pack-in cables are these little thin jobs that looks like a five year old could tear them in two with little effort.

I always thought there was a difference between speaker wire and say, generic, lamp cable wire. Heh.

[Sky]

Your old band didn't have some monster stacks that would look good in your living room?

Ehhh...it's been a while since I've mentioned this. Pretty much everything I've ever owned has been stolen from me at some point. This might surface again when I'm talking about police or theft in politics. I've had two PA systems and countless speaker systems. Full stack (2 4x12s) when I played guitar, a 2x15 loaded with kickass EVMB 400W speakers. Guitars, basses, effects...seriously, all stolen. I don't talk much about that shit these days, I've put the past behind me.

Although to address your query, most of that stuff a) isn't great for regular home theater/stereo application and b) wouldn't fit in the living room. I imagine the PA fronts would be ok, you could probably even set up the monitor wedges for surrounds. But a PA front would be an 18" woof, 4x12" mids and a big horn for tweet. And our third system was even bigger than that, our woofs were 4x15" monster cabs. Soo....yeah.

[MrHat]

I have a great receiver and I picked up tons of Monster cable and hella good Definitive Technology speakers.

But, the only reason I spent money on this is because I got it all @ 65% off due to buying it at cost.

My advice, don't fucking buy anything audio ever @ retail.

Ever.

[Chimpy]

For the system you linked, just pick up some 18 guage lamp wire at Home Depot. Last time I bought some it was literally like 6 cents a foot. Should work wonders.

Lamp wire? Really? Cool. So it will conduct the sound then? Interesting. Yeah, the pack-in cables are these little thin jobs that looks like a five year old could tear them in two with little effort.

I always thought there was a difference between speaker wire and say, generic, lamp cable wire. Heh.

There is, the price.

It is all just copper wire, and in many cases, the lamp wire is higher quality copper than the stuff used in "speaker wire".

In every professional sound reinforcement environment I have ever worked in, off the shelf "electrical" wiring was used to transmit power level (from amp to speaker) signals.

Using good quality cables for line and mic level signals is usually a good idea though.

[Righ]

Ideally you want many fine strands of 'oxygen free copper' to get the best possible signal, but lamp wire will indeed be (much) better than the shit that they gave you with the system and nearly indistinguishable from OFC in any sane length. What you have is more akin to what was once telephone wire... before telephones outgrew it. But even if you want to go to purist 12 gauge OFC cable, there are many people cheaper than Monster who spread less poop about their wires. How well and what quality of connectors you secure to the ends will have a bigger difference than the (iron) contaminants in the copper though. If you want some of the best cables and don't want to spend a fortune, I recommend this:

http://www.axiomaudio.com/bulkcable.html

[Nebu]

Interesting that you'd say Axiom.  I often recommend Axiom speakers as being a bargain in quality for the cost and their connectors compete very favorably with cables at 2-3x the cost.  Axiom is what Paradigm used to be... one of the best bangs for the buck in the audio industry. 

[Riggswolfe]

My connectors are the little spring loaded dealies on the ends and the little screws that you slide the wire under on the reciever. In both cases I just push a bare wire in there.

Hmm..lamp wire. That's really cool and a bit non-intuitive. Sounds like later this summer maybe I can get some better speakers, which is I'm hoping the really weak part of my system. (I figure I paid ~$500 for the whole thing that the 6 speakers plus subwoofer it came with are probably cheap POSes.)

[Righ]

My connectors are the little spring loaded dealies on the ends and the little screws that you slide the wire under on the reciever. In both cases I just push a bare wire in there.

Not recommended. Fit some banana plugs on the spring-loaded ends, and some spade connectors on the screw ends. You might be able to get as good a connection with bare wire initially, but it probably wont stay as true over time. Its all about conducting the signal as best you can. Even gold plated, they won't cost much.

[Selby]

Well you guys might not like Bose, but the Bose Wave Radio is actually pretty good for an oversized alarm clock.

But it's $599 for a fucking alarm clock.  I can't hear enough of a difference between it and my 12 year old Sony receiver\CD changer setup & 35 year old 3-way Pioneers to make me even consider shelling out for new stuff.  I bought a $29.95 radio with CD player from Target that sounds just fine when I am waking up or trying to go to sleep to music.