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Title: Altered Carbon
Post by: satael on December 05, 2017, 01:08:19 AM
Altered Carbon Date Announcement (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qM7Eob4YFDQ)

So this was announced for 2.2.2018 on Netflix.
Quote
Based on the award-winning novel, Altered Carbon takes place in a future where the human mind can now be digitized and downloaded into a "cortical stack" and placed into new bodies, called sleeves.

The series follows Envoy soldier Takeshi Kovacs (Joel Kinnaman), who is brought back to life centuries later to investigate the attempted murder of Laurens Bancroft (James Purefoy), the wealthiest man on Earth. As the investigation progresses, Kovacs comes to learn that his past isn’t nearly as buried as he thought.

I'm pretty excited since I'm a fan of Richard Morgan's writing (even the fantasy books).


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Ironwood on December 05, 2017, 03:49:24 AM
Yeah, massive excitement over here.  Interestingly, some of the hints in the interviews suggest that they've changed some of the smaller details, but the big picture seems to remain exactly the same and the big worry for some fans (we require multiple Kovacs) has been confirmed on IMDB for over a year.

So I'm looking forwards. 


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Ironwood on February 03, 2018, 06:10:19 AM
Yeah, that's the stuff.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Khaldun on February 03, 2018, 08:17:15 AM
The big change to Kovacs' background worried me but a lot of reviews say it works and it was kind of necessary because in the books we get his background through his thoughts, which you can't really do well on screen.

On the other hand, the reviews have been kind of mixed so far, so we'll see.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Engels on February 03, 2018, 10:52:20 AM
Only watched two episodes thus far, trying to pace it out, but I think it's just off the scale fantastic. It's one of those rare shows where everything is so exciting scene to scene that it's hard to find a moment to pause the stream to take a pee break.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: MahrinSkel on February 03, 2018, 04:54:25 PM
It's a live action of a cyberpunkish sci-fi anime, which means that if you stop to think for 5 seconds about it as sci-fi, it all falls apart. But between Rule of Cool and some really tight plotting, you don't get many chances to pick at it.

--Dave


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Tale on February 04, 2018, 06:47:16 AM
It's a live action of a cyberpunkish sci-fi anime

Isn't it a live action of a novel?


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: calapine on February 04, 2018, 08:20:51 AM
Altered Carbon is definitely I novel.

Source: It's on my bookshelves.

And looking forward to that show.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Raguel on February 04, 2018, 12:02:25 PM
I'm about 2 episodes in and I don't care for it. It's an interesting concept, I just think two of the main actors (the protagonist Kovacs and the lady cop) are really horrible and make the show hard to watch.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Engels on February 04, 2018, 12:55:58 PM
Wow, just goes to show that people's impressions can be wildly different. I loved Joel Kinnaman in the Killing and I'm loving him here. I also am enjoying the cop and the integration of her latin family into the story with the conceit that language barriers are eliminated through some sort of learning software implant and all that's left is different cultures without a linguistic divide.

As to the impression that it's based on an Anime, I can't really find fault with that impression, since some of the scenes look like straight up Japanese storytelling (not gonna spoil it, but you'll probably know it when you see it if you've watched just about any amount of Anime).

Another criticism I've heard is that the it's not as philosophical as, say, Westworld. I can't disagree strongly enough, as it's themes are grounded in pretty gritty questions about mortality and meaning, and its exploring them in the way that good scifi does; extrapolating the what-if to the n'th degree and seeing what questions emerge. Sure, its not Heidegger but its also an action drama so turning your nose up at it for this seems to be a bit off the mark, both in terms of missing the questions it does ask, and perhaps expecting the tedium of philosophic exposition that's the bane of many many boring sci fi attempts (Neal Stephenson, I'm looking at you).


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: MahrinSkel on February 04, 2018, 12:59:28 PM
It's a live action of a cyberpunkish sci-fi anime

Isn't it a live action of a novel?
Apparently, yes. Which seems weird, because it "feels" very anime. Not in a bad way.

--Dave


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Bzalthek on February 04, 2018, 10:06:40 PM
This is hotness squared.  I'm four episodes in and quite impressed with it.  Especially all the side story and bit actors.  (I loves aryan mexican grandmama, he was fucking perfect)


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Viin on February 04, 2018, 10:10:50 PM
I like this too. Good sets and good camera work. Plot moves along quickly. (only 3 episodes in so far)


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Ironwood on February 05, 2018, 07:28:21 AM
I never thought I'd be satisfied with changes to the novel, never mind happy.  But I'm extremely happy at some of this.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Bunk on February 05, 2018, 12:56:37 PM
This is a new standard setter for TV sci-fi for me. Binged the first 9 episodes over the weekend. Sad that I only have one to go.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: satael on February 05, 2018, 02:26:37 PM
I liked this but I wasn't too happy with some of the changes made like


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Der Helm on February 06, 2018, 04:20:18 AM
I  :heart: Poe.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Ironwood on February 06, 2018, 06:13:58 AM
Changing The Hendrix into The Raven was inspired and the chap playing Poe gets all the love in the world. 

The Envoy changes were the only things that didn't really sit right with me and that mostly due to the fact that A - as mentioned, other books are now going to get HUGE sections rewritten if they decide to continue and B - It's so unnecessary.  Kovacs makes it quite clear he did bad shit for the Protectorate before joining with Quell, so there's literally no reason to change this except to make Quell's group more badass, which is really not needed.

I will say that perhaps one of the best reasons for the changes is so that blokes like me can actually see something new in the story.  It's nice when the wife says 'who's he' and I can genuinely reply 'I don't fucking know.'  The Bancroft Son thing at least put a different rail on the narrative.

And, let's just be brutally frank for a moment, Ortega is just super fucking hot.  Like, Super.

And who doesn't love a White Supremacist Granny Clone ?





Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Bzalthek on February 06, 2018, 07:52:01 AM
Dichen clone fight was absurdly hot and disturbing.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Tale on February 06, 2018, 04:47:16 PM
I  :heart: Poe.

Same. I've been an Edgar Allan Poe fan for a long time. Combining him with a cyberpunk world is perfect!

I'm only at epsiode 4 but the achievement here is QUALITY FUCKING CYBERPUNK. Cyberpunk as moving pictures has never been done this well before, unless you count Blade Runner or video games like Deus Ex. We now have an actual successful big-budget cyberpunk drama.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Viin on February 06, 2018, 08:46:01 PM
And, let's just be brutally frank for a moment, Ortega is just super fucking hot.  Like, Super.

Yes.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Surlyboi on February 06, 2018, 09:37:29 PM
Dichen clone fight was absurdly hot and disturbing.

That's partially because Dichen herself is absurdly hot and disturbing.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Ironwood on February 07, 2018, 03:16:36 AM
Also that.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Bzalthek on February 07, 2018, 05:38:31 PM
Dichen clone fight was absurdly hot and disturbing.

That's partially because Dichen herself is absurdly hot and disturbing.

Absolutely no argument from me there.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Khaldun on February 07, 2018, 05:46:01 PM
I am liking a lot but I don't find Dichen hot at all.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Teleku on February 07, 2018, 07:08:01 PM
Watched the first several episodes of this.  Really enjoying it!  Never read the books, so knew nothing coming into this.

Also,
And, let's just be brutally frank for a moment, Ortega is just super fucking hot.  Like, Super.
100 times this.  Holy hell.  Hollywood really needs to get on the ball poaching Mexican actress's at a much faster rate.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Threash on February 07, 2018, 07:45:13 PM
I am liking a lot but I don't find Dichen hot at all.


She was hot in Dollhouse ten years ago.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Tale on February 09, 2018, 07:44:03 PM
Just finished the series. Loved it. Perfect really. True cyberpunk television shows to binge on demand in 4k or multiple devices over a global network. I am in the future.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Surlyboi on February 10, 2018, 12:07:35 AM
The future is here, it's just not widely distributed. -Gibson.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Polysorbate80 on February 10, 2018, 02:01:13 AM
Was about the third episode where it came together for me, and I stopped questioning the changes and just enjoyed it.

Had to buy Sune Wagner’s cover of More Human than Human, just wish it weren’t so short


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: pxib on February 10, 2018, 02:51:52 PM
The future is here, it's just not widely distributed. -Gibson.
"Unevenly" distributed.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Surlyboi on February 10, 2018, 11:15:41 PM
Thanks for the correction.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: MrHat on February 11, 2018, 09:38:22 AM
I loved this show.

My only complaint is:



Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: kaid on February 14, 2018, 08:46:26 AM
I loved this show.

My only complaint is:




Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: jgsugden on February 14, 2018, 05:42:13 PM
Really liking this show.  Only 3 episodes in and I did not read the books (or have not yet I should say), but it is working for me.  The cast is great and the dialogue has been perfectly cliché in a good way.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Threash on February 14, 2018, 08:04:32 PM
I loved this show apart from super cartoony evil villain. I'm going to keep doing evil shit until you love me is always dumb.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Viin on February 15, 2018, 03:16:32 PM
She's obviously cray cray.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: jgsugden on February 20, 2018, 09:15:51 PM
This was great, but I wish they'd stuck the landing a bit better.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Ironwood on February 21, 2018, 03:08:53 AM
I loved this show apart from super cartoony evil villain. I'm going to keep doing evil shit until you love me is always dumb.

That's the only change I had a real, real, real major issue with.  It didn't work.  Like, at all.



Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Tale on February 21, 2018, 06:40:41 PM
This was great, but I wish they'd stuck the landing a bit better.

That's been the only problem with the last three series I've watched: Godless, The Sinner, Altered Carbon.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: lamaros on March 13, 2018, 03:48:25 PM
Yeah this got going in the second episode, but then went to shit from flashback episode to the end.


Oh well!


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: grebo on March 17, 2018, 07:54:53 PM
It is excruciating how much this sucked.  The first half is perfect.  The mystery is interesting.  Joel Kinnaman and Chris Conner are killing it.  The science is cool.  The societal shifts generated by said science are cool.  The violence is really well done.  The abs are insanely chiseled.

Then along comes Dichen Lachman to be absolutely horrible and constantly dribble out pointless nonsense.  She turns this perfect masterpiece into a confused stumbling mess.  It's like a Zach Snyder roman orgy where everyone's mother in law just showed up at the same time. I kept hoping that they'd get back to the cool stuff, but they never do.

The violence is the only thing that's consistently great.  They add in another character just to be violent, and he's great.  Even Lachman gets that right.  But the story is terrible.  The end is so uninteresting.  What a waste.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: justdave on April 01, 2018, 05:27:58 PM
What utter shite. I forced myself through to episode six and finally gave up when


Only two good things about it were the hotel as Edgar Allen Poe instead of Jimi Hendrix; he actually fit better as the creepy, desperate, guest-less AI hotel (though they likely made the change for rights issues than anything else), and even though I'm as gay as the day is long, the gal playing Ortega is rockin' gorgeous.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Tale on April 01, 2018, 08:23:53 PM
I totally disagree with the last three posts. Oh well. I am very happy to be living in a time when The Expanse, Altered Carbon and Bladed Runner 2049 are things.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: jgsugden on April 01, 2018, 11:13:18 PM
I totally disagree with the last three posts. Oh well. I am very happy to be living in a time when The Expanse, Altered Carbon and Bladed Runner 2049 are things.
You can't totally disagree with the last three posts.  I think justdave knows if he is gay.  You have to agree with that part.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Tale on April 02, 2018, 12:35:50 AM
I totally disagree with the last three posts. Oh well. I am very happy to be living in a time when The Expanse, Altered Carbon and Bladed Runner 2049 are things.
You can't totally disagree with the last three posts.  I think justdave knows if he is gay.  You have to agree with that part.

I stand corrected.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: justdave on April 02, 2018, 12:50:43 AM
Hah! Assholes.  :heart:


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: MahrinSkel on April 02, 2018, 04:20:28 PM
Are you sure you're gay? Maybe it's just a phase? If you meet the right woman, maybe you'd change your mind.

--Dave


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: justdave on April 02, 2018, 07:16:59 PM
I've tried that, unfortunately. It always comes down to the same conversation.

"I wish you'd put a new roll of toilet paper on when the old one's empty!"

"Yes, well, I wish you had a penis."



Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: justdave on April 02, 2018, 07:33:12 PM
Okay, to be a little less dismissive, I should say there were a couple other good things about this. The visuals and sound are gorgeous, aryan abeulita was great, and I actually like Joel Kinnaman as Ryker. Reading the book  I got him into my head as looking like Willem Dafoe, for some reason, and kept wondering why anyone would fuck this guy. Bonus points, it turns out that James Purefoy is no slouch downtown.

This made me go back and re-read the book just to see if I was mis-remembering things, though, and I think that's what killed it for me, it just doesn't feel the same to me. And, hey! I love the Netflix Expanse treatment! Watched the fuck out of that.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: WayAbvPar on April 07, 2018, 12:44:27 PM
Although I agree it sort of fell apart at the end, I enjoyed this immensely. Now someone needs to adapt everything William Gibson has written. I would KILL for a Sprawl series. Cyberpunk is great- if you build a good world, you can tell stories basically forever.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: justdave on April 10, 2018, 12:15:31 AM
VERY yes. Though, I would agitate for a Virtual Light trilogy show before a Sprawl one, if only because that would be a bit dated unless handled properly.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: HaemishM on April 10, 2018, 09:55:20 AM
The Virtual Light story would be a little less action-y than the Sprawl with an even less satisfying ending.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: justdave on April 11, 2018, 04:18:34 PM
You didn't like the ending of the Sprawl trilogy or Virtual Light? Philistine! It's not like he Neal Stephensoned it.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: HaemishM on April 11, 2018, 04:51:33 PM
I loved the ending of both actually. I just think the Sprawl trilogy had a more understandable ending.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: justdave on April 11, 2018, 05:19:39 PM
Okay, yeah, I gotta give you that one. Alpha Centauri was easier to parse than Laney's weird-ass, bitter end and the whole SB30 thing.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Teleku on April 13, 2018, 04:47:33 AM
I overall liked the Sprawl trilogy, but Neuromancer was just such a better book than the other two.  It was a perfect self contained story, and while I don't think the later two where terrible by any means, they were just far less interesting stories.  Again, I enjoyed them, but not sure it would be wise to try and adapt the trilogy to screen, as opposed to just doing Neuromancer by itself.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Hoax on April 16, 2018, 04:38:29 PM
The best idea would be to take any of the shorts from Burning Chrome and just flesh that out into something. The trilogies are just too strong in book form even for this golden age of TV and are in an awkward place future wise as part of the future-tech in them is now-tech right now.

I actually think the Pattern Recognition trilogy could be pretty fantastic as the bones for a tv series. Like a smarter/more real Mr Robot. Would love to see that.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Threash on July 27, 2018, 02:34:24 PM
Renewed with Anthony Mackie as the new lead. (https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/altered-carbon-renewed-season-2-new-star-anthony-mackie-1130243)


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Ironwood on July 27, 2018, 02:52:23 PM
Interesting.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Tale on July 27, 2018, 02:54:40 PM
Happy to hear it.

And further to the posts above, Amazon may be doing (https://www.theverge.com/2018/4/17/17247828/amazon-william-gibson-the-peripheral-novel-series) William Gibson's The Peripheral as a series.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: HaemishM on July 27, 2018, 03:28:44 PM
That looks more like they are doing The Peripheral as a series rather than anything in the Pattern Recognition series.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: Tale on July 27, 2018, 08:18:55 PM
Apologies, I was posting at stupid o'clock and typed the wrong thing. Corrected.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon (Netflix 2018)
Post by: WayAbvPar on August 02, 2018, 02:07:28 PM
Looking forward to both S2 and The Peripheral. TP is a good setup for a slower narrative like a series...a movie would take too long to set things up.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon
Post by: Abagadro on October 16, 2018, 03:23:35 AM
Finally caught up to this. Been so long since I read this book that I only remember flashes so didn't have any issues with changes as I didn't even notice them.  Ortega is indeed hot as balls and Poe was a great alteration for sure.  Third Act problems (way too much exposition, Expanse is doing that kind of thing much better, hopefully they get better at it in S2).  I did love bad-ass S&M Lizzie. Wish we got actually more of that and she got to fight a boss instead of redshirts.

Can't believe all this talk of upcoming cyber without mentioning that Amazon is doing fucking Snowcrash (allegedly, been kinda quiet about it for a while).


Title: Re: Altered Carbon
Post by: Ironwood on October 16, 2018, 03:36:31 AM
They are ?  I've always thought putting that on screen would be utter balls.  Like, Ready Player One type balls.


Title: Re: Altered Carbon
Post by: Teleku on October 16, 2018, 03:51:51 AM
Hmm, yeah, I'm torn.  Enjoyed the book, but it's going to be really hard to capture that insane/satirical world on screen.  Like, Brazil is the only movie I can think of that did that sort of thing successfully.