f13.net

Book 1: Cat's Cradle by Kurt Vonnegut. (http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=11913.0)
Book 2: A Canticle for Leibowitz by Walter Miller. (http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=12116.0)

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The order of picking books is as follows:
sigil, Samwise, Rendakor, lamaros, Tebonas, Stray, Phildo, Prospero, MaceVanHoffen, Lt.Dan, Margalis, Bokonon, Strazos, and NowhereMan
Modded: 02/03: Removed one from the list per his own wishes.

So I'm an English Major or something. I'm sure there are more of us out there in the intertubes, but I'm wondering if some of ya'll would like to start an informal book club. I'm more or less interested in literature rather than books, but I'm open to suggestions.

Thoughts?  :hello_thar:

(edit by Samwise: added link to first thread)

Let's start with Lovecraft? ^_^

When I wrote this thread I was really thinking H.G. Wells or Arthur Miller.

We really could do Lovecraft if you want though. If people want to brainstorm some authors, we could take a poll at the end, possibly.

I really would like to stay away from non-lit though, if at all possible. "The Return of the Book" thread is over there someplace, and it has been done once before.

On second though, we could do genres instead. I'll nominate 20th Century Modernism and 20th Century Feminist Lit.

 :grin:

I'll nominate 1800's European Authors.

Henry Miller

How does this book club work? Is it just the snooty version of Return of the Book, or is there like some sort of exchange that happens? :-)

I don't get that either, would we all come back on an assigned date and discuss what we thought were allegories while the authors role over in their graves screaming "it's just an adventure book about a guy hunting a fucking whale you assholes"?

We all read then discuss? I'm down.

Pick a good book, though.

H.G. Wells is fun. And an easy place to start.

I'm going to take the grin as a punchline..

Maybe we should read collections of author's letters just so we can get the notion that they have much much more to say about their own work than we could ever come up with...

I wouldn't mind reading an American author (given I have a subject on such this semester) but would suggest that given the crowd here the book picked be to the shorter and simpler side of literature to begin, so at least more than two people end up reading it.

I don't see what the point would be if we read different books on the same topic, it'd require much more effort on everyone's part to generate an interesting discussion from that.

Spooky.  My New Year's resolution was to raised my reading level above scif-fi/fantasy targeted at 15 year olds.  Of course I broke that today by reading another Eriksen book  :uhrr:

Count me in.

I was bringing in the new year reading the Chronicles of Narnia again. (The Last Battle is painful...)

So no F13 Fight Club?  :heartbreak:

Yes, I suppose we'd do one or so every one to two weeks (or whatever set time). I'm tired of only reading stuff for class and the like. I'd like to have a separate subforum (if we get enough people) so we can post/archive our discussions in a neat and organized manner. Also, we can have two threads for each book, one with spoilers, and one without. If we happen across a book I am studying through my coursework, I could post some stuff from there as well (as well as anyone else who has permission from an instructor/professor). Overall, in response to your question, it would be read, then write, then discuss.


We don't have to read anything by Melville if it makes you happy. I would, however, enjoy hearing what you thought about the books we read.


I had assumed that we would read the same author from a particular genre. That's what all the voting was about.

Apologies for posting to my own post, but another idea might be to focus more on anthologized short stories. It might be more accessible to more members with time restrictions.

I was going to suggest that (I thought I did but then noticed that I didn't) and agree.

I'd be down with a book club, in whichever format is most agreeable to the majority of folks.

Generally,  the bulk of the stuff I read is genre fiction (scifi/fantasy,  smattering of historical fiction and horror [I'd read more,  but this genre is moribund]) and history (Rome, 17-18th century Colonial American, smattering of European history) but it's as much because I don't have a source of good recommendations as anything else.

To echo Schild, Lovecraft is a good choice in that it's mostly short stories,  and his stuff is a standout in the horror genre.  Bad choice because I'd bet many of the people here have read him already, and the whole racism thing.

Something like Palahniuk (Fight Club, Haunted) or Cormac McCarthy (No Country for Old Men, Blood Meridian, The Road) might be an idea. 

There's no such thing as literature, it's just another genre.

Yeah, I didn't quite get that distinction either. I understand you guys want to read stuff a bit more high-brow than, say...Salvatore? But beyond that, not sure what you guys meant.

Do we have to get tweed jackets and pipes to join? If so, I'm in.

I am in.  :awesome_for_real:

Typically everyone has a couple of weeks to read the same book, then they discuss. Books are typically books that foster discussion, as in not Tom Clancy or something like that.

What's wrong with Tom Clancy!?!?

This sounds like fun, but if the chosen books are too boring I'd have to pass. So, I say we elect someone who has good taste in books, and they can pass "the torch" to the next person to select a book.

Book discussions are generaly more fun when they're interesting books, not just easy to read.

If we choose something like Clancy I'm not going to bother.

Going to have to pick something pretty popular if you want people in the US, Europe and Australia to all be able to get their hands on it.

Or pick classics. I would prefer classics.

Oh, just start with the Illiad. That's easy enough.

Or possibly the Aeneid, I've never actually read that one. Or even King Arthur, in Olde English.

What kind of discussion can you have about Tom Clancy? "I liked it." "The part where he shot the guy was cool." It doesn't make them bad books but there isn't much to talk about with them.

Typically books are chosen that are on interesting topics, done in an interesting style or something of that sort. For example Lovecraft has a very distinctive style, both writing style as well as tone and setting. It might be interesting to compare to more modern authors and styles. (Not advocating Lovecraft, just saying)

How about we discuss the groundrules for the f13 knitting circle before we start throwing book names about?

To kick things off lets make a list of things we need agreement on.  Stuff like;
- all read the same book
- how do we choose a book
- how do we go about reading the book and then commenting (eg wait till end of agreed reading period, jump in as we go, spoliers or not)
- any other rules about getting the book - costs, library access,
- whatever other issues anyone thinks we need as a groundrule

PS cmlancas - I thought you were a butcher.  shouldn't you be knee deep in gore or something?

I suggest that everyone read this.

(http://ipunkrock.com/diario/get/42/please%20kill%20me.JPG)

Don't know what fiction to suggest though. I'm really not too keen on it, except some classics. And as far as "genre" fiction goes, you'll find me reading Mickey Spillane far before I even touch an RA Salvatore book.

Pope or Fagles? Etc, etc!  :drill:

- all read the same book Yes
- how do we choose a book Topic/Genre/Timeframe picked in turn by participants, then everyone else makes ONE serious suggestion at most for that topic, and the topic chooser decides from them (bearing in mind the comments of others)
- how do we go about reading the book and then commenting (eg wait till end of agreed reading period, jump in as we go, spoliers or not) Two-three week reading period. After one week a SPOILER thread is started for discussion, after three a new book is chosen.
- any other rules about getting the book - costs, library access,  Better to pick books that are avaliable at libraries or cheaply avaliable second hand where possible. I know many/most probably wont have access to university libraries, but..
- whatever other issues anyone thinks we need as a groundrule everyone reads the books in english, pref. same translation if applicable

As it's cmlancas' idea I'd suggest he pick an area he's interested in and those of us intersted in participiating make a suggestion in that category.

Count me in if you do decide to do a book club.

As a suggestion, I have been doing the NYTimes Book Club (http://readingroom.blogs.nytimes.com/) for the past couple months. In November, we read War & Peace, and for two weeks of December, The Education of Henry Adams. The January book has not yet been announced, but I was thinking that if it is of interest to everyone here, we could do that book. The discussion would of course be here, but it's nice to see what the reader panelists have to say about the books as talking points as well. Just a thought I figured I'd throw out there.

I'm all about classics, but why not go for something a bit closer to the average f13'ers heart, like classic fantasy or sci fi? Asimov's Foundation, or Neuromancer, or even Game of Thrones or some such?

Because many will have already read them I assume. Not as much fun reading books you're read (and might not have liked) before over again.

Plus, if all you read is SF and fantasy you need some broadinin' imo.

And people haven't read the classics?

How about "The Space Merchants." Classic sci-fi, considered one of the best works, yet I'll guess that most haven't read it. Timeless satire and you can discuss a variety of topics including how relevant it is today, the writing itself, the underlying political message, etc. Also very readable.

I think it would be a mistake to choose "classics", most people will drop out quickly and many will have already read them. I consider "The Space Merchants" an overlooked classic.

"Timeless satire"? Hmm, sounds interesting. I'm not a big sci-fi fan, and most of the stuff I do like (literature or not) is comedy. For example, my favorite sci-fi show is Futurama. Otherwise, sci-fi, like fantasy, is some boring shit -- unless there's something to be made fun of.


[edit] Speaking of which, there was a book written awhile back by Eric Idle, called the Road the Mars. I never got around to it. Anyone want to keep that in mind? I mean... Python + Space Truckers and Robots. Can't be that bad.

It's the type of sci-fi that has sci-fi trappings but is not really a science-fiction story. There are no laser swords and pew pew action, the point is not the science fiction part, that's just the setting.

Anyway more on topic I'm with lamaros for the most part on the details. Rotate categories, people give suggestions, etc etc etc.

We need a poll. I've brainstormed some categories and here's what I've come up with:

Early 20th Century Modernism
Later 20th Century Modernism
19th Century Romanticism
19th Century Victorianism
20th Century Feminist Lit
19th-20th Sci-Fi (A la The Time Machine, Brave New World, Farenheit 451)
19th-20th Century Mystery/Noir (A la The Long Goodbye, The Maltese Falcon, or even Poe's short stories)

Also, we can add stuff to this list. I've purposely left off poetry because I don't think that's a good place to start. Also, I think serious classics like Oedipus and The Aeneid are (imo) too much work for me. However, if you all are dying to read stuff like Pope, Marvell, Shakespeare, Donne, or Jonson, we can do that.
 


I think we should stick to short stories and keep it at about a week's time for the first month or so, and then broaden it to a novel when we get more people.

Count me in, need to diversify my reading habits.

Christ. I suck. Edited because I was sucking hard.

Double Edit: I added the poll. I'll start thinking of ideas for each genre. I'll try to select works that I believe most of you will not have read. For example, if we choose 20th century modernism, I won't use any common Hemingway short stories (unless the demand is there) because I'm sure most of you have read them. Same with Sci-Fi; we'll try to move outside things in which we are familiar.

I don't know if I'll have time to participate, but I'd suggest Slaughterhouse-Five by Vonnegut.

I would have to veto that. It's high school summer reading.

Some of Vonnegut qualifies as comedy sci-fi for me. I've read just about all of it though.. Would like to try something new.

ugh. Seeing romanticism up there makes me not want to pick it. mostly because I've done multiple term papers on it over the course of 3 years.

Would dig some noir or modernism though. Votes in.

Let's just watch Oprah.

Why reinvent the wheel?

Uh. If you said that, you'd be Vajurasing it up. Shakespeare is assigned to high schoolers too. Should we not read him?

In a less snarky response, currently scholars are giving Vonnegut a hell of a lot of attention. Slaughter-House Five  might not be my first choice here, but I might vote for Breakfast of Champions.

If Noir wins, I'm starting with "Red Wind" by Raymond Chandler. I'll guess most of you haven't read it, and hopefully everyone will enjoy it.

Edit: It's okay, I promise that I really know that short stories get quotes instead of italics, I swear!

If we did Romanticism, I'd want to do some Byron and maybe some Coleridge. Stuff like "Ode to a Grecian Urn" (Keats) would be fun here.

There were a bunch of posts here. Now it just looks weird that I have a hat trick.  :drill:

FIFY

You keep threatening people with romanticism so we are too scared to spend time here.

I'd take a pass on romanticism too.  One of my worst college experiences encompassed romanticism.

I'd like to nominate Tim O'Brien's The Things They Carried.  It fits the 'short stories' requirement, although some people may have read it in high school or college.

Mainly because O'Brien is one of my favorite authors and I've read the book enough times where I won't have to read it again to participate.  :awesome_for_real:

But then, I like Achewood, so what do I know.   

You see, what you have here is a bunch of lay people wanting to broaden their reading hoirzon (ignoring the whole discussion about other sci-fi authors).  Then you jump in with fancy schmancy terms like romanti-wha? and moderni-who? and I'm starting to thing "fuck we're definitely going to get a book I'm going to bin after 30 pages".

How about some lay-categories like 20 cenutury American novelists, Dickens, 60s scif-fi?  Once we get to actually suggesting books it would be better to move away from "Wacky Wednesday by Dr Seuss, because I liked it" to "The Grinch by Dr Seuss, because I think it's more than a kids book and I'd like to discuss and be enlightened about it".

I'm sure that you mean Middle English and are thinking of one or more editions of Sir Thomas Malory's work. And indeed, this is the sort of thing that I would consider 'romance' in literary terms.

I might could see how this could be an issue if this weren't the internet and www.wikipedia.org didn't exist. However, this is the internet, and I know that Noir, Mystery, Female Authors, and Sci-Fi aren't difficult.

I'm sure I could pick out four books in modernism/postmodernism that you wouldn't bin after 30 pages. I bet you've already read some, too.

Don't get me wrong - I'm open-minded about this and willing to give it a shot.  THERE'S A NEW YEARS RESOLUTION AT STEAK, DAMMIT.

I guess I just wanted easy mode on the category so I could actually find a book to suggest, without pulling it off some wiki or an Amazon wish list.

Since it seems like Sci-Fi is going to be the first genre, I'm open to suggestions. Preferably, I would like to have three stories per two-week period (or so), consisting of two short, and maybe one short novel. With three per two weeks, it'll give people on the thread a choice of what to read in case we get some  :drill:. Schild and I already came up with one short story, and I think I have a good idea of the short novel.

 :awesome_for_real:

This is getting way over-engineered. Start simple.

3 stories? No. Pick a book or a collection. One. Doing this sort of thing is already like herding cats, I've seen it fail instantly a number of times. If you do three different things some people are only going to read one, then you'll have three different discussions going. The whole point is for everyone to read the same thing.

Pick one thing, something that most people will like and that everyone hasn't already read. And don't let people pussy out. The point is that they read what you pick, then down the road you read what they pick. The whole expanding horizons bit, you can't please everyone and giving people a menu to choose from is going to tank this instantly.

Edit: The above post should be read in the authoritative voice of a project lead.  :grin:

I think he plans on announcing one. Waiting for talk to die down and then announcing the other. I think.

I'd bet you're wrong.  My experience is that almost every geek thinks they know what a Cthulhu is, but couldn't tell you the name of more than one or two actual Lovecraft stories.

If we picked something without any pop culture resonance (Dream Quest of Unknown Kadath is a great one) I bet it'd be new to almost everyone.

I recommend that you all work your way through the banned books list (here is a good one: http://digital.library.upenn.edu/books/banned-books.html).

Because I know this crowd I think you should start with Fanny Hill (http://wiretap.area.com/ftp.items/Library/Classic/fannyhill.txt).   :pedobear:

I'm trying to offer a variety here. Just like a variety of threads, perhaps a variety of books/stories for people to read. I don't mind doing just one, but I don't want to turn people off. Plus, I know some will read them all (like myself), and one short story every week to two weeks might not be enough for them. However, your point is certainly noted. I have seen the f13 commitment, and well, on second thought, the commitment never came to pass.  :awesome_for_real:

Offering a menu is the easiest way to get this to fail.

Pick a book, give people a couple weeks to discuss, repeat.

Agree.

People are here to read a book and discuss. Not to read a book they personaly want to read and discuss. And if we rotate the person picking they will get their go in the end.

Plus, I think odds say some of those who are the pickiest might be ones who aren't as motivated to go the distance when the book might not be 100% their thing anyway..

Good thing Romanticism lost....that stuff made me sick in high school + college.


I just hope that I can actually get these things read if I participate. Fack, I just now finished  "The End of Hyperion." Took me long enough, and I actually liked it...mostly.

Count me in.

(although please regard the fact that I'm busy/lazy)

Signe should record the book on mp3 so we don't have to read.

I don't really know which author is in what genre listed (modernism, etc), but I know what I like to read.

I'd recommend Pride and Prejudice, by Jane Austen, simply because I don't think most folks around here would think of reading her work.  I also don't want to be the only heterosexual male I know that enjoys Jane Austen.

Since that'll probably cause apoplexy, I'll suggest another: The Last of the Mohicans, by James Fenimore Cooper.  I think he's considered to be a Romantic, and we all saw where that led ... but dammit, the man could write.  Another advantage is that most of Cooper's works are available online (http://external.oneonta.edu/cooper/links.html#texts).

I think that if we were assigned Mohicans, we should have to read Twain's The Literary Offenses of James Fennimore Cooper.  :awesome_for_real:

Voting ends soon!

I really like to be in, but half a room full of  partly read books says I'm too OCD to finish reading my books  :-)

Please no. This is the exact book I had in mind when I was hesitant to reply! Worst book I was assigned to read in all of high school...except maybe Moby Dick. Its a close thing.

My dearest Rendakor, now be serious. I want to talk very seriously. Let me know every thing that I am to know, without delay. Will you tell me how long you have hated that book?

Let's get this movable feast underway!

Did we pick a category yet? Organize people! cmlancas take charge!

If he won't, then I can vow that I've hated Jane Austen for over 7 years now.

I'm not much of a fan of Austen's subject matter, but I love her turn of phrase.  Pride and Prejudice has the best opening sentence of any novel I've ever read:

"It is a truth universally acknowledged, that a single man in possession of a good fortune, must be in want of a wife."

That is one well-constructed sentence.  It's at once a scathing, sarcastic observation about the social norms of her day and tells you pretty much what the novel is about, packaged in a lovely little grammatical powerhouse.  She earns marks in my book for being very good at the mechanics of writing.

I mean come on ... Austen was probably the original cynical Internet Douchebag.  How could you not like her?

Her shit is boring.

It makes it pretty easy not to like her.

It's not you, it's me.

SF is it? It is.

Pick a good'un cmlancas.

Heh, I knew when I suggested Austen it wouldn't go well.

For something more modern, I'll toss out Ray Bradbury for consideration and to redeem myself.  The Martian Chronicles is a surprisingly deep novel, full of all manner of meaning and what not.  It's also got aliens, which never hurts.

Dandelion Wine isn't sci fi, but it is one of Bradbury's better novels.  It's like a Norman Rockwell painting put to paper.  It comes up regularly on book club lists.

About 6 years or so, now, Dr. lesion.

The masses clamor and demand science fiction! In response, I have chosen a major work, Cat's Cradle, by Kurt Vonnegut, to lead us into our first discussion.

Some off-hand reasons why I chose Cat's Cradle:

1) Ease of Entry: Vonnegut's style isn't going to throw any of you for a loop -- it's not Jane Austen here. He creates a straightforward, gritty, and poignant prose style.
2) Critical Interpretations: Scholars in academia continue to analyze Vonnegut, especially with his death a few months back. I will offer to assist anyone who believes he/she has a convincing reading with critical articles.
3) Fun: This book is hilarious. I think it befits this board to read this work because the book contains "usefully cynical commentary."

Therefore, I hope you enjoy it. I have been looking for online e-texts for Cat's Cradle, and there apparently is an e-text on Google Books. Unfortunately, when I go to log in through my university's web proxy (with full access to most scholastic sites), I get a major error and cannot continue. Therefore, if any of you can come up with a legal e-text, it would be splendid.

That being said, places to buy Cat's Cradle:
Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/4001149125/ref=sr_1_olp_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1199972663&sr=8-3) <--From $2.70 at the moment.
AbeBooks (http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?an=vonnegut%2C+kurt&sts=t&tn=Cat%27s+Cradle&x=47&y=17) <--From $1.23 at the moment.
eBay (http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?from=R40&_trksid=m37&satitle=%22cat%27s+cradle%22+vonnegut&category0=) <---From $2.00 at the moment.
This book should also be available at all major public and university libraries.

Also, if you love this novel, you might interest yourself in reading Harrison Bergeron (http://instruct.westvalley.edu/lafave/hb.html), recommended by schild. I rather liked it.

Cheers, and happy reading!

Edit: Ready to respond? Go here. (http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=11913.0)

Sounds good, ordered.

I just hope I am able to keep up.

Also, I hope that it's good.

Dib on picking the mystery novel. Pluzze. You must all come to the proper appreciation of agatha!

Dear God no not Agatha Christie! At least go with someone like John Dickson Carr.

Agatha has some quiality books! Though many are by-numbers jobs some a fun. And short! There is lots of other good stuff about too, but it's better to pick books that piss people off!  :drill:

I've always wanted to know how Murder on the Orient Express ended.  Pretty sure it was an elaborate suicide.

I've always meant to get into the old noir stuff,  but never got started.  I tend to like the modern riffs on noir,  especially noir mixing other genres,  so will be interesting to explore the basis of it.

I have a great book lined up for Noir if ya'll let me continue picking. I think everyone will like it. You just can't not like Chandler.

It all depends how sharp the knives of opinion on Cat's Cradle are, methinks.

The Postman Always Rings Twice would be my Non-Agatha suggestion (seriously, Agatha has some good books).

People hear enough about what I've been reading.  I'm happy to have someone else picking for me,  especially since I'm in a slight rut.  I'm pretty much done with the Fantasy genre,  without going out and chasing down out-of-print/hard to find classics. 

Been picking at scifi.

This pick was a great way to force me to pick back up Vonnegut,  so I can him a fair shot.

Postman is a good choice too lamaros. Definitely a possibility too. I just can't see how people can't like Cat's Cradle. It's a lot like moist, delicious cake.

Truthfully,  I sorta wanted to see a Heinlen or Chalker choice for the pure entertainment of forum outrage explosions.

Why, Heinlen is good. I even have a few of his books, most of which I haven't actually read...

Ok, so I only read Starship Troopers.

Alot of the time Heinlein takes a social more, and then creates a situation where most of society's normal rational reasons don't apply,  and then runs with it so you have to ask yourself if your belief is rationally founded,  or just upbringing/"it's icky" response.

Homosexuality (obviously not a huge issue now compared to the time of writing), incest, non-standard marriage arrangements, gender roles, goverment arrangements, civil liberties, religion, etc. just from the books I've read.

I always thought he was an absurdist, I mean, The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress, what? You bet it is. It's all dusty and rocky and shit. You'd just get all cut up. And what about when it's on top? I'm not strong enough to let the moon mount me. Fuck! Who'd want to sleep with the moon... Insane...

Heinlein is weird. At some point suffered severe brain trauma and got all fucked up. Some of his stuff is pulpy fun, like The Puppet Masters and some of it like Farnham's Freehold is some of the worst shit ever written.

I prefer if we rotate picking books. Kind of silly for the same person to keep picking.

Also why are "female authors" a genre?

I think Andre Norton would be the perfect choice for explosive argumentative entertainment.  My wife reads a lot of the classics (she introduced me to Austen), and it's always a fun conversational grenade to mention my enjoyment of the Witch World books around her.

I'm picking up Cat's Cradle tomorrow.  I've never read anything by Vonnegut, so this'll be awesome.

Many traditional canons completely ignore many important female authors. Therefore, a few anthologies have surfaced focusing on women's lit.

I wasn't attempting to be sexist, although one could argue that simply having a category for women's lit is sexist by definition. It's just the way academia does it right now. They aren't sure how to lump the great female authors that have been discovered in the last twenty-five years in with the dead white males that have been so prominent for so long without mucking things up. I could PM you further if you want, it gets kinda dry and silly.

About halfway through Stranger in a Strange Land I had to stop and ask myself what the fuck was going on.  It would definitely be a great book for discussion.

I always thought it was interesting that even though there are many female authors in sci-fi, fantasy and mystery most of them use their initials for the covers instead of their actual names so that people don't stereotype them and assume the book is all sappy and romantic.

It's slowly getting better though in that they don't have to hide behind initials as much.

I think the only female sci-fi author I've seen anthologized is LeGuin. And it isn't for the Earthsea series, it's for something else.

I think we should read something by Willa Cather at some point. As female authors go, she is my favorite, but her personal life and her writing make for some interesting discussion.

Well, here in Seattle, Twice Sold Tales is out, Magus Books is out, even Univeristy Village Barnes and Noble is out of Cat's Cradle! Tomorrow I'll check out a few more.

As for good female scifi and/or fantasy writers, folks interested should check out Elizabeth Moon and Robin Hobb.

Fuck, whoever I bought the book from on Amazon isn't shipping the book until Sunday or Monday, with an estimated arrival of somewhere between the 18th and Feb 1.

Lame.

Well, at least it's always nice to have more books. But next time, I'll just find the book in person.

Robin Hobb's Farseer series was excellent. Best fantasy I've read in a while; utterly avoids the "tell the story for over 9000 angles" thing that I hate so much.

She's in Seattle this Wednesday, stumping for her latest Shaman series book. She's a total hottie too.

I read her Farseer series and really enjoyed it, but haven't started any of the Shaman books yet. Are they any good? I think she's excellent when writing from a first-person perspective, but I'm not sure that I like her third-person style.

I dug it. Its pretty similar to the Farseer books.

Stranger in a Strange Land is one of my top 5 favorite books of all time.

It's one of my dad's all-time favorites also, which is why I read it in the first place and holy shit, do I ever have a new opinion of him now.

So how are we picking the next book?  We've got a week.  Are we taking it in turns to be book club dictators?

That I'm not sure. However, the next genre will be Noir/Mystery, as it was second in the poll. I have a pick I'd like to put forth, but I know it won't be cmlancas's book club :)

Well, my suggestions is The Postman Always Rings Twice, as mentioned earlier.

Or if mystery and not noir I will suggest a good Agatha :-)

I'd go for a Nero Wolfe mystery.   :drill:

I'm not sure how much discussion we'd get out of one, but damn are they entertaining.

For a modern take on noir I would suggest Andrew Vachss' Strega. To me the point of a book club is in part to expose people to new stuff and I doubt many people have read Vachss.

I'd agree, but I was trying to hold the discussion to things discussed on a collegiate level. Ideas within that spectrum? Postman is a good choice imo -- I can get outside my comfort zone.  :awesome_for_real:

I'd be happy to take your pick though, Margalis.


Would anyone be interested in doing a few weeks on 20th century modernism? We got a pretty good response on Vonnegut so far (we had people who couldn't wait to post), and I think it would be unfair to modernism as a whole to only read one novel.

Thoughts?

Why restrict to things on the collegiate level? I'm not in college, are you?

Let's throw out suggestions for noir and have someone make the final choice. Not me, I don't know much about the genre, and I'd rather spend my pick on something else. Let's just list a few possibilities and someone can take a turn as dictator.

Yes, I am. However, I've linked stuff like critical articles written on Cat's Cradle, and I won't be able to do that for Random_Book_01 someone wants us to read. While it's okay to go outside the collegiate level, I really want to be reading things that are generally accepted as "literature" (Yes, I just used a huge, arguable abstraction there. Don't flog me, this isn't politics). I also posted in the first post in my thread that "The Return of the Book Thread" was over there someplace.

Originally when I started this thread, I had something like the discussion we have in the V thread in mind about great literature. Don't make me read manga, eh?  :awesome_for_real:

I'm torn.

The stated purpose of this 'club' was to read literature which holds itself in some sort of safety net. As cmlancas said, it's better to discuss things where you have some critical material to fall back on. I think if many of you just chose anything you'd pick bad books. Bad books being ones that a) I don't enjoy, and b) aren't good for discussion.

On the other hand it's nice to read newer stuff and a lot of things you do at college level aren't within the last 10 years, let alone 5. As long as we have a good discussion before we pick new stuff and people have the ability to veto I'm not against that either.

I can think of a few recent books that would be quite good for discussing.

You have to have a certain amount of faith in people to not pick bad books.

 If someone picks a book that everyone else hates we just don't let them pick again.  I'm perfectly willing to wade through one medicore book per person.  Reading books you don't like builds character.

Can I suggest a new category?

Books by writers who committed suicide.

This is f13 here, Marg. Do you have that faith?  :awesome_for_real:

I thought up an algorithm for rotating book selection today that includes a player justice system.  I will share it with you as evidence of the fact that there is something terribly wrong with me.

There is a list of all the book club members.  You stay on this list as long as you read the book each week and post something in that book's thread.  New or returning members are added to the list at the bottom.  ("Fallen" members are maintained in a separate "inactive" list and are inserted at the top as they go inactive; if multiple members return in a given week, they're added to the bottom of the active member list in whatever order they were in the "inactive" list.)

Each book is selected by the person at the top of the active member list.  That person is then moved to the bottom of the active member list.

During the discussion period for each book, any currently-active member who read the book and really hated it may opt to put a "black spot" on the member who selected it.

If it is your turn to pick a book and you have one or more black spots, you do not get to pick a book; instead one black spot is removed from your name and you go to the bottom of the list as if you had picked a book.  The next person in the list picks a book as usual.  Black spots are not wiped if you go inactive.

 :drill:

That system works for me Sam, though, someone should be able to pass if they have no suggestions for the genre that's up (or are we not rotating genres based on the poll? cmlancas has been speaking as if we are doing so, and if that's the case someone is invariably going to come upon a genre that they have no experience in). I'd say passing just moves you down one spot, rather than put you at the bottom, if we're doing some kind of genre rotation. If not, than passing should put you at the bottom.

One to one is a bad ratio. Otherwise I could just put a black spot on everyone and nothing would get chosen. Or we could have a book that everyone but one person loved and yet the person who suggested it never suggested one again.. etc.

I will start a website where people can buy black spots from me for Real Money!  I'll start making lots of F13 accounts now so I can spam everyone.  Samwise just made my moneyhat for me.

If everyone has a black spot (or any equal number of spots), they all cancel out, because the queue just rotates until they've all been cleared.  That's the brilliance.   :oh_i_see:

If you have a book that everyone but one person loves, then the suggester only gets one black spot, which means they only sit out one "rotation" at most (and that's assuming that everyone else in the list picks only books that are loved by all).

If you're a dick and blackspot everyone, their spots will all clear pretty quickly; they, on the other hand, are liable to all blackspot you out of spite, and you probably won't get another suggestion in your natural lifetime.

Also, I like Rendakor's suggestion, but I assume that we'd just dispense with the genre rotation and figure that genres will naturally sort themselves out according to individual tastes (if 70% of the people in the club like noir, then 70% of the books picked will probably be noir if everyone gets to pick the same number of times).

It's cmlancas's show, though, so what we do is up to him.  I just thought the problem of designing a "fair" rotation scheme that has some insurance against people with godawful taste was an interesting one.   :-)

I thought the point was to read stuff out of the comfort zone. If we leave it to people to pick then I assume we'll get a whole lot of shit sf. After all, if you don't read much you'r enot going to have many ideas about what's going to be good.

I think a system is better simple. Rotate categories and people picking. If there turns out ot be issues with the choices people have made it's be obvious and can be delt with at the time.

Now, can more people talk about the book for this bit!? I don't want to sit here in silence, but neither do I want to hog the conversation. Maybe it's just a weekend thing.

The prob with rotating genres lamaros is that not all of us have read stuff out of all genres. I know literally no victorian or romantic authors, and only the modern or postmodern stuff I read in HS (and I can't say I enjoyed much of it). If it ever came to me to suggest, I'd want to pitch something by Chuck Palahniuk (he wrote Fight Club but that wouldn't be my suggestion), except a) most people here have already read his stuff and b) what category would he fall under? Late 20th postmodern, maybe?

If we just rotate categories and people picking it's going to turn into a 3 man show with only those of you who are well read suggesting things, and the rest of us sitting here not contributing; I'd rather read a few "shit sf" books and have books from everyone than a nice well versed selection from 3 people.

Re: the book, post something if you've got something to discuss. I'm bad at this, and raised the only points I thought of; I chose to stay out of your pissing contest with Margalis, as it reminded me too much of Politics :uhrr:

Well see, my thing would be mentioning books I havn't read. I think anyone can look up a category and find out what type of novels they are and find one that sounds good to them. Or make up a new category. As long as it's not all the same it doesn't matter after all. It's not like the categories cmlancas put up are exhaustive.

I thought the point was that we recommend books we've read, so that when everyone else reads it, they have some guarantee that it's not totally godawful. Thats why I liked Samwise's idea. If I was willing to just pick books randomly from these genres, I'd have read them by now.

My suggestion is "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep", by Phillip K Dick from 1968. This is the book Bladerunner is based on. Its different enough from the movie that it has stuff to talk about, yet to me its as compelling a read as the movie was to watch. It also goes more deeply into some isssues that then movie does, such as the destruction of earth's wildlife and the entire concept of empathy as the defining factor of defining a human being. Lots to talk about, action, social dystopia and more sci-fi gadgetry than you can shake a stick at. And its from an author that I, at least, consider part of capital L literature.

It is longer than the previous book, at 224 pages.

Amazon link here (http://www.amazon.com/Androids-Dream-Electric-Millennium-Masterworks/dp/1857988132/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200764241&sr=8-1)

mmm. Another good choice. But let's not forget that Blade Runner is also based on "Nighthawks" too.  :awesome_for_real:

Uhm, I'm not familiar with Nighthawks.

Gosh, I almost want to suggest a book or two, but I'm pretty sure I'd get Blackspotted to hell. I was not a lit guy in college.

(http://www.groonk.net/blog/images/nighthawks.jpg)

^Nighthawks by Hopper

This probably won't stay long, I don't feel like image dumping it.

Ah, I see what you mean. Well, this might be a turn off for some, but the book DADOS isn't very noire-ish. It has the atmosphere present in most Phillip K Dick stories.

I voted for Sci-Fi… …I'd like to read some fiction, I read a great deal, but mostly all non-fiction these days…

Some suggestions:

Neuromancer by William Gibson (or other title by William Gibson)
Starship Troopers (or other title by Robert Heinlein, have read some, but still have never read Stranger in a Strange Land)
Otherland by Tad Williams
Neal Stephenson (though not my favorite,  I have to strain to read…)

Maybe we can narrow down to a short list of titles (in voted upon genre) and then vote on the title (or author)…

Uh, we picked a sci-fi book. Did you see it?

No, didn't see that… …scratch my last post then…

DADoES has probably been read by a few people, and is SF, which we've already had. The Movie is noirish, but the book is notsomuch.

I like Philip K. Dick as much as anyone, but I think he has better books than that one, and that it'd be better to wait till we get back to SF again to pick it.


Well, there's no guarantee. Some of you like American Gods and such, afterall. :-)

But seriously. How do you read and find new things if no one ever reads something new? For those of you not willing to take a chance on a new book you're dependent on people who are, and who's taste you share, to broaden your reading. You don't have to do it randomly. Afterall, the first time you read The Great Gatsby it was probably recommended by things you had just heard about the book generally. Reading Joyce, Faulkner, etc you were probably confident enough to just go off their reputation and not depend on someone who you knew having read the novel.

You just listed half of the books I've read in the last 6 months.

Other categories I suggest:

Short Fiction.
Asian Literature.
Black writers.
Non-Fiction.
Poetry.
Magic Realism. (As much as I generally hate it).
Pre-16th century fiction.
and
Free Book Choice!

Today The Onion called us "a bunch of freaks". (http://www.theonion.com/content/news/area_eccentric_reads_entire_book)  I think we should shut this down and delete all the threads.

You know, if we're in this for discussion, I'm just gonna throw this out there:

The Stranger by Camus.

Doesn't everyone read that in high school?

The Onion hasn't been funny for 5 years.  :heartbreak:

Umm...I don't, that's why I thought the book club here was such a good idea. Great Gatsby wasn't very good imo, and I read it because it was assigned in High School. Never read any Joyce or Faulkner. In after "wanting to broaden horizons." And while I'm willing to take a chance on a book at random, I'm not willing to take a chance recommending a book at random.

How much do you really absorb when you read a book for high school anyway?  The only thing I remember about that book is that the Cure wrote a song about it.  And it turned a friend of mine into a drug-addled born-again Buddhist who now lives in a monastery somewhere in the woods of New York.

Well, it depends how recently you left high-school I guess.

But isn't it better reading something you havn't read at all rather than something you just can't remember? Especialy if most everyone has read it and might remember better.

True.  Okay, how about Mein Kampf?

 :pedobear:

Throwing random books out there:

The Pillars of the Earth - Ken Follet (historical fiction)

Son of the Revolution - Liang Heng and Judith Shapiro (um...factual historical account?durr, autobiographical)

I can elaborate if anyone would like, but they're both EXCELLENT books.

I'm not sure if I'd pick Joyce of Faulkner, simply because it might turn off quite a few people not interested in experimental literature. I love stream of consciousness, Araby, Portrait, and The Sound and the Fury. However, on the f13 list to people who are looking to broaden horizons? I'm not so sure. (However, if everyone was looking for a challenge, I'd be all for it.)

If by experimental you mean beautiful. But it was only an example--I don't want to make the SF army here hate me--I'd not recommend them.

I don't think anyone has yet suggested John Steinbeck.  Now, I really dislike most of his work.  But one book is awesome:  Travels with Charley.  It's a simple, road trip travelogue that will really appeal to those who love to travel.

Not Grapes of Wrath or Of Mice and Men? Also, he has some good short stories. However, Steinbeck makes me ashamed to go to Monterey; it is so touristy now with the aquarium there. At least the aquarium is awesome though.  :awesome_for_real:

Grapes of Wrath is good stuff.

I was forced to read Grapes of Wrath when I was about nine.  It scarred me for life.  And yet, having read a few other things by him in later years, I think it's my favorite book of his.   :uhrr:

I always wanted to name a band Rosasharn. I mean... a woman breast feeding a bum. That's hot.

[edit] Seriously though... I like it for.. sentimental reasons I guess? Some of my family on my dad's side made that migration west back then. And Steinbeck's ideals are reflective of a time when socialism wasn't so villainized in America, so that's a neat peculiarity.

Ugh, I just couldn't stand most anything else by Steinbeck.  It's a writing style thing.  Him and Hemingway, just ... ugh.

I did, however, really enjoy the characters and setting of Cannery Row.  Just not Steinbeck's prose style.  I'm the sort of reader that I'll reread stuff like Cannery Row if there was anything I liked about it, though.

As an aside:  I have a rabid love of everything Mark Twain ever wrote, and I've been told by "lit people" that that's just odd.  I guess Twain and Steinbeck get compared a lot for some reason.  God knows why.  Twain is clearly as far above Steinbeck as the Wii is above every other console  :grin:

So what do we think? Should we vote on the next book or just have someone choose it from the thread that people in the book club have posted in?

I see in the thread so far:

lamaros, Miasma, Samwise, Rendakor, Margalis, Strazos, Lt.Dan, hal, Stray, Tebonas, sigil, NowhereMan, MaceVanHoffen, Bokonon, Prospero and Phildo

I think it should be limited to those people, as opposed to those of you slacking who didn't read the first book!  :drill:

I'm not really in this thread. Just lurking mostly. Haven't read Cat's Cradle in like ten years, not sure what to say.

Just make stuff up and be provocative. It gets the juices flowing.

I'm intrigued by that book which made somebody become a druggy-hippie-minimalist-Buddhist.

Edit: I just looked it up and it sounds horribly depressing, I don't need that.

I have to reiterate my desire not to read The Outsider/The Stranger again. I've read it a few times in the last few years, recently watched a play of it, see it referenced everyone, and I'm rather over it!

It's short though, so people can just read it for personal pleasure. It's hot (get it!?). Also, if you've never read any other Camus, do so. I especially like The Plague.

I am still working on Cat's Cradle. Took me a while to get my hands on a copy. I don't have a strong feeling about the next book, but I'm not big on French existentialists. I got my Masters in Existential Phenomenological Psychology, so its a bit of a repeat for me. Hee.

I was just reminded of something ...

Back when Lost was in its first season, I remember reading that certain plot elements were inspired by a number of novels, among them The Third Policeman (http://www.amazon.com/Third-Policeman-Flann-OBrien/dp/156478214X/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1200979744&sr=8-1).  I intend to read it in any case.  It sounds strange and interesting, and could make for good discussion.

As I've not read it, I can't recommend it.  I had never even heard of the author until I saw that bit about Lost.  But maybe someone here knows something about it?  Does it even sound like something folks here would enjoy?

*insert cheapshot at quality of writing of something associated in any way with Lost*

Who the hell has a graduate program like that?

Lost at first seemed like Ubik by Phillip K. Dick. (One of my favorite books) I think at this point they are just making shit up without rhyme or reason to keep the show going but it looked to be going down that road.

That's the book I'm suggesting when it is my turn BTW.

I think we should take turns choosing. Makes the choices more original I think, more room for wider scope, when it's not always the most popular option that gets in.

Seattle University (http://www.seattleu.edu/artsci/gradpsy/), a Jesuit school.

I agree that we should take turns picking books. We need some way of choosing genre though, if we want to keep our selections diverse.

How bout this: make a new poll with a more comprehensive genre list and we vote again. Then we start at the top genre; anyone can suggest a book of that genre, and we vote on books. Once someone's book is picked, they can't suggest until we've read something from everyone (or no one who hasn't suggested has a book for that particular genre). Its a little complex, but it would give everyone a say and keep our selection varied. (If we go with this, sci fi would go at the bottom with cmlancas unable to suggest)

Or just list our names in some order and alternate picking, genres be damned. :drill:

Simpler is better. I say just list the names and go down the line letting each person pick whatever. They can solicit suggestions if they want.

I think a fair amount of people read the book,  but were turned off by the anti-discussion that followed.

Yes.  Litfags throwing poo at each other about the correct way to discuss a book is not conducive to actually discussing the book.   :uhrr:

Meanwhile the thread sits there for days inbetween, with us 'litfags' holding back, and no one else posts anything at all...

"I liked it!" isn't discussion. There are many topics raised there that havn't been discussed that much as yet, and many more people can bring up themselves beside. Yet they havn't.

Because cmlancas and I had a little digression about lit theory (in a literature bookclub) everyone else has been too put off to post themselves. Please...

lamaros, instead of continuing to be a whiny self-centered douchebag who trolls every thread you could try asking people *what* about the discussion turned them off.

When the first post about the book is someone complaining after reading 30 pages you're off to a bad start. That's my take.

Samwise and Johny Cee, what turned you guys off? Feel free to blame me at least in part. :grin:

If people are going to back out of discussing something because they don't like the fact that someone disliked the book...

I responded to samwise and tried to have a decent discussion. You took issue with what I said so we discussed things. cmlancas put on his teaching cap about lit theory and I took issue. Meanwhile we were still discussing Ice-9, religion, and how we all saw the book.

I enjoy discussing books and if it happens that someone takes offence with the way I've done it then they can let me know about it and I'll take it into account. (I sent you a PM along these lines, you'll remember). I'm opinionated, but not entirely unreasonable. But how am I meant to respond to nothing?

Others indicated a tepid response to the book, why single me out?  :grin:

If you look at the contents of that thread and think "gee, I can't see what scared people off" there may be no hope for you.   :awesome_for_real:

Speaking for myself, I mostly stopped posting in that thread because Lamaros started inexplicably blaming me for the dickwaving contest that you three were having.  Not knowing what exactly I had done wrong, I decided it was better to keep my big yap shut.   :nda:

Anyway, speaking of book picking, have any of you read A Canticle for Leibowitz?  cmlancas says he hasn't, so he might not be able to throw links at us in lieu of actual discussion.   :awesome_for_real:  If Marg and Lam haven't read it either I think that should be our next book.  It counts as both "science fiction" and "modernism".  Assuming I don't misunderstand what "modernism" is, which I probably do.

I didn't blame you, I said that my response to you is what cmlancas took issue with, but the problem was that it was made in response to a specific point you had made (about the landscape of SF in the 50's and 60s) but that context was lost later one with all the quoting.

I didn't blame you at all. :( Sigh.

Also, I tried to avoid talking about it and Stray said to continue...

Like I said. I have no problem with discussing things in a different way, I assume the same goes for anyone (margalis and cmlancas I 'spose) who was involved in such stuff. But unless people mention it to you how are you meant to know? The only response to this was:

"I don't think it's annoying at all. Go right ahead. This is what book discussions should be about!"

Who's to know?


Havn't read it.

The tone of the discussion went pretty aggressive early on,  for no apparent reason.  Seemed like things could have been rerouted more constructively with a couple of "could you clarify this point?"

I blame Samwise.  He's glib.

 :oh_i_see:

Testosterone poisoning for the lose.

cmlancas designate a successor that will choose the next book. Sounds like the simples thing to me. That person picks, then picks a successor.

cmlancas acting like a teacher instead of a peer turned me off immediately. Then it turned into a Politics thread. :uhrr: Also, I made what few comments I could think of, but the book did not seem very deep to me. Those of you wanting more discussion should keep things civil; I'm not whipping out the epeen over something I don't care about.

I don't like the successor idea; a list is better, to make sure everyone gets a shot.

Edit: wow, double fail...I give up. Someone merge this with the book club sticky since my cellphone is being :uhrr: .

« Last Merge: Today at 09:45:42 AM by lesion »

Don't know how my name slipped in there. Didn't read the first book due to delivering problems with Amazon (basically my only delivering method for non-mainstream english books). I strongly suspect I might have that same problem again in the future.

My bad. Didn't know it'd make things worse. I thought you and cmlancas were actually on the right track for a book discussion, despite it getting a little heated.

I'd really like to recommend the following book, Homesickness by Murray Bail, but it is out of stock at Amazon and being an Australian author will probably be hard to find in places overseas, so I wont. It's a great book nonetheless.

There are some bits to it that might go past non-Australian readers (there are bits that will go past everyone) but it's not that big a flaw to my mind. It's a distinctive book with Bail's style strong throughout, and where it works to much better effect than his more well known book, Eucalyptus.

The Amazon review gives a good explanation of it:

http://www.amazon.com/Homesickness-Novel-Murray-Bail/dp/B000H2M3CO/ref=pd_bbs_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1201214860&sr=8-2

So, we were theoretically supposed to start a new book yesterday and I don't think one's been formally put forth yet.  Someone needs to seize the reins and establish how new books get picked.  That someone should probably be cmlancas since it was his idea, he started the thread, and he can edit the first post.

cmlancas post below makes my timewasting pointless and confusing. removed.

Sorry if I got all pedagogical, I really was just trying to help discussion. Then, it devolved from  :awesome_for_real: to  :oh_i_see: to  :uhrr: to  :ye_gods: . Interesting how they were all in a line. Unfortunately, I think I fell for the troll-bait.

That part of the thread might should've been snipped off, but I just couldn't help but respond.  :drill:

Anyway, yes, I think we should make a list. I'm going to hop on a MUD and do a random number generation.

The results:
1- lamaros, 2-Miasma, 3-Samwise, 4-Rendakor, 5-Margalis, 6-Strazos, 7-Lt.Dan, 8-hal, 9-Stray, 10-Tebonas, 11-sigil, 12-NowhereMan, 13-MaceVanHoffen, 14-B-o-k-o-n-o-n, 15-Prospero and 16-Phildo

11,3,8,4,1,10,9,16,2,15,13,7,5,14,6,12

So, the book list will be, (and I'll post this on the first page):

sigil, Samwise, hal, Rendakor, lamaros, Tebonas, Stray, Phildo, Miasma, Prospero, MaceVanHoffen, Lt.Dan, Margalis, Bokonon, Strazos, and NowhereMan

For the constraints of the next book, your pick must be inside Mystery/Noir. Some choices have already been posted if you're confused or if you don't know what to pick.

Edit: What the fuck is going on? Every time I type out Bok's name, it gives me something wacky.

sigil, if you could PM Samwise and I with your selection by say, tonight, that'd be swell. I'll try to reach you on steam and PM so he can edit my post (he has this newfangled neat lookin' thing on the first post) and I can start you a new thread.


Oh, and I won't   :ye_gods: it up. I promise. So come out of your shells, people!

Sigil, disregard the bit about PMing me.   :grin:  cmlancas, you can always edit your own posts, unless we put you in the special group and nobody told me.

Also, just a suggestion -- you can skip the coordinating on PMs and stuff.  Just have the next picker start the thread for the next book.  cmlancas will see it and update the first post of this thread accordingly.  Everyone wins and I don't have to do anything.   :awesome_for_real:

I think picking books two weeks before read date woudl still be good, considering some people's trouble with ordering.

Also, should Soukyan be on that list?

Couple comments:

1. There is no need to force people to pick from certain genres. If people pick genres they personally like over time that will represent all the genres in proportion to audience taste. If 25% of people want to read Noir then those 25% can pick Noir for their books.

2. It doesn't seem right to me to exclude people who didn't participate in the first discussion, especially people who read the book and were turned off by the fucktardery -- while including the fucktards. Posting in any of the book club threads should be enough assuming the person is still interested.

Let's just keep a list of all the interested people along with whether they have picked or not.

Oops. It isn't perfect. Just tack him on at the end?  :drill:

Oh, and I don't know how you did that nifty header stuff. It was nice and tidy and I liked it. About the only html I know is <a href=> :P

Please remove me from your list as I am not participating. I just went back through the thread and failed to see where I had posted. But, what ever . Please remove me from your list.

Thank you

BBcode is even easier than HTML. 

To make a link:


To make that nice horizontal line thing (a "horizontal rule"):


You don't even have to type all that in.  To add a link, highlight the link text and click the (http://forums.f13.net/Themes/f13/images/bbc/url.gif) button.  To add an hrule, click the (http://forums.f13.net/Themes/f13/images/bbc/hr.gif) button.  It's like using MS Word.

OH damn, I've been using "<a href>" all these years.

[url] is much better.  It automatically opens the link in a new window instead of taking over my precious f13 window.   :grin:

So is sigil picking a book or what?   :grin:

Yes, I overuse the  :grin: emoticon.  But it so perfectly encapsulates the way I feel most of the day.

 :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:

I move we should push him to the end of the line. Samwise, go ahead. (I know you'll be on here today  :awesome_for_real:)

 :grin:

Right then.  Book is A Canticle for Leibowitz by Walter M. Miller.  GO!

hal Rendakor, if you're about I wondered if you had a book in mind (you're up next) and if so could let people know here in this thread a week in advance or so if it's going to prove troublesome to get a hold of.

Edit: hal asked above to be removed from the list.

I'm next?! OH SHI-

Since we're doing "Literature" it can't be anything remotely new, right? Let me check my collection when I get home, and I'll post my pick tonight. It won't be noir, but I'll try to get us away from sci-fi at least.

I don't see why it can't be new. I also don't see why it can't be something you haven't read.

Yeah go for broke, I will most likely pick something new that I havn't read when it's my turn. (But from an author I trust).

Alright well, assuming everyone hasn't read it, my pick is Battle Royale by Koushun Takami.

If you've read it is there any specific translation you recommend?

Looks like there's only one translation going around.

The original japanese, of course!

Didn't even think of that to be honest. Mine's translated by Yuji Oniki, the one published in the US by Viz. Tried to find it on amazon, the one they have on there that is the novel and not the manga looks like mine, but they don't have a translator credited. :uhrr:

Edit: Yea I wasn't aware there was more than one, so your comment confused me.

Haven't read it.  Will start looking for it as soon as I finish Canticle for the umpteenth time.

Is that more or less than the nth time?

I may need to bow out of this for a few months until school is over.  I just can't keep up with the pace of the reading and actually study at the moment.  I'll still be happy to recommend a book when my turn comes around, though.

The answer to that question varies with the value of n.

So umpteenth is fixed?

Could I be taken off the "choose a book" list, I don't actually want to select a book we read.  Plus your guys' choices are kinda bumming me out so I think I'm going to sit out from now on.

I was going to pick something awesome and un SFish next (in a month?), wait! :-(

I found a copy of Battle Royale at Borders today, so I'll be wading through that in short order.  (Note to others working on acquiring it -- there's a manga of the same name, but that's not what you want.  You want the novel, which will probably be in the sci-fi section.)  Also, IMO you should start a thread for it so people who don't monitor this thread closely will know what to shop for.

wat

we're doing battle royale?

like THE Battle Royale?

fucking rad.

Who's "we", white man?

I don't know what you're talking about. But Battle Royale is great, and you find it under Fiction at BN or Borders here in Phoenix.

Red and Black cover.

Edit: This is what you want.

(http://www.coverbrowser.com/image/bestselling-comics-2007/189-1.jpg)

Yes. But here in Pennsylvania, B&N files it under sci-fi. Border's under general fiction. Corporate standards. Bah!

And yes, good idea, Samwise.

I finished Battle Royale.  It went very quick for a 600-page book.

While it's nice that I already own BR...does it really count as actual literature? I thought it was more of a "light novel, " to borrow a term from JP.


Note that I have not actually Read the book yet, though I have glanced at it, just to see how it was written.

You can use your black mark if you like.  :grin:

I'm going into it with an open mind. I've seen the movie and read parts of the manga but whatever, I'll take it on its own merits.

Naw, this is nowhere near bad enough to warrant a black mark.

Speaking of which, I need to finish the Manga...I still need the final 1 or 2 volumes.

I'm not sure when, if ever, we'll be reading the next book, but I'm going to opt out of picking one and I seem to be next to choose. Uni is starting today and I'll be reading too much from that to probably have the inclination to read more.

Actually, can that:

Read 'The Road' by Cormac McCarthy. It continues the current theme, and is a good read to boot.

I know it's not a book choice this week, but I'm reading through The Postman Always Rings Twice while I'm auditing a course and I noticed that it was recommended by another poster. Therefore, I'm going to start a thread here (http://forums.f13.net/index.php?topic=12518.0).

Edit: Added the URL, and perhaps as we finish/choose books, we can just start new threads as "F13 Book Club Part X: Book_01 by Author_01"