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Author Topic: Return of the Book Thread  (Read 888736 times)
Rasix
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I am the harbinger of your doom!


Reply #6580 on: March 02, 2021, 10:10:22 AM

I started reading the Dresden books. Read about 5 and will probably read a few more, but something is a bit off. Just a bit too... try hard?

He writes from Harry's perspective, and Harry is a bit of a dork and, to be honest, chauvinist. A lot of it reads like wish fulfillment. It's a good story and interesting world, but I don't hold Butcher's writing up as a reason to read the series.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2021, 11:12:04 AM by Rasix »

-Rasix
lamaros
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Reply #6581 on: March 02, 2021, 11:35:14 PM

I started reading the Dresden books. Read about 5 and will probably read a few more, but something is a bit off. Just a bit too... try hard?

He writes from Harry's perspective, and Harry is a bit of a dork and, to be honest, chauvinist. A lot of it reads like wish fulfillment. It's a good story and interesting world, but I don't hold Butcher's writing up as a reason to read the series.

Yeah the whole, "I'm chivalrous, now excuse me while I tell you all the details about the women's breasts and nipples, it's cold out" stuff is pretty tiring. It annoys me a lot more than Garrett P.I.'s "I'm sexist, I know, but I'll leave most of it to your imagination" stuff.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2021, 11:37:53 PM by lamaros »
Draegan
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Reply #6582 on: March 03, 2021, 07:29:31 AM

I've tried to re-read Dune a number of times in the last month.

I'll get to page 5 soon. I promise.
BobtheSomething
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Posts: 402


Reply #6583 on: March 03, 2021, 10:36:27 AM

I've tried to re-read Dune a number of times in the last month.

I'll get to page 5 soon. I promise.

Maybe start with the appendices?
Khaldun
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Reply #6584 on: March 03, 2021, 12:14:29 PM

Dune is definitely a slow burn kind of read--it's so all-in on the world-building that even the exposition only comes in the form of both portentous and pretentious dialogue and Paul's inner monologue.
Johny Cee
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Reply #6585 on: March 03, 2021, 03:11:12 PM

I started reading the Dresden books. Read about 5 and will probably read a few more, but something is a bit off. Just a bit too... try hard?

He writes from Harry's perspective, and Harry is a bit of a dork and, to be honest, chauvinist. A lot of it reads like wish fulfillment. It's a good story and interesting world, but I don't hold Butcher's writing up as a reason to read the series.

Yeah the whole, "I'm chivalrous, now excuse me while I tell you all the details about the women's breasts and nipples, it's cold out" stuff is pretty tiring. It annoys me a lot more than Garrett P.I.'s "I'm sexist, I know, but I'll leave most of it to your imagination" stuff.

Harry feels like an audience surrogate/wish fulfillment character lots of times, so it feels blech because its putting his actions/thoughts on you.  As was pointed out in other places, Harry also has a pretty strong Nice Guy vibe and tends to think that women want him, but he also isn't getting any, so it feels extra gross.  Harry's voice is very modern/nerd culture, which helps with that audience identification.

Let's put it this way:  If Harry stared complaining about all the Chads getting the Beckys, would you be surprised?


Garrett is a character, we are just privy to his inner thoughts.  He also spends inordinate time talking about beer, horse paranoia, and how bad the swamps were in the war.  His voice, like many Cook characters, is kind of self-educated Blue Collar.  I wouldn't even call him sexist...  he seems to have no problem respecting women as equals or superiors (unlike Dresden!), he's just always on the prowl/kind of a womanizer.  He's sometimes a bit gross/sexually aggressive in a noir kind of way.  I'm entertained by Garrett as a character, but don't particularly identify with him.

NowhereMan
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Reply #6586 on: March 04, 2021, 08:55:30 AM

Yeah, Harry was written to be consciously like that but it really didn't work that well, it was at least partly an effort to pastiche/homage pulp detective stuff. Butcher has, I believe, admitted as much and made an effort to change those aspects of Harry and he's less obnoxious about that in later books. I do like that you see some actual character growth from people in the Dresden books but I wouldn't recommend anyone persevere through it if you're not enjoying things (at least once you're past the first 3 books, that I don't remember being particularly good).

"Look at my car. Do you think that was bought with the earnest love of geeks?" - HaemishM
rattran
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Posts: 4205

Unreasonable


Reply #6587 on: March 04, 2021, 02:57:44 PM

His new(ish) wife also gets pissed about the misogyny and points it out to him now.
WayAbvPar
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Reply #6588 on: April 15, 2021, 07:30:58 PM

Read the first of the Assassin's Apprentice series. It was wildly uneven, but I think I enjoyed it. Haven't read a 'new' fantasy series for a couple of years, so it was fun to get to learn a new world.

When speaking of the MMOG industry, the glass may be half full, but it's full of urine. HaemishM

Always wear clean underwear because you never know when a Tory Government is going to fuck you.- Ironwood

Libertarians make fun of everyone because they can't see beyond the event horizons of their own assholes Surlyboi
Chimpy
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WWW
Reply #6589 on: April 16, 2021, 06:21:46 AM

Read the first of the Assassin's Apprentice series. It was wildly uneven, but I think I enjoyed it. Haven't read a 'new' fantasy series for a couple of years, so it was fun to get to learn a new world.

Save yourself the trouble of continuing.  DRILLING AND WOMANLINESS

'Reality' is the only word in the language that should always be used in quotes.
Reg
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Reply #6590 on: April 16, 2021, 06:41:13 AM

You're talking about the series by Robin Hobb? I liked it myself. I think Apprentice was her first book so yeah it's a little rough. She wrote several trilogies set in that world. If you like it, then google up the reading order and follow that. Fitz gets another trilogy of his own to cap it all off.

IMO, one of the best things about it is that it's complete. You aren't making a 20 year commitment like Wheel of Time.  awesome, for real
NowhereMan
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Reply #6591 on: April 16, 2021, 07:39:11 AM

I've just finished Brandon Sanderson's Rhythm of War (newest one in the Stormlight Archives series) and really enjoyed it. It's a long book and there's a good 15-20% that probably would have been better served as standalone novella or covering off the character it focuses on in an earlier book. Sanderson has definitely gotten a handle on the climax, things genuinely do build in tension and urgency and minor plots do get resolved before the finale (rather than historically where 90% of the novel was raising questions, creating plot threads and the last 10% was resolving everything suddenly).

I hope it's not spoiler worthy but these are part of his Cosmere thing and by this point they've added a lot more of people travelling from other planets and discussions of things going on in other parts of the universe. It's very much moving from the initial high fantasy setting to more Science Fantasy. It's interesting but I can see people getting frustrated at either 1) putting in all these 'natural laws' for magic that treats it as almost a mundane element of world or 2) Putting all this pseudo-scientific stuff that is nothing like how actual science works. Hard magic fantasy types will probably enjoy it but it is very much pseudo science in the sense that he talks about science being a gradual, collaborative process but then the plot requires one character to make pretty much a solo breakthrough through pulling 20 hour days due to obsession that leaps scientific understanding forward by 6000 years. In fairness those previous 6,000 years were mostly spent fighting using magic at the direction of god level beings that didn't really give people time to research stuff I guess.

Overall it was a solid entry and I did like his tackling of depression and mental illness with Kaladin. His prose still feels pretty workmanlike and it's definitely being dealt with as text rather than subtext but it definitely feels like he's put time in to understanding the issue and trying to handle it appropriately.

"Look at my car. Do you think that was bought with the earnest love of geeks?" - HaemishM
rattran
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Posts: 4205

Unreasonable


Reply #6592 on: April 16, 2021, 08:29:22 AM

Read the first of the Assassin's Apprentice series. It was wildly uneven, but I think I enjoyed it. Haven't read a 'new' fantasy series for a couple of years, so it was fun to get to learn a new world.

Overall, I've enjoyed her writing, but parts are really bad. In all her series there's at least some parts that made me just want to give up reading it and move to something more consistent.

Didn't help that I was reading Iain Banks' stuff for the first time in between her books.
Rendakor
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Reply #6593 on: April 16, 2021, 07:25:08 PM

I liked her first two Fitz trilogies (haven't read the newer one) but really hated the Soldier Son one. First book was mediocre, second was really shit, third was not purchased.

"i can't be a star citizen. they won't even give me a star green card"
Reg
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Reply #6594 on: April 17, 2021, 07:31:14 AM

Yeah, soldier son was garbage. Luckily, it had no visible connection to Fitz' universe so I figure it doesn't count. :)
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