Why I can't take John Travolta seriously

[Paelos]

Which goes a long way in explaing why religion villainizes free sex.

Depends on which religion.

[Strazos]

Sorry if I've liked enough Tarantino movies. It's not so much that I like Tarantino, it's more like there are some movies that I like, and he happened to direct them.

Then again, it seems more people around here are pretty jaded when it comes to film. Most of you seem to go to the movies (or rent, or whatever) more than I have in the last couple of years.

[Velorath]

Sorry if I've liked enough Tarantino movies. It's not so much that I like Tarantino, it's more like there are some movies that I like, and he happened to direct them.

Then again, it seems more people around here are pretty jaded when it comes to film. Most of you seem to go to the movies (or rent, or whatever) more than I have in the last couple of years.

I see a lot of movies these days (as it's my job), but I like Tarantino's stuff and I won't even jokingly apologize for it just because some cunt here thinks his opinion will be worth more than two squirts of piss to people just so long as he can make it sound like only retards would possibly disagree with him.

[Samwise]

Then again, it seems more people around here are pretty jaded when it comes to film. Most of you seem to go to the movies (or rent, or whatever) more than I have in the last couple of years.

I go to a lot of movies because I like movies, and I don't dislike movies because I go to a lot of movies.

[Selby]

but I like Tarantino's stuff and I won't even jokingly apologize for it just because some cunt here thinks his opinion will be worth more than two squirts of piss to people just so long as he can make it sound like only retards would possibly disagree with him.

If a movie is good, it's good.  Who cares who directed it or starred in it.  If Uwe Boll put out a good movie (sure), I would enjoy it just because it was a good movie, I wouldn't pretend to hate it just because it happened to have some idiot director.  Of course everyone's definition of "good" is more than a little subjective...

[stray]

That's silly. You can't seperate the art from the artist.

[Paelos]

That's silly. You can't seperate the art from the artist.

Agreed, and where Tarantino is concerned his movies have either really been great in my eyes, or they have been unwatchable shit that I tuned out of in the first hour. I don't have a lot of middle ground with his stuff.

[Johny Cee]

Sorry if I've liked enough Tarantino movies. It's not so much that I like Tarantino, it's more like there are some movies that I like, and he happened to direct them.

Then again, it seems more people around here are pretty jaded when it comes to film. Most of you seem to go to the movies (or rent, or whatever) more than I have in the last couple of years.

This is a "time of life" thing.  You hit the mid-20's and all of sudden you're much less motivated to do anything.

[schild]

This is a "time of life" thing. You hit the mid-20's and all of sudden you're much less motivated to do anything.

Truth.

[Paelos]

This is a "time of life" thing. You hit the mid-20's and all of sudden you're much less motivated to do anything.

Truth.

Yeah I'm sitting in that hellhole right now.

[Samwise]

This is a "time of life" thing.  You hit the mid-20's and all of sudden you're much less motivated to do anything.

Does that mean it's temporary?  Thank God.

[Gutboy Barrelhouse]

But when you hit 45 you get motivated all over again 

[Ironwood]

That's silly. You can't seperate the art from the artist.

I don't know if that should have been in green, as well as the monkey agreeing with you, but it's bollocks.

[Sky]

Scientology fasicnates me because I'd love to move 2000 years into the future and see what scientology morphs into. I know I'm walking dangerous ground here, but L Ron is the Joseph Smith of the 20th century, and it makes me wonder if Jesus and Moses before him weren't the L Ron and Joseph Smith's of their day as well.

This is precisely my viewpoint on the matter.

Except L Ron actually wrote his book.

[Damn Dirty Ape]

Indeed.  While I dig Jesus from a hippie point of view, he didn't write his own book.  Supposedly, his followers scribed a few scrolls (which we only have copies of copies of copies), padded it out with huge chunks of Judaism, and then told the Jews they were the ones who were confused about their own frikkin' Messiah.

Pure balls.

Back to the OP and another reason why we can't take John Travolta seriously:

Hard hat days and honky-tonk nights.

[Jayce]

Hard hat days and honky-tonk nights.

"I live la vida luna.  The crazy life".

Then later, Ricky Martin taught us real Spanish.

[stray]

That's silly. You can't seperate the art from the artist.

I don't know if that should have been in green, as well as the monkey agreeing with you, but it's bollocks.

No it wasn't meant to be in green. The monkey probably agrees with me because he's involved in creative pursuits himself.

I don't know anyone, including myself, who doesn't inject their personality and life experiences in their creations, or anybody who intentionally avoids removing their identity and personal style from what they create. Even when they're paying homage to something and just drawing Mickey Mouse, or mimicing Kerouac, or copping Hendrix, they still put a piece of themselves in it. The person is the art and vice versa. What's going on in their life affects it. What they personally like affects it. Who are they are affects it. And once you're acquainted with one or two works, you can gauge who they are and what they're style is in order to know what to expect in future projects (more or less -- though a good artist will keep surprising you in how he or she applies that personal style).

In this case, we're talking about filmmakers. One who is more or less an auteur at that. And one who is on the extreme side of things, at near evangelistic levels, in making films that are pretty much about himself and his own tastes.

[EDIT] Someone school me on the proper use of the word "affect". 

[Triforcer]

Oh, come on.  This is just like those unbelievably faggy debates about not playing good games because of the company that makes them.  If a movie/game is good, I'll watch/play it.  This isn't about politics/religion/whatever where there are actually good moral reasons to boycott the creator of something because you disagree with them.  Its about gaming.  If Uwe Boll himself makes a good movie (somehow) I'll watch it. 

[stray]

Oh, come on.  This is just like those unbelievably faggy debates about not playing good games because of the company that makes them.  If a movie/game is good, I'll watch/play it.  This isn't about politics/religion/whatever where there are actually good moral reasons to boycott the creator of something because you disagree with them.  Its about gaming.  If Uwe Boll himself makes a good movie (somehow) I'll watch it. 

Lol. Being able to discern who has talent and good ideas, or who's style you gravitate towards is "unbelievably faggy"? And yet, you're OK with dissing art and entertainment for sake of "moral reasons".

Pardon me if I don't bother debating with you.

[Triforcer]

Oh, come on.  This is just like those unbelievably faggy debates about not playing good games because of the company that makes them.  If a movie/game is good, I'll watch/play it.  This isn't about politics/religion/whatever where there are actually good moral reasons to boycott the creator of something because you disagree with them.  Its about gaming.  If Uwe Boll himself makes a good movie (somehow) I'll watch it. 

Lol. Being able to discern who has talent and good ideas, or who's style you gravitate towards is "unbelievably faggy"? And yet, you're OK with dissing art and entertainment for sake of "moral reasons".

Pardon me if I don't bother debating with you.

Pardon me if I don't debate with you, because you just changed your argument in the last post.  I have nothing against using the creator of a movie as a pre-viewing INDICATOR of whether you should see it, in the absence of any other information- in that case, you are still trying to determine if a movie is good.  Previously, you and others were arguing that even if a movie is normatively and indisputably GOOD (and you learn this through other sources of information), you wouldn't see it because of the creator.

The two arguments are analytically distinct.  Which do you really mean, 1 or 2?   

[Jayce]

Oh, come on.  This is just like those unbelievably faggy debates about not playing good games because of the company that makes them.  If a movie/game is good, I'll watch/play it.  This isn't about politics/religion/whatever where there are actually good moral reasons to boycott the creator of something because you disagree with them.  Its about gaming.  If Uwe Boll himself makes a good movie (somehow) I'll watch it. 

Lol. Being able to discern who has talent and good ideas, or who's style you gravitate towards is "unbelievably faggy"? And yet, you're OK with dissing art and entertainment for sake of "moral reasons".

Pardon me if I don't bother debating with you.

Even leaving aside the sideways slam to the gay members of our little community by your incredibly insightful use of the word faggy, this debate is stupid.

There's boycotting a director/writer/painter because you don't think you'd like him if you had a conversation over coffee.

There's boycotting same because they give money to [cause you are morally opposed to].

Those two things aren't the same.  One is more serious than the other.  Which one is more serious is an exercise for the reader.

[stray]

And still, he's calling it "unbelievably faggy" merely if someone said:

"Hey, I liked all of Tim Schafer's games. I think I'll buy this new one."

Or, "There's like 2 Vonnegut books I haven't liked for the past twenty years I've been reading him. I'll give this one a shot."


As opposed to,

"Anna Karenina lost her virginity before marriage. Good riddance to Tolstoy, I say!"

[Triforcer]

And still, he's calling it "unbelievably faggy" merely if someone said:

"Hey, I liked all of Tim Schafer's games. I think I'll buy this new one."

Or, "There's like 2 Vonnegut books I haven't liked for the past twenty years I've been reading him. I'll give this one a shot."


As opposed to,

"Anna Karenina lost her virginity before marriage. Good riddance to Tolstoy, I say!"

Completely not what I said, or meant.  I'm through debating with you as well, because you apparently are incapable of understanding the ex ante/ex poste distinction I made above. 

[stray]

I understand what you said, and understand that you're the biggest idiot around here as well. One which, even if you grew up for awhile, would still be more stupid than Broughden. Seriously, you take the cake. You're one part Alex Keaton, one part Ishmael Boorg. And just another kid to boot.

And even if I did misunderstand, I still wouldn't care. Because I don't like you, and I'm quite happy never giving you an ounce of respect just by default.

[Morat20]

Indeed.  While I dig Jesus from a hippie point of view, he didn't write his own book.  Supposedly, his followers scribed a few scrolls (which we only have copies of copies of copies), padded it out with huge chunks of Judaism, and then told the Jews they were the ones who were confused about their own frikkin' Messiah.

Pure balls.

Back to the OP and another reason why we can't take John Travolta seriously:

Hard hat days and honky-tonk nights.

You could see the house I grew up in in one of the opening shots of Urban Cowboy. I used to drive by Gilley's all the time -- well, by the burned down wreck that used to be Gilley's.

One thing I don't believe the movie mentions is the horrible stench that often lingers over Pasadena. See, we have a large paper mill in the area -- according to an engineer I know (whole career in enviromental compliance) it's the best-smelling and cleanest paper-mill in the country. However, that's like saying the rotting carcass of a dead bull elephant in your backyard is the best-smelling rotting bull elephant in the world. It's really not a help.

Prevailing winds tend to blow the stench of that damn mill all over the place. Add in the miles and miles of refineries right across 225, and there is -- shall we say -- a distinct odor. There's upsides and downsides. The upside is that since schools are funded by property taxes, the schools in the area tend to be a LOT better than is the case (Deer Park, for instance, is one of the better school districts in the state). The downside -- we live next to the biggest domestic manufacturer of cyanide. Also, I have it on good authority that (at least during the 80s) the general view at the refineries towards air pollutants was "It's fucking cheaper to pay the EPA fines than dispose of it properly".

Also, John Travolta once filmed a movie here and seriously depressed property values.

[Yegolev]

I don't know anyone, including myself, who doesn't inject their personality and life experiences in their creations,

I prefer to eject my personality onto my creations, but it is probably the same thing.

[Lantyssa]

Woooo!  Pasa-Git-Down-Dena!

Chemical alley.  Lovely place.  My dad was sent to one of the plants there to improve their processes.  Being told about the phosgene and isocyanates they used to produce polymers was an enlightening experience as to the realities of industrial chemistry.

[Morat20]

Woooo!  Pasa-Git-Down-Dena!

Chemical alley.  Lovely place.  My dad was sent to one of the plants there to improve their processes.  Being told about the phosgene and isocyanates they used to produce polymers was an enlightening experience as to the realities of industrial chemistry.

Also happened to be on the A-list for nuclear targets during the Cold War. Sure, you wanted to nuke military bases and such -- but a single nuke could strip the US of a fair-sized port AND one of it's biggest refining centers.

[Damn Dirty Ape]

If nuclear destruction had been included in Urban Cowby's plotline, it would've been a worthwhile movie.  Travolta kicking commie ass in a post-apocalyptic world makes for a helluva 'merican icon.

[Selby]

One thing I don't believe the movie mentions is the horrible stench that often lingers over Pasadena.

You truly do have to actually smell it to believe how bad it can be.  I thought crude oil being refined out in Abilene or drilled for in Odessa stunk something fierce, but Pasadena has a stench all its own...

The upside is that since schools are funded by property taxes, the schools in the area tend to be a LOT better than is the case (Deer Park, for instance, is one of the better school districts in the state).

I don't know... the Pasadena school system isn't the most stellar according to my sister-in-law and all of the other half's family who are firmly entrenched in the area.  The Friendswood\Pearland districts are considerably "safer" schools to go to.  Sure, it isn't inner city Houston or anything like that, but it definitely isn't the top school district of choice.

And my father-in-law used to tell us all kinds of stories about Gilley's.  I never knew if he was telling the truth with some of them though...

[Lantyssa]

Clear Lake was "the" school in that area.  At least it was supposed to be.  I personally found it pretty bad, just attended by kids from better off families.

[Selby]

Pretty much what she told me too.  Just because astronauts and engineers at NASA have kids and expensive schools doesn't mean the kids are any more responsible or turn out any less messed up than the ones from bad school districts.  They just get into good colleges and drop out after wasting daddy's money for 1-2 years.

[Ironwood]

I understand what you said, and understand that you're the biggest idiot around here as well. One which, even if you grew up for awhile, would still be more stupid than Broughden. Seriously, you take the cake. You're one part Alex Keaton, one part Ishmael Boorg. And just another kid to boot.

And even if I did misunderstand, I still wouldn't care. Because I don't like you, and I'm quite happy never giving you an ounce of respect just by default.

Hey, I still disagree totally with what you said about Art, but I can get behind your Triforcer Stance.


(And it was a totally throwaway comment anyway, I don't wanna get into a debate about the Authorial Phallacy anyways, since I spent too much time studying it during my own creative pursuits.  It was an interesting Debate tactic tho.  I look forward to our lightsabre fight where you claim TO HAVE THE HIGH GROUND.)

God, I watched that movie again yesterday.   Still shit.

[HaemishM]

(And it was a totally throwaway comment anyway, I don't wanna get into a debate about the Authorial Phallacy anyways, since I spent too much time studying it during my own creative pursuits.  It was an interesting Debate tactic tho.  I look forward to our lightsabre fight where you claim TO HAVE THE HIGH GROUND.)

God, I watched that movie again yesterday.   Still shit.

For fuck's sake, why?

[WindupAtheist]

*steps into the middle of the thread, tumbleweed blowing by dramatically, six-shooters of fanboyism strapped to each hip*

Let's do this.