LOTRO NDA has been lifted.

[Trippy]

To hit 600k is saying that in the few territories LoTRO is going to launch they are going to do better than WoW did in those territories in the first year.

No, it does not. 5 months after the US/Korea launch WoW hit 1.8 million world wide including 0.5 million in Europe. Those numbers don't include China since it hadn't launched there yet. One year after launch WoW in NA (plus Australia) was well over 1 million and Europe was closing in on 1 million (it would break 1 million in January 2006).

[Venkman]

Ok, so then, not.

[Nyght]

This has the potential to blow up badly in their face.  Yah, I know Turbine's done a much better technical job with this one, but I see the risk of disaster here and just wince.

Give people 1 million beta keys and have your game melt under the pressure.  Have those cross over WoW players look around and not see anything different worth staying for except for a brand new grind.  Watch as the LOTR fanbois flood in and wonder why the hell they're killing rats and picking flowers, and why they can't be GANDALF.  Cry bitter tears when your beta->retail conversion hovers at 10%.

I would have kept this small and under control.  But what the hell do I know? Perhaps this is how you take dead aim at WoW. /shrug

After another day or so of consideration, I have come more and more to hold this view.

One of the (many) mistakes SWG made was to pop open too many servers too soon. This lead to some pretty empty servers even early on and the effect lingers to this day uncorrected.

If you have a huge 'pre-order' free trial it may cause bad things to happen.

First is the 'I paid for the pre-order' syndrome which can lead to a lack of tolerance for queues. This will put big pressure on them to open up enough servers to keep the wait times low. If you don't get enough conversion, those servers are ghost towns later in a game where group play is pretty much a requirement later on. And most of you know well I am not talking about a year out here. Mid to upper levels of the current content by summer.

Second is, this has to really hammer your GM staff. First day on the job and you flood the place with 500k nooblers with 10 problems each. I think we can look forward to reports of really slow call responce. Probably not that accurate for the longer term game but as a first impression, not so good.

Of coarse the obvious up side is you get a hell of a lot of folks to come take a look.

Certainly, this is a unique twist to a release in some respects. A trip to the grocery for another box of microwave popcorn may be in order.

[Venkman]

I agree, however, I do think LoTRO starts a bit better than having the 24+ starting areas SWG had. If I recall correct, there's only four places to start in LoTRO, so immediately you'll have density if they keep the number of servers down to a responsible level. Plus, the lifers will quickly outgrow those areas so day 1 and day 2 will be very different. Any word on whether the beta testers or Lifers will be able to play on Live servers before boxes hit retail? I don't care for myself as I won't be buying it right away (if ever), but I'm thinking about the day 1 fiasco of spawn competition in the public spaces.

[Nyght]

Any word on whether the beta testers or Lifers will be able to play on Live servers before boxes hit retail? I don't care for myself as I won't be buying it right away (if ever), but I'm thinking about the day 1 fiasco of spawn competition in the public spaces.

This is exactly the case. If you preorder, all your characters can start Friday and roll to live (level capped at 15). The requirement for continuing into live play after April 24th is to enter a retail box key.

Note that they are starting heavy promotions with these offers starting today and with the current issue of PC Gamer.

In other words, level capped live starts Friday for everyone with enough sense to fill in an order blank at an online order house, or to put up a refundable $5 at the local brick and mortar. This also gets you 10/month for as little or as long as you wish if you buy the box.

[Endie]

Any word on whether the beta testers or Lifers will be able to play on Live servers before boxes hit retail? I don't care for myself as I won't be buying it right away (if ever), but I'm thinking about the day 1 fiasco of spawn competition in the public spaces.

I'm not sure I understand your question correctly, so forgive me if this is a complete non-sequitor, but all those who purchase pre-order boxes (life and normal pre-order) get about ten days access before public launch, and open beta testers get to carry their characters through at up to level 15 into live.  Both are smart moves that should spread out a lot of the load on public launch day.

I've pre-ordered for my wife and I: are there going to be any Euro F13ers concentrating on a particular server?  There's a goon one, but I don't really want to expose her to that  .

[Nyght]

I think part of the misconception here is our usual interpretation of the word preorder.

From what I can see, preorder will be available right through open beta up until 'release' on April 24th.

And preorder is really on a pseudo commitment to purchase, cancelable at any time.

[Endie]

^^^ Indeed, and those who buy pre-order boxes are all, as I understand, able to choose the $9.99/month or $199/life deals.  There's no special "lifer" box.

PS I wasn't disagreeing: our replies to Darniaq just crossed.

[Hound]

I am not really sure how well this will work in order to spread the players though due to the level cap. I see all the level 15's congregating at the Northern Bree fields, the Weather Hills area. and possibly some Old Forest action unless they have some more solo content ready to drop in for that level range that was not available in closed beta. Of course grouping you could do some of the higher areas, but if you are doing the higher level quests once capped you are screwed if you turn them in. You will end up on the short end of the stick come release and will be in for some serious grinding for several  levels, and with the advancement heavily weighted towards questing that would be a long and painful grind.

Just my opinion here but if I had been them I would have gave the pre orders 2 weeks and the public one week on this open beta thing. 3 weeks plus could end up biting them in the ass.

[Sky]

Damn! I skimmed the email and thought there was a week before release. You mean it's level capped at 15 for almost a month (Mar 30 - Apr 24)? That's messed up. Guess I'll have a gaggle of lvl 15 characters.

Bat Country server choice? Not that we ever muster up to much, and Signe will probably kick us all out of the guild like she did in EQ2. She's mean like that. 

[Signe]

It was Lt.Dan!  I swear!  I tried to stop him but he wouldn't listen.  I think he punched me, too.   

[tazelbain]

It was Lt.Dan!  I swear!  I tried to stop him but he wouldn't listen.  I think he punched me, too.   

You were a monk.  You could have easily dodged it.

[Sky]

It just makes me a wee bit sad because I've been playing EQ2 for two months now. There's a bunch of stuff I can't get because it's guild-only and I dislike selling crap that could be used by guildies (if anyone's even playing, heh).

Moot point, I'm out in a week due to the Station Pass rate hike.

YOU attempt to make a shameless money grab on Sky and fail!

[Nebu]

Didn't most of the f13 people quit playing beta after a few days?  I'd be surprised if more than a handful a) bought this at release and b) those that did stayed longer than a month.  I appreciated the look of the game, but the gameplay was pretty uninspired.   

[Venkman]

That's about what happened at the time I took a look The forum for discussing LoTRO was always very quiet. I sorta see that as substantiating my impression of LoTRO: competent but largely uninspired. There simply isn't enough reason to talk about the game because the game itself is merely a well-executed time sink that doesn't brook much personal player creativity. A game can still do very well without inspiring terabytes of conversations every day of course.

I would have liked to have checked it out with my new rig, but beta is all barred up until tomorrow and I don't think my old beta account will work anymore since I didn't pre-order.

[Ixxit]

I would have liked to have checked it out with my new rig, but beta is all barred up until tomorrow and I don't think my old beta account will work anymore since I didn't pre-order.

Log into your Turbine billing page and under LoTRo you should see your beta account with an expiry date.  Last time I checked  my beta account said April 24th.  My preorder is in there as well with the same expiry which I think is when you need to enter a retail key.

[WindupAtheist]

The graphics look very nice, and by all accounts it's far more solid than a typical Turbine release, but... Jesus... who really gives a shit about yet another "shinier Everquest done better" at this point?  It doesn't even seem to have any sort of hook beyond the Tolkien license.

Is there something I haven't heard about that is supposed to make this game stand out?  Cool housing?  Some sort of unprecendented character customization?  A different take on PVP than what we're used to?  Anything?

[Endie]

I played it in Beta and stopped myself because I knew 'er indoors would want to play it, too.  I've pre-ordered two copies and I'm thoroughly looking forward to getting back into it.  It helps that I adore Tolkien.

That stuff about "waaah it's not that different from other MMOs but with a Tolkien license" is a load of bollocks.  The games industry produces games that are technically the same as other games but with different stories and graphics.  That's what they do.  Halo, HL, Doom, Quake, CS etc etc...  They're all just the same game with tweaking that certainly doesn't change the basic game you're playing.  RTS, FPS, RPG, MMO: real innovation is ultra-rare.  And even those that do innovate stop soon enough (Paradox, Blizzard etc).

If someone said "oh, we're making BG3.. same engine, new stories" I'd buy it.  And now that someone is saying "we're making WoW, but with a story and world you like" I'm all over it.

And anyway, the real reason that it's bullshit is that this cri de coeur for novelty is coming from someone who has been playing the same MMO for the best part of a decade.

Housing isn't in at the moment, but it's coming, and it'll possibly be related to the family element.  The things that are exciting people on SA are a weird mixture: everything from monster play for PvP to the ability to play music using the keyboard.  Jam sessions of Mary Had a Little Lamb in Bree.  Whatever floats their boat, I suppose.

[Ixxit]

If someone said "oh, we're making BG3.. same engine, new stories" I'd buy it.  And now that someone is saying "we're making WoW, but with a story and world you like" I'm all over it.

Great point, you pretty much summed up my feelings.   If have ever have to play another second of cartoony, jokesy WoW  I'll vomit in my own lap.  Now Blizzard  isn't the sole keeper of MMO polish and ease of entry. Insofar as Lotro being 'just another Diku', what do the writhing masses care.  Does anyone outside the small circle of mmo intelligensia, philosophers and brainiacs  even know what a diku is or even care?

Lotro looks fantastic , runs great, is easy to get into and a boon to any gamer even vaguely interested in the source material who is not tied up in knots that is just another 'diku'.  That's why Lotro will be a success.  Not only that, Turbine has done a fantastic job marketing, generating interest, and preselling their game with an amazing pricing scheme.  All Access Pass 30.00, Planetside 15.00.  Fuck you Sony.

[Nija]

That stuff about "waaah it's not that different from other MMOs but with a Tolkien license" is a load of bollocks.  ...
Housing isn't in at the moment, but it's coming, and it'll possibly be related to the family element.  The things that are exciting people on SA are a weird mixture: everything from monster play for PvP to the ability to play music using the keyboard.  Jam sessions of Mary Had a Little Lamb in Bree.  Whatever floats their boat, I suppose.

It's not bullshit for many reasons. One of which you emphasized yourself - no housing at release. Coming later. A sign of many things to come - later. Take a look at that world map and the areas included at release.

World of Warcraft was a better EQ. LOTRO isn't a better World of Warcraft. I still believe that licenses hurt rather than help these massive games.

Enjoy your 2 month long SimBeru Tolkien adventure.

Oh, and "The games industry produces games that are technically the same as other games but with different stories and graphics.  That's what they do.  Halo, HL, Doom, Quake, CS etc etc...  They're all just the same game with tweaking that certainly doesn't change the basic game you're playing."

Halo, HL, Doom, Quake, and CS (Okay maybe not CS) are all very different games.

• Halo - first decent console shooter. If anyone mentions Goldeneye I'm going to dress up like Oddjob and slap you in the face with the golden gun.
• HL - You could STACK BOXES and get into the ceiling! EXCITING GAMEPLAY FINALLY BROUGHT TO SHOOTER GAMES! NOT JUST KILLING ALIENS ANYMORE! (I hate Half Life)
• DOOM - I don't have to say anything about Doom.
• Quake - From 4 player DWANGO (yes, I racked up huge phone bills calling Dallas to play.) to TCP/IP. Spawned Team Fortress. I was in an Iron Glove League TF clan for awhile. When you're playing 32vs32 scrims weekly, in 1997, it makes crap like Battlefield seem weaksauce.
• CS - I fucking hate CS because it stole the creativity from the mod scene and players from other, better games. More people should have played Vietcong and Air Bucs. But why play those games when you could get your rocks off by wtfpwning 12 year olds with the AWP then listening to them cry?

Since I've wasted enough time in this chat box, here's my MMO run down.

• DSO - Small world - couldn't control small amounts of players
• M59 - Small world - decent control over players. Had some fun/funny stuff
• UO - big world, NO IDEA how to control ANY players.
• AC - big world, I don't know why this 'bombed'. Blame EQ for giving people a comfortable mud with elves and dwarves and stupid shit that they were accustomed to. Original content is tough to learn for disgruntled UO players.
• EQ - at first, a haven for the people who didn't like getting whacked in UO. Eventually these guys got bored and started making challenges for themselves, which consisted of running around naked looking for their body before it decayed. Too bad they didn't realize they would be having more fun if they were chasing and killing a red guy to get their shit back.
• AO - The 4 frames per second would bug you if you could actually stay connected to the server for more than a minute.
• DAOC - haha
• AC2 - HAHA
• SWG - Where to begin...
• EQ2 - meh. It released as bad as AO did, and did a pretty good turn around - also like AO did. Nothing worthwhile here.
• WOW - Like EQ, but less running around naked. and holy shit, the game runs good and the server doesn't crash. Amazing. Plus, wow, they have actual quests that lead up to max level. Stop the fucking presses.
• DSO - fofofoofofofo
• VG - "what"
• LOTRO - Let's copy WOW exactly and PRAY that we can con some Lord of the Rings fans into paying us for a lifetime sub.

I skipped a few dozen but they can all be summed up with this - "Pain."

I really don't see why people who have a year /played racked up in WOW looking at LOTRO and saying to themselves, "Now there's where I'm going to spend 12 months out of the next 26 months of my life." WOW is going to have EQ-like 'hardcore retention' unlike anything ever seen before. Look at Rasix for instance. Christ man, that's pathetic!

[Nebu]

That stuff about "waaah it's not that different from other MMOs but with a Tolkien license" is a load of bollocks. 

I could understand your statement better if the quests or the story were engaging, but they're really not.  Kill 10 wolves and return to me is hardly an epic Legolas-like experience.  I was never driven along in the story.  I was never compelled to play just a little longer to complete some quest that finished a story arc.  It was a grind with pretty uninteresting combat stuck into a pretty world.  I'm not here to tell you what is fun or not, but it seems a bit much to suggest that the story in this game is enough to breath new life into its gameplay.

[Venkman]

That's what they do.  Halo, HL, Doom, Quake, CS etc etc... 

Err, actually, just how many good label-slaps are there in the other genres too? When we talk about the standout titles, it's because they emerged surpreme above the general riff-raff derivative crap. The one thing I do completely agree with in that DFC intelligence piece about MMOs is that there's generally only one standout title that everyone points to as an example of the genre. This is the same case with other genres as well.

The big difference is that here you need to keep paying for it. Some games stand the test of time just because. Here, that's not an option. It needs to stand the test of time, against any new graphic, tech, and innovation that follows. It's no wonder the developers live diku. It survives innovation by speaking to pure greed. It really doesn't matter how pretty the slot machine is when the player believes the odds of winning are high.

Into this steps LoTRO. Fine game, more of the same. That worked well for DAoC and WoW later. I actually do think LoTRO will do fine. But then, it's got that big license thing which means "fine" isn't going to cut it. There's no reason to label-slap a game mechanic with a license unless you think you can make buckets of cash from it. And if Turbine doesn't because a merely-competent execution isn't enough to pull people from WoW/EQ2/interests-elsewhere, then they won't hit whatever their internal expectations are (ie, SWG). From there it's anyone's guess what happens to the game.

It's for that reason alone I'm surprised anyone paid for the lifetime subscription thing. NO MMO is ever so consistent one should pay for more than three months in advance, six if you're a fanatic. Basic business realities could require Turbine change things more radically than players experienced in beta.

[Furiously]

It's for that reason alone I'm surprised anyone paid for the lifetime subscription thing. NO MMO is ever so consistent one should pay for more than three months in advance, six if you're a fanatic. Basic business realities could require Turbine change things more radically than players experienced in beta.

I <3 my puzzle pirates Alpharrr lifetime subscription.

[Sky]

Nija seems to dislike mmo way more than I do. Why even bother playing them if you only liked AC? And the SimBeru thing...I'm not getting it. Does the combat suck and crafting rock? Are there several dedicated social/crafting classes?

I don't give a flying monkey shit about innovation. I don't care about housing, and pvp in mmo has sucked so bad in almost every iteration, I really don't care about that anymore, either. I like games that I find enjoyable, there's really not a good metric for it. WoW certainly didn't remake the wheel, but they were solo-friendly and polished. That's enough for me in an mmo. LotRO sounds polished and not too group-oriented. If I don't like it, I'm only out a few bucks, since I had the money budgeted for my EQ2 sub that I cancelled.

I think SOE is going to need ass salve. Between releasing VG when WoW:BC was released and raising their sub prices when LotRO is released (more or less)....

At the very least I should get more mileage out of LotRO than the slew of 5-10 hour games that are splattered all over EB's shelves like they were jettisoned from a mexican's ass on the 6th of May.

[Nebu]

It's for that reason alone I'm surprised anyone paid for the lifetime subscription thing. NO MMO is ever so consistent one should pay for more than three months in advance, six if you're a fanatic. Basic business realities could require Turbine change things more radically than players experienced in beta.

Well... Turbine has shown that it's not hard to pull the plug on a title.  Have they written any language into the lifetime sub that guarantees service for a certain time period?  I'd fear that they could pull the plug at their discretion (or whim).

[Nebu]

At the very least I should get more mileage out of LotRO than the slew of 5-10 hour games that are splattered all over EB's shelves like they were jettisoned from a mexican's ass on the 6th of May.

I think that's very true.  No matter what people say about MMOG's, they usually end up being at least a reasonably good value compared to other games in terms of an entertainment $ per hour sense.  LotRO is a very good looking game that is moderately engaging and I'm certain that most people will get at least the box cost out of it in entertainment value.  I just don't think that there's much beyond that.  It's a new version of the same old thing.  Proclaiming otherwise is pure fanboyism. 

[Rasix]

LotRO sounds polished and not too group-oriented.

Just about in the same fashion that WoW is.  You run into group centric material in the middle of the story line stuff as early as your late teens. 

From the sounds of things, you'll get similar mileage out of LoTRO as you had with WoW, maybe less depending on how much the MMO deja vu sets in.

They're going to have to revamp the combat (and possibly the classes.. people who thought WoW's were bland are in for some eye-poppin')for me to even take a peak unless Blizzard server farms get hit by a meteor.  I'm not going to bother paying for second best when first still holds interest for me. 

[Nija]

Nija seems to dislike mmo way more than I do. Why even bother playing them if you only liked AC? And the SimBeru thing...I'm not getting it. Does the combat suck and crafting rock? Are there several dedicated social/crafting classes?

I like little pieces of pretty much every game. That's what keeps me trying new shit. To discover other things I like. It's a bad habit on par with smoking. Me trying every game. Thankfully I've realized that games really don't change much from beta to final, so I don't end up spending money on them. The only time you should revisit a game is when they have a staff change, and staff changes are usually accompanied with free trials.

It's not a money thing either - I mean I have a half a million dollar mortgage. It's just the principle. People didn't buy Pepsi One. They stopped making Pepsi One. Do the same thing for MMOs.

Outrageous shit like talking about your expansion plans THE WEEK AFTER YOUR GAME GOES GOLD should be death sentences. That's par. Encouraged and expected. Nonsense.

Asheron's Call, in particular, I did like. I sucked at the game - my highest level on DT was in the 30s and I got my ass kicked all over the goddamn map. I did enjoy the concept and the execution, up to a point. At that point in life I just couldn't put in the time to get skillful enough to make it worth while. No, I didn't have to poopsock and press the '5' button 8000 thousand times so my '5' button did more damage than your '5' button, I just had to get enough game knowledge to know that OK he's casting spell XYZ which has a casting time of 4 seconds, so I'll have to dodge... NOW. Oh and dude is shooting an arrow at me, so I'll have to forward/back strafe him because I'm trying to use magic on this guy over here, and the archer has me flanked so side/side strafing isn't going to do any good. You know what I mean.

Shit like Warhammer saying they won't have friendly collision because it can cause griefing. This stuff was fixed in UO a literal decade ago. Phase 1 beta started June/July '97, 10 years ago almost exactly. You could push through people when you had full stam. This prevents people sitting their fat ogre asses in doorways. This also prevents 733 people standing on the same square and casting AOE attacks. Someone should tell this to that Jacobs dipshit.

SimBeru means that people are going to go into a LOTR game thinking that they will be the ones on the quest. They will be part of the fellowship. They will be important. Jedi of the Rings.

They won't be. They'll quit. Or they will prosper as moisture farmers. I don't care, I don't want any part of it. I don't see why anyone would.

[shiznitz]

It's for that reason alone I'm surprised anyone paid for the lifetime subscription thing. NO MMO is ever so consistent one should pay for more than three months in advance, six if you're a fanatic. Basic business realities could require Turbine change things more radically than players experienced in beta.

Well... Turbine has shown that it's not hard to pull the plug on a title.  Have they written any language into the lifetime sub that guarantees service for a certain time period?  I'd fear that they could pull the plug at their discretion (or whim).

AC2 lasted more than a year and $199/12 months = ~$17/mo so even if the game is an utter and total failure, a lifetime sub is not expensive.

[Nebu]

AC2 lasted more than a year and $199/12 months = ~$17/mo so even if the game is an utter and total failure, a lifetime sub is not expensive.

I fully understand that and expect that LotRO will last longer.  My point was more asking if there was any specific language in the agreement stating that they can't simply pull the plug when they feel it's good for them.  Most MMO's state that they don't guarantee service.  With this lifetime thing, I was wondering if that had changed.   

[WayAbvPar]

They're going to have to revamp the combat (and possibly the classes.. people who thought WoW's were bland are in for some eye-poppin')for me to even take a peak unless Blizzard server farms get hit like a meteor.  I'm not going to bother paying for second best when first still holds interest for me.

Amen. Combat is just fucking BORING 99.99% of the time.

[CmdrSlack]

I rather enjoyed the LoTRO beta.  I pre-ordered, largely because I want the 9.99/mo sub fee.  With the level cap for the preorder "live" phase, it's not like it's essential to be in....it'll just get you past the likely laggy on launch newbie areas.  I am willing to preorder for that.  Getting to 15 was trivial during beta, so unless they seriously ramped up the XP curve since I last logged into the beta, I'm not particularly concerned about starting on Friday.  Besides, I'm having a lot of fun with CoH right now. 

Whether I'm as important as Frodo or not isn't really an issue for me.  It seems to me that most people with any MMO experience already know that they're playing as an "also ran" not a lore-changing hero.  I thought the world was well-crafted and I rather liked the low magic approach to loremasters.  Heck, LoTRO is the first game that made me actually enjoy a pure fighter class...and that says a lot.  About the closest I've ever come to a pure fighter class in any other game was rolling up a ranger in EQ.  For some reason the standard warrior gig has never done much for me.  I don't know why the champion class seems so different, but for me it does. 

I've come to the conclusion that MMOs are just too goofy of a genre to make sweeping conclusions about -- different strokes for different folks and whatnot.  Maybe I'll hit the upper 20s and think that LoTRO is bland as hell, I dunno.  I do know that I've never hit max level in any game, but CoH and LoTRO are the two most likely candidates for me doing that.  I will admit that my hitting 50 in CoH will largely depend on the next double xp weekend, but that's a gripe for a different thread in a different subforum.

[CmdrSlack]

AC2 lasted more than a year and $199/12 months = ~$17/mo so even if the game is an utter and total failure, a lifetime sub is not expensive.

I fully understand that and expect that LotRO will last longer.  My point was more asking if there was any specific language in the agreement stating that they can't simply pull the plug when they feel it's good for them.  Most MMO's state that they don't guarantee service.  With this lifetime thing, I was wondering if that had changed.   

I'd actually like to know as well.  It sure seems like a bad idea on their part to guarantee service for any amount of time.  Were I the lawyer drafting their EULAs, I'd certainly advise against it. 

[WindupAtheist]

Look, I flushed out a fanboy!

That stuff about "waaah it's not that different from other MMOs but with a Tolkien license" is a load of bollocks.  The games industry produces games that are technically the same as other games but with different stories and graphics.  That's what they do.  Halo, HL, Doom, Quake, CS etc etc...  They're all just the same game with tweaking that certainly doesn't change the basic game you're playing.  RTS, FPS, RPG, MMO: real innovation is ultra-rare.  And even those that do innovate stop soon enough (Paradox, Blizzard etc).

If you think Doom and Halo are the same game, you're a fucking idiot.  Not to mention the fact that you listed like five games out of the eleventy-billion shooters to come out over the years.  The games industry rips itself off constantly, but 99% of everything it produces that way is forgettable bullshit.  There were a million games that were basically "Doom but a little bit different!" that nobody gave a shit about or remembers now.

If someone said "oh, we're making BG3.. same engine, new stories" I'd buy it.  And now that someone is saying "we're making WoW, but with a story and world you like" I'm all over it.

How long do you think "Holy crap I'm in MIDDLE EARTH bro!" is going to last?  A week?  Two weeks?  A month?  By the time summer rolls around, you're gonna be LFG so you can team up with LeGoLaZz and SirPwnsaLot to run the barrow dens for your 2% chance at a new shield, or whatever, and it's gonna be every shitty MMOG you've ever played all over again.

And anyway, the real reason that it's bullshit is that this cri de coeur for novelty is coming from someone who has been playing the same MMO for the best part of a decade.

And yet, taking that virtual world UO style of gameplay and slapping on "a story and world that I like" wasn't enough to make me try Star Wars Galaxies.  When they keep serving you the exact same game over and over again, I can see the sense in just picking one that floats your boat and sticking with it.  What I can't see is going "OH BOY A CLONE OF A GAME I DIDN'T LIKE ENOUGH TO STICK WITH, BUT THIS ONE HAS OFFICIALLY LICENSED HOBBITS(tm)!!  I CAN'T WAIT!"

Housing isn't in at the moment, but it's coming, and it'll possibly be related to the family element.  The things that are exciting people on SA are a weird mixture: everything from monster play for PvP to the ability to play music using the keyboard.  Jam sessions of Mary Had a Little Lamb in Bree.  Whatever floats their boat, I suppose.

Blah blah blah, shit that's supposed to be patched in post-release.  Seriously, it's WoW or EQ2 + Hobbits(tm).  If you didn't like WoW or EQ2 that much, I don't know what the fuck you expect to find here.

[Sir Fodder]

It was fun running around the Shire taking screenshots while delivering mail and pies, but things got boring after a short while, not much new for me to do or see aside from the pretty environments.

I guess the Tolkien snob in me chafed a little due to the shoehorning of lore into formulaic MOG, mainly because It's not hard to imagine various creative directions that could have been taken by fitting the gameplay to the lore rather than vice-versa. I'd like a detailed and customizable Shire simulator MOG of some sort, but doubt anyone would want to fund worldy nonsense of that sort. The Turbine shareholders are probably happy with the nice safe design though, I think they placed a pretty solid bet.