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f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  MMOG Discussion  |  Eve Online  |  Topic: EvE Devs play with BoB. Investigation in progress....New Scandal page 9! 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Author Topic: EvE Devs play with BoB. Investigation in progress....New Scandal page 9!  (Read 441143 times)
Endie
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Reply #595 on: June 01, 2007, 02:19:04 AM

The turn this thread has taken in the last few hours is quite intruiging.

The message I choose to take from it is that Iceland itself is the problem, and that we must wipe it clean and start afresh.

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"What else would one expect of Scottish sociopaths sipping their single malt Glenlivit [sic]?" Jack Thompson
Trippy
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Reply #596 on: June 01, 2007, 03:19:51 AM

Arthur_Parker
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Reply #597 on: June 01, 2007, 05:00:06 AM

Well, my sphere of experience in forming that hypothesis includes researching postings about the social environment of Iceland, taking what I know personally from study about countries and communities that have demographics and geographies similar to Iceland, and the generally accepted sociological posit that a company's culture, regardless of if it is international or not, tends to reflect that of its founders' culture. (If you question that foundational argument, I'll need to organize my citations on the topic and PM you, let me know.)

Have I lived in Iceland or been to Iceland? No.

Did I write that post just because I figured I could get away with it since there's no one (or very few) people from Iceland who will see it and throw the bullshit flag? No. Although, I'd welcome anyone who has personal experience with Icelandic corporate and social culture to call me a pompous dick and that I'm wrong.

Taking what you know and synthesizing it into conclusions is the foundation of social research, even if you have no personal experience with it. Some of our most celebrated theories (granted, they're based on a greater body of evidence than I'm citing here) include things that no one can have personal experience with - black holes, relativity, etc. At the end of the day, they're still educated guesses, which is all I'm claiming.

The argument that, "Since no one we know of here has any personal experience with Icelandic culture, we can't talk about any effect it might have," sets an unacceptable bound on our thinkable thought when trying to determine why CCP relates to the playerbase the way it does.

-Sutro

Sutro, let's test your ideas on national culture affecting community relations.

I have honestly always wondered what the interactions will be like between the devs and players of the first mmorpg based in Ireland.  It's only a single letter different from Iceland and I'd be grateful if you enlightment me with your predictions on the subject, just general trends is fine, I'm not after specific details.

Here's a link to help get you started.
DraconianOne
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Reply #598 on: June 01, 2007, 05:34:05 AM

I have honestly always wondered what the interactions will be like between the devs and players of the first mmorpg based in Ireland. 

Oh god please no!  It'll be an MMO set in the fictional world of Killinaskully and the first expansion would add the Craggy Island zone.  Player perception will be one of Cčad Mile Fŕilte at first with friendly CM staff and positive Dev interaction but after a few drinks patches the Devs would start getting abusive and be yelling things like "G'way, you bunch of cuhnts!" at the player base.

The game itself would probably play something like this:

Questgiving NPC: How are you, so?
Player: Eh?
NPC: Will ya be wanting ta kill some rats for us, right so?
Player: Um... I don't know.  Will I?
NPC: Of course ya feckin' will, sure enough!
Player: Is there a reward?
NPC: You're some kind o' scammin' Nigerian wanker, so you are.  Reward?  You can have a feckin' Jumbo Breakfast Roll d'ya know what I mean ,like?  What was I saying?
Player: Err...
NPC: With chips.
Player: Chips?
NPC: Plenty of chips.

Interaction between the Devs and Server admin folk will probably involve marching through each others areas with banners and flags and brass bands once a year BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT WE'VE ALWAYS DONE AND WE'RE ALWAYS GOING TO DO, AS IS OUR GOD GIVEN RIGHT STRIKE ME DOWN IF IT AINT SO!

Or something!

A point can be MOOT. MUTE is more along the lines of what you should be. - WayAbvPar
Engels
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Reply #599 on: June 01, 2007, 05:49:32 AM

I like this new guy. Fek.

I should get back to nature, too.  You know, like going to a shop for groceries instead of the computer.  Maybe a condo in the woods that doesn't even have a health club or restaurant attached.  Buy a car with only two cup holders or something. -Signe

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cevik
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Reply #600 on: June 01, 2007, 08:01:47 AM

Sutro is the most full of shit ass talker I've ever seen in my entire life.

It's okay that I was bluntly honest with you, because I'm from Cevikhatesyouallia and that's the culture where I'm from.

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Sutro
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Reply #601 on: June 01, 2007, 08:46:23 AM



All the same, I'll take the bait. Should have something worked up by tomorrow. I'll pass on Wikipedia.

-Sutro

gimpyone
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Reply #602 on: June 01, 2007, 10:17:12 AM

The guy that read the "State of the Goonion" has been banned from SA apparently for trying to assert he has copyright control over the speech.  Even SA hates Goonfleet I suppose.
Miasma
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Reply #603 on: June 01, 2007, 10:35:13 AM

Holy crap you're right, he sent the game forum mods a PM
Quote
howdy sir.

There is a link in the "State of the goonion" thread in "Your Consloe sucks" subforum which contains a recording of my voice reading a speech last night to members of goonfleet on our private team speak server.

This recording is copywritten material, with the copyright owned by me.

I am a professional voice actor, and parts of this recording are possibly to be used in a revenu generating music recording which is currently being worked on by myself and several other members of goonfleet.

I am not trying to create a drama situation, nor do I have any beef with anyone, but permission was never granted for this recording to be posted here in any manner whatsoever.

I therefore am asking you if you could remove the link to the file.

Thank you.

What a douchebag, how the fuck can you claim posting a link to a file that your own people published on the internet is somehow violating a copyright.  Based on just that alone I suddenly do believe the latest drama was a fabrication.
SansWetware
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Reply #604 on: June 01, 2007, 10:38:54 AM

The guy that read the "State of the Goonion" has been banned from SA apparently for trying to assert he has copyright control over the speech.  Even SA hates Goonfleet I suppose.

Yeah that has been true for a while (the hating, I mean).

After Ireland can you do tribal Africa?  I want to know the effects of penis gourd size on petition response time.


TheDreamr
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Reply #605 on: June 01, 2007, 11:36:42 AM

Transparency ... CCP style; "CCP Admiral Chamrajnagar" has either been renamed or deleted, searching for them ingame turns up no results and the forum thread asking why goes unanswered.

Does CCP actually have public relations staff?

edit button addict.
Comstar
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Reply #606 on: June 01, 2007, 11:47:58 AM

What a douchebag, how the fuck can you claim posting a link to a file that your own people published on the internet is somehow violating a copyright.  Based on just that alone I suddenly do believe the latest drama was a fabrication.

Farking hell, it's true? Good grief.

Losing the Goonfleet thread in SA means a lot less newbies joining goonfleet. 

Defending the Galaxy, from the Scum of the Universe, with nothing but a flashlight and a tshirt. We need tanks Boo, lots of tanks!
Yoru
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Reply #607 on: June 01, 2007, 11:49:56 AM

Transparency ... CCP style; "CCP Admiral Chamrajnagar" has either been renamed or deleted, searching for them ingame turns up no results and the forum thread asking why goes unanswered.

Does CCP actually have public relations staff?

Yes. They just subcontract it to the Department of Homeland Security. ;)
Morat20
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Reply #608 on: June 01, 2007, 11:52:15 AM

So, could someone explain -- what the hell just happened to goonfleet? Bonus points if you can prove BoB used CCP to do it. :)
Hellinar
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Reply #609 on: June 01, 2007, 12:04:23 PM

After Ireland can you do tribal Africa?

I think in tribal Africa you would get on average a better CS response if you were from the same tribe, and spoke the same language as, the CS reps. I’m with Sutro that a company’s culture affects its responses to events. And that culture is in turn affected by the culture of its founders and location. Seems “obvious” to me. The debatable point is, how big is the affect? Is it at all relevant when talking about CPP?

I’ve got little experience of Iceland, but a lot of experience with a nearby Atlantic island with similar population and a historic reliance on fish. My experience in Newfoundland is that the small size of the population removes the presumed anonymity of the average customer. The assumption that the average customer is an anonymous walking wallet breaks down. Customers will get upset  if you treat them in the “all customers are anonymous” style appropriate to big business in big populations.

I think CPPs difficulties with CS are being affected by the culture they started in. I doubt if diet and drink habits have much effect though. smiley
Endie
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Reply #610 on: June 01, 2007, 12:11:25 PM

Farking hell, it's true? Good grief.

Losing the Goonfleet thread in SA means a lot less newbies joining goonfleet. 

Axe Maniac is a twat, and he's been openly itching to ban eve threads for ages.. Sending it to YCS is a nice touch, though.

We'll no doubt still be welcomed for adbot, so I imagine that we'll probably just link from that to a publically viewable GF thread instead.

We didn't want that thread, anyway  tongue

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Simond
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Reply #611 on: June 01, 2007, 12:19:26 PM

...Assuming that El Pinto Grande doesn't get pissed off at Axe Maniac first.
EPG's still a directors of The Greater Goon (the 'other' goon corp), right?

"You're really a good person, aren't you? So, there's no path for you to take here. Go home. This isn't a place for someone like you."
Grand Design
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Reply #612 on: June 01, 2007, 12:46:02 PM

I've played EvE for almost two years, so I think I can comment on this.  I've also read SomethingAwful for longer than that, so, again, I can probably comment on this.  Reading this thread over the course of the past week, I find myself going from one end of the spectrum to the other.  At first, like most, I was astounded that, once again, CCP is caught red-handed helping out their friends in BoB. (And I came this >< close to canceling.)  But, the more that I read from Goons, the more I realized that this was above and beyond the current 'metagame' of EvE.  CCP has become the prime target of the Goons; they will tell you that it's BoB, but since they draw no distinction between the two, rightfully so or not, CCP is the target.  And, further, this is not Goons, this is SA vs. CCP.  For any Goon to believe in his or her heart of hearts that they just "love the game and want to do the right thing," is naive at best, psychologically incapable of detecting deception at worst.  SA is and always has been the source of grief; their targets vary, as do their agents, but the goal of SA has always been to laugh at the grief that they can cause.  And it's funny; like I said, I've read it for years.  However, it appears that, in forming this juggernaut of a conflict, SA have taken a lot of folks who honestly do enjoy EvE and are using them for their own (pick an adjective) goals.  Which is why I'm sure this post will piss some of you off - I'm not being patronizing, I really think that you are being taken for a ride by SA.  Time will tell.

As for this current 'metagame' we are witnessing:  Metagame is a euphemism for reality.  What is "beyond the game", well, only one thing and you're either living in it or denying it.  Look at what has happened on both sides of the issue.  On one, we have the developers of the game giving aid to their friends in the most powerful alliance in the game: metagame.  On the other side, we have a popular humor website forming an alliance to grief the powerful alliance: metagame.  Both sides are skirting the rules and giving precedence to the "metagame" over the game.  One has the goal of making their game bigger and better for profit and status; the other has the goal of making the game into laughing stock for profit and status.  This is the reason for the conflict.  I cannot make it any simpler.  When I boil it down to that, I have to take sides with CCP - at least it is their baby and they don't want to hurt it (though they obviously have in their poor decisions.)  SA wants to kill, kill, kill it, and then post the entire ridiculous saga on their website, logs, videos and all, complete with snide, tongue-in-cheek commentary and sell gigantoid advertising and profit, profit, profit.  Does SA do anything but what I've just described?   

I hope I didn't piss anyone off - this is really how I see this conflict and its not meant to pick on anyone.  And, for the record, I belong to no corp, no alliance and have no friends.  Wow, thats sad when you type it.  I have two accounts and will continue to subscribe.  Though I do find CCP's responses far from convincing, they have created one of the coolest pieces of software I've seen and deserve compensation for that.  Hopefully they will realize that being in bed with BoB severely hurts their credibility.  Hopefully the community will realize that CCP is not getting out of bed with BoB. 

Or have I completely missed the mark?
Miasma
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Reply #613 on: June 01, 2007, 12:48:18 PM

Arthur_Parker
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Reply #614 on: June 01, 2007, 12:53:47 PM

So, could someone explain -- what the hell just happened to goonfleet? Bonus points if you can prove BoB used CCP to do it. :)

Either a goon did something incredibly stupid by trying to enforce copywrite on a teamspeak recording about a space guild against SA or SA forum moderators got trolled epic style. 

I'm still not sure which it was.

Either way it was really stupid to get Eve discussion banned in the games forum.
ajax34i
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Reply #615 on: June 01, 2007, 12:58:36 PM

When I boil it down to that, I have to take sides with CCP

When I boil it down to whatever it is, I don't care, one way or another.  I used to have good will towards dev houses, appreciate them for creating something, but right now I'm indifferent:  if you provide something that's useful to me, I will buy, otherwise no.  I don't have any special good will towards tomato growers, I either buy their tomatoes or not; I will not buy rotten tomatoes simply because the farmer has worked hard or long hours or whatever.

Goons are griefers.  I've been turned off by griefers, and EVE encourages the behavior.  Plus, it's buggy.  I quit because of the bugs, and I don't care about CCP or what happens to them, and I don't care about the game.  Patches throughout the last 3 years - buggy.  My standards have raised.

This is just entertaining reading.  I don't follow the links or dig for info, I just read the briefs here.
Lum
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Reply #616 on: June 01, 2007, 01:02:17 PM

Either way it was really stupid to get Eve discussion banned in the games forum.

It did give us some nice music, though.
Miasma
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Reply #617 on: June 01, 2007, 01:06:48 PM

What have you done, that's copyrighted, now you're going to get sued!
« Last Edit: June 01, 2007, 01:10:22 PM by Miasma »
Simond
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Reply #618 on: June 01, 2007, 01:07:07 PM


"You're really a good person, aren't you? So, there's no path for you to take here. Go home. This isn't a place for someone like you."
Arthur_Parker
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Reply #619 on: June 01, 2007, 01:37:57 PM

Either way it was really stupid to get Eve discussion banned in the games forum.

It did give us some nice music, though.

There was a thread on the goonfleet forums a few weeks ago saying SA had gone downhill with the recent moderation changes.  Quite a few people were posting that goonfleet had evolved like some kind of mutant child to make a better community than SA, all this seems to have proved them wrong.

I laughed myself silly at the "state of the goonion" thread in YCS, there are very few places you can get that kind of entertainment.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2007, 02:23:26 PM by Arthur_Parker »
MahrinSkel
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When she crossed over, she was just a ship. But when she came back... she was bullshit!


Reply #620 on: June 01, 2007, 04:32:31 PM

The problem is that GoonFleet has a split personality, in several different directions.  There's the Something-Awful-culture-jamming crowd, the Eve-griefers-need-love-too crowd, and the 10-bucks-is-better-than-10-million-SP crowd.  Remedial was in the first camp, The Mittani was in the second, and Nate Hammertown/Mawg seems to be in the third.

In Eve, losing a war tends to either seal the cracks of a community, or split them wide open (usually the latter).

--Dave

--Signature Unclear
Arthur_Parker
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Reply #621 on: June 01, 2007, 05:02:11 PM

The problem is that GoonFleet has a split personality, in several different directions.  There's the Something-Awful-culture-jamming crowd, the Eve-griefers-need-love-too crowd, and the 10-bucks-is-better-than-10-million-SP crowd.  Remedial was in the first camp, The Mittani was in the second, and Nate Hammertown/Mawg seems to be in the third.

In Eve, losing a war tends to either seal the cracks of a community, or split them wide open (usually the latter).

--Dave

Dave just do yourself a favour and stop posting about goonfleet.  Nate Hammertown/Mawg is not the CEO, in fact it's two people, Nate Hammertown just trolled eveo mods into thinking he was the new CEO.  Mawg is the idiot who threatened legal action against SA for a spaceship game (I'm convinced it wasn't a troll now), guess he didn't know there was a frontpage, he's an actor who rose to fame because he reads books over teamspeak.  Your intelligence network is terrible if you don't even know the name of the new goonswarm CEO.

Edit - Rereading this I should say, I meant intelligence as in spying etc, so added network after intelligence
« Last Edit: June 01, 2007, 05:29:24 PM by Arthur_Parker »
JoeTF
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Reply #622 on: June 01, 2007, 05:07:49 PM

Then please enlighten us who is.

Or STFU.
Arthur_Parker
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Reply #623 on: June 01, 2007, 05:17:17 PM

Then please enlighten us who is.

Or STFU.

Ok but you have to understand what I'm about to tell you is one of goonfleet's most closely guarded secrets.  The knowledge I'm about to impart has been handed down from goon to goon for a period of months stretching as far back as to the founding of goonfleet and if rumours are true, possibly even further.

Do not repeat this information anywhere else, I shall deny all knowledge and edit this post to cover my tracks.

From within game, click the "people and places" icon, change search type to "corporation", enter search string of "goonfleet", now for the clever bit, click "search".  From the box that pops up (I like to call this a "window") right click "goonfleet" and left click "show info".  Under attriibutes note down the following information CEO, "name".

This message will now self destruct.
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Reply #624 on: June 01, 2007, 06:20:47 PM

The problem is that GoonFleet has a split personality, in several different directions.  There's the Something-Awful-culture-jamming crowd, the Eve-griefers-need-love-too crowd, and the 10-bucks-is-better-than-10-million-SP crowd.  Remedial was in the first camp, The Mittani was in the second, and Nate Hammertown/Mawg seems to be in the third.

In Eve, losing a war tends to either seal the cracks of a community, or split them wide open (usually the latter).

--Dave

Dave just do yourself a favour and stop posting about goonfleet.  Nate Hammertown/Mawg is not the CEO, in fact it's two people, Nate Hammertown just trolled eveo mods into thinking he was the new CEO.  Mawg is the idiot who threatened legal action against SA for a spaceship game (I'm convinced it wasn't a troll now), guess he didn't know there was a frontpage, he's an actor who rose to fame because he reads books over teamspeak.  Your intelligence network is terrible if you don't even know the name of the new goonswarm CEO.

Edit - Rereading this I should say, I meant intelligence as in spying etc, so added network after intelligence


I think Dave's main disconnect is that he doesn't understand the cultural differences between Goons and himself.  You see, Goons come from the nation of Buka.  Things are different in Buka, and that is causing his confusion.  As I undestand it from Wikipedia, the people of Buka share one of those crank-to-operate One Child Per Laptop latptops.  That likely makes it SEEM like they have a fractured presence in Eve and other games.

A little cultural relativisim never hurt anyone.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2007, 06:23:46 PM by CmdrSlack »

I traded in my fun blog for several legal blogs. Or, "blawgs," as the cutesy attorney blawgosphere likes to call 'em.
MahrinSkel
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When she crossed over, she was just a ship. But when she came back... she was bullshit!


Reply #625 on: June 01, 2007, 06:50:41 PM

No, my problem is that the Goons are so fond of misdirection, dramabombs, and general trolling that I just don't have enough *interest* to pick through it all and figure out who is actually in charge over there right now.  If anyone can really be said to be.  Whoever the actual CEO is, from what I heard in the "State of the Goonion", he falls into the third camp.

--Dave

--Signature Unclear
SansWetware
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Reply #626 on: June 01, 2007, 09:15:18 PM

No, my problem is that the Goons are so fond of misdirection, dramabombs, and general trolling that I just don't have enough *interest* to pick through it all and figure out who is actually in charge over there right now.  If anyone can really be said to be.  Whoever the actual CEO is, from what I heard in the "State of the Goonion", he falls into the third camp.

--Dave

Sesfan (one of the games top FC's) is the new CEO.  He's a beloved figure in Goonfleet.  Mittani retired and is not really running things from behind the scenes.  So don't think or say that - because that is not what is happening.  Definitely not.

Also the CEO did not read or write the State of the Goonion.  Mittani did before he retired to not run things from out of game.  Mawg Spawn read it for him because Mittani sounds like Data from Star Trek: TNG and doesn't feel he has an inspiring voice.  Then Mawg Spawn tried the worst prank in the history of pranks and got permabanned from SA for it.

Nate Hammertown had a mock campaign for CEO after Mittani cancelled his account earlier this week to lighten the mood and it was so funny it worked.  So now when anyone asks who the CEO is goons say Nate Hammertown.


MahrinSkel
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When she crossed over, she was just a ship. But when she came back... she was bullshit!


Reply #627 on: June 01, 2007, 11:11:14 PM

See, now that I know that The Mittani wrote it, I know I can't trust a damned thing about it.  Including that The Mittani wrote it.  I gave up trying to gather intel about the Goons a long time ago, there's no better counter-intel method than being totally bugfuck insane.  And yeah, I know that you guys will take that as a compliment (although you might act like you don't, just to fuck with me now that I said that).

--Dave

--Signature Unclear
Yoru
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Reply #628 on: June 01, 2007, 11:17:02 PM

See, now that I know that The Mittani wrote it, I know I can't trust a damned thing about it.  Including that The Mittani wrote it.  I gave up trying to gather intel about the Goons a long time ago, there's no better counter-intel method than being totally bugfuck insane.  And yeah, I know that you guys will take that as a compliment (although you might act like you don't, just to fuck with me now that I said that).

--Dave

Maybe that's what they want you to think. Unless they want you to think that that's what they'd want you to think. Unless they want you to think that since they'd want you to think that that's what they want you to think.

... fuck it, how about a nice game of Chess?
Megrim
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Reply #629 on: June 01, 2007, 11:42:58 PM

See, now that I know that The Mittani wrote it, I know I can't trust a damned thing about it.  Including that The Mittani wrote it.  I gave up trying to gather intel about the Goons a long time ago, there's no better counter-intel method than being totally bugfuck insane.  And yeah, I know that you guys will take that as a compliment (although you might act like you don't, just to fuck with me now that I said that).

--Dave

Maybe that's what they want you to think. Unless they want you to think that that's what they'd want you to think. Unless they want you to think that since they'd want you to think that that's what they want you to think.

... fuck it, how about a nice game of Chess?


Fight me.

One must bow to offer aid to a fallen man - The Tao of Shinsei.
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