Age of Conan: Class List

[Venkman]

Neither Warhammer nor Conan is popular enough to make any real difference based on name.

Bingo.

WAR is a game mechanic, both in IP and in execution. It feels like the lore was wrapped around that to justify the game experience, similar to Warcraft. I could be wrong about that though so would be interested in corrections.

Similar to World of Warcraft is the approach that the MMO has little to do mechanically with the turn-taking strategy miniatures game IP. But like WoW, it could survive that translation well, extending the brand fine,

Also similar to WoW is general user interface, and therefore general user experience. It seems to play just like it except in what players are motivated to do (which itself is enough differentiation).

AoC is none of these. It is a game with a pretty different play experience from standard diku, based on only a story IP. Last I played it the game felt a bit closer to DDO combat than anything else. So, story-based IP with a unique combat mechanic and a pushing-envelope graphics engine.

Sound familiar?

I think WAR is going to do MUCH better than AoC based on the above alone. If Funcom fubar's this like AO then that'll just be insult upon injury. However, AO was so long ago I can't imagine they haven't changed enough to know what to focus on.

[stray]

You're pretty off about the Warhammer IP. It started off as an RPG, not a combat game. And it's one of the oldest PnP spinoffs to boot.

It's very much a world. Think D&D, but with the wretched filth and humor of a Monty Python movie (i.e. those muddy peasants in Holy Grail or Jabberwocky). There are, of course, civilized elements (Elves, Imperials) -- and even futuristic elements (more like steampunkish elements) -- but it's just a rougher and more comical version of D&D. It's also more focused on providing an atmosphere of political conflict and war (as opposed to inclusive bands of adventurers out to save the world).

[Hoax]

I agree with Stray's summation of the Warhammer world and Darniaq's (misdrawn) conclusions.  WAR will most likely do better in the short and long term compared to AoC, as nothing has been said or released or shown to give me any faith that Funcom is going to pull a working game out of their ass this time around.  The IP for WAR will most likely draw more fans but Conan's IP will raise curiosity and gives name recognition as well.

WAR will also be bolstered by picking up everyone who still wanders around teh intrawebs talking about DAOC this DAOC that.

Either way execution trumps IP by a mile on these games, you have to do something better then WoW while maintaining Blizzard's level of polish and ease of access or you might as well go home at this point.

[Venkman]

Thanks for the headsup on the IP. I identify WH40k by the miniatures, but had to figure there was more to it (particularly since WAR is based on the RP). This is why I think WH will do better though. It's got strong enough lore to make an RPG and a strong enough following from 40k to make for a ready audience, and a lot of cash from EA. These were some of WoW's main advantages. What they don't have is Blizzard's rockstar status, and I personally don't feel the omgDAoCisawesome crowd is anywhere near the size of the b.net one. But Mythic is at least competent and creative in many areas, and with the proper support can do good stuff. And so far it seems EA is giving proper support (money, resources, handsoff the design).

So WAR>AoC chances all day long. WAR vs WoW is going to make 2007 a fun year.

[Slayerik]

Thanks for the headsup on the IP. I identify WH40k by the miniatures, but had to figure there was more to it (particularly since WAR is based on the RP). This is why I think WH will do better though. It's got strong enough lore to make an RPG and a strong enough following from 40k to make for a ready audience, and a lot of cash from EA. These were some of WoW's main advantages. What they don't have is Blizzard's rockstar status, and I personally don't feel the omgDAoCisawesome crowd is anywhere near the size of the b.net one. But Mythic is at least competent and creative in many areas, and with the proper support can do good stuff. And so far it seems EA is giving proper support (money, resources, handsoff the design).

So WAR>AoC chances all day long. WAR vs WoW is going to make 2007 a fun year.

WAR vrs. WoW? Thats like me (WAR) walking up to Chuck Lidell (WOW) and spitting in his face.

WAR vrs. AoC might make 2007 a fun year. Thats more like me walking up to my younger brother and spitting in his face. Too bad the punk is bigger than me now.

Its interesting, the WAR vrs. AoC. 2 software houses, both having worked on MMOs before, and one that you know wants to have a non-assdebacle launch this time. I'm still with age of Conan doing 500k, I think their lure of the "Mature" rating, decapitations, player cities, and excellent timing for grabbing WoW burnouts will make it successful, as long as they dont repeat an AO launch. When is WAR's scheduled release (if any)?

[Murgos]

Both teams are doing interesting things but I am more interested in AoC simply because they are just a bit more out of the box.  WAR still seems like DIKU++ to me.

[Venkman]

I dunno. I'm fairly sure WoW has a lock on the 5mil+ subscription range for the foreseeable future, sure. And without EA, WAR would be an interesting diversion for a few hundred thousand people, most of them in the U.S.

But with EA, WAR has the same potential world-wide reach that Blizzard, with VUG had. That I feel is very important, particularly given WAR's competitive nature being in some ways WoW++ for cultures in the Far East that eat that stuff right up.

I don't know how well EA does over there. But they are very huge and do globalize in general. That's still fairly unique in this genre. Given the analagous theme, diku foundation, and PvP focus of WAR, I think it's got a shot at the multi-million paying subscriber/sub-licensed-Cafe-publisher accountbase that WoW has. Remember, more than 50% of WoW account holders are in China.

Will it win? I don't think so. But as long as the game doesn't suck (Maybe they'll have demos up at GDC), I do think it comes out of the gate with the greatest potential of any title out or known to have a chance of coming.

[stray]

I don't know why you say U.S. Someone already pointed out it's popularity in Europe. Hell, it originated and is maintained in Europe.

[Hoax]

I dont think f13's crowd realizes how little most 2X-yr olds and under give a fuck about Conan.  Anyone else from my age bracket (I'm 23) have a comment on this?  Everyone I know, knows of Conan but I dont know one Conan fan.  Warhammer will generate its own hype because it has fanbois.  AoC needs to generate hype via the regular hype channels or having a kickass product when the OB starts.  I wish I knew how well Dawn of War has done in terms of sales, because that has added a bunch of gamers to the WH brand.

Also to add to what Stray is saying, Gamesworkshop is MASSIVE in England.  I have no idea what its penetration is like in other European countries but Gamesworkshop is an English company first and foremost they are way bigger there then in the US.

I'm pulling for AoC because I dislike Mythic and think Funcom tries harder to make their own games, not just clone someone else's.  They need a good release or they are proper fucked but can they pull it off?  At this point I dont think they are going to get it right.  Deadline is coming up but no beta date announced, the latest class releases are still vapor-speak with no real skill descriptions except the max level stuff.  It just doesn't seem like their shit is together.

There are going to be a huge amount of people that have only bought WoW and a few other games in the last two years thinking, hrm I guess I can pay $50 and see what people are talking about.  These games are going to have to kickass from LvL1 but I dont think either of these dev's appreciates that.  I expect the newbie game to be boring and stupid "lets kill rats" in both games.

[slog]

I was stuck in the Newb area along with thousands of others during Funcom's Anarchy Online end of beta event. 

I would have to stronly disagree with anyone that thinks Funcom knows what they are doing.

[Venkman]

Agreed. Conan is not a huge IP. It's an interesting one, but I'd bet that most people who even know about it don't know the roots in real history as Stray as outlined them.

I don't know why you say U.S. Someone already pointed out it's popularity in Europe. Hell, it originated and is maintained in Europe.

How much of EU? All of it or mostly England? I only ask out of curiosity, because my point wasn't about the appeal of WH40k to EU, but rather Mythic being able to canvas EU with a partner while focusing as they rightly would on US alone, without EA.

How well does DAoC do in EU and what percentage of accounts do they account for? I really don't know. It just always seemed to me US was their main focus with EU being a want-to-have.

[Slayerik]

I was stuck in the Newb area along with thousands of others during Funcom's Anarchy Online end of beta event. 

I would have to stronly disagree with anyone that thinks Funcom knows what they are doing.

How long ago was this again?

I actually got a kick out of their starting space, with the leets and E-leets or whatever that spammed 1337speak.

[slog]

6 years ago?

[Murgos]

AO's launch was the kind of suck that reverberates 6 years later and makes people think, "Right, I'll believe it when I see it."  That's a lot of suck.

[Slayerik]

But they did have flying mounts way before anyone else did! :)

[Xuri]

All suck is good suck.

[Sky]

I actually got a kick out of their starting space, with the leets and E-leets or whatever that spammed 1337speak.

My character Xerr having a conversation with a leet.

[Bokonon]

I dont think f13's crowd realizes how little most 2X-yr olds and under give a fuck about Conan.  Anyone else from my age bracket (I'm 23) have a comment on this?  Everyone I know, knows of Conan but I dont know one Conan fan.

Get off my lawn!

What can I say about F13?  It's really my favorite website in the entire universe!  I love the irreverent banter and sly wit these keyboard jockeys produce.  And I especially love the staff, they're AWESOME.

[Bokonon]

But they did have flying mounts way before anyone else did! :)

Not true, WWIIOnline beat them to release

What can I say about F13?  It's really my favorite website in the entire universe!  I love the irreverent banter and sly wit these keyboard jockeys produce.  And I especially love the staff, they're AWESOME.

[Sky]

I dont think f13's crowd realizes how little most 2X-yr olds and under give a fuck about Conan.  Anyone else from my age bracket (I'm 23) have a comment on this?  Everyone I know, knows of Conan but I dont know one Conan fan. 

Suddenly AoC is sounding better.

[stray]

How much of EU? All of it or mostly England? I only ask out of curiosity, because my point wasn't about the appeal of WH40k to EU, but rather Mythic being able to canvas EU with a partner while focusing as they rightly would on US alone, without EA.

Oh, I don't know how much. I don't play or follow WH much myself (had some friends from awhile back who did). I just figured it was pretty common knowledge that it's got a large fanbase in Europe. That's where it's started, and where you'll usually find the biggest fans from. It's like the RPG equivalent of soccer football or something. ;)

Not to say it doesn't have a lot of fans in the US too though.

[palmer_eldritch]

AoC is none of these. It is a game with a pretty different play experience from standard diku, based on only a story IP. Last I played it the game felt a bit closer to DDO combat than anything else. So, story-based IP with a unique combat mechanic and a pushing-envelope graphics engine.

Sound familiar?

Different to a standard diku and unique combat - sounds good to me. Good as in worth keeping an eye on (who really knows yet if it will turn out to be a good game?).

I've had my fill of dikus. I enjoyed LotR (beta) and Vanguard, but neither will keep me playing for the long haul. I don't know if WAR is another diku but if so, maybe I'll play that for a month or two as well, but no more. I'm all in favour of people trying something different. Eventually one of them will get it right, hopefully. I started with UO, then played Everquest, and then . . . lots and lots of Everquest clones. Even WoW is just a better executed Everquest. It's not different to EQ or DAOC in the way that EQ was different to UO. There are exceptions, ie Eve and SWG in its earliest incarnation, and they're the games I've had most fun with since I quit EQ many years ago.

I guess someone who makes a game not based on what has become the standard model is more likely to screw up, but good luck to them. It *might* be truly great at least.

By the way, Funcom proved they could make a solid, stable, working multiplayer game a long time ago, with AO. It was just that they proved it some time after AO had launched.

[Signe]

I've never read a Conan book in my life and I fell asleep during the film.  Still, I'd love to have an MMORPG with good PvP for a change.  So whatever.

[stray]

I've never read a Conan book in my life and I fell asleep during the film.  Still, I'd love to have an MMORPG with good PvP for a change.  So whatever.

When people say that, I tell him that they probably watched the wrong film.

Conan the Barbarian. Watch it.

NOT Conan the Destroyer.


Either way though, the books are where it's at. But that first film was pretty great. Still the best fantasy based movie in my opinion (yes, I think it's better than LotR. Don't ask me to repeat it).

[Ixxit]

I've never read a Conan book in my life and I fell asleep during the film.  Still, I'd love to have an MMORPG with good PvP for a change.  So whatever.

When people say that, I tell him that they probably watched the wrong film.

Conan the Barbarian. Watch it.

NOT Conan the Destroyer.


Either way though, the books are where it's at. But that first film was pretty great. Still the best fantasy based movie in my opinion (yes, I think it's better than LotR. Don't ask me to repeat it).

Nothing beats James Earl Jones as Thulsa Doom.  I was sad to learn from the 'passings clip' on the Oscars that Mako died last year (the crazy wizard/narrator guy from the first movie).

For me it wasn't only the novels, but also the hundreds of comics (Conan the Barbarian,  King Conan, The Savage Sword of Conan) that I collected in the 70's and 80's as a kid/teen.

I think if anyone under 30 thinks Conan is just 'meh', they probably watched too much of this:


http://imdb.com/title/tt0129673/

[Venkman]

Not true, WWIIOnline beat them to release

Wow, I never realized WWIIO had the aircraft in its 2001 launch. My first "flying mount" was the Mosquito in Planetside during beta in 2003.

Different to a standard diku and unique combat - sounds good to me. Good as in worth keeping an eye on (who really knows yet if it will turn out to be a good game?).

Oh absolutely. As a gamer, I'm very interested in AoC. All I've been talking about lo these past pages is what I think of its business potential.

AoC, WAR and TR, that's my near-term personal interest list.

[Signe]

I had no idea there was ever a tv series.  And I think Stray is right.  I remembered it when Ixxit mentioned James Earl Jones.  I did kind of like that one.  It must have been the second one.  I have to add that I'm not a big Arnie fan, although I can tolerate him in action films.  (as long as he doesn't talk too much and keeps most of his clothing on)

[stray]

I think if anyone under 30 thinks Conan is just 'meh', they probably watched too much of this:


http://imdb.com/title/tt0129673/

Ugh, I stayed away from that show. I am under 30 though. Just under 30. ;)

Didn't realize Mako died. That sucks. He was funny in whatever I saw him in, but he also had the perfect narrator's voice. I mean, just the intro to that movie + the title score is fucking genius. All intros in all movies should have Mako in them  :-D

[stray]

I had no idea there was ever a tv series.  And I think Stray is right.  I remembered it when Ixxit mentioned James Earl Jones.  I did kind of like that one.  It must have been the second one.  I have to add that I'm not a big Arnie fan, although I can tolerate him in action films.  (as long as he doesn't talk too much and keeps most of his clothing on)

It's kind of a guy thing, I guess. Conan. Though I've convinced a few women to like it. Now if only I get one to like that, the Road Warrior, Kung Fu flicks, and loud guitars, then I'll marry her. 

[Azazel]

I don't know why you say U.S. Someone already pointed out it's popularity in Europe. Hell, it originated and is maintained in Europe.

Um, yeah. Darniaq's comment about WAR having a following due to 40k is a little misinformed as well. The Warhammer Fantasy IP is particularly huge in Europe. It's debatable whether WFB or 40k is more popular over there, but I can tell you that both are very popular in Europe, and that the IP there is plenty strong EA or no EA. I know quite a few (not all) of f13'ers have a rather US-centric view of the world, but what are the US and European WoW numbers again?

Also, Stray. WFRP came about at roughly the same time as WFB3 did. The warhammer world (aside from beginnings as a basement D&D campaign, etc) was first published in WFB1 to the best of my knowledge. Jackson and Livingstone imported and sold D&D rules and materials when GW started.

[Merusk]

Not true, WWIIOnline beat them to release

Wow, I never realized WWIIO had the aircraft in its 2001 launch. My first "flying mount" was the Mosquito in Planetside during beta in 2003.

How the hell can you forget those awesome flying tanks?

[trias_e]

When people say that, I tell him that they probably watched the wrong film.

Conan the Barbarian. Watch it.

NOT Conan the Destroyer.

So true.  God, I loved the first movie.  22 year old male here.  It had it all, from a sense of humor, to quite possibly the best movie soundtrack ever, to a whole lot more I can't explain.  In the top 10 movies I've ever seen.


Yet, I never read any books.  I suppose I just treated it as a self-contained experience and thus never explored the 'mythos' further.

[Bokonon]

Not true, WWIIOnline beat them to release

Wow, I never realized WWIIO had the aircraft in its 2001 launch. My first "flying mount" was the Mosquito in Planetside during beta in 2003.

How the hell can you forget those awesome flying tanks?

Ding ding!

[Margalis]

The movie was awesome. Arnie was at his physical peak, Conan's mom was a super-hot porn-star (no joke), the soundtrack was phenomenal. The movie had a very visceral feel.

Anyway I must be the only person in the world who liked AO. I'm looking forward to Conan. Just remembering all the cool clothing styles in AO gets me worked into a lather. I'll never forget the first time I walked outside the city and saw what had to be 50 people each looking really cool and dressed totally differently.

[Calantus]

I dont think f13's crowd realizes how little most 2X-yr olds and under give a fuck about Conan.  Anyone else from my age bracket (I'm 23) have a comment on this?  Everyone I know, knows of Conan but I dont know one Conan fan.

Conan is those movies where Arnold plays a barbarian and kills some stuff, yeah? I vaguely remember seeing a couple of those when I was little. That sums up my Conan experience; as a brand it means nothing to me at all.