Disgaea 2: The Review

[ForumBot 0.8 beta]

Disgaea 2: The Review


Nippon Ichi is a company known for bringing us underappreciated tactics games with exceptional humor and innovative combat systems. It all started in America with Disgaea, which was hands down the best of their localizations. Until Disgaea 2.

» Read More

[Yegolev]

I give this review nine giggitys up.

[MisterNoisy]

Wow.  Just from those shots, it looks like the best localization of all time.

[Merusk]

Hm.. I still haven't played Disagea 1, just because I'd heard it's precursor was really good and I was trying to find it.  Guess I'll have to find a copy and play around.

[Yoru]

I hope that the PS3 comes out soon so that PS2 prices drop like a stone and I can play the handful of PS2 games I've been meaning to (this one included in that list) on the cheap.

[schild]

No one deserves to play Disgaea 2 for "cheap" or Disgaea 1 for that matter. In fact, if I had my way, this game would cost double.

[Rasix]

Disgaea 1 itself seems to be pretty hard to find.  I don't think you'll ever see it "on-the-cheap" unless they re-release it. Used copies tend to go for more than it retailed at.

I am playing a dangerous game counting on EB Games having extra copies tomorrow. 

[Yoru]

Disgaea 1 I've actually played. I was referring to Disgaea 2, and I can quite easily borrow the disc. I was more indicating that I was waiting for cheap used PS2s to hit the market when the PS3 comes out.

[Jain Zar]

While I enjoyed and completed the original (A RARE feat for any game longer than 15 hours.), in no way is it worth Ebay prices.

Even some of my favorite and most beloved games really aren't worth the 40-75 bucks I paid for them.  (Phantasy Star 2 was massively expensive when it came out.  6 MEGABITS OF RPGING! And an included full color hint book which in the pre Gamefaqs days of 1990 was the only thing that made that game remotely winnable...)

Schild, if you think Disgaea 1 or 2 is worth double their MSRP could you do gaming a favor and smack your head repeatedly into a wall until you have lost that particularly WRONG thought?

Id like to enjoy gaming without having my bank account assraped if you don't mind.   

[schild]

You don't like gaming if you don't like Disgaea.

It's a fact of life.

[Cyrrex]

While I enjoyed and completed the original (A RARE feat for any game longer than 15 hours.), in no way is it worth Ebay prices.

If you truly cannot enjoy any game that lasts longer than 15 hours (or more specifically, from which you cannot get 15 hours of enjoyment), then sure, I can understand the gripe...of course, then one would have to open up that can of worms and ask why that is.  I'll not.

For us that can, on the other hand, 50 bucks is relatively cheap entertainment for a game that lasts more than 15 hours.   Whether or not your budget can bear it is completely irrelevant.

[schild]

$50 is cheap for 8 hours of entertainment. 4 movies costs nearly $40 now and are rarely 2 hours a piece these days.

[Jain Zar]

While I enjoyed and completed the original (A RARE feat for any game longer than 15 hours.), in no way is it worth Ebay prices.

If you truly cannot enjoy any game that lasts longer than 15 hours (or more specifically, from which you cannot get 15 hours of enjoyment), then sure, I can understand the gripe...of course, then one would have to open up that can of worms and ask why that is.  I'll not.

For us that can, on the other hand, 50 bucks is relatively cheap entertainment for a game that lasts more than 15 hours.   Whether or not your budget can bear it is completely irrelevant.

Way to misunderstand me guys.

First off the reason I rarely finish games longer than 15 hours is I tend to get bored of most games past this point due to mindless repetition.  (Reason number 3 I can't be bothered with Japanese console RPGs.)  After a point, doing the same thing over and over again usually stops being compelling and I want the next experience.   If the ending is in sight I may soldier on (possibly the only reason I made it through the cut and paste corridors of Halo), but sometimes a good story can help.

Needless to say. I have never maxed an MMORPG character out, and the mere thought of constant same old PVP or farming runs is something I would never do.

And no, 50 bucks is not cheap.  I would prefer a good 2 dollars an hour to fun ratio if at all possible.  I know to some people 50 bucks is nothing, but I tend to have lots of interests and while I have no debts, I do have bills.  (And the movie analogy doesn't really work since most DVDs have double the feature length in extras, and are rewatchable.  While I loved KOTOR, I don't have the time to replay it, but I will happily throw in Jurassic Park or Aliens to rewatch when im bored some evening, or sometimes even in a window on my iMac while I chat on IRC, or paint up some gaming minis or something.    When games get to the 20ish mark I don't need them to last as long, and I can have more fun for less cost and risk.

There are very few replayable games out there, and sadly given modern computers Warlords 2 and Master of Orion 2 aren't easily playable on them.  (Ironically these games were ones I could pick up and play for an evening's entertainment.  And their sequels or spiritual successors fail to be half as good.  Or even include the best part .  (Hello GalCiv 2.  I don't want to WATCH fleet combat.  I want to spend most of my time in that.  I want a little Civ in my spacefleet wargame.  Not Civ where a taste of wargame happens.)

But its the worth double comments that I thought was particularly stupid.
Is Disgaea good?
Sure.
Is it worth the 70+ it goes for on Ebay?
NO FUCKING WAY.

No game is worth inflated prices, and inflated prices are ass to begin with.
Rarity is dumb, especially with digital software that could and should be easily duplicated to make money, hopefully to fuck over morons with more money than sense who happily pay 150+ for Rondo of Blood or Panzer Dragoon Saga or Chase the Chuckwagon.
(And I fucking LOVE PDS.  But MSRP was cutting it as is.)
Seriously.  How hard would it be to print up another run of Disgaea either by Atlus or NIS?
(Ironically every other NIS strategy RPG released after it seems easy to get at well under MSRP.  I got La Pucelle and Phantom Brave really cheap.)

[Cyrrex]

No, those are all good points I suppose.  I didn't know what your inflated ebay prices were, and would generally agree that it typically wouldn't be worth it.

I guess I am basically attacking the premise that - given a decent game, with a decent length for a first run through and moderate replay value - in other words, your Average Game...isn't worth 50 dollars.  I think it is. 

[schild]

Due to a momentary lapse in the public hivemind, I am now the proud owner of:

boobiekingdom.com
thedarksenate.com
prinnyland.com
prinnies.com
seaofgehenna.com

Also, for the amusement of f13.house, I bought the following.

davidlopan.com
girlwithgreeneyes.com
chingdai.com
battleatchibi.com
changsing.com

and to top it all off:

lopandemonium.com

Edit: Also, firstsovereignemperor.com - which is useless because nobody knows how to spell "sovereign."

[Phildo]

I'd just like to point out that at your 2 dollar an hour to fun ratio, the storyline alone in Disgaea 1 should be worth over $100, and the same goes for the second.  And there's the gratification that comes with doing so much damage that the amount has to be truncated on-screen.

Furthermore, it seems you're only concerned about the gameplay itself, and not the content or storyline.  MOST RPGs and tactics games are in fact story-driven, and the Disgaea series have some of the best storylines I've had the pleasure to come across.  You might try buying TV show box-sets to get the equivalent amount of story, but that'd end up costing more than just buying the game would.  And with the game, you get the added feeling of accomplishment that comes from succesfully completing missions, etc.

[Yegolev]

How about $188 for mint Disgaea 1?  The used one is only half that, though.  Glad I got my copy already.  No, I'm not tempted even a little bit to sell it.  I'm going to be buried with my games.  Well, not all of them.  Not Geist.  Nor Advent Rising.

You don't like gaming if you don't like Disgaea.

It's a fact of life.

Aren't you the person who hasn't played GTA 4 or 5?  You are only hurting yourself, you know.

[schild]

Disgaea was reprinted. It's really not that hard to find anymore.

I have "played" GTA. In fact, I own a copy of GTA San Andreas because I got it for free. I found the controls to be shit, the music to be trash (compared to Vice City), and the characters to be terribly fucking boring.

Thug life, yo. Good game design ain't easy but it's necessary.

[Rasix]

Just got this.  Yah, this is some fine fucking gaming.

"d00d!"

[schild]

There's about 5 "this can't get better" moments. It always does.

[caladein]

How about $188 for mint Disgaea 1?  The used one is only half that, though.  Glad I got my copy already.  No, I'm not tempted even a little bit to sell it.  I'm going to be buried with my games.  Well, not all of them.  Not Geist.  Nor Advent Rising.

Reminds me of trying to find Final Fantasy Tactics before they reprinted it. Why is it always the (good) tactical RPGs that shoot up in price like crazy?

[Jain Zar]

^^^

Rarity and demand.  (More rarity than demand though.)

Small print run plus niche genre plus hardcore fanbase equals cash demands.

RPGs are the polar opposite of sports games when it comes to keeping their value.  Especially given how outside of Squaresoft, Namco, Capcom, and Konami, most of the english language publishers rarely even get their titles anywhere outside of the Gamestop HAY DO YOU WANT TO PREORDER SUBSCRIBE TO GAME INFORMER OR BUY USED FOR 5 BUCKS LESS hellholes of Radio Shack like shit.

Atlus and the thankfully defunct Working Designs being the big ones here.

FFTactics was a double punch though.  Small initial print run since tactics games weren't popular in the west.  (For console games there was a couple Sega ones and that was pretty much it till after FFT.) And the increasingly rabid otaku scum that formed the modern electronic RPG fanbase.  (Ok, Fallout fans are generally worse, but they at least have a great game to be complete fucking douchebag embarrasments over.  Final Fantasy?  Not so much.)

All this reminds me I should sell my SNES complete carts of Chrono Trigger and FF3 (6) though.  Complete in box SNES RPGs that have massive amounts of fanwank over it.
That means cash money.

[schild]

It doesn't mean that much money though.

Yet.

Also, Victor Ireland (the working design guy) is back with his new company Gaijinworks.

[Trippy]

I picked up Disgaea 2 today at Fry's (it's on sale for $39.95) and I just started playing and I can already tell it's going to be great! :-D It's even funnier than the first one!

[tazelbain]

I like all changes they did to Item World except pirates.  Every 4th level I got this shitty ass level 73 pirate who solos my whole team.  Even if I could kill him, I am not sure I should.  He'll probably replaced by a lvl 200 pirate.  I am stuck rushing the gate or MGEing out.  I wouldn't mind so much if it didn't happen so often.  LOL, I had a map equiped for a while he started showing up every damn level.

I am not sure about this felony system.

But the other changes are great and story is top notch.

[Murgos]

I went to three places this weekend looking for this game and all anyone had were preview boxes.  Is it being released at different times in different parts of the country?

[Merusk]

It's just not a huge print run, I think.  Went to Best Buy on friday and they still had 2 dozen DQ8 boxes, but I had search behind every case to find the single copy of Disagea someone had hidden amongst them. 

I've been having a bit of fun with it.  Only just hit chapter 3, but I've been trying everything.  So far it's been pretty amusing, but I can tell it's a hell of a lot deeper.  Good lord, you could spend years just leveling shit up and reincarnating characters.

 I've got a question on Item world, though.  If you use an MGE, does the level of the item go up by the # of areas you've already cleared, or are you forced to level it in increments of 10?  I had my first try last night and 10 battles in a row (more if you go to the mystery rooms) is a fucking endurance run.  I was out of SP by the 6th map and didn't have any way to restore it.  (Yeah, "items, duh." Wish I'd thought of it before I went in.)   I figured I had to push on through, though, or else I'd have wasted the previous hour.

[Trippy]

There's an item boss every 10 levels -- you have to kill him/her/it to level up the item based on the number of levels you cleared. If you are running out of SP/characters you can build some stacks and throw/move somebody into the exit to quickly skip over a level, unless there happens to be a gatekeeper standing on it then you either need to kill him outright or move him out of the way with a special (like one of the fist ones).

[tazelbain]

You are right it can be an endurance run.  Get couple fighters (5 throw) or "tough guy" (early unlockable, 6 throw) and shoes and armor for Tink.  So you if pickup up Tink off the homebase before he moves, he'll get his 7mv on end to rush the gate after his teammates chuck is french sterotype ass accross the map.

Items level once per level complete regardless of whether you finish a map or rush the gate. Same is true whether you do three levels and MGE, or complete 100 levels.  But Item Generals and their ilk do provide a bonus to the stat increases provided by the levels during your run.  So, 10 levels, kill IG, exit is better than 3 levels, MGE, 7 levels, kill IG exit. But one IG isn't going to have a great effect. Now 100 levels, 7 generals, 2 kings, and a god in one run, that's going make a big difference.

[Merusk]

Ahh thanks for the clarification then.   Still, it's better to level something up than to not do so at all, yes?  I can't see myself doing another of those 10(12 w/ the mystery doors) level runs any time soon.

I tried to avoid 'rushing the gate' just because I needed levels/ $ and I figured doing an item dungeon was going to be less tiresome than running the basic maps over and over. (It was.)   If I really wanted to just level an item, I might try it the stack way. (I didn't know you could lift multiple characters, very nice.)

Oh.. and when it mentions 'throw an enemy in your gate, see what happens!'  don't.  Oops.

[tazelbain]

The D1 item faq on gamefaqs says MGEs have no effect on the bonus from the item boss.  Longer runs always seemed better to me.  You don't have to kill the boss but there is no reason not to.

Leveling items is definitely not needed. You go the senate to get get items to buy, or just rely on the items from the clearing bonus.  Early in the game I like to level muscles, orbs, and seals.  I think your stategy is sound. Also having more more than 10 characers helps.  Even though you can only bring 10 into a level, it doesn't have to be the same 10 and having a few spare in case of accidental death helps.

>Oh.. and when it mentions 'throw an enemy in your gate, see what happens!'  don't.  Oops.
Monsters generally suck as party members so there is no need to capture them, but thats a cheep way rack up hospital items.

[Merusk]

>Oh.. and when it mentions 'throw an enemy in your gate, see what happens!'  don't.  Oops.
Monsters generally suck as party members so there is no need to capture them, but thats a cheep way rack up hospital items.

Oh is that what's supposed to happen? The few I did it to just wound-up destroying my gate. I guess it's like Pokemon where you have to beat the shit out of them first?

Also - Geo-Chains are luv... I hit a 2000+ square chain and I've never seen the item bonus meter fly so much.  Heh.  This is a damn fun game, even without the story.

[Trippy]

Oh.. and when it mentions 'throw an enemy in your gate, see what happens!'  don't.  Oops.

Throwing enemy humans into your gate is bad, unless you are trying to exploit the hospital (you get prizes for having to rez people). Throwing monsters that are wounded is good if you are trying to collect them.

[Trippy]

Ahh thanks for the clarification then.   Still, it's better to level something up than to not do so at all, yes?  I can't see myself doing another of those 10(12 w/ the mystery doors) level runs any time soon.

For me in the early to mid game the Item World is more for collecting Specialists than for levelling up the item. You will get better class items as you play through various means (Assembly Bills, buying through shops -- i.e. increasing customer rank, stealing, etc.) so it's usually not worth it to try and level some mundane item.

[Fabricated]

I picked up Disgaea 2 yesterday despite being broke as a joke. I played a bit and it was good, but I don't find myself as taken with it as I was with FFT so far. I wish they'd explain exactly what each of those weapon/armor properties meant so I didn't have to "try out" every piece of equipment to see if it was better or worse.

Also, in what world is this game's music good? I'm only about 10 battles in and I'm half tempted to mute it. The English dub isn't too hot, and the Japanese voice acting annoys me like most Japanese voice acting does.