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Author Topic: Why is roleplaying so gay?  (Read 25033 times)
schild
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on: April 07, 2006, 01:49:00 AM

Llava
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Reply #1 on: April 07, 2006, 01:59:19 AM

Just to pre-empt any offense taken, even though I cover it in the article:

I use the word "gay" in a very derogatory, arguably bigoted manner.  I don't think there's anything wrong with homosexuality.  Think 'South Park'- use of the word is part shock value (though if you're shocked by that... you need to turn down the sensitivity on your shockometer a bit) and part... well, laziness.  South Park can get away with it, so can I.

Okay.  I don't/didn't expect it to be a problem or anything, but just want to cover my ass (ha ha) on that one.

That the saints may enjoy their beatitude and the grace of God more abundantly they are permitted to see the punishment of the damned in hell. -Saint Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica
Tebonas
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Reply #2 on: April 07, 2006, 02:42:12 AM

Your premise seems to be roleplaying=cybering.

I fucking hate that aspect of "roleplaying", but that is one aspect, sadly blown out of proportion because it is the number one fantasy of geeks who can never get any real sexual contact and have to play it out. That is NOT roleplaying.

Roleplaying is giving your character a background and motivation. And acting according to these motivations. For a long time my EQ Shaman never attacked or killed anything that wasn't attacking him first. He missed out on some raid encounters and even one of the Kunark Planes. Because he had a wife and kids at home (as background story, no other player, I always found that icky personally) he didn't have to engange in cybersex with other people. A short "Thanks I'm happily married", followed by a "Don't continue with this, how dare you try to tempt me! The Six Hammers of Justice may smite you!" usually took care of that.

One of my fondest memories in MMORPGs was an expedition from Halas to a bandit camp three zones away, to "Bring Justice to the plains of Karana". A group of people acting out the raiding of a camp in character. Just giving ourself a reason to be there and kill those bandits. Adding a layer of fun to the simple mechanic of going from A to B to kill C. And nobody cybertouched anybody.
Catalan
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Reply #3 on: April 07, 2006, 02:58:12 AM

I'm a roleplayer, and I hate 99% of the roleplayers I've ever met in MMOGS.
I mean, I hate how roleplaying seems to consist in turning every situation into some retarded pseudo-renaissance soap opera with balls and fucking weddings.
So I'll agree that having 100 guys saying "well met" for 2 hours so another one and a cybertransvestite can have their silly ceremony is too gay even for the gayest gay of them all.
I was part of the Lurikeen Uprising, a 1000 person leprechaun-only guild that invaded an RP server in DAoC. It was an hilarious infestation that amounted to a great oportunity for RP, that of  course was badly received by the leading drama dragqueens of the server, I mean... 250 rabid midgets crash into your lame flower throwing competition and all you can figure out to do is /appeal as fast as you can. Great RP there...

Hey, look what I found... I thought the intardnets had already lost it forever... http://archives.jeuxonline.info/fils/89963.html



Tebonas
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Reply #4 on: April 07, 2006, 03:38:08 AM

Hmm, now that you mention it my last positve roleplaying experience in MMOGs is at least four years gone. You might be unto something...
Signe
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Reply #5 on: April 07, 2006, 03:41:05 AM

Thanks for the article.  It really opened my eyes.  I knew you were pervy, but I had no idea you were gay. 

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pxib
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Reply #6 on: April 07, 2006, 03:48:26 AM

I don't mind the sex, really. It tends to go on in private and I don't have to see it. If it happens publically it is DEFINITELY against the rules and I can report those randy perpetrators to the proper authorities. Sex over wires is almost as old as communication over wires. We have reports of lascivious Morse code between telegraph operators. Meh.

It's the renaissance faire/soap opera that rises my gorge.

No, you are not the lost queen of a forgotten kingdom.
No, you are not a bandit lord.
No, you are not married.
STEP AWAY FROM THE CAMP FIRE --  IT IS NOT STORY TIME.

Some day there will be a game in which you can start as a street urchin and work your way up to bandit lord. I can already think of at least one game where marriage is more important and has more in-game effect than combat. These games are not and will never be World of Warcraft. I never want to be part of a game in which you can be the lost queen of a forgotten kingdom because, frankly, the supply of forgotten kingdoms cannot POSSIBLY keep up with the demand.

Gameworld-appropriate history and  background is great. Motivation and in-character chat while you PLAY THE ACTUAL GAME AS IT IS DESIGNED  is fantastic. Trying to play house and have tea parties in Anarchy Online is pathetic.  It hurts my sense of immersion more than some dipwad saying "LF HEALER" ever will. It makes the baby Jesus cry.

Some folks would prefer a social sandbox like the average MUSH... but left to their own devices, a crowd of pure Socializers flounders in their own elaborately incestuous mental-masturbation -- they need Achievers to give their world meaning. Just ask Old Man Bartle.
WindupAtheist
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Reply #7 on: April 07, 2006, 03:54:43 AM

I take off my robe and wizard hat.

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"Yeah, it's pretty awesome."  --  Me
Tebonas
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Reply #8 on: April 07, 2006, 04:13:23 AM

I don't mind the sex, really. It tends to go on in private and I don't have to see it. If it happens publically it is DEFINITELY against the rules and I can report those randy perpetrators to the proper authorities. Sex over wires is almost as old as communication over wires. We have reports of lascivious Morse code between telegraph operators. Meh.
You obviously never had to endure people kissing and smooching a whole raid long over /emote. I envy you!
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Reply #9 on: April 07, 2006, 07:18:58 AM

Gameworld-appropriate history and  background is great. Motivation and in-character chat while you PLAY THE ACTUAL GAME AS IT IS DESIGNED  is fantastic. Trying to play house and have tea parties in Anarchy Online is pathetic.  It hurts my sense of immersion more than some dipwad saying "LF HEALER" ever will. It makes the baby Jesus cry.
Yeah, that's the meat of it. I fool around with a "roleplay" supergroup on CoH which is really nothing more than something to focus the banter around. There are very few games which can support a serious story, and most of them are niche.

Does AO count as niche? And did they ever implement player missions? You could do some serious stuff with that. I was out exploring and accidentally walked in on a "hostage situation" which was basically a clanner waiting in an Omnitek prison in a fairly open-PvP zone, and had a very interesting conversation which unfortunately started out as "don't shoot this is an RP".

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Reply #10 on: April 07, 2006, 07:59:49 AM

You'd have to go to a MUD to find better roleplaying. MMOs are just not built for it.

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Reply #11 on: April 07, 2006, 08:03:51 AM

I'm a roleplayer, and I hate 99% of the roleplayers I've ever met in MMOGS.
I mean, I hate how roleplaying seems to consist in turning every situation into some retarded pseudo-renaissance soap opera with balls and fucking weddings.
So I'll agree that having 100 guys saying "well met" for 2 hours so another one and a cybertransvestite can have their silly ceremony is too gay even for the gayest gay of them all.
I was part of the Lurikeen Uprising, a 1000 person leprechaun-only guild that invaded an RP server in DAoC. It was an hilarious infestation that amounted to a great oportunity for RP, that of† course was badly received by the leading drama dragqueens of the server, I mean... 250 rabid midgets crash into your lame flower throwing competition and all you can figure out to do is /appeal as fast as you can. Great RP there...

Hey, look what I found... I thought the intardnets had already lost it forever... http://archives.jeuxonline.info/fils/89963.html





Didn't you know that adding -eth to verbs makes you a good roleplayer?(as seen by his link) I owneth j00 RP noobs. lol


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AcidCat
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Reply #12 on: April 07, 2006, 08:56:59 AM

Hehe, I do some light RPing from time to time with characters I make on the RP servers, but sexuality just isn't a part of the program. If I'm horny I'll hit up my wife, probably get denied, then hit up my porn stash. The last place I would look for any kind of sexual fulfillment would be a videogame.

My latest RP character is a human priest on Steamwheedle Cartel named Grandpappy. Old black dude. It's fun to RP a cantankerous old man. It's not fun to RP a horny she-elf. I agree with the article - that's just gay.  embarassed
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Reply #13 on: April 07, 2006, 09:21:39 AM

You'd have to go to a MUD to find better roleplaying. MMOs are just not built for it.

QFT

I'd even add that MUSHes are even better, since there are actually no combat mechanics at all and the whole thing has to be scripted and told by two or more 'mature' writers. That's where my best stories were told. I looked into RP guilds when in EQ, and although I respect them and what they are trying to do, the game play and graphics destroy any illusion that I'm able to write a real story of any sorts. The only thing of worth I saw were in MMO fan fiction.

I guess what it boils down to for me is wether you're writing a story or living out an alter ego that just sporadically reacts to its environment without any need for a fleshed out background. If you're just doing a personality revision for yourself, knock yourself out in MMOs. If you want to do interactive story telling, stick to text based games that not only allow that, but require it.

I should get back to nature, too.  You know, like going to a shop for groceries instead of the computer.  Maybe a condo in the woods that doesn't even have a health club or restaurant attached.  Buy a car with only two cup holders or something.

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Reply #14 on: April 07, 2006, 10:19:29 AM

For hot Mangina information check out http://www.notaddicted.com/forums/showthread.php?t=138.

An article on the prevalence of androgynous sexuality in MMORPGs coming from a guy named Llava. Just saying...
« Last Edit: April 07, 2006, 10:22:22 AM by Bill Brasky »
Zane0
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Reply #15 on: April 07, 2006, 10:42:10 AM

Quote
And did they ever implement player missions?
No.

I've always been relatively open to a bit of RPing, but it always gets very very insipid, and I quickly give up.  There just isn't enough drive to act in character, and it never carries much meaning, I find.
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Reply #16 on: April 07, 2006, 11:43:43 AM

Just to pre-empt any offense taken, even though I cover it in the article:

I use the word "gay" in a very derogatory, arguably bigoted manner.† I don't think there's anything wrong with homosexuality.† Think 'South Park'- use of the word is part shock value (though if you're shocked by that... you need to turn down the sensitivity on your shockometer a bit) and part... well, laziness.† South Park can get away with it, so can I.

Okay.† I don't/didn't expect it to be a problem or anything, but just want to cover my ass (ha ha) on that one.

Just because South Park does it doesn't make it right. I wish you would've come up with a better term. I also think you are painting all roleplayers with a brush that really only applies to a subset.
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Reply #17 on: April 07, 2006, 12:00:16 PM

Unfortunately, in my experience, that subset is by far in the majority in online games. I've found, the less you leave up to the imagination of the players, the further they'll take the whole roleplaying thing and wander off into waters unchartered. And by unchartered I mean annoying.
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Reply #18 on: April 07, 2006, 12:11:44 PM

For hot Mangina information check out http://www.notaddicted.com/forums/showthread.php?t=138.

An article on the prevalence of androgynous sexuality in MMORPGs coming from a guy named Llava. Just saying...

Quote from: Llava
Iím not particularly masculine, even arguably just a bit feminine. Iím okay with that.

In all seriousness, I really enjoy roleplaying.  I even do so occasionally in City of Villains now, just heading into Pocket D (the pocket dimension club) and chatting in-character.  However, that's not really writing a story.  Pretty much nothing that can happen in Pocket D is going to significantly change my characters one way or another- their stories advance when I say "Okay, I'm going to add to/change this story now."

I have to agree with schild in saying that it's been the majority of roleplayers in my experience.  Every time I start to consider getting  really involved in a roleplaying community, I read some of the stories by the people in the center of the whole thing and think to myself "Okay... nevermind, I'd rather not be a part of that."

It's not just the drama.  That's irritating, sure, but you can deal with it.  The really scary part is when you go to one of these things and you suddenly get the sensation, "...everyone here has cybered with everyone else here."  And the emotes start flying, and suddenly it's even more clear- you just walked into an online, in-character, swingers' club.

But it's not as though there's anything that could be done about it.  Those kinds of people are just out there, and it's not as though you can stop them from roleplaying.  More often than not, they're at the center of the roleplaying communities- you'd work really hard at it, too, if you thought it was going to get you laid.  The article was just for a laugh.

(And in all seriousness, I do apologize if anyone's offended by my use of the word "gay". As I said, it's not intended as a slam against homosexual individuals at all.  I figured that, in the context of this site, I could get away with it, given our enthusiasm for the term "art fag" and all.)
« Last Edit: April 07, 2006, 12:16:03 PM by Llava »

That the saints may enjoy their beatitude and the grace of God more abundantly they are permitted to see the punishment of the damned in hell. -Saint Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica
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Reply #19 on: April 07, 2006, 12:52:23 PM

I don't play on RP servers.  I do RP occasionally.  I have one WoW toon who is always "in character" which can be rather challenging at times, although she's a tailor who spends most of her time in Stormwind.  It's on a regular pvp server.  I don't do stories, I just amuse myself.  Most of the time, I'm just playing the game (although that toon is mostly an AH toon).

The hostility from some people toward rp is quite amusing.

There's a guy on my server who rps full-time.  He's famous on the server.  All he has to do is say something, anything, and he elicits 5-6 comments.  I find it quite entertaining.

I played in an rp guild in DAOC on the Mordred server for a while.  (Mordred was the pk server).  It was all-rp, all the time.  It was an all-kobold guild called Shadowclan (aka Shaddurklan).  We used to surround players, and demand "tribute" from them (imagine being level 40 surrounded by 20 lvl 15 kobolds shouting "tribut!" and "klomp da pinky!").  Shadowclan has it's own language, in fact, and a strict hierarchy, with rules and so on.

That was a lot of fun, but it did become wearing after a while - all guild chat, public speaking, and even tells were in kobold-speak.

Anyhow, I've never run across cybering, nor a wedding, although I once attended an online memorial for a person who died irl.

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Reply #20 on: April 07, 2006, 01:11:08 PM

Mih wur in Shaddurklan tuu.

Shadowclan was a lot of fun on Mordred and, in my opinion, a good example of what roleplaying SHOULD be.  It added fun and flavor to the server.  Nobody on the rest of Mordred was interested in roleplaying back, though, (or I should say- mostly nobody...every so often a couple people would join in) so it eventually just became a bunch of little, blue, funny talking weirdos.

They had a great attitude, though.  "You're only level 5?  Come on out to the frontiers, we'll take care of you!"

That the saints may enjoy their beatitude and the grace of God more abundantly they are permitted to see the punishment of the damned in hell. -Saint Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica
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Reply #21 on: April 07, 2006, 01:13:48 PM

I dont think RP'ing is inherently gay as much as fantasy settings are 95% gay so any RP'ing done in them ends up gay.

A nation consists of its laws. A nation does not consist of its situation at a given time. If an individual's morals are situational, then that individual is without morals. If a nation's laws are situational, that nation has no laws, and soon isn't a nation.
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Llava
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Reply #22 on: April 07, 2006, 01:17:28 PM

But that doesn't explain why it followed over to City of Villains.

Course... there's all that spandex...

EDIT:

There's something going on in CoV right now on the Virtue server, it's pretty weird.  These guys just showed up with no fanfare or anything.  They've handled this pretty well, I'm impressed.  Wish more roleplayers were like this.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2006, 02:19:03 PM by Llava »

That the saints may enjoy their beatitude and the grace of God more abundantly they are permitted to see the punishment of the damned in hell. -Saint Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica
Catalan
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Reply #23 on: April 07, 2006, 02:46:38 PM

Mih wur in Shaddurklan tuu.

Shadowclan was a lot of fun on Mordred and, in my opinion, a good example of what roleplaying SHOULD be.  It added fun and flavor to the server.  Nobody on the rest of Mordred was interested in roleplaying back, though, (or I should say- mostly nobody...every so often a couple people would join in) so it eventually just became a bunch of little, blue, funny talking weirdos.

They had a great attitude, though.  "You're only level 5?  Come on out to the frontiers, we'll take care of you!"

Waaagh Hoowah BuurzKlan! Heh, I was there too, the first months in Mordred, still wearing the starter leather rags at level 20 and living the life of a little blue highwaykobold are the high point of my MMOG life.
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Reply #24 on: April 07, 2006, 03:43:13 PM

Hoowah!  Mor kobolds! Dats bubhosh!

Yes, Shadowclan was great fun.  Part of the fun for me was that they were rp'ers on a non-rp server.

I understand they are active on Bleeding Hollow for WoW.  Is that rp?

(If the damned WoW servers were working, I'd be able to log on and check myself.)
WindupAtheist
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Badicalthon


Reply #25 on: April 07, 2006, 05:46:47 PM

So it's a few years ago, the night of the big Age of Shadows patch in UO.  The goddamn thing is shit, and one by one shards are blowing up as they receive it.  The only shard not scheduled for a buttfucking that night is Siege Perilous, so naturally everyone makes a character there.  About forty of us newbs are sitting at SP Brit Bank, milling around aimlessly.

I start screaming that we should attack the Shadowclan fort near Yew, an NPC orc fort which the guild typically inhabits.  After a few minutes, someone with a developed character comes around and starts handing out yellow robes and cheap weapons.  Now we're forty armed newbs in uniform.  A mage opens a gate to the fort, and off we go.

The half-dozen orcs scattered at first, actually, at the sight of that many people spilling out of a gate.  Within thirty seconds or so, however, they realized what was going on, and the slaughter commenced.  They kept a wandering healer penned up inside the fort, so they could rez quickly in PVP, and we put that to good use.  We rushed them over and over, sometimes lasting only seconds between deaths, filling the fort with corpses and our packs with deathrobes.

It went on like this for twenty or thirty minutes, newbs screaming silly shit and rezzing over and over again, until petering out after the orcs killed their own wandering healer to keep us from rezzing.  Good times.

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Reply #26 on: April 07, 2006, 05:55:39 PM

That's pretty much why I loved UO in a nutshell.
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Reply #27 on: April 08, 2006, 02:56:30 PM

Ah this is always a fun discussion. I still play D&D every week, so I'm no stranger to roleplaying, but RP in an MMOG? Good luck. No one can ever agree on what equates good RP or bad RP, so everyone eventually just either has a hissy fit or runs of to cyber.

I've played a few in role characters over the years. Bunktavious on Siege in UO I played like a Druid - he wore robes, never tamed anything tougher than polar bear, and got his ass kicked all the time. I didn't really talk in character though, so was I roleplaying, or not? If I do roleplay, its usually a secondary character that I have no intent of ever being uber with. The two simply do not go hand in hand (which is one reason so many people see RP as a waste of time).

Then we can get in to the whole mangina thing. About half of my characters in MMOGs have been female. I never try to pretend I'm female and I never RP with them, but there is still that negative stereotype. I've wondered why I bother with the female characters, and the best answer I can give is that I generally prefer the art assets for females in these games over what they give the males. Otherwise, I don't know. Its not like I go wack off to my WoW character.

Shadowbane, before it came out, actually looked like it might lend itself to RP. That sounds silly, but full pvp games like UO, AC Darktide, etc have actually lent themselves to RP quite well. I think its the fact that the game doesn't force everyone to play on the same side. WoW missed the boat on this one, they really should have let the two sides understand one another on the RP servers. 

Anyways, about Shadowbane, I joined up with a group of people and participated in a pre game guild. This was probably about nine months before the game came out. Essentially we were a website/forum guild, since there was no game, made up of people from AC, EQ, etc, all with an interest in RP. It was fun for a while, people actually posting in character on the boards as we worked out the details of our little kingdom. It took about 4 months for the entire thing to devour itself in a mass of whiny chaos.

It was too bad, some of them were really good guys and girls (Grimwell was there briefly, he was smart enough to get out of Dodge before the whole thing imploded though). Roleplayers just can't seem to interact for long periods of time without wanting to kill one another.

Ah well, I always have my Priest of Hextor and his friends, hell bent on bathing in the blood of Heironious's self righteous peons in their pretty little city. Good old D&D.


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Reply #28 on: April 08, 2006, 09:26:35 PM

God hates fa^h^h furries and nig^h^h^h roleplayers.

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Reply #29 on: April 09, 2006, 12:38:57 AM

I generally prefer the art assets for females

Because someone had to do it eventually, might as well get it out of the way.

That the saints may enjoy their beatitude and the grace of God more abundantly they are permitted to see the punishment of the damned in hell. -Saint Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica
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Reply #30 on: April 10, 2006, 06:48:37 AM

Shadowclan rocked. I was lucky enough to rp with them some, though I never joined. This was way back on Cats, iirc, before they got GM blessing on the fort. There were a few newb orcs around training and a couple blue mages came along to mess with them. I was a thief, and this was before they changed the system, theives went red from stealing from blues back then (not some jerky bank thief, arrpeed). So I was red, with no combat skills (common for me in UO, heh). I was hiding out and filching reagents/arrows/weapons, really pissing off the pks. Eventually they took off because they couldn't attack anymore (though they did come back later with a vengeance).

The SC guys thought it was hilarious and let me hang out, despite being human. They loved my 'takee game', and trained me a little in swords so I wouldn't die so easily (I had whatever the default minimum strength was, and the accordingly low hp). They found it funny their training swords killed me in one shot :P

RP? One of the things that soured me on it was an otherwise nice girl who was a total cyberwhore, she had left her previous boyfriend for a guy she met online, cybering. That's disgusting, imo. I've always had a strict policy of 'gaming is gaming', and 'reality is reality', and ne'er the twain shall meet. Some people don't have a very strong hold on reality, or are just plain too freaky for me.

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Reply #31 on: April 10, 2006, 08:35:30 AM

RP doesn't work in MMOG's, because the MMOG is a static, unchanging world. And roleplaying only thrives when there isn't a set list of triggers and switches that you throw to advance or change things. RP doesn't work very well along a linear path, becuase the whole idea of RPing is about improv, rolling with the situation and changing your character and the world through your actions or inactions. You can't do any of that in most MMOG's, because you can't change the world.

Roleplaying also requires PVP, because there has to be conflict or else its just masturbation with an audience. If you don't have conflict, your just some whiny whackjob talking to no one in particular about his hard life as an orphan destined to save the world. MMOG's just aren't made for it. Shadowbane could have been a great RP world, if 1) the mechanics had more actively punished those who didn't rp (such as ARAC guilds) and 2) open PVP didn't attract such a bunch of mealy-mouthed, drooling, crumbsnatching, azzraping fucktard mongoloids.

Second Life actually has a great deal of RPing, because other than building shit, what else is there to do? You can build the mechanics of roleplaying, as well as the set dressing. But you'll probably eventually run up against the Kool-Aid Man in your medieval dress up.

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Reply #32 on: April 10, 2006, 11:02:35 AM

Personally, I'd say the biggest drawback to roleplaying in MMOs is the prevalance of information.  Back in UO, I successfully roleplayed quite a bit.  In EQ, it worked for a while until guilds stopped guarding their raid secrets and spoiler sites had gone beyond huge.  At this point is where many "casual roleplayers" lost their grip, because they'd be sorta-roleplaying and then lapse into DPS discussions, spawn rates and drop rates, loot locations, etc...  Every game since has been about the same, with WoW, Thottbot and the almost completely open UI being the most horrid example that makes it nearly impossible to escape numbers and raw data.  In City of Heroes, for a short period on the Virtue server, I had some damn fine RP.  I ran a newspaper and I played a reporter.  People who played along had some fun in-character adventures with the added bonus of seeing the story written up in a semi-newspaper style with prose and photos.  Even had some folks allow me to "run" stories integrating missions and street fighting into original works.  However, as time went on, and as we all levelled up, many people wanted to just tell me about their adventures and have me write a story, rather than actually have me tag along.  The most common complaint was that having me in group and not fighting made the missions too hard.  Of course, this was crap as some groups of folks still happily took me along.  In the end though, the numbers won, and the roleplaying on Virtue dwindled to mainly people standing in the park acting out soap opera dialogue.
Fargull
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Reply #33 on: April 10, 2006, 12:17:07 PM

Shadowclan rocked. I was lucky enough to rp with them some, though I never joined. This was way back on Cats, iirc, before they got GM blessing on the fort. There were a few newb orcs around training and a couple blue mages came along to mess with them. I was a thief, and this was before they changed the system, theives went red from stealing from blues back then (not some jerky bank thief, arrpeed). So I was red, with no combat skills (common for me in UO, heh). I was hiding out and filching reagents/arrows/weapons, really pissing off the pks. Eventually they took off because they couldn't attack anymore (though they did come back later with a vengeance).

The situation with Shadowclan arrose because UO actually had a very non-item centric game mechanic and the ability for the players to do something like this.. same with Kazola's.  Something that has not been provided to any extent in the games beyond UO.

"I have come to believe that a great teacher is a great artist and that there are as few as there are any other great artists. Teaching might even be the greatest of the arts since the medium is the human mind and spirit." John Steinbeck
Hoax
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l33t kiddie


Reply #34 on: April 10, 2006, 12:32:10 PM

RP doesn't work in MMOG's, because the MMOG is a static, unchanging world. And roleplaying only thrives when there isn't a set list of triggers and switches that you throw to advance or change things. RP doesn't work very well along a linear path, becuase the whole idea of RPing is about improv, rolling with the situation and changing your character and the world through your actions or inactions. You can't do any of that in most MMOG's, because you can't change the world.

Roleplaying also requires PVP, because there has to be conflict or else its just masturbation with an audience. If you don't have conflict, your just some whiny whackjob talking to no one in particular about his hard life as an orphan destined to save the world. MMOG's just aren't made for it. Shadowbane could have been a great RP world, if 1) the mechanics had more actively punished those who didn't rp (such as ARAC guilds) and 2) open PVP didn't attract such a bunch of mealy-mouthed, drooling, crumbsnatching, azzraping fucktard mongoloids.

Second Life actually has a great deal of RPing, because other than building shit, what else is there to do? You can build the mechanics of roleplaying, as well as the set dressing. But you'll probably eventually run up against the Kool-Aid Man in your medieval dress up.

.gg

This one is over folks, pack it up.

I wonder if that makes me a RP'er considering I'm always advocating for non-linear pvp+ worlds?

A nation consists of its laws. A nation does not consist of its situation at a given time. If an individual's morals are situational, then that individual is without morals. If a nation's laws are situational, that nation has no laws, and soon isn't a nation.
-William Gibson
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