Korean gamers threaten to sue NCSoft

[Nebu]

The league claims that the game is too expensive. It noted that the monthly fee of 30,000 won ($25.40) was almost double the rate in some other countries. Monthly rates are $15 in the United States, 2,000 yen ($17.60) in Japan, and $480 NT ($14) in Taiwan. "Korean game players are being discriminated against," they said.
The league also said that the game's server crashed too often, and that there was significant fraud or hacking of the game, yet the company has not taken action to improve conditions. They said that they would file the suit if the company did not act by May 28.

Read about it here

I find this pretty ridiculous, but the outcome may be interesting to follow.

[WayAbvPar]

Does that have anything to do with the fact that a lot of Koreans play L2 in bangs, and thus may have multiple players per account? Does the 'house' buy the accounts and rent slots to the players, or how does it work?

[Venkman]

An interesting possible case here, but it just depends on what NC Soft says about it. I could imagine their excuse would be that 90%+ (or whatever) of their gamers play in those Internet Cafes (WayAbv, I assume "bang" means the same thing?), and therefore are actually paying list than gamers who don't have that option. Like most of the U.S.

[Murgos]

Bet you a dollar management and collection of Korean accounts is handled by a third party.

[WayAbvPar]

Internet Cafes (WayAbv, I assume "bang" means the same thing?)

You are correct, sir.

[Furiously]

I like the bit about the selling of in-game items needing to be outlawed by the government. How it's ok because there is no "Law" against it.

[Nebu]

I think suing NCSoft over their monthly fee is a silly suit.  I am interested in seeing what comes of their case against duping, hacks, and cheats.  With the sale of virtual items becoming more and more commonplace, dupes and cheats begin to have real if not significant monetary value.

The other part of this that made me chuckle was seeing that the US doesn't hold the monopoly on frivilous lawsuits anymore.  Westernization isn't always a good thing now is it?

[angry.bob]

A much better lawsuit would be to get their internet cafes named something way less gay sounding.

[SirBruce]

An interesting possible case here, but it just depends on what NC Soft says about it. I could imagine their excuse would be that 90%+ (or whatever) of their gamers play in those Internet Cafes (WayAbv, I assume "bang" means the same thing?), and therefore are actually paying list than gamers who don't have that option. Like most of the U.S.

For Lineage, it used to be that high, but over 50% of their customer base comes from individual subscriptions now.

Bruce

[Venkman]

In Korea or worldwide?

[SirBruce]

Worldwide.  They were talking about that back in GDC 2003.  In one report I saw it was as high as 60%.

It's also important to note the PC Baangs are no longer growing in number in South Korea, and have actually declined somewhat in the past couple of years.

Bruce

[schild]

Didn't bother reading the article since Koreans suing someone over something that they seem to love oh so much (MMORPGs) seems insane and arrogant to me. But it's my assumption that when one kid has an account 7 people really have it (or however many character slots there are). City of Heroes for example, one kid would buy it, and the rest of his friends would take turns playing it at said net cafe. I mean, sure my friends and I could share an account if we all played at seperate times, cattassing away our lives.

I hope the people suing NCSoft get their ass handed to them on a silver platter. But it seems to me if I played an MMO as much as they do (sure, not all of them play that much, but it seems like the hardcore are in the majority there - just look at Lineage 2) $25 would seem cheap compared to a monthlong activity like say EATING SOMETHING BESIDES FUCKING RAMEN NOODLES.

They need to get off their goddamn high horse and get back to the local net cafe.

EDIT: Ok, so I read the article. 520 million accounts? Sweet christ. It's a little late to be complaining about the monthly fee. Idiots.

[Mesozoic]

Sounds like they just don't want to pay the price of their slavish devotion.

[Venkman]

Worldwide.  They were talking about that back in GDC 2003.  In one report I saw it was as high as 60%.

Ah ok. Then that does sorta support a possible case. If they're getting charged more than the rest of the world for no better reason than geography, then it does compel some exploration. It still depends on NC Soft's justification.

[Kairos]

Hey, the Korean players have shown that they are willing to pay that much, and so they get charged that much. That's capitalism for you.

[SirBruce]

Worldwide.  They were talking about that back in GDC 2003.  In one report I saw it was as high as 60%.

Ah ok. Then that does sorta support a possible case. If they're getting charged more than the rest of the world for no better reason than geography, then it does compel some exploration. It still depends on NC Soft's justification.

But does a company really NEED a justification for charging different prices for the same service in different markets?

On the other hand, I saw that there's now a lawsuit against the major drug manufacturers for trying to block the importation of drugs from Canada.  Since the drugs are sold cheaper in Canada than in the US, people from the US are buying them from Canadian pharmacies, which defeats the entire purpose of charging one price in one market and another in another market.

Bruce

[eldaec]

Worldwide.  They were talking about that back in GDC 2003.  In one report I saw it was as high as 60%.

Ah ok. Then that does sorta support a possible case. If they're getting charged more than the rest of the world for no better reason than geography, then it does compel some exploration. It still depends on NC Soft's justification.

But does a company really NEED a justification for charging different prices for the same service in different markets?

If it does then I want an assload of money back on every single computer I ever bought in the UK.

(there is no justification required of course)

[Arcadian Del Sol]

The Lincoln Navigator is WAY too expensive for an SUV.
Lets sue.

[schild]

The Lincoln Navigator is WAY too expensive for an SUV.
Lets sue.

Navigator? You haven't seen the Porsche SUV have you? What the fuck is the point of buying a LUXURY SUV?

Somebody clue me in here.

[eldaec]

On the other hand, I saw that there's now a lawsuit against the major drug manufacturers for trying to block the importation of drugs from Canada.  Since the drugs are sold cheaper in Canada than in the US, people from the US are buying them from Canadian pharmacies, which defeats the entire purpose of charging one price in one market and another in another market.

This is a whole other thing.

This is a supplier trying to prevent you selling things on to anyone you damn well please. Or, in plainer language 'operating a cartel'.

This is illegal within most countries, and within most regional trading areas (EU, NAFTA etc), though interestingly it's steadily becoming less so in the world of intellectual property. (witness the DVD region fiasco)

[schild]

I don't support much of what the MPAA does or Hollywood, but the DVD Region thing I support. Barely.

The idea that a dvd can be released in America before a movie gets say, shipped to Korea and the DVD is set to Region 1 so it can't be played over there (yes, yes, I know Region free dvd players are legal in Korea, bear with me) makes complete fiscal sense. There's a LOT of work that goes into a proper foreign release of a movie. Particularly animated ones. But that's besides the point, the DVD region example doesn't compare at all to the ACTUAL topic at hand.

Many Koreans share their account with their friends at a netcafe. They should be charged probably 7x as much as we are for one account. Then maybe they'll get their pale ass out of a chair and fucking do something instead of playing Lineage 1 until someone ganks them, takes their items, and kill themselves. Sorry, no pity for the financially stupid.

[Aslan]

That's what I find really shocking about this whole suit.  These guys are wasting valuable catassing time suing, and they are SO going to be outleveled by the time the get back.  N00bs.

[eldaec]

(yes, yes, I know Region free dvd players are legal in Korea, bear with me)

Just for reference, also legal in Europe, afaik Japan, and all other significant markets.

Just about all insignificant markets don't care either way and have failed to do anything legislative, and certainly have better things to do than care if you dvd player arbitarily locks content or not.

It is in fact now quite difficult to buy a region locked dvd player outside of the US, assuming you don't want some sub £50 p.o.s. purchased from your local supermarket.

I agree this has nothing directly to do with the Lineage example though.

Only way I could see the Korean case making any sense would be if they could somehow argue that NCSoft were abusing a monoploy position - but that makes no sense in the actual context whatsoever.

[Venkman]

That's what I find really shocking about this whole suit.  These guys are wasting valuable catassing time suing, and they are SO going to be outleveled by the time the get back.  N00bs.

Nah, their legal advisor sure isn't playing L2. Litigation is a turn-key operation here, just fire off the amount of you want, grab some popcorn and plan two or three trips to a courtroom. Why would it be any different in Korea?

(in case anyone's a lawyer or laywer wannabe: /sarcasm off)

[HaemishM]

Can the players of L2 sue because the game just sucks?

Another problem that users pointed out was the cash trading of game items offline. Within the game, there are many different "items" such as weapons, clothing or potions, that have different levels of power. Acquiring more powerful items can take hours of playing time. The ability to acquire more powerful items also depends on the level of skill of the player. Therefore, for players unable or unwilling to devote the necessary time, buying and selling items for cash has become a widespread trend.
"Offline or online trading of items has nothing to do with the company," a company official said. "If it is illegal, then the government should make a law forbidding cash trade of online items," the official added.
Many users, however, disagree. "The basic structure of online games is that if one has good items and equipment, then he or she can win," one game player said.

If that becomes part of the case, this will be a big decision. If not, this is just another whiney bitch lawsuit, only with keke la ^__^ thrown in for good measure.

[Arthur_Parker]

It is in fact now quite difficult to buy a region locked dvd player outside of the US, assuming you don't want some sub £50 p.o.s. purchased from your local supermarket.

I got a Toshiba high range DVD with my tv as part of a package, it only plays region 2, no cd-rs either.  Bought a pacific dvd from Asda for about £40, it plays anything I throw at it, I'm almost convinced it would play a beer mat.