Those wacky Jews were on to something.

[stray]

I think you did.

The fact you have to clean Under Something freaks me out enough.

The fact that advocating we cut off an area of the genitals for anything other than religious beliefs freaks me out.

My final words: Circumcision is overrated (err...For Gentiles, that is). As is the "uncleaniness" thing. Seriously. It's a crock.

[schild]

The fact that advocating we cut off an area of the genitals for anything other than religious beliefs freaks me out.

Advocating anything with the word "belief" in it doesn't freak you out?

Some of you may be wondering if I just went there. Well, I did.

[/internetretardslapfight]

[Signe]

Hey, but if you're into that. Enjoy the smegma. For those of you completely not in the know:

smeg·ma (smgm)
n.

A sebaceous secretion, especially the whitish cheesy secretion that collects under the prepuce of the penis or around the clitoris.

Gee, thanks for the enlightenment!

[Strazos]

Also, when was the last time you saw an uncut guy in porn?

Never in those with higher production values. But the low-budget stuff....

[stray]

The fact that advocating we cut off an area of the genitals for anything other than religious beliefs freaks me out.

Advocating anything with the word "belief" in it doesn't freak you out?

Some of you may be wondering if I just went there. Well, I did.

[/internetretardslapfight]

Umm...I'm just being nice and as respectful as I can. It may hold some cultural/spiritual significance and meaning, but I'm just saying that I don't see the medical benefits of it. Why the hell would we born that way then? Is it like the groin's equivalant of wisdom teeth or the appendix?

[stray]

Also, when was the last time you saw an uncut guy in porn?

Never in those with higher production values. But the low-budget stuff....

And this comes from our very own specialist in all things "Roma".

Watch just about any Euro porn, dude.

[edit] Besides, what's "higher production values"? Vivid?

That stuff sucks anyways.

[Strazos]

All I am saying is that I have seen such thins in pr0n. American pr0n at that.

[Samwise]

Enjoy the smegma. For those of you completely not in the know:

smeg·ma (smgm)
n.

A sebaceous secretion, especially the whitish cheesy secretion that collects under the prepuce of the penis or around the clitoris.

Nothing like trimming off a girl's clitoris to get rid of those pesky sebaceous secretions, eh?

[schild]

Why the hell would we born that way then? Is it like the groin's equivalant of wisdom teeth or the appendix?

Hey, that's a good way of explaining it.

[schild]

Nothing like trimming off a girl's clitoris to get rid of those pesky sebaceous secretions, eh?

If getting circumcised (as a male) removed all sensation, I'd be in the oppisite camp. For women, it's barbaric. For men, it does more good than bad. Though I'd love to see that proved otherwise.

[Tebonas]

The sensation that some Americans hate their own bodies slowly begins to creep into my consciousness.

"Eh, foreskin, make it go away"
"Eh, hair (everywhere except on top of our head), make it go away"
"Eh, breasts without implants, make them go away"

The first two are just an excuse for less body hygiene (yes, hairy parts and parts under foreskin smell funny if you don't wash them and you sweat, so for a radical concept try washing yourself once in a while). The third could be watching too much LA story, and once having a makeout session with an exchange student whose parents bought her new ones for some reason or another. Thanks but no thanks, give me real breasts any day of the week. The fake ones don't even look better, and do you really need more than a hand/mouth full?

You are really spending too much time envisioning how you want to be and not enough time enjoying how you are.

I keep my foreskin, my women keep their natural breasts, and the amount of body hair removed is negotiable upon how much hair your have in you mouth after Uncle Junioring your girl.

Crazy backwards Central European ramblings for the day, thankyouverymuch.

[Paelos]

This is inevitably headed towards a posting of who's cut and who is not, which can't lead to anything good.

Den this fast.

[Tebonas]

Oh before I forget. The "facts" which is healthier, cut or uncut, change every few years. I wouldn't advocate one or the other for medical reasons until the experts are sure on that, schild.

[Llava]

Wow, circumcision prevents 7 out of 10 infections?

Damn.  I should've been more promiscuous before I found The One.

Thanks anyways, Mom and Dad!

[Hanzii]

For fun:

1 Many older men, who have bladder or prostate gland problems, also develop difficulties with their foreskins due to their surgeon's handling, cleaning, and using instruments. Some of these patients will need circumcising. Afterwards it is often astonishing to find some who have never ever seen their glans (knob) exposed before!

2 Some older men develop cancer of the penis - about 1 in 1000 - fairly rare, but tragic if you or your son are in that small statistic. Infant circumcision gives almost 100% protection, and young adult circumcision also gives a large degree of protection.

I think the very small number of possibly prevented penile cance more or less equals the number of eunuchs created by botched circumcisions. ie very small, but it happens - while the prevention of penile cancer is nowhere near proven, the fact that some circumcisions go horribly wrong is - especially in backwater countries where the procedure can be bperformed with no medical professionals present.

And nice link. Good of you to find and unbiased source - heres's the mothers against circumcision to counter.

Fact is, circumcision is a religious procedure that wasn't known in the western world (apart from westerne jews and muslims) before the 19th century. It was adopted in the belief that it prevented disease and masturbation. Many other bad medical ideas of the time - like the full frontal lobotomy - has since been abandoned, but this lingers on. But it is declining because there simply isn't enough proof to support the medical benefits. The US is the western country with most circumcisions, but even here it's fallen to about 60% of males, which will hopefully prevent parents from going "we're doing it, so he wont look different from the other kids while bathing" - which is the craziest reason for a medical procedure I've ever heard.

It doesn't seem like a particularily harmfull procedure if done by medical personel, so I'm fine with people continuing for religious reasons. But I'm glad that over here it's only legal to perform the procedure with a doctor present - some doctors have suggested banning the practice even for religious reasons in my country, because it's a waste of public money. But that would just lead to unsuperwised cuttings, so I'm happy with the way it is now.
But please don't pretend the science is clear on this - there's benefits as well as negatives and the prevailing opinion in the western medical society is that's it's an uneccessary procedure to perform on infants.

Wikipedia has a good discussion.

[Signe]

The den is too good for this thread.  Just make it go away.

[stray]

The den is too good for this thread.  Just make it go away.

It's been a suprisingly mature discussion, all things considered.

But if you REALLY want it to go away, I could tell an old wallet/suitcase joke (and even throw in a clever magic trick while I'm at it) .

[Hanzii]

It's been a suprisingly mature discussion, all things considered.

But if you REALLY want it to go away, I could tell an old wallet/suitcase joke (and even throw in a clever magic trick while I'm at it) .

Yeah, I could have linked to the main Wiki-entry, which has a picture of the item in question.
But compared to the 7 page Daydreamer abortion of a thread, I don't see the harm in this one...

[HaemishM]

Medical or not, it's a pretty harmless procedure if done right. Unless the wife objects, I intend our kids to have it done, because it was done to me and I've never missed it.

[Ironwood]

Seems to be a totally unneccesary procedure, so unless my wife objects, I'm not going to let sharp things near my sons todge.

All of which serves to highlight that this is one of these personal choice thingies that has no place on a board...

[Ookii]

This is inevitably headed towards a posting of who's cut and who is not, which can't lead to anything good.

So I guess you're not, it's more of a 'who's not' type of thing, rather than a 'who is'.

[Signe]

This thread makes me cry for the little children.     As far as I know, they're not even given anything to dull the pain.  It's believed that some infants don't even cry but it's probably because of shock. Can anyone actually believe that it doesn't cause incredible pain?  Sorry, I just can't bear the thought of putting children, who are much to young to voice their objections, through such a painful experience.  I just don't see the point. 

[Strazos]

Some parents don't cut the kids at birth, instead letting them decide to have it done once they are mature enough to make choices for themselves.

I couldn't imagine going through the pain.

[Pococurante]

Wikipedia has a good discussion.

Sounds like the worst thing about circumcision is being born in New Zealand...

[Yegolev]

Medical or not, it's a pretty harmless procedure if done right. Unless the wife objects, I intend our kids to have it done, because it was done to me and I've never missed it.

Can't miss what you never had.

Everything causes cancer, if you read the right report, so I discount that.  Other problems can be solved by not being a filthy fucker.

[Bunk]

This thread makes me cry for the little children.     As far as I know, they're not even given anything to dull the pain.  It's believed that some infants don't even cry but it's probably because of shock. Can anyone actually believe that it doesn't cause incredible pain?  Sorry, I just can't bear the thought of putting children, who are much to young to voice their objections, through such a painful experience.  I just don't see the point. 

Well, I can honestly say I have no memory of it either way. As has been said, its really a personal choice, since there are pros and cons to both ways. Personally, I'm rather glad my parents decided to.

[Llava]

On the other half, you may be being cruel to your son if you're NOT getting him a circumcision and here's why:

My girlfriend was, when we started dating, totally against giving blowjobs.  She thought it was gross and said she'd never do it.

But because of the clean cut look of my wedding tackle, she decided (without cajoling from me) that the process was not nearly so objectionable as she had felt before.  It came as a surprise to me, but a pleasant one.

So be kind.  Help your son get head.

[Yegolev]

So be kind.  Help your son get head.

Hehe, ok... I'm done.

[stray]

Umm...Yeah, I've never had a blowjob.  

[WayAbvPar]

Umm...Yeah, I've never had a blowjob. 

Unless you are female, this is the most disturbing thing I have ever read! Even if you have to pay for one, do yourself a favor and check it out.

[stray]

That "rolls eyes" thing is my version of "green text".

[Signe]

Well, just because you don't remember being tortured by a big man with scissors as an infant, doesn't mean it didn't have an affect on your personality.  I wonder if the having your foreskin suddenly whacked off raises your chances of becoming a serial killer? 

[schild]

Well, just because you don't remember being tortured by a big man with scissors as an infant, doesn't mean it didn't have an affect on your personality.  I wonder if the having your foreskin suddenly whacked off raises your chances of becoming a serial killer?

It mostly just raises your chances of becoming a banker.

[WayAbvPar]

That "rolls eyes" thing is my version of "green text".

I assumed so, but I figured it was a good place for a PSA. These are important issues we are dealing with!

[stray]

That "rolls eyes" thing is my version of "green text".

I assumed so, but I figured it was a good place for a PSA. These are important issues we are dealing with!

Your concern is noted. 

I still have yet to experience a "gumjob" though.