Episode 3

[WayAbvPar]

Does my fictional car have a distinct area that I left primer grey, and exist in a galaxy with millions of different languages yet speaks in an incredibly effeminate british accent?

You bet your ass.

That looks like some sort of gibberish that voodoolilly would write, claiming it was phonetically slang. 

[AOFanboi]

That looks like some sort of gibberish that voodoolilly would write, claiming it was phonetically slang. 

It's either Finnish or Estonian. And Ep 3 was better than the first two simply because Lucas could not fit as many stinking merchandising toys in it. Like the Ep 1 "and this part of the movie exists to sell Star Wars Racer" pod race, "inspired" by the racing segment of a 1970s Norwegian animated movie that is far far better than anything Lucas has made.

[Shockeye]

That looks like some sort of gibberish that voodoolilly would write, claiming it was phonetically slang. 

It's either Finnish or Estonian. And Ep 3 was better than the first two simply because Lucas could not fit as many stinking merchandising toys in it. Like the Ep 1 "and this part of the movie exists to sell Star Wars Racer" pod race, "inspired" by the racing segment of a 1970s Norwegian animated movie that is far far better than anything Lucas has made.

What I've read had Lucas sayings the pod race was inspired by Ben-Hur.

[Abagadro]

If by "inspired" he means "copied yet managed to suck the life out of" then I would agree with him.

[Azazel]

What annoys me are geniuses who spot "inconsistencies" based on the assumption that episodes 3 and 4 took place maybe a week apart.  You know what I mean.

"OMG WHY DIDNT VADER RECOGNIZE C3PO IN THE CARBON FREEZING ROOM?!"
"HEY WHY DIDNT OBI-WAN RECOGNIZE R2D2???"

Because it's been two fucking decades since they were last seen?  Because droids identical to those are a commonplace sight?  How accurately do YOU recall... say... the stereo your buddy owned in 1985?

I thought it was because Lucas wrote the Star Wars films with the same attention to detail and continuity that SoE releases EQ1 expansions.. time for a NEW LOST continent! And as a bonus, some NEW GODs that have always been there. No, really. Also, here's some incestuous kissing since Leia only became Luke's sister to wrap up that "no, there is another" loose end from ESB.


But who can hate star wars when it brought us this?:
http://www.storewars.org/flash/index.html


Oh, and FWIW, I enjoyed RoTS quite a bit.

[HaemishM]

But who can hate star wars when it brought us this?:
http://www.storewars.org/flash/index.html

Fucking hippies.

[WindupAtheist]

The world should completely switch over to organic farming and nothing else!  Chemicals and stuff are evil!

*billions starve to death*

Oops.  Well, hippies can't do math.

[Paelos]

Billions starving would be ok with the hippies.

YOU GOTTA SIMPLIFY, MAAAAAAAN!

[Murgos]

Billions starving would be ok with the hippies.

YOU GOTTA SIMPLIFY, MAAAAAAAN!

Which is funny because hippy's are about the least competent farmers there are, farming is hard work (especially when you forgo the mechanical tools and chemicals) and I have yet to meet a hippy that wanted anything to do with hard work.

There is a reason all those communes that started in the 60's failed within a few years.

[Merusk]

There is a reason all those communes that started in the 60's failed within a few years.

I always figured it had more to do with the women not being as attractive after they've popped-out a few kids.  Mommy fat and saggy boobs aren't condusive to communal love and naked fire dancing.

Plus the general understanding that nobody wants to work hard when they're stoned out of their mind.

[eldaec]

I've only just been to see this. And it seems a shame to see the longest thread evar that isn't about poker die.

It was better than AotC. Anyone who says otherwise must have watched a different AotC. AotC was fucking awful.

It was better than tPM. Not least becuase Anakin was at least Padme's contemporary instead of pointlessly making him 8. As others said, tPM was, in plot terms, a film of pure pointlessness. But the groovy lightsaber fight at the end remains the best of the series.

It was better than RotJ. Because of the fucking teddy bears, and the annoying the jabba the hutt waste of time, all that's really good about RotJ is the space battle, which there seems to be less of whenever I watch this.

It was better than star wars. Because even Anakin isn't as whiny as Luke.

I haven't decided if it's better than Empire. But it's close. Empire isn't as good as people keep saying, people make just as many stupid decisions and there are just as many plot holes if you really feel the need to dig them out.

Ultimately all the films include shit getting blown up in satisfying quantities, sometimes in space, always with lasers and robots. I fail to see why people have such a hard time with this. It's not Citizen fucking Caine.

Oh, and the stupid lines were easier to ignore and to forgive due to the pace in this one, if it had been slower like number 2 I have no doubt the lines would have got more terrible but the pace helped me ignore them.

[Velorath]

Ultimately all the films include shit getting blown up in satisfying quantities, sometimes in space, always with lasers and robots. I fail to see why people have such a hard time with this. It's not Citizen fucking Caine.

It might have to do with the fact that three of the movies were largely made good by Harrison Ford,  Yoda acting like a crazy old fuck on some swamp planet,  and Darth Vader not being a whiny bitch.  Take away all that and you've got the prequels.

[Llava]

I pretty much agree with eldaec.  I feel that Episode 3 was one of the best of the whole series not because episode 3 was some fantastic piece of art, but because the series just isn't that good.  To be entertained for the majority of the film makes it a success when compared to a number of the other SW films.

[HaemishM]

I fail to understand how anyone could watch Episdoe 3 and not go into an apoplectic fit of cursing halfway through it. AotC was blandly awful, this one was just shit-sandwich awful. It isn't about whether it's good art or not, because plainly, it's a genre film that makes no bones about being such. The same goes for the other movies.

The difference is that Empire and Star Wars had meat to the story, and internal consistency. It all made some sort of sense, even if it was all very coincidental in the adventure story sort of way. Sith had NONE of that. It was rushed, the pacing was awful, the logic of the world horribly flawed, visually over-busy, with horrible dialogue and a completely unconvincing dramatic moment.

I really think whether you liked Sith or not all depends on if you "bought into" Anakin's 30-second transformation from conflicted whiny Jedi to complete evil whiny cockmuncher.

[Bunk]

I really think whether you liked Sith or not all depends on if you "bought into" Anakin's 30-second transformation from conflicted whiny Jedi to complete evil whiny cockmuncher.

Personally, I've pretty much decided that for me to enjoy it, I have think of using the force as being one of those Absolute power Corrupts Absolutely type things. That the reason why Jedi have so many weenie and prissy rules, is that they know the force is to much for the average mind to handle. Essentially, Anakin had been falling for years by giving in to his emotions too much, lacking in discipline, etc... Palpatine had been setting him up to fall since he was a little kid. Everything just fell in to place all at once. Sure, in retrospect, dumping Episode 1 completely and starting the three movie arc with the Clone Wars would have allowed for a more progressive transformation, but that fact didn't ruin 3 for me.

All in all, trying to justify it like this really is pointless, becuase there really is no consistency in the rules of the Star Wars Universe, but I don't care. I enjoyed Episode 3 for the ride it was. I think I was satisfied by it, because 1 and 2 had set me up to expect 3 to suck, and it didn't. After seeing 1 and 2, all I really needed to enjoy 3 was a lack of Jar Jar, mop-top kids, C-3P0, and lines about sand (though they tried hard to reach that level with the "romance" dialogue again).

[Merusk]

I really think whether you liked Sith or not all depends on if you "bought into" Anakin's 30-second transformation from conflicted whiny Jedi to complete evil whiny cockmuncher.

I bought it as much as I bought his 30-second transformation from, "Luke must die," to, "into the pit with you, fugly."

[Roac]

I bought it as much as I bought his 30-second transformation from, "Luke must die," to, "into the pit with you, fugly."

"It's not that kind of movie, kid."
-Harrison Ford to Mark Hamill, during shooting of A New Hope.

[eldaec]

Ultimately all the films include shit getting blown up in satisfying quantities, sometimes in space, always with lasers and robots. I fail to see why people have such a hard time with this. It's not Citizen fucking Caine.

It might have to do with the fact that three of the movies were largely made good by Harrison Ford,  Yoda acting like a crazy old fuck on some swamp planet,  and Darth Vader not being a whiny bitch.  Take away all that and you've got the prequels.

To counter Ford, Yoda, and Darth, you can add Ewan MacGregor, Iain McDiamand in decent quantities, and Yoda acting like a crazy old fuck on various planets.

The prequels aren't worse than the orginals by that much.

And I don't mean to say that any of the 5 (AotC doesn't count - damn that was shit) were a terrible a way to watch 2 hours of shit blowing up.

Whether or not you liked Empire more, RotS is the best implementation of 'all sorts of shit gets blowed up in space/sci-fi situations' I can remember since Aliens - and hell - they even made it a tragedy, I was almost certain Lucas would find a crappy excuse for celebration at the end. Even if your forum handle is I dunno, 'schild' or something, the tragedy choice alone is worth celebrating because it will probably remind studio executives that big budget films shouldn't always have happy endings.

People have moaned about the plot as if the story itsef had real problems. Seriously, read some Shakespeare. He, and everyone else since had just as many unimportant pedant point plot holes in their scripts. Star Wars just didn't cover itself well enough in the dialogue to smooth you over them. Focus your fire people, the dialogue is what creates the problem. I for one don't give a rats ass about C3PO.

/shrug

Still doesn't make it the greatest movie ever, or anything near it, but not everything has to be an art-fag character movie.

[HaemishM]

But it should at least follow some of its own rules. Which it doesn't.

It doesn't have to be art-fag character movies, but it's characters should at least act in a manner that is believable within the context of the story. They don't, especially in the prequels, and really haven't since about the emergence of the goddamn Ewoks in RotJ.

Empire is held up as the paragon of the series because it really is that good.

[AOFanboi]

(AotC doesn't count - damn that was shit)

How can people consider The Toy Store Menace to be a better film than AotC, which at least had story progress? Episode I is the shittiest piece of sci-fi since Freejack.

[HaemishM]

Because of that 15-minute sword fight scene between Darth Maul and the Qui-Gon/Obi-Won tandem. That was just pure cinematic brilliance, IMO. And I'd watch 2 hours of that scene repeated before ever watching Ep 2 or Ep 3 again. The fight scene was so good, it makes the rest of the movie, which was REALLY SHITTY, better in comparison.

[eldaec]

Because of that 15-minute sword fight scene between Darth Maul and the Qui-Gon/Obi-Won tandem.

Exactly.

Also Qui-Gon and Obi-wan throughout the film.

[stray]

Qui-Gon and Maul were killed off too soon.....And all we were left with was Dooku.

In the end, I don't really "hate" the new trilogy, but it could have been much better.

[Shockeye]

Qui-Gon and Maul were killed off too soon.....And all we were left with was Dooku.

I would love to see how many outtakes there were where Ewan couldn't get "Dooku" out with a straight face. In AotC and RotS it seemed like he was on the verge of laughing each time he said it.

[eldaec]

But it should at least follow some of its own rules. Which it doesn't.

It doesn't have to be art-fag character movies, but it's characters should at least act in a manner that is believable within the context of the story. They don't, especially in the prequels, and really haven't since about the emergence of the goddamn Ewoks in RotJ.

Regarding the Anakin becoming evil problem; it went better than I was expecting.

Given that they repeatedly made clear that the dark lord of the fricking sith had taken anakin under his wing for some years now, and given that they'd put together a reasonable setup for the Emperor to get Obi-Wan out of the way, and given they'd gone to the trouble to give Anakin an actual excuse to not see the difference between Jedi and Sith at the key moment ("he's too dangerous to leave alive"). I could accept the initial split second decision to stop Mace killing Sidious, and force him to try to take Sidious alive. And it was nicely able to convey Anakin kidding himself that he was doing good, while actually just getting one over on Mace and hoping to stop his wife dying.

Once you accept that split second decision, and observe its immeadiate consequences, I took everything up till the fight with Obi-Wan as red mist and temporary insanity fuelled by the emporer's evil powers. I have no idea if that is what Lucas meant me to take it as (I accept he might not). This wouldn't be the first story where brave knight x swears fealty to evil bastard y in a fit of dispair after doing something stupid.

The Anakin kidding himself that he's saving the world thing worked pretty well for me too.

I fully accept though - that you have to buy in to the split second decision to stop Mace. Once Mace was dead I felt they'd done enough to cue up the melodrama.

[eldaec]

Oh, the frankenstein scene at the end... now that was dumb.

[stray]

It was promising....Until....Well, we know the bit 

Who would have guessed that it'd be James Earl Jones that'd have worst fuckup of the film?

[Mortriden]

It was promising....Until....Well, we know the bit 

Who would have guessed that it'd be James Earl Jones that'd have worst fuckup of the film?

The same ass who wrote that in the script.

[HaemishM]

I fully accept though - that you have to buy in to the split second decision to stop Mace. Once Mace was dead I felt they'd done enough to cue up the melodrama.

It wasn't even so much the stopping Mace thing that bugged me, it was the WAY he stopped him. Cutting his hand off seems overboard. Then the absolute slaughter of everyone in the Jedi Academy, including kids? It was just way too quick.

[TheWalrus]

  You forget, Lucas has an obsession with people losing limbs/hands. Shit, I think a couple guys in the Indiana Jones series lost limbs before biting it too.

 Somewhere, hes got to have an uncle that once told him a story about how he lost his hand in a farming accident, how bad it hurt, and that it's a pain you never forget. Or something. So Lucas made Star Wars to get him over the pain. ><

[Llava]

So what?  Vader chops off hands.

It's his "thing."  Mastering the Force is really all about marketing.  You gotta have a gimmick.

[Abagadro]

It's all about lazy writing...er...I mean symmetry. Ya symmetry.

[eldaec]

Lucas has an obsession with repeating ideas in different contexts with different characters. There are dozens of other examples, espeicially in ep3. Most of them, imo at least, help the films more than they hurt.

It's a good idea that suffers from clumsy scripting. Which pretty much sums up all 6 films.


And Vader actually only performs 3 out of 8 hand choppings I can think of in the films. In case you care.

[Ookii]

Rather than make a new thread:


The Koreans sure do love their Star Wars!
http://kr.n2o.yahoo.com/NBBS/1211199988

[schild]

Wow. How did you even manage to press the "post" button?