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Author Topic: The Witcher  (Read 5364 times)
Velorath
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Reply #70 on: July 22, 2019, 09:30:42 AM

The show runner did Daredevil and the Umbrella Academy but she also did the Defenders which I've heard wasn't very good. (I never got around to watching it.)

Specifically, she was a producer on Season 2 of Daredevil and wrote 3 of the episodes that season (more of the Elektra focused episodes rather than the Punisher stuff, so basically the low point of the series for me).
HaemishM
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Reply #71 on: July 22, 2019, 09:57:09 AM

The Defenders was fine. The only issue I had with it was Iron Fist but that was because his show wasn't that good.

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Reply #72 on: July 22, 2019, 10:21:11 AM

I'm familiar with game Witcher but I always thought that Ciri was partially raised by Gerlat for an unknown reason.

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Reply #73 on: July 22, 2019, 11:22:57 AM

Looks like it has potentially, I am suddenly optimistic. 

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Reply #74 on: July 23, 2019, 08:25:06 AM

This looks ok. I have the flix anyway, so we know we're gonna watch it.

I felt the Defenders was pretty weak, but I strongly dislike Jessica Jones. Also, the defenders are Dr Strange, Valkyrie, Gargoyle, Son of Satan and folks like that.  why so serious? I felt the flix team was like a Team-Up issue with Heroes for Hire and Daredevil, with some c-rate 90s angster thrown in for the kids.

Actually the amount of angsty bullshit is so high in all the flix Marvel stuff, it's obnoxious. I hope the trend of angsty grimdark can go away at some point, when the millennials get out of their teens in 30 or 40 years.

That said, it works for the Witcher, so no problems there  DRILLING AND WOMANLINESS

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Reply #75 on: July 23, 2019, 08:50:21 AM

I canít get over the one sword vs two.  Two is the iconic look of the character so I donít know why they changed it.
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Reply #76 on: July 23, 2019, 09:15:49 AM

How hard is it to say "one sword for monsters, one sword for idiots". Granted there is a theory that book Geralt keeps the silver sword of roach (his horse).

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Reply #77 on: July 23, 2019, 10:33:22 AM

I canít get over the one sword vs two.  Two is the iconic look of the character so I donít know why they changed it.
Not to mention it can play a great dramatic agent.

Geralt approaches the old crone...and draws the silver...

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Reply #78 on: July 23, 2019, 05:43:53 PM

I'm in but if they wanted me to feel a strong connection to it they would have fixed the medallion and given him two fucking swords idk. I'm not hyped but I want it to be good & I think it can be executed well so they picked a good IP in that regard.

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Khaldun
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Reply #79 on: July 23, 2019, 07:07:36 PM

Wait, what are you all seeing that says he doesn't have two swords?
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Reply #80 on: July 23, 2019, 07:19:18 PM

Wait, what are you all seeing that says he doesn't have two swords?
There is nothing that says/shows he won't have two swords. People are just complaining that the pictures so far only show one sword. The showrunner has even essentially tweeted out twice that the second sword is in the show.

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Reply #81 on: July 23, 2019, 09:05:10 PM

I based this on the pictures with only one sword.  So if they are going to fix it:  excellent!
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Reply #82 on: July 23, 2019, 11:11:48 PM

Yeah, he has the second sword. Unlike in the games, however, in the books he generally keeps the silver sword on Roach, as he only uses it when absolutely necessary.

A lot of gripes thrown at the show based on what we've seen of it are often actually just due to them pulling more from the books than the games (which makes sense given the author's involvement in the show and his absolutely raging hatred of the games [the guy is a fucking idiot on this stance -- he actually claims the games are only popular because of the popularity of his books, when anyone with a brain knows that outside of the niche market that is that region... everyone knows of books solely due to the games] and games as a whole).

There are some things being changed, however, mainly to make things more inclusive, that technically go against the books and the lore of the world, but so long as the product is fine only idiots will whine about that sort of stuff.

The scrotum armour is hilariously bad, though.
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Reply #83 on: July 24, 2019, 02:51:26 AM

What Ceryse said, all of it  Oh ho ho ho. Reallllly? . In the books, Silver Sword is usually on Roach, end of the story, really. Showrunner and Cavill definitely love the games, but they also met (especially the former) Sapkowski quite often during the shooting. You get the sense that talking openly about the videogames is a bit of a minefield for them.


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Cyrrex
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Reply #84 on: July 24, 2019, 02:57:43 AM

They don't need to adapt the games, but it is pants-on-head stupid if they do not understand where they main appeal comes from and keep it in account.  The games.

Using the current example, the reason to have him wear the second sword is A) because it obviously looks cooler, and B) because that's how most of their likely fan base would expect to see it.

"...maybe if you cleaned the piss out of the sunny d bottles under your desks and returned em, you could upgrade you vid cards, fucken lusers.." - Grunk
Lucas
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Reply #85 on: July 24, 2019, 03:04:19 AM

They don't need to adapt the games, but it is pants-on-head stupid if they do not understand where they main appeal comes from and keep it in account.  The games.

Using the current example, the reason to have him wear the second sword is A) because it obviously looks cooler, and B) because that's how most of their likely fan base would expect to see it.

Yeah, yeah, I get it, but I think that, already in the discussion forums of the games, just for the sake of it, there were recurrent topics about how "realistic" (as realistic a "fantasy" might get) would it be for a person to actually carry two swords like Geralt does in terms of balace and practicality while fighting, for example. In other words, sure, CDP depicted the character like that because it is surely spectacular, but perhaps you don't really want two swords on your back (even Geralt with his "superhuman" senses and traits) if you adopt the fighting style Geralt does.

That's another way too look at it.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2019, 03:06:19 AM by Lucas »

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Cyrrex
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Reply #86 on: July 24, 2019, 03:13:46 AM

Yeah, I thought of the same thing, being an expert pretend swordsman myself.  But what was a valid discussion when going from books to games does not automatically make a good discussion when going from games to tv show.  Especially as the latter two are visual, so the apples to apples comparisons are more obvious.  I mean, first thing we look for in the casting of Geralt is "hmm, does Cavill look enough like what video game Geralt looks like?  Hmmm."  We wring our hands, and then we see the trailer and say "yep, job well done chaps, that's one thing checked off the list".  And similarly, whinging about how the female leads may or may not match up to our expectations as compared to their video game counterparts.  

That said, they don't have to get it all just right, I am not advocating that at all.  I merely suggest that dogmatic adherence to the books would be retarded.  I bet most people who played Witcher have absolutely no idea that there are books.  I didn't, and I am nerdier by far than the average potential viewer of this thing.  This isn't like GoT.


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Reply #87 on: July 24, 2019, 07:40:01 AM

Well, the author can feel however he wants and in the end fighting against the popularity of your IP is when principles meet stubborn ignorance. At least GRRM's books were popular before GoT went to tv. I'd never heard of the Witcher before the games and I've worked in a library for 20 years. I couldn't tell you the author's name, still. (fake edit: I can because I was giving my fiancee (our fic lib) a heads up and we already have the series, so I guess now I'm going to finally read it lol)

Let me put it another way: I'm far more interested in Cyberpunk 2077 than this tv show.

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Reply #88 on: July 24, 2019, 11:05:54 AM

Well for all intent and purposes the games are set after the books. The games are quality fanfiction that draw in a big audience despite being a obscure PC game for years (I've only played the witcher 3 and bought the last two games on a steam sale). They can easily adapt the current series of books and adapt the game later. Which works out because Geralt was pushing 40-60 in the games and quite noticeable more grey wolf than white wolf.

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Reply #89 on: July 24, 2019, 11:07:35 AM

If I remember the story correctly, when the author licensed the game to CDPR, he took more cash upfront instead of royalties, despite the company trying to convince him that the royalties were the better option.  Years later, that was obviously a dumb move, so I think the author's hatred of the games is a combination of bitterness and old man yelling at clouds.  I'm a big fantasy nerd, and I had barely heard of the books before the first game.  Outside of Poland, they were pretty niche, and now they're known worldwide.  

Either way, I look forward to the show, and anticipate being cranky when Netflix cancels it too soon once the show contracts make it more expensive to do the later seasons.  
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Reply #90 on: July 24, 2019, 11:53:10 AM

If I remember the story correctly, when the author licensed the game to CDPR, he took more cash upfront instead of royalties, despite the company trying to convince him that the royalties were the better option.  Years later, that was obviously a dumb move, so I think the author's hatred of the games is a combination of bitterness and old man yelling at clouds.  I'm a big fantasy nerd, and I had barely heard of the books before the first game.  Outside of Poland, they were pretty niche, and now they're known worldwide.  

Either way, I look forward to the show, and anticipate being cranky when Netflix cancels it too soon once the show contracts make it more expensive to do the later seasons.  

Always take royalties if you're an IP holder. My lord, the business sense on creatives drives me crazy sometimes.

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Ceryse
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Reply #91 on: July 24, 2019, 12:15:22 PM

If I remember the story correctly, when the author licensed the game to CDPR, he took more cash upfront instead of royalties, despite the company trying to convince him that the royalties were the better option.  Years later, that was obviously a dumb move, so I think the author's hatred of the games is a combination of bitterness and old man yelling at clouds.  I'm a big fantasy nerd, and I had barely heard of the books before the first game.  Outside of Poland, they were pretty niche, and now they're known worldwide.  

Either way, I look forward to the show, and anticipate being cranky when Netflix cancels it too soon once the show contracts make it more expensive to do the later seasons.  

Yeah, it is a fairly well known story now; when CDPR went to him he demanded cash up-front instead of a percentage of profits because he never thought the games would do well because, to him, games cannot be a creative medium of note, period. The games (even the first one did well) did pretty well and the third game just raked it in. The author started to get really pissed off whenever people asked him if the books were based on the games (an understandable annoyance, to be fair), or when he saw in other regions Geralt from the games was put on the covers of his books. He ended up suing CDPR for money due to the success of the games (and CDPR settled with him giving him a bunch of money -- and based on Polish law he likely would have won anyway). He has on numerous occasions ranted and raved about his hatred for the games in particular and gaming in general (even before he made his original deal with CDPR he was apparently very anti-video game).

Apparently even the author of the Metro series of books has called him out for being a fuckmuppet who can't recognize reality, since he continues to claim the popularity of the books is the only reason the games sold well. And, sure, good source material helps.. but anyone who thinks the books even remotely approach the games in terms of popularity is absolutely fucking insane. The games are the only reason the author's name escaped the region for all but the smallest of numbers.
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Reply #92 on: July 24, 2019, 12:42:06 PM

Sapkowski comes off like a general all-purpose asshole in everything I've read about him.

The games really are not "quality fanfiction"--I think in certain ways #3 is both a great distillation of the books and a better continuation of them. The books are good; the games are extremely continuous with them and respectful of the IP in a way that's unusual in gaming. That he doesn't get this is not to his credit.
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Reply #93 on: July 24, 2019, 12:49:45 PM

Outside of Poland, they were pretty niche, and now they're known worldwide.  

Nope. They were known in Europe.
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Reply #94 on: July 24, 2019, 12:50:40 PM

True that.

Also, some of you are fucking mental.

Also, the author is a complete cunt.  This is known.

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Reply #95 on: July 24, 2019, 01:05:52 PM

Outside of Poland, they were pretty niche, and now they're known worldwide.  

Nope. They were known in Europe.

Ah, apologies.  When I was trying to find English translations back when the first game came out, I was told otherwise. 
Lucas
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Reply #96 on: July 24, 2019, 01:21:04 PM

Outside of Poland, they were pretty niche, and now they're known worldwide.  

Nope. They were known in Europe.

Hmm, so and so, depends on which country: honestly, during the nineties or the early '00, I often went to my local libraries: lots of Katharine Kerr, Morgan Llywelyn, Stephen Lawhead, Zimmer Bradley, Jordan, Gemmell and other "usual suspects"...But Sapkowski? Unfortunately, here in Italy they started translating his books after the second game.

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Reply #97 on: July 24, 2019, 01:24:25 PM

Outside of Poland, they were pretty niche, and now they're known worldwide.  

Nope. They were known in Europe.

Hmm, so and so, depends on which country: honestly, during the nineties or the early '00, I often went to my local libraries: lots of Katharine Kerr, Morgan Llywelyn, Stephen Lawhead, Zimmer Bradley, Jordan, Gemmell and other "usual suspects"...But Sapkowski? Unfortunately, here in Italy they started translating his books after the second game.

I'm not saying that it was spread across but middle and east. If I remember Germany also. English translation was late. Poland was also just getting started after soviet...
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Reply #98 on: July 24, 2019, 01:35:48 PM

Always take royalties if you're an IP holder. My lord, the business sense on creatives drives me crazy sometimes.

Yeah, unless you are living in a hovel and about to starve, always take less money up front if they offer you a piece of the backend. I'd rather be getting 100 checks for $100 over the next 60 months than get $3000 up front and watch my creation pay the mortgage on someone else's summer home.

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Reply #99 on: July 24, 2019, 03:52:58 PM

Sapkowski comes off like a general all-purpose asshole in everything I've read about him.

The games really are not "quality fanfiction"--I think in certain ways #3 is both a great distillation of the books and a better continuation of them. The books are good; the games are extremely continuous with them and respectful of the IP in a way that's unusual in gaming. That he doesn't get this is not to his credit.


I only say quality fan fiction as respect to the author. The Witcher 3 is basically my version of the Geralt and his world and I probably never read the books if it wasn't for the netflix series.

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Lucas
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Further proof that Italians have suspect taste in games.


Reply #100 on: July 24, 2019, 04:46:10 PM

If you never read the books, and want to quickly skip to the main saga (book 3 to 7), first read the following short stories from Book 1 and 2:

Book 1:

- "The Witcher" (basically the full version of Witcher 1's original intro)
- "A Question of Price" (very VERY important in the grand scheme of things)
- "The Last Wish" (Geralt meets Yennefer for the first time, under peculiar circumstances)

Book 2:
- "The Sword of Destiny" (you could consider it a sequel to "A question of price". And...Hello Ciri!)
- "Something More" (again a sequel of the "sword of destiny").

That way, you strip down book 1 from 7 to 3 stories, Book 2 from 6 to 2 ; yes,  two or three more stories also feature Geralt and Yennefer (not to mention Jaskier/Dandelion), but they're not as fundamental (but of course you get a bit more in-depth about their relationship).

VERY honorable mentions: like I wrote a few messages ago, "A Grain of Truth" from Book 1; then, "A Little Sacrifice" from Book 2 which is maybe the best fantasy short story I've ever read (beside the marvelous ending, the whole story has almost a "lovecraftian" vibe to it).
------------------------
Final mention: first episode of the TV series should begin with the short story from Book 1 called "The Lesser Evil" (Renfri kicks ass).

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Reply #101 on: July 24, 2019, 04:56:59 PM

Only reason I knew about the Books was that my copy of the first Witcher game was a "Special edition" that came with a copy of "The Witcher" short story. I have to say it was a very good read.

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Reply #102 on: July 24, 2019, 05:32:00 PM

Sapkowski comes off like a general all-purpose asshole in everything I've read about him.

The games really are not "quality fanfiction"--I think in certain ways #3 is both a great distillation of the books and a better continuation of them. The books are good; the games are extremely continuous with them and respectful of the IP in a way that's unusual in gaming. That he doesn't get this is not to his credit.


I only say quality fan fiction as respect to the author. The Witcher 3 is basically my version of the Geralt and his world and I probably never read the books if it wasn't for the netflix series.

Like almost everyone on the planet I played the games before I read the books. However, saying the games is quality fanfiction really is fitting in a way since:


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Reply #103 on: July 24, 2019, 06:15:36 PM

I've always thought
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Reply #104 on: July 24, 2019, 09:16:26 PM


"We live in a country, where John Lennon takes six bullets in the chest, Yoko Ono was standing right next to him and not one fucking bullet! Explain that to me! Explain that to me, God! Explain it to me, God!" - Denis Leary summing up my feelings about the nature of the universe.
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