NFL 2015

[Rasix]

Collinsworth was also a pretty decent receiver, so he might know what he's talking about.  He's not yet afflicted with a bad case of Phil Simms-itis, where all previous knowledge is replaced with stupid quips and I-told-you-so-s.

[01101010]

Collinsworth was also a pretty decent receiver, so he might know what he's talking about.  He's not yet afflicted with a bad case of Phil Simms-itis, where all previous knowledge is replaced with stupid quips and I-told-you-so-s.

If it ever comes to that, I will cry.

[sickrubik]

Update on gronk. Basically Day to Day.

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/671419589327241216

#Patriots TE Rob Gronkowski has a minor knee strain, source said. At most, he'll miss a week. This is after the MRI.

[Surlyboi]

[Mithas]

I was going to go to bed, but I thought I'd just watch the last two minutes because surely the Browns wouldn't tie it right?  Now I have to watch this bad/good game until the end.  

edit: lolbrowns 

[Rasix]

[Shannow]

holy fuck that was bad. Do we call up any friends today who are Cleveland Browns fans to make sure they are ok? Or are they just numb to this shit by now?

[Azuredream]

It doesn't really hurt, the season was already over. Plus the ending was so ridiculous the only reaction you can really have is a wry smile in the vein of that Jags fan. The only thing at stake was the satisfaction of sweeping the Ravens. At this point we're jockeying for draft position. If only I had confidence we could actually draft well.

[01101010]

I, for one, am slightly shocked we were actually in the game in the first place. Only slightly because lolSchaub was Qbing the Ravens, but still. This really is the life of a Browns fan... we have come to expect this type of shit. I think Red Right 88 started it, the Drive confirmed it, and the Fumble became the proof the Browns are cursed. This is not even a blip on the woe radar.

McCown is out for the season with a shoulder/collarbone injury to the surprise of no one. Austin Davis will start the rest of the year because Pettine for some reason puts morals before talent, or the exploration of talent. Johnny is an unknown and will stay that way until he is cut or traded to the Cowboys. Pettine and his crew have to be taken out back and shot at the end of the season. This coaching staff is horrid in every aspect of the game. Flip is the only bright spot and even that is dim.

I would cheer the fact we are in the hunt for a top draft pick, but who cares really? the Browns have the worst draft record since they came back. Seriously... their 1st round drafting has been bottom barrel for more than 10 years. How that is statistically possible is beyond me. So no, Browns fans should not care if they get a high pick - they'll just fuck it up again.

[HaemishM]

In some ways, they should probably wish for a lower pick since it seems the higher the expectation, the worse of a fuck up it's going to be. Trent Richardson, Brandon Weedon, Johnny Football? I don't understand the demotion of Manziel - he seemed at times at least as competent as McCown with more updside (also more downside but it's the Browns - shittiness alone should allow for more risky play). One of my bosses was hoping Davis would get the starts because they are both alumni of Southern Miss. Unless Pettine thinks Davis will be next year's starter (or that Pettine will be coach when that happens), I'm not sure what putting Manziel on timeout does. There's just nothing to cheer for with the Browns and an organization that seems to wallow in its own stupidity and actively seek to fuck with the fans' emotions.

[01101010]

In some ways, they should probably wish for a lower pick since it seems the higher the expectation, the worse of a fuck up it's going to be. Trent Richardson, Brandon Weedon, Johnny Football? I don't understand the demotion of Manziel - he seemed at times at least as competent as McCown with more updside (also more downside but it's the Browns - shittiness alone should allow for more risky play). One of my bosses was hoping Davis would get the starts because they are both alumni of Southern Miss. Unless Pettine thinks Davis will be next year's starter (or that Pettine will be coach when that happens), I'm not sure what putting Manziel on timeout does. There's just nothing to cheer for with the Browns and an organization that seems to wallow in its own stupidity and actively seek to fuck with the fans' emotions.

Not to mention there really is no homerun draft pick this year, certainly no QB that jumps out as a ringer. So in theory, the Browns have no business reaching for a QB in the first round at this point. In the end, no one will give a shit because the Browns will browns up the place just like every year.

[Azuredream]

Weeden/Manziel were both late first rounders, not early, although Richardson was #3. We actually have made a couple good first round picks in the last decade, Haden, Thomas, and Mack come to mind. I think our odds of not fucking up our pick ever so slightly increase the higher our pick is.

I still can't believe we drafted Weeden in that 2012 draft. Between him and trading up for Richardson that draft was a complete disaster that ensured we would keep our cellar-dwelling status for another 5 years.

[01101010]

Since 1999, the Browns draft picks. Starred ones turned out to be ok (Couch gets a star and a pass for being a QB on an expansion PoS team)

• Tim Couch *
• Courtney Brown
• Gerard Warren
• William Green
• Jeff Faine
• Kellen Winslow II
• Braylon Edwards
• Kamerion Wimbley
• Joe Thomas*
• Brady Quinn
• Alex Mack*
• Joe Haden*
• Phil Taylor
• Trent Richardson
• Brandon Weeden
• Barkevious Mingo
• Justin Gilbert
• Johnny Manziel
• Danny Shelton
• Cameron Erving

And I reluctantly give Haden a star because he was lights out at one time, but has faded precipitously and will probably be done with football in the next year. Otherwise, 80% of those first rounders went belly up. Some might have been good, but being on the Browns brings down anyone's rating. The history of picking badly is there, I'd say moreso than other teams. Call that a factor of the GM/HC turnover or what have you, but they should be at least close to 50% and they are not.

At least they got something back for Richardson so I can't fault them too badly for that; however they still managed to turn that good fortune into a shit sandwich.

[Shannow]

Barkevious Mingo.....you just snuck a name in from the Key and Peele skit didn't you?

[Paelos]

Cleveland also got one of the most favorable draft trades in a long time with the Julio Jones deal, and subsequently fucked that up.

[HaemishM]

I think the solution is clear. Stop drafting first rounders, trade away all your first rounders for proven 2nd and 3rd and 4th year guys since your draft scouts obviously can't pick a giraffe out of a gazelle lineup.

[01101010]

I think the solution is clear. Stop drafting first rounders, trade away all your first rounders for proven 2nd and 3rd and 4th year guys since your draft scouts obviously can't pick a giraffe out of a gazelle lineup.

Logic does not live here. You'd think with this much evidence, they would get a clue and invest in some quality scouts and trust those scouts rather than whoever they have picking names out of a hat in the back room. FFS, at least Millen drafted WRs because he had some clue this is a passing league regardless of where you play - exhibit A: Pittsburgh of all places.

[Shannow]

That's funny since there's a school of thought that drafting WR in the 1st round is a waste of that pick's value. Simply from the point of how many plays a WR is involved in it's not worth it. (Look up how many times the Pats have drafted a WR in the first round) TE's can be worth it because of their blocking ability, RB's are not because as you mentioned it's a passing league. You need a QB first and an OL that can keep him upright because they play and are integral to every single down.

[Paelos]

That's funny since there's a school of thought that drafting WR in the 1st round is a waste of that pick's value. Simply from the point of how many plays a WR is involved in it's not worth it. (Look up how many times the Pats have drafted a WR in the first round) TE's can be worth it because of their blocking ability, RB's are not because as you mentioned it's a passing league. You need a QB first and an OL that can keep him upright because they play and are integral to every single down.

Look at what happened to the Falcons after they did it. Yes, they have Julio Jones, one of THE best receivers in the league and they can barely scape the playoff hunt after getting a HC fired due to terrible seasons. That move in 2011 killed the long term future of the team because they not only took a WR, they traded away 2 years of picks for him.

[01101010]

That's funny since there's a school of thought that drafting WR in the 1st round is a waste of that pick's value. Simply from the point of how many plays a WR is involved in it's not worth it. (Look up how many times the Pats have drafted a WR in the first round) TE's can be worth it because of their blocking ability, RB's are not because as you mentioned it's a passing league. You need a QB first and an OL that can keep him upright because they play and are integral to every single down.

That's valid, but when your GM shirks basically EVERY WR in the draft and collects every 6' and under WR free agent and signs a washed up receiver from KC who has a total of (what? 3? 5?) receptions this entire season... My humble conclusion is to stop ignoring that position in the draft (you obviously can't pick any of the other positions correctly.... give WR a try). Yes, I understand what the monkey is saying, but guys like Green, Jones, Johnson, Brown, Cooper? You go out on a limb and get them...maybe not sell the farm for them, but you have to pick them if they are there. 

Browns OL looks good on paper, Mack, Thomas, Bitonio, Schwartz (serviceable, and better this year) with Erving learning a new position. That line should not be as bad as it is, and that is on the coaching staff. I like Manziel, but I think if the line performs this year, McCown could have won more games (by the grace of god rather than a good receiving core) and Johnny is a steady #2 backup - but the OL got McCown killed and now it looks like Davis will be the next great hope. Don't matter who the QB is back there... they'll be on the IR in a few weeks at this rate - but Johnny can at least run away. He'll get hurt for other reasons (see: RGIII).

Browns defense is abysmal and really shouldn't be with the amount of coin thrown on that side of the field. Add in the fact our illustrious head coach is a defensive-minded coach with an emphasis on stopping the run, and it just screams the coaching is the problem. O'Neil... should never have been hired. I can't for the life of me figure out why the Browns paid so much attention to their shitty ability to stop the run in the off season, went out and spent money to solve the problem, then completely dropped the ball on coaching it. They have actually regressed in something they were already dead last in...

And the other part of Pettine's plan was a strong run game... no words needed there other than he should revise that to say, any run game at all.

Bottom line, the coaching staff on the Browns is horrible at every position. I used to think the teams in Cleveland are just a farm team for the rest of the league... seems they are also where coaches go to try out and ultimately fail.

I am done till 2016 training camp - if Pettine is still there, I'll gladly ignore the Browns in 2016. While I can't quite root for anyone else in the AFC north due to my Cleveland dysfunction, I can root for the Lions. At least they can play spoiler and have some what of a chance to actually win a few.

[Paelos]

Technically, you should always take the best player available in the first round regardless of need. Too many teams focus on needs in the first round which is stupid. If that player isn't there, you trade out or you draft something else for need in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

Where most teams (like the Browns) go wrong is they start trading UP in the first round to get those needs. And usually it's QB related, which is the biggest lottery ticket play in the NFL right now. Your odds of hitting a good one that can win in the next two years and get to the playoffs? Very shitty. And all the while you should have been building an offensive line, a defensive line, a secondary, some linebacker talent, then some receivers, and maybe a runningback or two. But runningbacks in the NFL now are like sponges. You pick up most at the store when one gets all old and gross and smells funny.

[Hoax]

If you ask me you pick BPA with some modifiers based on ceiling/floor of the position.

Think of it as ties go to X position except tie is more like "if anyone in the entire draft war room thinks its close" if we're several tiers apart. So say you 9 out of 10 guys think a RB is best player on the board if one coach thinks a lineman is better. Take the fucking lineman.

QB > OL / DL > LB / DB / TE  > WR / RB

[Paelos]

If you ask me you pick BPA with some modifiers based on ceiling/floor of the position.

Think of it as ties go to X position except tie is more like "if anyone in the entire draft war room thinks its close" if we're several tiers apart. So say you 9 out of 10 guys think a RB is best player on the board if one coach thinks a lineman is better. Take the fucking lineman.

QB > OL / DL > LB / DB / TE  > WR / RB

Agreed, the best player is often going to be based on a weighted scale. The best RB in the draft isn't going to be worth the 3rd best OL for example. You basically have to weight the positions first and then assess value.

[K9]

To be fair, Joe Thomas may be one of the best first round picks by any team in the past few decades; has the guy even missed a snap since he started?

[Megrim]

That's funny since there's a school of thought that drafting WR in the 1st round is a waste of that pick's value. Simply from the point of how many plays a WR is involved in it's not worth it. (Look up how many times the Pats have drafted a WR in the first round) TE's can be worth it because of their blocking ability, RB's are not because as you mentioned it's a passing league. You need a QB first and an OL that can keep him upright because they play and are integral to every single down.

Actually they are only on half the time =p

Imo, you need a solid O-line first and foremost. An non-exceptional but consistent QB is often sufficient, provided he has time and confidence in not getting killed.

[01101010]

To be fair, Joe Thomas may be one of the best first round picks by any team in the past few decades; has the guy even missed a snap since he started?

No, he hasn't. But he has not been all that great this year.

[sickrubik]

http://www.theonion.com/article/greg-hardy-assures-tony-romo-hes-seen-ex-girlfrien-51937

[WayAbvPar]

http://www.theonion.com/article/greg-hardy-assures-tony-romo-hes-seen-ex-girlfrien-51937

 

[Paelos]

The Onion has now passed into "yeah that's probably real" territory over the last few years.

[Rasix]

Holy shit.

[Malakili]

Ha. Lions.

[Shannow]

Maybe that'll cheer the Browns fans up.

[Bungee]

While I can't quite root for anyone else in the AFC north due to my Cleveland dysfunction, I can root for the Lions. At least they can play spoiler and have some what of a chance to actually win a few.

They sure share a love for snatching defeats from the jaws of certain victories though.

[01101010]

Meh... Hail Mary's happen and are IMHO fun to watch - even on the losing side. A field goal to win the game that gets blocked and returned to lose the game is an entirely different level of hell.

Besides, rooting for the Lions this season will feel like rooting for a Browns' team with real players, not scabs - they might still lose, but at least they are playing football.

[HaemishM]

ZOMG.

What the fuck did I just watch? The Pack gets shut out for almost 3 quarters, then comes back to win it on a pretty soft facemask penalty and a hail mary motherfucker that actually gets caught and there's no penalty? I'm not sure I'm allowed to call that a good win because holy shit.

Eddie Lacey has got to the one that Aaron Rodgers has been talking about in his statements earlier in the week where he said some of the young guys need to make sure they are doing the extra prep work instead of playing the videogames. That's the only reason I can think of for basically exiling him to the bench for most of that game. Well, he did blow chunks when he actually did get the on the field, so that may be the problem too. Packers defense continues to play 5 different games of football in 4 quarters, looking one world beaters one drive and like they are beating off the next. They still appear physically incapable of covering the screen more than once per game. The offense also doesn't seem able to get anyone open, especially down the sidelines. And our O line is now down to chewing gum and duct tape.

But a win's a win. And even better, that last TD was to Richard Rodgers, my TE in the JV league and he and Rodgers combined for over 50 points so that's a good start to a game that I didn't need to win. I'm sure they'll shit the bed next week in the playoffs.