MLB 2013

[Yegolev]

I'm a behind-the-dugout guy.  Don't go very often, but that will change.

[Bann]

This is more appropriate for the MLB 2014 thread, but: Prince Fielder traded to Texas Rangers for Ian Kinsler.

I'm curious what the rest of MLB thinks of the move. As a tiger fan, I love the deal. Prince was great in the regular season, but went ice cold in the playoffs the last 2 years. Additionally, First base being open means Cabrera back at his natural position and the ability for the manager to adjust his lineup more. Prince Fielder never missed a game as a tiger, which was awesome.... but that meant Cabrera or Martinez or whoever never could take the occasional turn at first. Perhaps most importantly, his contract is off the books. That means you going from being cash strapped to being able to find a solution for left field and the bull pen via free agency, and now can make a serious play at locking up Scherzer (and Cabrera down the road) if you want too. Kinsler solves the 2nd base void left by Infante and allows Jackson to move down into the middle/bottom of the order where he probably fits better.

[Ingmar]

I think both teams do well on this one.

[Paelos]

It's AL so I won't really care unless either team makes the world series, but it seems like a fair trade.

[Ingmar]

Also note, his contract isn't really off the books apparently - the reports I read said that Detroit is paying the difference in contracts to Texas, so they're not saving any money. So, it becomes pretty much a swap of Fielder for Kinsler plus not having to suffer through Cabrera's defense at 3rd.

[Paelos]

Fielder is probably one of the top 5 worst contracts in baseball currently, so it would be really stupid if they had picked up the whole thing.

[Ingmar]

The thing I read was apparently partly wrong - they're sending SOME cash to Texas, but not the full difference in contract, so they do get a bunch more money to play with (probably to throw at Scherzer.)

[WayAbvPar]

Just enough to feed Fielder for a few weeks until they can find a ranch to board him.

[Paelos]

Just enough to feed Fielder for a few weeks until they can find a ranch to board him.

I wonder what he's worth per pound a year.

[Ingmar]

I'm going to laugh if McCann and A-Rod end up both playing on the team at the same time. Watch out for the fun police, A-Rod!

[Paelos]

I'm going to laugh if McCann and A-Rod end up both playing on the team at the same time. Watch out for the fun police, A-Rod!

How is McCann sticking up for his pitcher a bad thing exactly?

[Sjofn]

It'll be fine, Ingmar, I don't recall McCann screaming in the face of his teammates when they admire their home runs for too long.

[Paelos]

Woah woah woah. Let's be fair, Brian McCann only screamed at Carlos Gonzalez because he was actively yelling at Paul Maholm as he rounded the bases. It was wildly out of line.

[Sjofn]

That isn't the only time he's done that, although I admit that is probably the funniest time because of the whole NO I'M NOT GONNA LET YOU CROSS HOME PLATE thing. I don't even really care that he's an old man yelling at clouds from time to time (in fact, I encourage it, because then I get to hear about it later and be amused by it). But like it or not, the Braves were delicate about their fee-fees enough this season that I heard about it, and I just don't pay that much attention to non-Giants whatnot.

If it makes you feel better, I also heard about how the Diamondbacks and Cardinals are sensitive too. So it's not like they're the only fun police around!

[Paelos]

I knew the Mariners were bad, I had no idea they were this stupid.

[HaemishM]

I knew the Mariners were bad, I had no idea they were this stupid.

Past history should tell you that they are indeed, that fucking stupid.

10-years, $240 million for Robinson Cano? 27 homers in the band box that is New Yankee Stadium and you think he'll hit more homers in that cavernous fucking homer tomb? Did Carlos Beltran teach them nothing?

[JWIV]

I knew the Mariners were bad, I had no idea they were this stupid.

Past history should tell you that they are indeed, that fucking stupid.

10-years, $240 million for Robinson Cano? 27 homers in the band box that is New Yankee Stadium and you think he'll hit more homers in that cavernous fucking homer tomb? Did Carlos Beltran teach them nothing?

I need other teams to be stupid for the Orioles to even have a damn chance this season. Glad to see both Cano and Granderson out of the AL East while the Orioles furiously dump salary because I guess Angelos wants a new building or something.

[Ingmar]

I knew the Mariners were bad, I had no idea they were this stupid.

Past history should tell you that they are indeed, that fucking stupid.

10-years, $240 million for Robinson Cano? 27 homers in the band box that is New Yankee Stadium and you think he'll hit more homers in that cavernous fucking homer tomb? Did Carlos Beltran teach them nothing?

They did move the fences in, but yeah. The 10 years is the part that is really dumb, the per-year is actually a little below what I expected, I figured he'd get 25.

[HaemishM]

The total dollar amount and the per year is, IMO, as stupid as the length of the contract. I'm not sure what teams are thinking with these mega decade deals. When the richest team in baseball is bemoaning their own lengthy megadeal (A-Rod's idiotic contract), and the Tigers traded away their mega deal man, you'd think other teams might look at that and decide to just not pay it. It's not like even the Yankees were willing to go that high or that long for him. And he's never hit more than 33 homers in a season.

And OMG, I just looked at his stats - he's 31 years old. WHAT... THE... FUCK? You have to figure no matter how good his conditioning or pharmaceutical regime, he's got at best 5 good years left. Seven years if he's really lucky. Even if you assume he adjusts his hitting to make up for the big park in Seattle, you can't think he's going to be $24 million's worth of runs every year for the length of that contract? Even rich teams like the Cubs were regretting a seven-year deal they signed for Soriano back at the height of his game.

Stupid must grow on trees in the MLB. I think that's more evidence that teams need a salary cap, to save themselves from their own idiocy.

[Ingmar]

Well, the new TV deal has every team getting 25 million more a year or whatever, so I guess they figured it was easiest to just spend it on one guy. 

[ghost]

Wow.  Roy Halladay is retiring.  I figured he had a few more years left in him.  Guess his shoulder isn't doing so hot.

[Paelos]

Winter meetings coming up. Any guesses on big deals?

Also Bobby Cox is going into the Hall of Fame. Good for him.

[HaemishM]

Well, the new TV deal has every team getting 25 million more a year or whatever, so I guess they figured it was easiest to just spend it on one guy. 

That seems to be the Mariners MO for losing the last decade or so. 

Also, Bobby Cox TOTALLY deserves the Hall of Fame. For someone to not only have turned the Braves of the late '80's into a winner, but then to make them perennial winners for almost two decades - just masterful stuff.

[Ingmar]

Yeah Cox in the HOF is a no brainer, really. Mazzone should get in too, but I don't think they make much space for coaches.

[JWIV]

I knew the Mariners were bad, I had no idea they were this stupid.

Past history should tell you that they are indeed, that fucking stupid.

10-years, $240 million for Robinson Cano? 27 homers in the band box that is New Yankee Stadium and you think he'll hit more homers in that cavernous fucking homer tomb? Did Carlos Beltran teach them nothing?

It's potentially even better.

http://deadspin.com/the-mariners-may-have-bid-against-themselves-for-robins-1479755692

By mid-day Friday, Seattle had heard that some team bid nine years and $225 million for Robinson Cano, so the Mariners upped their bid to $240 million and 10 years before apparently realizing the initial bid had come from themselves, too.

[Paelos]

HOW DO THESE GM'S STAY EMPLOYED?

I mean fuck, I could pull together the people in this very thread and make more competent contract decisions.

[ghost]

I dunno.  I always thought Bobby Cox was a little overrated. 

[HaemishM]

I knew the Mariners were bad, I had no idea they were this stupid.

Past history should tell you that they are indeed, that fucking stupid.

10-years, $240 million for Robinson Cano? 27 homers in the band box that is New Yankee Stadium and you think he'll hit more homers in that cavernous fucking homer tomb? Did Carlos Beltran teach them nothing?

It's potentially even better.

http://deadspin.com/the-mariners-may-have-bid-against-themselves-for-robins-1479755692

By mid-day Friday, Seattle had heard that some team bid nine years and $225 million for Robinson Cano, so the Mariners upped their bid to $240 million and 10 years before apparently realizing the initial bid had come from themselves, too.

Somebody talk Wayabvpar off the ledge. 

[WayAbvPar]

This story sheds light on what most non-retarded Mariners fans already know. What a fucking cesspool of festering, feckless, fuckheaded cunts. The team is doomed until Lincoln is gone. I should have shivved him when I had a chance (he was in line in front of me at the Nintendo cafeteria about a million years ago when we both worked there). He was only a corporate lawyer then, but I should have known!

[HaemishM]

That sounds like a complete clusterfuck, but it certainly can explain what a trainwreck on the field that team has been. It would also explain why they'd put out yet another shitty contract on a free agent home run hitter, though I still hesitate to call Cano a home run hitter.

[WayAbvPar]

He is one of the top 5 best hitters in the game. How he ages will determine how onerous the contract is seen, but as a 5-6 WAR player now, 24M/year is right in the range for average cost per win (about 6M per win last I checked). If he ages gracefully and the price per win goes up (2nd is a guarantee, the first not nearly), the contract could be a decent value all the way through.

Best scenario now is to add a couple of pieces through FA and/or trade,  get rid of Armstrong (he is retiring next month, and I am holding out hope for a murder/suicide with Lincoln), and hope like hell the team has a decent season. I don't think the current ownership will sell until the regional sports channel money rolls in for a bit, but I think they could sell high once it does. Then we just need an owner who A) wants to win rather than run a profit every year B) understands baseball and how to assemble a competent front office, and C) is smart enough to let his people do their fucking jobs instead of meddling all the goddamned time.

I MAY take my family to one game this season if I they show interest. My daughter will be just old enough to grok that the guys out there are the guys on TV, and my son loves to go (since they have a fun playground and lots of goodies to eat...he couldn't care less about sports   ). I am loathe to give these assholes any more of my money though.

[Ingmar]

I don't think I'd have him in my top 5 in a raw hitting sense. He might be in my top 5 overall value-wise but defense, positional scarcity, and durability factor into that.

[Paelos]

It's a terrible deal no matter how you slice it. There are 6 years minimum where he's going to be completely overpaid and they will be begging to get out.

[WayAbvPar]

And how do you know that? If he is still a 3-4 WAR player until he is 40, the deal will be fine. If he falls off a cliff tomorrow, it will be a disaster. There is no way to know. At his current value, the contract is for market value, or maybe a hair under if he is still +6 WAR. He will probably hit fewer homers and more doubles in Seattle, but his stats were not as inflated by Yankee Stadium as you might guess. Saw an article the other day were he was something like 137th best as a home park hitter, and 5th as a road hitter.

Personally I wouldn't have signed him to anything past 6 years, but in order to get him to come to baseball Siberia they had to overextend to 10. I am fine with that. I am just glad it wasn't Prince Fielder or Jason Hamilton who decided to come instead.

I don't think I'd have him in my top 5 in a raw hitting sense. He might be in my top 5 overall value-wise but defense, positional scarcity, and durability factor into that.

Yes, you are probably right. I should have said Top 5 position players, not just hitters.

[Paelos]

And how do you know that?

Because the roid era is over. Hitters past age 35 on average are garbage?