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Author Topic: Fists of Fury (Monk Thread)  (Read 16265 times)
bhodi
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Posts: 6817

No lie.


on: May 16, 2012, 04:47:35 PM

So, monk's my main. Monks are fun. Talk about monk stuff here. I'll tell you what I've learned.

You'll likely want a teleport skill. That's either Dashing Strike or Fists of Thunder runed with Thunderclap.
In general, ignore the 2h staves. In general, more hits = more spirit regen and spirit regen is where you do your damage. Stick with 1.4+ speed weapons. Tooltip needs to be +30% DPS for a 2h to be worth it
1h+shield is 100% completely viable. In fact, it might do more than dual wielding because dual wielding takes the AVERAGE of both weapons plus 15%. A good shield with dex is just as good as a 2nd weapon.
Sockets are REALLY STRONG in fast weapons because red gems are per-hit and thus disproportionately strong
Haste IS included in the tooltip damage calculation
Rings/gear with "+2-3 Damage" type stuff are far stronger than you'd normally think. Each +dam is ~10-15 dex worth of damage.
It's REALLY difficult to 'eyeball' weapons and gear with a bunch of stats so just equip them and compare your overall damage number, it's on the bottom left of your inventory.

When you hit 21, I want you to try this build.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#WfdiXh!Yc!aaa.a

I went from level 21, all the way through the end of normal with it. Dash into a pile 'o guys, sweeping wind, then spam cyclone strike and breath when you need to heal.
When you hit 23, switch to serenity (3s immune) with the +heal (peaceful repose)
At 25, put implosion on cyclone strike. This is the point at which the build becomes completely absurd. You lock down creatures for the heavy hitting aoe of your party.

If you are 25, seriously try switching to this for absurdity. You can finish normal with this.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#WfdigS!Yc!aZZ.a

Feel free to use any mantra you want depending on your gear. I used mostly ret but I ended the game with mantra of healing for my buddies (sup Phred) but I didn't use it until I runed it for more healing.

Anyway it's absurd if you have decent speed weapons (I finished them with crafted level 28) and/or are parting with a heavy hitter like a wizard or another AOE class. Not totally optimal for bosses, but plenty, plenty strong to get you to nightmare. I have no bosses build because I haven't needed it.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2012, 05:02:19 PM by bhodi »
Llyse
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Reply #1 on: May 16, 2012, 05:47:37 PM

Looks bloody awesome, thanks for the tips Bhodi!
Job601
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Reply #2 on: May 16, 2012, 06:01:56 PM

Looks bloody awesome, thanks for the tips Bhodi!

I like to use dashing strike to go in, cyclone to grab them, and lashtail kick runed for extra knockback to send them all out again.  Fast, awesome visual, and works great until you run out of spirit in the middle of 20 guys.  Dashing strike has no cooldown and so it's great for getting away as well as in -- you can target debris and treasure as well as enemies.  The tooltip says you can dash to a location, but I can't get that to work. 

I have the passive for healing from spending spirit, so a seven sided strike or the giant bell one heals you for a ton. (I'm still in normal act3, so no idea about longterm viability.)  The trick so far seems to be that you either have plenty of spirit or good single target damage, but not both.   I'm hoping runes I haven't unlocked yet will help.
lesion
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Posts: 754


Reply #3 on: May 16, 2012, 06:07:25 PM

I don't think I can function without Thunderclap. The combination of teleport and bonus AoE is just too good to give up, not to mention the tooltip says it's the fastest spirit builder.

Since I'm doing HC I use a slightly more defensive/single-target build but it's really close to bhodi's: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#aVdYXh!dc!aaZZaa

Works amazing on bosses as they take extra damage and you can almost chain interrupts with blind/dash. Dunno if that'll work in NM+ though.

steam|a grue \[T]/
Llyse
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Calvin and Hobbes are back to maul the fuck outta you.


Reply #4 on: May 16, 2012, 06:13:22 PM

Looks bloody awesome, thanks for the tips Bhodi!

I like to use dashing strike to go in, cyclone to grab them, and lashtail kick runed for extra knockback to send them all out again.  Fast, awesome visual, and works great until you run out of spirit in the middle of 20 guys.  Dashing strike has no cooldown and so it's great for getting away as well as in -- you can target debris and treasure as well as enemies.  The tooltip says you can dash to a location, but I can't get that to work. 

I have the passive for healing from spending spirit, so a seven sided strike or the giant bell one heals you for a ton. (I'm still in normal act3, so no idea about longterm viability.)  The trick so far seems to be that you either have plenty of spirit or good single target damage, but not both.   I'm hoping runes I haven't unlocked yet will help.

I'm only in Act2 but I can't live without blind, it's like multi stun, so bloody valuable verse, champions, summoners, anything. It even works on Bosses. I'm also using double spirit for my passive but am considering the Damage reduction one... I love this game.  awesome, for real
Quinton
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Reply #5 on: May 17, 2012, 01:40:15 AM

I've been doing 2H because the effective DPS is massively higher (maybe I've just been luckier on 2H drops), but have been frustrated by spirit regen not being fast enough.  Will flip back to 1H and see how that works. Does the type of weapon matter at all?

EDIT:  For 1000G on the AH I picked up a rare 1H fist weapon with much better stats than my daibo.  Tried your lv21 build and it's seriously fun.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2012, 04:03:51 AM by Quinton »
amiable
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Reply #6 on: May 17, 2012, 04:44:53 AM

My one-handed+ shield build that I will be running with the wife (who is playing a wizard).  Pure tank/party support.

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#aWXgjh!ZXU!aYcbba

This is also the build (with slight modifications) I plan to first try hardcore with.  Doesn't do a lot of DPS but it is tough as nails!
« Last Edit: May 17, 2012, 04:50:55 AM by amiable »
Amaron
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Reply #7 on: May 17, 2012, 05:01:10 AM

Anyone else on nightmare yet?  Lavawalkers and those stupid tentacle mobs that cause a poison tentacle to popup are driving me crazy.   In general I feel like there is an overabundance of mobs that can nearly instakill you if you get into melee range.
bhodi
Moderator
Posts: 6817

No lie.


Reply #8 on: May 17, 2012, 09:23:43 AM

A buying guide for monks:

Normal mode gear can be had on the AH for criminally good prices right now. Here are some tips.

In general, search for 10 levels below and 5 levels above you.
Dex is your primary stat! Most stuff should have dex on it!
Vit is your secondary stat! You can't ignore this after level 25 or so!
Pretend nothing else is on your gear except dex/vit/weapon speed/+damage!

Weapon:
A good fast ruby-sockted 1h weapon is the best thing you can do for your character!
Optimal for normal,low nightmare is 1h 1.4+ speed +shield with a socketed weapon. Spend the money on 1 awesome weapon rather than split your funds and gems for two.

A Flawless ruby will double your fist DPS in normal mode. Look at buying one on the AH for ~7k if you have to.

Search on the AH for 1h socketed weapons with dex or dex/vit, sort by DPS. Search for all, don't limit yourself to rares. Attack speed, extra damage, whatever is all factored into the DPS number so the only thing you care about is dex.

Armor:
Cheap helm/pants/shoulders/belt can be found at the crafting levels for each. Tons of people are wasting mats trying to get THEIR armor and are casting the dross onto the AH, frequently for stupidly low buyouts! Their wasted mats are YOUR Gain! Know these levels because the AH is STUFFED with them.

Search for them specifically, because only suckers waste mats trying to craft their perfect piece of gear, and suckers often have criminally low buyouts.

Helm: 17
Pants: 25
Belt: 26
Shoulders: 29

Armor sockets are OK if you have flawless+ to put in them. Otherwise, don't search for them. Don't buy socketed gear and then buy gems to put in them, just buy the gear instead, you're going to get better stats.

Non-Helm Armor: Search for dex and vitality
Helm/Spirit Stone: Spirit regen/Health per Sprit is absurdly good. Get either/both depending on your taste. These are Helm+Weapon only buffs. Sockets are good, too.
Amulet/Rings: You probably want +x-X Damage, attack speed, crit, in that order.
Move speed is generally worthwhile on your shoes.

I don't know shit about how much magic find helps/hurts so i have no info about creating a set of that, sorry.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2012, 09:55:57 AM by bhodi »
lesion
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Posts: 754


Reply #9 on: May 17, 2012, 10:19:42 AM

Started using Blazing Fists and man, it's awesome. I can see it outperforming Thunder with a good amount of crit. Anyone else notice how much +15% run speed feels like? Yowza.

steam|a grue \[T]/
Slayerik
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Reply #10 on: May 17, 2012, 10:47:58 AM

Thanks bhodi, great info.

"I have more qualifications than Jesus and earn more than this whole board put together.  My ego is huge and my modesty non-existant." -Ironwood
Miasma
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Stopgap Measure


Reply #11 on: May 18, 2012, 07:00:50 AM

Here's a newb question.  Do I lose anything by equiping weapons that don't seem very monkish like swords?  I was surprised at the large range of weapons I can equip, I thought it would have only been fist spike type weapons and am wondering if I'm doing something wrong by using a sword.
Ruvaldt
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Goat Variations


Reply #12 on: May 18, 2012, 07:08:21 AM

I certainly don't seem to miss out on anything with my dual-wielding of axes.  They both have high dex mods though and stat-wise really look to be built for monks.  The speed of the weapon seems to be the most important part when judging that sort of thing.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2012, 07:12:20 AM by Ruvaldt »

"For a long time now I have tried simply to write the best I can. Sometimes I have good luck and write better than I can." - Ernest Hemingway
SurfD
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Reply #13 on: May 18, 2012, 07:13:23 AM

Here's a newb question.  Do I lose anything by equiping weapons that don't seem very monkish like swords?  I was surprised at the large range of weapons I can equip, I thought it would have only been fist spike type weapons and am wondering if I'm doing something wrong by using a sword.
The only thing i think you miss out on by not equipping Class specific Weapons / Armor is the Class specific bonuses that the RNG item generator can stick on them.  For monks, that is things like +Spirit regen / Spirit-> Life modifiers and things like that.

I have a nice 1 hand fist with dex / + damage / +spirit regen and a spirt -> Life mod, which contributes a lot to my self healing.  I still die occasionally, usually to things like a sudden unexpected swarm of those damn kamikazi imps.

Darwinism is the Gateway Science.
Job601
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Reply #14 on: May 18, 2012, 08:53:05 AM

Here's a newb question.  Do I lose anything by equiping weapons that don't seem very monkish like swords?  I was surprised at the large range of weapons I can equip, I thought it would have only been fist spike type weapons and am wondering if I'm doing something wrong by using a sword.

Apparently early in the development cycle the monk could only use fist spikes and staves, which is why there are only animations for those two weapon types.  I'm really glad the changed it because that would have made the item game really limiting.
Slayerik
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Reply #15 on: May 18, 2012, 01:23:14 PM

I decided to buy a buncha cheap rares with Vitality and  'Melee deals damage to attacker' stuff that is around lvl 25 req, and came up with this build to go with it. It's for when I hit around 25 I will start using it. THORN MONK HOOOOO

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#WfYXgS!Zc!ZabZZa + about 50 damage per hit on equipment.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2012, 01:28:36 PM by Slayerik »

"I have more qualifications than Jesus and earn more than this whole board put together.  My ego is huge and my modesty non-existant." -Ironwood
Threash
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Reply #16 on: May 18, 2012, 01:38:47 PM

Spammable dashing strike with the stunning kick rune is awesome on bosses, specially diablo.  I interrupted the fuck out of every single thing he tried to do.  Couple with life on spirit use passive and i was basically at full health pummeling him like a punching bag the whole time.

I am the .00000001428%
Sophismata
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Reply #17 on: May 19, 2012, 06:14:53 PM

Here's a newb question.  Do I lose anything by equiping weapons that don't seem very monkish like swords?  I was surprised at the large range of weapons I can equip, I thought it would have only been fist spike type weapons and am wondering if I'm doing something wrong by using a sword.

Apparently early in the development cycle the monk could only use fist spikes and staves, which is why there are only animations for those two weapon types.  I'm really glad the changed it because that would have made the item game really limiting.
Actually, neither fist weapons nor staves are included in the monk animations, which is really annoying. They spent a lot of time beautifully animating each weapon's auto-attack, but you'll never see it.

"You finally did it, you magnificent bastards. You went so nerd that even I don't know WTF you're talking about anymore. I salute you." - WindupAtheist
Threash
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Reply #18 on: May 19, 2012, 06:21:10 PM

Why would you use anything but monk weapons? the spirit regen or heal on spirit use they can have makes them far superior.

I am the .00000001428%
waffel
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Reply #19 on: May 19, 2012, 06:34:00 PM

I'm currently in Act 1 NM and decided to switch over to a big DPS 2hander. I swing a lot slower, but my triggered skills do a lot more damage. It's an interesting (and welcomed) change in gameplay and how I approach fights.

I'm still mixing up skills, and have been sticking with Deadly Reach throughout most of my leveling. I've tried the others and just prefer the range of Deadly Reach.
Wave Of Light with Explosive Light is pretty damn overpowered. It's my main skill I use now and it does a shitton of AOE damage.
Haven't used any other defensive skills other than the heal (Holy Light)
Blink is amazing for getting in and out of fights
Seven Sided Strike is sexy and the only Focus skill I ever use
I'm mixing the Mantras up a lot. If I find myself getting raped by monsters I'll go more defensive manstas, otherwise I go with Conviction for the damage boost
Passives have been getting changed a bit more me, but currently I the +100 spirit passive, spirit regen with mantras up, and the 3rd is currently the spirit regen with using 2 handers.

I love the class, just somewhat disappointed there isn't attack animations with a 2h staff, and 1h punching weapons aren't drawn when doing attack animations.
Llyse
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Reply #20 on: May 20, 2012, 05:32:42 PM

Why would you use anything but monk weapons? the spirit regen or heal on spirit use they can have makes them far superior.


I agree, dashing strike with stun is the bees knees.

I however disagree with the need for monk weapons, the bonuses are ok but this is Diablo, more dps always. Explode, splatter kick destroy those foozles!

Bhodi, thanks so much for that build you gave, I'm still using it in nightmare (with some modifications).

Passives I use the same except I take Dex is armour, since I'm in the thick of it a lot.

I love this game (albeit a little too much). I'm still being reckless and I'm stacking magic gear at the cost of hp and dex, but I can deal.   awesome, for real DRILLING AND MANLINESS
Slayerik
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Reply #21 on: May 20, 2012, 05:36:25 PM

I personally like the spinning blade, AOE blind, then deadly reach normal attack. With 7 side strike and occasional heals. So far so good at level 26.

"I have more qualifications than Jesus and earn more than this whole board put together.  My ego is huge and my modesty non-existant." -Ironwood
Job601
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Reply #22 on: May 20, 2012, 06:12:21 PM

The flavor of the month build in higher difficulties seems to be fists of thunder with the rune that gives you 15 spirit per crit + mantra of healing with the rune that gives you a shield.  With the spinning blade aura up you're getting constant crits and you can afford to spam the shield pretty much nonstop, to the extent that it's maybe too good.  Serenity's your oh shit button and you can add whatever else you want for damage.

Another build I tried for a while is stuns:  seven-sided strike with the stun rune, lashtail kick with the stun rune, teleport with stun, and retribution aura with the stun rune.  Not great against packs, but good enough to just about lock up bosses through nightmare.
Llyse
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Calvin and Hobbes are back to maul the fuck outta you.


Reply #23 on: May 20, 2012, 07:25:28 PM

I personally like the spinning blade, AOE blind, then deadly reach normal attack. With 7 side strike and occasional heals. So far so good at level 26.

I love AOE blind, and might bring that back in my Hardcore game.
Threash
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Reply #24 on: May 20, 2012, 07:58:11 PM

I might be missing something obvious but what's this spinning blade?

I am the .00000001428%
Job601
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Reply #25 on: May 20, 2012, 08:23:06 PM

I might be missing something obvious but what's this spinning blade?

Sweeping wind with the blade storm rune (double damage).  Spinning blade isn't the name at all.
Xuri
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몇살이세욬ㅋ 몇살이 몇살 몇살이세욬ㅋ!!!!!1!


WWW
Reply #26 on: May 20, 2012, 11:17:49 PM

Just finished my first run-through with my monk on Normal.

Lvl 31, 402 dmg, 3400 health.
Build in last 1 1/2 acts:
1 - Serenity (Reap What is Sown)
2 - Breath of Heaven (Circle of Life
3 - Sweeping Wind (Master of Wind)
4 - Mantra of Healing (Sustenance)
LMB - Fists of Thunder (Static Charge)
RMB - Wave of Light (Explosive Light)

Boss fights pretty much all went like this, including on Diablo:
Step 1) Enable Mantra of Healing
Step 2) Enable Sweeping Wind (probably unnecessary)
Step 3) Attack boss using Fists of Thunder.
Step 4) If boss does something dangerous looking, enable Serenity.
Step 5) Repeat steps 3 and 4 until boss is dead.

Now on to Nightmare difficulty, I guess!

-= Ho Eyo He Hum =-
Threash
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Reply #27 on: May 21, 2012, 07:11:17 AM

Wait, so you get 15 spirit for ANY crit and not just crits with that ability? that does seem very broken.

I am the .00000001428%
Job601
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Reply #28 on: May 21, 2012, 07:54:00 AM

Wait, so you get 15 spirit for ANY crit and not just crits with that ability? that does seem very broken.

That's how it works at the moment.  I suspect it's a bug and not a feature and will get patched out.
bhodi
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Posts: 6817

No lie.


Reply #29 on: May 23, 2012, 07:40:09 AM

Don't use Boon of Protection in Healing Mantra

Because they're disabling it because it was too good. Which hurts in my hell play.
Slayerik
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Reply #30 on: May 23, 2012, 08:18:07 AM

So now that I'm in NM I am realizing that different / fun builds just really have no place. Time for rubies and DPS/vitality HOOO!

"I have more qualifications than Jesus and earn more than this whole board put together.  My ego is huge and my modesty non-existant." -Ironwood
kildorn
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Reply #31 on: May 23, 2012, 08:51:41 AM

So now that I'm in NM I am realizing that different / fun builds just really have no place. Time for rubies and DPS/vitality HOOO!

I still think I have a lot of viable builds for a wizard, but there are some core "you must take this or die" skills for the various classes. Diamond skin for Wizards, Smoke Screen for DH's.
Job601
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Reply #32 on: May 23, 2012, 10:31:11 AM

Don't use Boon of Protection in Healing Mantra

Because they're disabling it because it was too good. Which hurts in my hell play.

Goodbye, core of my build!  Spamming a shield over and over worked but wasn't exactly fun, so I'll be happy to try something else.  Maybe I'll try the build stacking dodge.
bhodi
Moderator
Posts: 6817

No lie.


Reply #33 on: May 23, 2012, 10:34:58 AM

Conviction with the 10% less damage rune is a pretty good second choice.
Llyse
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Calvin and Hobbes are back to maul the fuck outta you.


Reply #34 on: May 23, 2012, 05:06:13 PM

Wait, so you get 15 spirit for ANY crit and not just crits with that ability? that does seem very broken.

That's how it works at the moment.  I suspect it's a bug and not a feature and will get patched out.

Which skill is this?

I suspect it's been hot patched because I tried a couple of primary, on crit skills and didn't see my spirit jumping like seismograph.

What do you think about Conviction with Submission Rune Bhodi? 12% of weapon damage per second seems pretty awesome, or is it just too slow? I definitely go with the 10% less damage rune at hard boss fights
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