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f13.net  |  f13.net General Forums  |  The Gaming Graveyard  |  RIFT  |  Topic: Gripes, complaints and irritations. 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Author Topic: Gripes, complaints and irritations.  (Read 51878 times)
Threash
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Reply #665 on: August 10, 2011, 04:42:12 PM

Meaningful pvp would be it for me.  Just reading "five man content" sounds like nails on a chalkboard to me at this point.  I want to run dungeons once, ever.  No game can make enough content to play that way.

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March
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Reply #666 on: August 10, 2011, 05:32:55 PM

Rethink what end-game means.
Sky
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Reply #667 on: August 10, 2011, 07:08:19 PM

For me, the linear quest chain to end game...but I played so slowly in EQ2 that they were putting out expansions faster than I could get through them. So it's a bit unfair, maybe to hold Rift to the same light in that respect.

The combat is a bit off for me (I don't like GCD and their one-ahead queue is anemic to the point of useless), but the souls and roles are amazing (as I've said a bajillion times).

Mainly I guess it's the generic setting and lack of interesting races. EQ2 was nice for alts, because at least you could check out a few different starting areas. Rift is brutally boring for alts.

And the end-game centered on raiding and pvp with lots of daily grinding is not something I have a solution for, but it's awful. Maybe it's just that there's not enough journey to get there and they've embraced the fact that "people" like to race through content. With the world event, the alts I wasn't playing other than doing the dailies you could get in Meridian (for the world event) leveled maybe 5 times each.

It's hard for me to understand, because I like playing the game but at the same time it's just missed the target so completely for me, and most of the time I've complained about something I don't like, it ends up being something lifted directly from WoW...which is a game that has no attraction for me. Thus my worries about TOR and pretty much any mmo that is going to ape WoW...

Draegan
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Reply #668 on: August 11, 2011, 07:31:18 AM


I'll address this point by point because these are all valid points.  But I also find it funny saying this game lacks content when it currently has more content than any MMOG that is only 5 months old and one could say it has more content than any endgame MMOG out currently.  But that might be the fanboy in me.

1.  Your're right.  There needs to be more 5 man content.  Look for that coming soon from the hints I've gotten.  Soon, like in September.  There is also these duo/solo instances as well coming.  Soon.  You might even see promos of them in Gamescom.

2.  Currently there are 8 pvp ranks with even more gear to grind out.  Yay (/sarcasm)  However there is a new map/warfront on the test server (or there will be with the new PTS push) and there are alternative rulesets for maps.  In any case, adding a 5th map and game and also create alternative rulesets:  There is no other MMORPG that's done this so far.  How long did WOW last on, what, 3 maps?  So for the age of the game, I think this is pretty damn good.

3.  You're preaching to me.  Some of the soul design for dps, across all callings, is just fucking horrible.  Rogues are locked into having at least 17 assassn and 13 bd even before you start.  I agree 100%, but Trion is aware of it, at least on the Rogue side and tried to fix the problem in 1.4, but they failed horribly.

Side note on this point:  Mages, in Hammerknell, have like 3-5 different specs they are using that include dps, utility, and a large variety of builds.  They even are using a tank build in one fight.  But not everyone gets to play HK.  I hope they extend this into future content.

4.  I'm not a crafter because all crafting is boring like you mentioned.  A minigame would be fun that doesn't rely on me grinding mats out in the open world.  I agree 100%. 

5.  Coming very very soon, probably in 1.5 which very well might be in September.  Keep an eye on Gamescom if you're interested.  There will be solo/duo story instances.  There will also be "Instant Adventures" which are described as dynamic like events that you can queue up for. (Source is MMORPG.com).  Who knows. 

6.  I agree 100% and I've been saying the same thing since Alpha.  I haven't heard anything that suggests they are working on something different.  I know they are capable of creating it, but I don't know if they are going that direction.  Sad.

7.  That would be neat.  Tanking, Healing, DPS for all souls.  At least all of them can do at least two things in some capacity, that's not bad.  Maybe in an expansion.  I'd love to see this.

8.  Heh.  Class Balance.  Well Warriors and Rogues are extremely close on single target dps.  Mages and Rogues are very close on AOE dps.  Clerics and Warriors are very close on Tankage.  Rogues are losing the tank game in HK but excel in everything below.  Healing?  Well only Clerics can heal and add in Chloromancer.

Talking PVP... well yeah, that's hard.  I've never seen a balanced PVP game ever.

9.  See 7.

10.  Minimizing gear in PVP is a tough one.  Some people love, some people hate it.  I think a better solution would be to create groups.  I.e. Warfronts are split into tiers so Ranks 1-3 are in one tier.  Ranks 4-6 in the next.  Ranks 7-8 in another.  This way I don't get rolled.

However, this splits up the endgame population and increases queue time.  So you either complain about being rolled, or complain about waiting.  Perhaps allow the option?  I wonder if that would work.


11. Bugs get into games.  They've been known to roll people back due to bugs.  Let's see what they do about it.

12.  Yeah, I agree.  THey need more variety in the armor sets.  Some of the shit I'm seeing come out of HK is god awful.  New leather tank item I saw drop last night looks exactly like the T2 leather helmet that drops from xRD.  Sigh.

13.  Melee vs. Range:  They are doing this in HK.  I would hope they transition this to future content, no reason to think they won't.

---

This game is no more shallow than any other MMORPG at this point.  They only game I can think that has different stuff to do is LOTRO.  But saying the game is shallow when you have:

6 Raid Rifts
6 Expert Rifts
3 20 man raids
2 10 man raids
PVP rifts
4 (soon 5) Warfronts, with one map having two rulesets.

I think that's pretty good for a game that's been out for 6 months and has had a big game update almost every 30-40 days.  Tell me another game that's done the same?

One caveat is that they are implementing a post 50 use for experience next patch (maybe) that supposedly augments your character in some fashion.  Don't know what their AAs are going to be, but it should be fun.

I know I'm a major fanboy, but in all honesty it seems like you played the shit out of the game in a short amount of time and ran out of stuff to do.  I mean, you do have two level capped players that are also capped in PVP right?  That's aaaalooooottttt of PVPing.
Lantyssa
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Reply #669 on: August 11, 2011, 08:44:03 AM

I hope Rift does well, their devs are a shining example of how MMO development should be like and the work they've put in since launch is breathtaking, i just wish they were working on a different game.
I'd love to see their take on a sandbox.  I hope RIFT continues to do well enough that it lets them branch out with their MMO offerings whatever style they choose though.  Take a bit more risk now that they have a solid product.

Hahahaha!  I'm really good at this!
Sky
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Reply #670 on: August 11, 2011, 09:28:07 AM

I hope RIFT continues to do well enough that it lets them branch out with their MMO offerings whatever style they choose though.  Take a bit more risk now that they have a solid product.
I definitely agree with this.

Although part of me wants the company to self-destruct so the talent lands at Bioware Austin :)

Nebu
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Reply #671 on: August 11, 2011, 09:37:19 AM

I think that's pretty good for a game that's been out for 6 months and has had a big game update almost every 30-40 days. 

I do to.  I love Rift and want to play it.  Just remember that Trion is competing with WoW (and other MMOs) in their current state.  What Rift has relative to what WoW had at release is irrelevant.  My choice isn't between Rift and Vanilla WoW.  It's between Rift and WoW with all of its expansions (or EQ2 or LotRO).  

The game reminds me of WAR in so many ways... they came SO close to getting it right.  The soul system was a great idea poorly implemented.  The dungeons and boss encounters were great fun... the first 5 times I ran them.  PvP was really enjoyable until people mastered the souls and outranked the competition.  If they can do the things that I know Hartsman to be capable of, this could be a game that gets a lot of my money.  Until then, I'm going to play something that will keep me busy longer.  

I still read the forums and watch the game.  My hope isn't completely dead.  


"Always do what is right. It will gratify half of mankind and astound the other."

-  Mark Twain
Nebu
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Reply #672 on: August 11, 2011, 09:39:07 AM

I'd love to see their take on a sandbox.  I hope RIFT continues to do well enough that it lets them branch out with their MMO offerings whatever style they choose though.  Take a bit more risk now that they have a solid product.

I agree with this 100%. 

Trion has a real opportunity to innovate even more than they have and the talent to see it through.  I hope they give it a shot. 

"Always do what is right. It will gratify half of mankind and astound the other."

-  Mark Twain
Count Nerfedalot
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Reply #673 on: August 11, 2011, 10:19:21 AM

I hate to admit it, but I can't imagine them getting me back.  Pure combat just doesn't hold my attention all that long any more, at least not mmo style combat. I need other things to do in the world, and in Rift there weren't many options and they all frankly sucked.  Crafting is a tedious and mostly unrewarding drudgery, harvesting was even worse, collections were frustrating due to mob density + aggro + respawn rate, exploration even moreso and the world just isn't that big/have that many interesting things to discover anyway, no housing, what little story was mostly uninspiring, the character customization options were too limited and generally boring, combat itself was kinda fun but got very repetitive and was too fast-paced for any socializing, I'm not even remotely interested in the pvp, and the retarded auction house!!! aargh, I'm not even going there.

Basically I guess it's a combination of diku burnout and that this game just wasn't *for* me.  What they did they (mostly) did well, but I was hoping for something closer to EQ3.0 than WoW2.0.

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Reply #674 on: August 11, 2011, 10:45:09 AM

I need solo progression in regards to both story and gear available at 50.  That's what'll it'll take to get me to come back.  Some of their proposed future updates may provide that. 

I just don't have any time to dick around with the other options.  PVP progression doesn't seem like something I can keep up with.  Raiding is definitely something I cannot do.  And the leveling experience is way too static for me to get another character past 40.  I could try the Defiant story line at some point, as leveling up a mage is something I haven't taken past level 17.  But, that's something I can save when there's a reason to stick around for me at 50.   Right now, I've hit 44 on my highest character, saw there was nothing else I wanted to do and just unsubbed before I could change my mind.

-Rasix
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Reply #675 on: August 11, 2011, 11:53:31 AM

agree with Rasix.   

Also, I think they may have an implemented a dying model.  I'm not willing to pay a sub anymore for a game with cockblocks or any constraints that require me to alter my play style, since I am *paying* already for the game time.  I just don't think large numbers of people will put up with that business model for much longer.  Or they will keep game jumping every month or expansion.

After only playing regularly for 27 days, I think Rift is a polished and well executed game.   But it died for me the moment I left the solo'able/small-PUG content.  The inability to get a PUG to run the first lowbie dungeon was a sign, and so was the lack of population in the 20+ zones. 

It's the same problem these mudflation-centric games all share: a new player is totally dependant on the size (and play time) of the population of other players available to run content.  Unless you find some way around that problem (like LotRO's skirmish system), you will consistently see some players unable to experience some of the content.  As a solution, telling people 1) join a large guild, 2) play more, 3) play more at different times, 4) wait in PUG queues longer,  just isn't satisfactory when you are paying a monthly fee.  It's a different world now, and this "play-it-or-leave-it" design I don't think is going to last.

Draegan
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Reply #676 on: August 11, 2011, 12:08:44 PM

I do to.  I love Rift and want to play it.  Just remember that Trion is competing with WoW (and other MMOs) in their current state.  What Rift has relative to what WoW had at release is irrelevant.  My choice isn't between Rift and Vanilla WoW.  It's between Rift and WoW with all of its expansions (or EQ2 or LotRO).  



Thats kinda my point though.  What does WOW offer that Rift doesn't?  I think Rift currently has more content that WOW does right now.  The only thing WOW has that RIFT doesn't is Arenas and 10 man versions of the large raids.

Edit:  I guess WOW has a few extra routes to take at lower levels from 1-60?  I was previously talking endcap activities.

« Last Edit: August 11, 2011, 12:11:51 PM by Draegan »
Rasix
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Reply #677 on: August 11, 2011, 12:16:08 PM

I do to.  I love Rift and want to play it.  Just remember that Trion is competing with WoW (and other MMOs) in their current state.  What Rift has relative to what WoW had at release is irrelevant.  My choice isn't between Rift and Vanilla WoW.  It's between Rift and WoW with all of its expansions (or EQ2 or LotRO).  



Thats kinda my point though.  What does WOW offer that Rift doesn't?  I think Rift currently has more content that WOW does right now.  The only thing WOW has that RIFT doesn't is Arenas and 10 man versions of the large raids.

Edit:  I guess WOW has a few extra routes to take at lower levels from 1-60?  I was previously talking endcap activities.



It has more flexibility than what Rift offers.  Vanilla WoW is debatable, but if you're tied or barely beating Vanilla WoW in regards to leveling path, you're doing terrible.

-Rasix
March
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Reply #678 on: August 11, 2011, 12:46:33 PM

Asking what WoW has the Rift doesn't is exactly why many are quitting.

The better question is why doesn't Rift have more LoTRo, EQ2, CoX, DAoC, WAR, etc?
Draegan
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Reply #679 on: August 11, 2011, 01:34:37 PM

I do to.  I love Rift and want to play it.  Just remember that Trion is competing with WoW (and other MMOs) in their current state.  What Rift has relative to what WoW had at release is irrelevant.  My choice isn't between Rift and Vanilla WoW.  It's between Rift and WoW with all of its expansions (or EQ2 or LotRO).  



Thats kinda my point though.  What does WOW offer that Rift doesn't?  I think Rift currently has more content that WOW does right now.  The only thing WOW has that RIFT doesn't is Arenas and 10 man versions of the large raids.

Edit:  I guess WOW has a few extra routes to take at lower levels from 1-60?  I was previously talking endcap activities.



It has more flexibility than what Rift offers.  Vanilla WoW is debatable, but if you're tied or barely beating Vanilla WoW in regards to leveling path, you're doing terrible.

What flexibility?  I haven't played since early-mid WOTLK.  What's changed?  The only difference I can see is different early leveling paths which benefits alts.

I can think of a few features that games like EQ2 and LOTRO have that RIft has, namely small group content and player housing.

Can anyone elaborate?  

Edit:
Are you bringing up DAOC and WAR for RVR stuff?
Numtini
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Reply #680 on: August 12, 2011, 07:11:01 AM

The better question is why doesn't Rift have more LoTRo, EQ2, CoX, DAoC, WAR, etc?

I was enjoying it quite a bit, but the developers seem bound and determined to offer a 100% clone to WoW not an alternative. I don't like WoW or I'd be playing it.

If you can read this, you're on a board populated by misogynist assholes.
Threash
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Reply #681 on: August 12, 2011, 07:24:40 AM

I don't understand why anyone would play WoW over Rift, or how it has any more flexibility.  The only thing WoW has that I wish Rift did is arenas.

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Sky
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Reply #682 on: August 12, 2011, 07:48:36 AM

WoW does have cooler races and the leveling experience was more varied. There's something to be said for avoiding an abject grind with your second character, right out of the creator.

As someone who enjoyed crafting, EQ2 is a far better experience for the Broker alone. Even if I prefer the 'enter amount and hit button' style over the drawn-out EQ2 process. Also, EQ2 doesn't use the godawful GCD and you can queue your abilities so you don't end up with carpal tunnel syndrome. Which is kind of important, being a guitarist. As soon as my wrist starts aching because Rift basically demands mashing, game over. And macros...they just need to go away forever. Play the game or gtfo.

March
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Reply #683 on: August 22, 2011, 04:22:44 PM

Logged on a character to do the daily World Event quests to get the 50 [Dragon Tears].

Completed the quests, and went to mail the [Dragon Tears] to an alt... only to find no item in inventory.  I checked the Log, and sure enough...log says I received the quest reward.

Not a big deal, but I figured I'd be a good Riftizen and flag this bug.

Much to my surprise, I get this response:

Quote
Upon completion of world quests, player must remember to manually click on the rewards icon to receive their items. By not doing so, although the chat logs state you've received the rewards, they will not enter your inventory.

Since the [Dragon Tears] are the only thing you get from this quest, it is much akin to saying that you need to click on the [Gold] or your log will record your receipt, but hey... you didn't do it right... so no gold for you.

Any other quest that requires a selection will not let you complete until you make a selection... so, pretty sure this is not intended design.
Shatter
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Reply #684 on: August 25, 2011, 07:27:57 AM

I've reached burnout, actually I did a while ago but didnt have much else to play.  They still have premades dominating pugs in Warfronts and while getting to rank 6 was enough of a grind getting to 7 and 8 is now just retarded for time investment...especially if you continuously lose to premades.  No world pvp to speak of and these pvp rifts are lame...collect a shard and run to some point...wtf?  90% of these PvP rifts dont see PvP.  I figure by the time they figure out some world pvp worth mentioning Ill probably be into SWTOR or GW2.  Rift turned out to be a decent enough distraction this year but I definitely played it longer then I probably should of.  Luckily I got a beta invite to another game thats keeping my attention atm but I cancelled Rift yesterday.
Threash
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Reply #685 on: September 28, 2011, 06:33:14 AM

If you are a dps cleric in a warfront you just like losing.

I am the .00000001428%
Nebu
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Reply #686 on: September 28, 2011, 06:55:35 AM

If you are a dps cleric in a warfront you just like losing.

Don't be one of these.  I beg you.  I have 3 level 50 clerics (2 guardians before they allowed server merges and one defiant).  Playing a healer is so thankless in the WF that I don't begrudge anyone for playing DPS on their cleric.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2011, 06:59:49 AM by Nebu »

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devildog
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Reply #687 on: November 03, 2011, 12:34:36 PM

I have actually switched out of healing spec to go cabalist when i felt like the problem was that we could not punch through. Sometimes you need a hammer. Maybe clerics aren't the best hammers, but a full geared rank 8 cabalist can usually cause a few problems. You really need to see it from a healer perspective one time to see what i mean by this. When you have 10 rogues on the team and they are dropping like flies before you can roll more than a hot on them or cast a 2 second spell, they need a distraction more than they need a heal...i.e. someone else to worry about so they can do their thing a bit.
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Reply #688 on: November 03, 2011, 01:52:49 PM

Yep. I remember a black garden (it's always black garden  awesome, for real) where our side had 4.5 healers and the enemy had 2... however, everyone in our side was literally dying in 2 seconds or less due to being crazily outgeared and -played. People were STILL saying stuff like 'omg we don't have enough healers', even though what we needed was not healing -- it was CC, focus fire, and luck.

Similarly, a well-played damage spec player (who has interrupts and CC and knows how to use them + line up burst damage) can potentially help the group a lot more than just another healer. Of course having at least 1 healer per 5 characters is a good idea, but it's not just "add more healers and win".

Threash
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Reply #689 on: November 04, 2011, 07:04:17 AM

Squishy healers are almost as bad as not having healers.  There are some incredibly tough cleric specs out there though, and with valor equalization among the tiers most clerics should be damn hard to kill.  I've been in warfronts were a single cleric rushes the front line and is inmediately targeted by every single player on my team because hey "it's a cleric, get him!"  and then just doesn't die while the whole team is cut down by everyone else.

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dd0029
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Reply #690 on: November 05, 2011, 11:03:13 AM

I really like Hammerknell. Of the 5 bosses we have gotten through/to, they are all different and entertaining. However, they are almost all punishingly unforgiving of mistakes from most of the raid or from just getting hosed on an RNG basis.

Murdantix desperately needs a method for judging the demonic blast. Oh, you were too close to someone else. Sorry, you just died. Oh, three people in melee got picked for tar at the same moment he does a knockback, there goes your melee.

Zilas is probably one of the most entertaining fights I have ever seen. However, we are just getting in and have not gotten many weapons, so we have just enough DPS to beat him. Even one death means we are short on the DPS on the magus group, the spirit group or the boss/add group. Lets count some of the ways you can die. Well, first the adds. They need to be tanked by the boss for some cleave action, but if your tank is not right on the ball grabbing them they can paste someone right quick. Then there's the spinny dance. Don't be too close, you might be in the circle of death, but not too far, you're going to be going too slow to beat the other beam of death. Oh, and the "obvious" marker for where the beam starts, fairly small and white, nearly blending in on a light grey back ground. Suffice to say, there are a ton of ways for this to go bad and if you miss one, odds are you die.

Matron. This one is fairly easy, but can be punishing for melee if they can't keep up their rotation and keep up a mental 15 second count for moving in and out for a possible ground aoe.

Sicaron. We just got here. The first night, we could not even manage the pull. Healing is a bitch and a half on this one with a ton of "just deal with it". Our best so far is the low 70s. Everyone needs to be aware of their debuff list if they get the bubble thing. We haven't even gotten into the dispelling yet.

But for all of my complaints, these are all really cool fights. Suitably epic stuff. Just completely unforgiving.

The gear requirements to get in are annoying as well. We are running out of people geared enough to maintain our forward momentum.
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Reply #691 on: November 05, 2011, 07:36:47 PM

Comparing WOW to Rift, well lets see.  Playing WOW up to when I quit each day was the same, do dailies, do battlegrounds, maybe a  dungeon, logoff.   Guess what I do in Rift today...same thing.  Anyone that thinks WOW is different needs to stop sniffing glue. 
Draegan
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Reply #692 on: November 17, 2011, 01:29:30 PM

I really like Hammerknell. Of the 5 bosses we have gotten through/to, they are all different and entertaining. However, they are almost all punishingly unforgiving of mistakes from most of the raid or from just getting hosed on an RNG basis.


My guild is on Akylios.  You should of seen all the bosses when HK was released.  It was even more difficult on a retardedly stupid design level.  HK is at a good place right now with difficulty but not retarded hard level.
dd0029
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Reply #693 on: November 23, 2011, 11:40:31 AM

After three weeks of getting some of our stronger players poached by the local 10/11 guild, we managed to put together enough to start rolling again in HK. We tried Sicaron for a bit before and decided to leave that for later and work on Molinar. This is a fight I like. Its all about personal responsibility and no real oh you just died mechanics. Purple crap is not an instant killer. The King's Cursed blows are well telegraphed and if not easily healed through, at least reasonable. About the only thing that is kind of annoying is the tight percentage bit but with our ranged heavy makeup that's not too tough for target switching.
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Reply #694 on: December 23, 2011, 01:47:47 AM

Logged in using the three days free; my first time since the launch month.  I found rifts that were focused around christmas trees, trying to save the presents or something.  I felt so embarassed for actually considering taking part in such a stupid idea that I logged out and uninstalled.  The absurdity is overwhelming.
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Reply #695 on: December 28, 2011, 06:10:38 AM

If someone could take this entire game, and somehow magically switch the IP/World to one that is truly interesting and degenericify the graphics I'd play nothing else for my DIKU-ish game fix.

"The world is populated in the main by people who should not exist." - George Bernard Shaw
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Reply #696 on: December 28, 2011, 08:53:56 AM

I almost wonder if Trion could take an established IP, despite my misgivings of dealing with them, and make an awesome game from it.  Say their competence trying to do SWG...

Hahahaha!  I'm really good at this!
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Reply #697 on: December 28, 2011, 10:40:59 AM

I have to say, other than going totally free to play, there is nothing Trion could do to the game that would make me come back to play it. That said, I will definitely give Trion's next game a purchase and play.

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Reply #698 on: December 28, 2011, 12:56:03 PM

I think that, given the same resources as Bioware, Trion could have made a fantastic SWTOR MMO.  While I enjoy the story in TOR, the MMO aspects really don't impress me.  Once I've done the story lines, I don't see any reason to keep playing the game in its current state.

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Reply #699 on: December 28, 2011, 01:43:08 PM

A better question would be what would an MMO need to keep you playing.
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